DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business

[CrazedScotsman]

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

Well, there you have it. It is now against the law to if you want life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

The damage is done though. Voting out these people won't do a thing. Repealing the health care bill won't do a thing. The law has been found constitutional and the SCOTUS says the government can force an individual to buy a product. The only way to fix it is an amendment to the United States Constitution or another civil war.

Yes it will, the next president will probably have two Supreme court appointments. Vote and pray that it will not be Obama appointing them

It makes no difference though since its constitutional giving the government the ability to force the citizens to buy something. The government can now force the American citizen to buy only KFC now and not Chic-fil-a if they see fit. They don't have to give a reason, they can just do it. Now, I don't believe the government will do that, I'm just making a point. If you ask how they can force you to buy KFC, all they have to do is create the Chic-fil-a tax and triple the price. Yeah, but at least we still have Popeyes though, lol.

Repeal of the law won't fix what the SCOTUS did either, the law has been found constitutional. The only way to fix the damage done is to amend the constitution, but then you run into other problems like auto insurance which isn't to protect the person who buys it but other people property and lives.

I just think the SCOTUS opened pandoras box, that's all. Maybe I'm just paranoid. Let's hope so.

 

[JoeB131]

The Justice Department last week presented the Newland family of Colorado--who own Hercules Industries, a heating, ventilation and air-conditioning business--with what amounted to an ultimatum: Give up your religion or your business.

“Hercules Industries has ‘made no showing of a religious belief which requires that [it] engage in the [HVAC] business,” the Justice Department said in a formal filing in the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado.

In response to the Justice Department’s argument that the Newlands can either give up practicing their religion or give up owning their business, the Alliance Defending Freedom, which is representing the family, said in a reply brief: "[T]o the extent the government is arguing that its mandate does not really burden the Newlands because they are free to abandon their jobs, their livelihoods, and their property so that others can take over Hercules and comply, this expulsion from business would be an extreme form of government burden.”

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

You left out the little detail where the issue was that they weren't complying with the law that requires them to provide reproductive health care to their employees.

Oh, can't include that little salient fact.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The Justice Department last week presented the Newland family of Colorado--who own Hercules Industries, a heating, ventilation and air-conditioning business--with what amounted to an ultimatum: Give up your religion or your business.

“Hercules Industries has ‘made no showing of a religious belief which requires that [it] engage in the [HVAC] business,” the Justice Department said in a formal filing in the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado.

In response to the Justice Department’s argument that the Newlands can either give up practicing their religion or give up owning their business, the Alliance Defending Freedom, which is representing the family, said in a reply brief: "[T]o the extent the government is arguing that its mandate does not really burden the Newlands because they are free to abandon their jobs, their livelihoods, and their property so that others can take over Hercules and comply, this expulsion from business would be an extreme form of government burden.”

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

You left out the little detail where the issue was that they weren't complying with the law that requires them to provide reproductive health care to their employees.

Oh, can't include that little salient fact.

You missed the fact that the judge sided with the company, not the government.

That is the salient fact.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

This has nothing to do with a family, its religion, or business – it’s yet another attempt by the right to contrive a political controversy where none exists, predicated on their disdain for the president and ACA.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

This has nothing to do with a family, its religion, or business – it’s yet another attempt by the right to contrive a political controversy where none exists, predicated on their disdain for the president and ACA.

You didn't answer my question, why is that?

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

Conservatives are tedious on a number of levels.

You start these idiotic threads with links to inaccurate ‘sources.’

How dare the DOJ follow Constitutional case law.

Great spin.

Let us parse what the DOJ said.

Plaintiffs’ challenge rests largely on the theory that a for-profit, secular corporation established to manufacture heating, ventilation, and air conditioning (“HVAC”) products can claim to exercise a religion and thereby avoid the reach of laws designed to regulate commercial activity.

This cannot be.

What does that mean? What if the government suddenly declares that, in order to regulate commerce, a Muslim shop owner has to sell bacon? Would that be a constitutional exercise of Congress's ability to regulate commerce?

 

[Liability]

I love the fact that the Holder DOJ is so amazingly inept.

This is EXACTLY the kind of case that gives the SCOTUS a second bite at the apple to correct their imbecilic Obamacare ruling.

