Energy Independence in 92 Square Miles

[Synthaholic]

I am sure others have written in, but 92 miles by 92 miles is 8,464 square miles. Nonetheless a very small speck of land when comparing to the total land mass of the US which is 6+ million square miles, not even counting Alaska.

No, we don't have to put all that in the desert either. In many places it is better done on roof tops.

And nobody has suggested that it all has to be in one place. In fact, the OP states that distribution would be a problem.

Better to have small solar farms spread across the southern U.S.

 

[Synthaholic]

I am sure others have written in, but 92 miles by 92 miles is 8,464 square miles. Nonetheless a very small speck of land when comparing to the total land mass of the US which is 6+ million square miles, not even counting Alaska.

No, we don't have to put all that in the desert either. In many places it is better done on roof tops.

Better on roof tops, because all roofs are designed for the weight of Solar Panels, who pays to retrofit the roofs?

Like I said, the more you talk . . .

Until I re-roofed 2 summers ago, I had a solar water heater system on my old roof, which was extremely heavy by itself, but it was always filled with water, flowing through it's maze of large copper pipes. That system was up there for over 20 years with no damage to my roof or decking.

Solar photo panels, by contrast, are very light. There are also pole-mounted options.

 

[Synthaholic]

To understand the rough cost of what a residential grid-tied pv system could provide your home, here is the standard information needed to work through an estimate:



1) budget
2) location
3) total space available
4) direction the panels would face and angle
5) cost of electricity from your utility


Lets assume the following information for a sample cost-out:



1) $40,000 or less
2) Chicago, IL
3) 600 square feet of roof
4) South facing at 30 degree angle
5) ComEd rate of $0.14/kwh (the local utility company)


Now we apply additional solar information towards the specific evaluation:



1) $40,000 or less
2) Chicago, IL provides approximately 3.5 hours of quality sun each day, or 106 hours of solar hours each month
3) 600 ft of roof could fit approximately 33, 175 watt solar panels (18 sf per panel); 33 panels x 175 watts = 5.775 kilowatt system
4) South facing locations at approximately 30 degrees typically produces the best results, specifically in shade free locations
5) 5.775 kilowatt system produces this amount of electricity each hour of quality sun; 5.775kw x 106 hours per month = 612 kwh each month; 612 kwh x $0.14/kwh from ComEd = $85 in electric savings each month


The average cost of a grid-tie system including all products, installation and processing fees is around $7/watt. In the sample evaluation, $7/watt x 5,775 watt system = $40,425. In Illinois, the current state rebate is 30% of the cost of the solar kit. This results in a $12,127 refund. Federal incentives currently provide 30% tax credits for the cost of the solar kit, or another $12,127 in a one time tax credit. The net cost after federal and state incentives is $16,175. Keep in mind that municipalities and utility companies may also provide added incentives and discounts. It is important to work with a solar professional and an accountant to properly understand and process these financial details.


In the case of this sample evaluation, the solar system costs $16,175 and produces approximately $1,020 in savings per year. This results in a payback period of 15-16 years. However, this does not take into account the increased value of the residence, the likelihood of increased energy costs, or the environmental benefit and goodwill. Considering solar panels have a 25 year guarantee and are virtually trouble free once installed, the current benefits seem to outweigh the costs.

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LINK

As someone who lives in Florida, I'm getting waaaay more than 3.5 hours per day of quality sun. More like 8.

 

[Synthaholic]

Far less, by orders of magnitude, than it takes for a fossil fueled plant.

And the new thin film panels weigh next to nothing, and can be glued to the present steel roofs of most industrial and commercial buildings.

I wouldn't glue them, I would use the roof mounts to keep them 2-4 inches off the roof to allow air to circulate and keep them from overheating, reducing their lifespan.

 

[Synthaholic]

Far less, by orders of magnitude, than it takes for a fossil fueled plant.

And the new thin film panels weigh next to nothing, and can be glued to the present steel roofs of most industrial and commercial buildings.

Steel Roofs, you are an idiot, no industrial or commercial building has a Steel Roof.

Moron.

Metal Roofing Wholesalers sells all styles of metal roofs to the public nationwide

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Commercial Metal Roofing South Bend, Elkhart, Goshen Metal Roofing Commercial - Master Steel Roofing

Commercial Metal Roofing

 

[Old Rocks]

Poor stupid mdn. He, she, or it, has not a clue. The company I work for, a steel company has steel roofs measured in acres here in Portland, Oregon. And it is a small mill compared to the mills back east. A great many of the warehoused here also have steel roofs.

 

[westwall]

I've posted this on other boards, and the story is a few years old, but I recently saw some other news about this project, so it's still going strong.

Energy Independence in 92 Square Miles


Give Ausra CEO Bob Fishman a 92-by-92-mile expanse of desert land -- an area less than one-tenth the size of Nevada -- and he could power the entire United States. Fishman doesn’t control that much land, of course, and transporting electricity all over the country would get tricky. But that doesn’t make the power of Ausra’s solar technology any less mind-boggling.