Fuck, even some of the idiot lib Justices might get squishy soft on enforcing that stupidity at the cost of the freedom of religion.

 

[JoeB131]

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

You left out the little detail where the issue was that they weren't complying with the law that requires them to provide reproductive health care to their employees.

Oh, can't include that little salient fact.

You missed the fact that the judge sided with the company, not the government.

That is the salient fact.

Not really. These lower court justices get handed their asses all the time.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You left out the little detail where the issue was that they weren't complying with the law that requires them to provide reproductive health care to their employees.

Oh, can't include that little salient fact.

You missed the fact that the judge sided with the company, not the government.

That is the salient fact.

Not really. These lower court justices get handed their asses all the time.

Some do, some don't.

 

[JoeB131]

You missed the fact that the judge sided with the company, not the government.

That is the salient fact.

Not really. These lower court justices get handed their asses all the time.

Some do, some don't.

This one they will, because the obligations of employers to provide insurance would be rendered moot if anyone could claim it was against their religion to provide coverage.

 

[Full-Auto]

The Justice Department last week presented the Newland family of Colorado--who own Hercules Industries, a heating, ventilation and air-conditioning business--with what amounted to an ultimatum: Give up your religion or your business.

“Hercules Industries has ‘made no showing of a religious belief which requires that [it] engage in the [HVAC] business,” the Justice Department said in a formal filing in the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado.

In response to the Justice Department’s argument that the Newlands can either give up practicing their religion or give up owning their business, the Alliance Defending Freedom, which is representing the family, said in a reply brief: "[T]o the extent the government is arguing that its mandate does not really burden the Newlands because they are free to abandon their jobs, their livelihoods, and their property so that others can take over Hercules and comply, this expulsion from business would be an extreme form of government burden.”

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

The only businesses democrats support are bankrupt bound green energy companies, drug cartels and union motors...

 

[francoHFW]

Gotta love these fundie fascists....feqqem!

 

[francoHFW]

This is one issue the gov need to stay out of. If you need contraceptives buy your own but don't make private business finance you fun time.

It's cheaper for the insurer and the country for birth control to be covered, brainwashed SHYTTEHEAD. Keep religion out of the state- feqqing divisive Pub a-holes health care corporate shills...

Romneycare for all! Already a great success.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Not really. These lower court justices get handed their asses all the time.

Some do, some don't.

This one they will, because the obligations of employers to provide insurance would be rendered moot if anyone could claim it was against their religion to provide coverage.

Damn, you just destroyed your own position.

There is a religious conscious exemption written into the PPACA.

RELIGIOUS CONSCIENCE EXEMPTION — Such term shall not include any individual for any month if such individual has in effect an exemption under section 1311(d)(4)(H) of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act which certifies that such individual is a member of a recognized religious sect or division thereof described in section 1402(g)(1) and an adherent of established tenets or teachings of such sect or division as described in such section.

Section 1402(g)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code is the part that governs exemption from paying Social Security and Medicare taxes.

(g) Members of certain religious faiths

(1) Exemption

Any individual may file an application (in such form and manner, and with such official, as may be prescribed by regulations under this chapter) for an exemption from the tax imposed by this chapter if he is a member of a recognized religious sect or division thereof and is an adherent of established tenets or teachings of such sect or division by reason of which he is conscientiously opposed to acceptance of the benefits of any private or public insurance which makes payments in the event of death, disability, old-age, or retirement or makes payments toward the cost of, or provides services for, medical care (including the benefits of any insurance system established by the Social Security Act). Such exemption may be granted only if the application contains or is accompanied by -

(A) such evidence of such individual's membership in, and adherence to the tenets or teachings of, the sect or division thereof as the Secretary may require for purposes of determining such individual's compliance with the preceding sentence, and

(B) his waiver of all benefits and other payments under titles II and XVIII of the Social Security Act on the basis of his wages and self-employment income as well as all such benefits and other payments to him on the basis of the wages and self-employment income of any other person, and only if the Commissioner of Social Security finds that -

(C) such sect or division thereof has the established tenets or teachings referred to in the preceding sentence,

(D) it is the practice, and has been for a period of time which he deems to be substantial, for members of such sect or division thereof to make provision for their dependent members which in his judgment is reasonable in view of their general level of living, and

(E) such sect or division thereof has been in existence at all times since December 31, 1950.

An exemption may not be granted to any individual if any benefit or other payment referred to in subparagraph (B) became payable (or, but for section 203 or 222(b) of the Social Security Act, would have become payable) at or before the time of the filing of such waiver.

Damn, look at that, there are actually religious exceptions to tax laws. These same exceptions apply to to Obamacare. If the universe were as simple minded as you are Obamacare was just rendered moot. Fortunately for the universe, it is smarter than you are.

 

[jillian]

The Justice Department last week presented the Newland family of Colorado--who own Hercules Industries, a heating, ventilation and air-conditioning business--with what amounted to an ultimatum: Give up your religion or your business.

“Hercules Industries has ‘made no showing of a religious belief which requires that [it] engage in the [HVAC] business,” the Justice Department said in a formal filing in the U.S. District Court for the District of Colorado.

In response to the Justice Department’s argument that the Newlands can either give up practicing their religion or give up owning their business, the Alliance Defending Freedom, which is representing the family, said in a reply brief: "[T]o the extent the government is arguing that its mandate does not really burden the Newlands because they are free to abandon their jobs, their livelihoods, and their property so that others can take over Hercules and comply, this expulsion from business would be an extreme form of government burden.”

DOJ to Colorado Family: Give Up Your Religion or Your Business | CNSNews.com

great misrepresentation of what the filing says.
'
reality: a secular for-profit business has no religious exemption from complying with law.

why do you hate this country?

i think you should go live in a theocracy.

 

[jillian]

Damn, look at that, there are actually religious exceptions to tax laws. These same exceptions apply to to Obamacare. If the universe were as simple minded as you are Obamacare was just rendered moot. Fortunately for the universe, it is smarter than you are.

not for secular businesses. nice try.

but i do love how you hate rules... except when they control women.

 

[tererun]

Point 1. The bible says absolutely nothing about Birth control. So their point that it is a great part of their religion is incorrect. their own instruction book does not say a thing about it.

If you are going to run under the idea trhat your religion allows you to break the law then I have a religion that says i have every right to shoot an idiot. If you really want to allow the law to be circumvented by religion I ask you politely line up to be executed because i would hate to have to get tired chasing you. Otherwise, we all have to abide by the laws of society despite our religious beliefs, and that means discrimination by commercial enterprise is illegal, and this is clear discrimination against women.

If they find that their business is causing them to run contrary to their religion, which it is not, then they can sell their business and go into employment somewhere where they are not responsible for providing medical services to women like the law requires.

Oh, and finally the bible tells us all slavery is legal and appropriate. I guess yunder their law they do not have to pay their employees as long as they follow the rules put forth on slave owners by the bible. It is something the bible clearly mentions in many locations despite not mentioning BC anywhere.

 

[tererun]

Damn, look at that, there are actually religious exceptions to tax laws. These same exceptions apply to to Obamacare. If the universe were as simple minded as you are Obamacare was just rendered moot. Fortunately for the universe, it is smarter than you are.

yes, if they wish to remove themselves from the for profit commercial business tax area and place themselves under the regulations for a NFP religious organization they can do so. of course that would mean the end of their present business as they would need to become a church organization and their present business does not serve that purpose at all. However, for a secular commercial business who is not under tax exempt NFP religious status they have no rights to violate the law based on their religious beliefs.

I do hope SCOTUS is quick about hammering these people back into compliance with the law.

 

[Cowman]

You have this on anything other than Conservative News Service? You know... something a little more unbiased. If you're going to play the game of bitching about huffingtonpost links... you can't go around and fucking post something that is way in right field.

Huffingtonpost is at least a news aggregate. CNS is just sleaze.

 

[Amelia]

You have this on anything other than Conservative News Service? You know... something a little more unbiased. If you're going to play the game of bitching about huffingtonpost links... you can't go around and fucking post something that is way in right field.

Huffingtonpost is at least a news aggregate. CNS is just sleaze.

Christian Science Monitor wasn't good enough for you?

 

[Annie]

You have this on anything other than Conservative News Service? You know... something a little more unbiased. If you're going to play the game of bitching about huffingtonpost links... you can't go around and fucking post something that is way in right field.

Huffingtonpost is at least a news aggregate. CNS is just sleaze.

Christian Science Monitor wasn't good enough for you?

I got no rep for that.