While most older solar setups depend on pricey photovoltaic panels, Ausra’s installations boast mass-produced mirror clusters that focus the sun’s rays onto water-filled tubes. When the water begins to boil, it produces enough steam to turn an array of turbines. Fishman estimates electricity generated this way will cost 10 to 12 cents per kilowatt-hour -- on par with power from polluting sources such as coal, and 50% less than photovoltaic power. “Photovoltaic is constrained because it uses high-grade silicon,” he says. “We’re using everyday materials -- just steel, glass, and water.”

VC extraordinaire Vinod Khosla invested $25 million in Ausra last year, and Kleiner, Perkins, Caulfield, & Byers kicked in another $15 million, a colossal vote of confidence that has proven contagious. In November 2007, Pacific Gas & Electric signed a 20-year power purchasing agreement with the company that will generate more than $1 billion in revenue (Ausra’s first California plant is slated to be up and running by 2010), and Ausra officials are in talks with utilities in Florida and Nevada to cement similar deals. “I don’t think it’s out of the question for us to get 30% of the national grid within 20 years,” Fishman says.
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More stupidity, press releases of dreams passes for proof in your mind, you beleive everything you read in a press release? This is why we have our problems, the gulliable and naive beleive all they read.

I actually worked for the company or I should say a smaller company bought by the Giant French Company that owns this company. The Saleman for the Solar side of the business is a convicted drug dealer, caught selling Cocaine to a minor, he spent over a year in prison. He will say anything to anyone, he does not care, I watched him sell a contract for nuclear work over the phone, regardless of if we could do the work in the time he said, he under cut the competition with a pure lie. Which is what you need to sell Solar.

Your article is very old, three years. where is the 92 square miles of Solar, if the claim was true why was it not built? Further they will use natural gas to produce the energy to boil the medium to power the turbines that turn the generators. Why use Solar at all, simple, they have convinced the public Solar is clean and worth the very expensive price.

Of course you have to shove it down the throats of Californians first, which is easy, having a very large illegal mexican voting block that is under educated makes that easy to pass. Having the rest of the population that uses three year old press releases as a source of their knowledge guarantees the measures pass.

Of course you must give the electricity to the poor at a cheap rate, so they have no idea of the true cost, and of course the other rate payers end up paying the bill of the poor.

The date of the press release from your "article".



More recent news is of a company that failed, failed to show that their idea works. That does not matter, just let Obama dump billions and billions of our money into the solar money pit and it will work, just read the press release, it says it works. Yet after three years it was not built.

Financing woes shrink Ausra's big solar plans | Green Tech - CNET News

Ausra President and CEO Bob Fishman told different news outlets this week that the company has been forced to change its business strategy in response to the credit crisis. The company is also laying off staff as part of the reorganization, according to reports.

The change is a clear sign of how the credit crisis and the current structure of government incentives are hurting the business for large-scale renewable-energy projects

Of course now this company has been bought by Areva, a giant corporation is France, by owning this company they meet the EU's laws to trade carbon credits, another huge scam.

Other than a few people like T. Boone Pickens and Ted Turner, state and federal land is the only options for large areas of land. That takes time.

Why would they need natural gas to boil when they have lenses and mirrors and the sun?

Illegals cannot vote.

You talk a lot of shit.

There is one of these plants down near four corners where Hwy 395 crosses Hwy 58 in California. I drive past it three times a year and a friend of mine owns an antique shop about 200 yards from the plant, they are rarely operational, he figures about 15% of the time. I've never seen it in operation in the 12 years I've been driving by the thing.

There was another one of these that was an experimental near Barstow off of Interstate 40 that was built some time in the 1970's or early 80's, I saw that in operation twice in 10 years.

 

[Synthaholic]

Poor stupid mdn. He, she, or it, has not a clue. The company I work for, a steel company has steel roofs measured in acres here in Portland, Oregon. And it is a small mill compared to the mills back east. A great many of the warehoused here also have steel roofs.

They are all over the place here in Florida. They are lighter, and keep your attic cooler due to reflecting heat rather than absorbing it.

When I recently re-roofed, I seriously considered it, but it was around $3,000 more expensive, and it wouldn't have conformed with the rest of the houses on the street. I didn't want to stick out.

 

[Synthaholic]

There is one of these plants down near four corners where Hwy 395 crosses Hwy 58 in California.

This? (click 'Satellite')


U.S. 395 & California 58, Barstow-Victorville, San Bernardino, California 93516 - Google Maps

 

[westwall]

There is one of these plants down near four corners where Hwy 395 crosses Hwy 58 in California.

This? (click 'Satellite')


U.S. 395 & California 58, Barstow-Victorville, San Bernardino, California 93516 - Google Maps

Yep, that's the one.