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Paul Ryan keeps saying our rights come from nature and God not the government. Actually, they come from "we the people" and we decide the rights that government puts foward through our representatives, referendums and so forth. Nature dictates some of our limitiations only. But we have been able to overcome a lot of those. God? If you believe in him, I thought he gave us free will to decide things for ourselves?
There is no god. If not for reasoning and collaboration between men......human beings created by the meeting of sperm and egg........there would be no laws, rights or the institutions needed to secure and protect them.
Yes.....in this nation, citizens are born with the rights that we have come to know and love. But you ought not lose sight of the fact that we....as in human beings....remain responsible for protecting them.
Except for the very first sentence, I completely agree with your post, LL.
The OP is asserting that government is the provider of these rights.
Government is we the people.
We the people wrote the founding documents.
The founding documents are what our Justices use to rule, on cases regarding rights.
Anyone can argue that the "Government" provided our rights, if you believe Government is we the people. To suggest otherwise is either being thick, or I guess Religious.
Which God? There are thousands.
Irony:
"Prove our Government doesn't provide our rights."
"Our Government's founding documents say so!"
Double entendre of irony, actually. wow.
Except for the very first sentence, I completely agree with your post, LL.
The OP is asserting that government is the provider of these rights.
Government is we the people.
We the people wrote the founding documents.
The founding documents are what our Justices use to rule, on cases regarding rights.
Anyone can argue that the "Government" provided our rights, if you believe Government is we the people. To suggest otherwise is either being thick, or I guess Religious.
One could be born on a remote island, with no system of government in place, and still be born with the fundamental right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Irony:
"Prove our Government doesn't provide our rights."
"Our Government's founding documents say so!"
Double entendre of irony, actually. wow.
So someone wrote down a truth.
Because that someone was part of a founding government makes it less true???
Paul Ryan keeps saying our rights come from nature and God not the government. Actually, they come from "we the people" and we decide the rights that government puts foward through our representatives, referendums and so forth. Nature dictates some of our limitiations only. But we have been able to overcome a lot of those. God? If you believe in him, I thought he gave us free will to decide things for ourselves?
Irony:
"Prove our Government doesn't provide our rights."
"Our Government's founding documents say so!"
Double entendre of irony, actually. wow.
So someone wrote down a truth.
Because that someone was part of a founding government makes it less true???
Something can't be a truth because you "believe" it to be.
Truth requires logical deducing.
I believe in our right to life, liberty and persuit of happiness.
I believe that in order to have the best human existence, we should have those.
But as far as proving we're "born with them," just because we find them ample? Makes no sense.
Paul Ryan keeps saying our rights come from nature and God not the government. Actually, they come from "we the people" and we decide the rights that government puts foward through our representatives, referendums and so forth. Nature dictates some of our limitiations only. But we have been able to overcome a lot of those. God? If you believe in him, I thought he gave us free will to decide things for ourselves?
The point is if God gives man freedom for life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness then there shouldn't be a government in place to take away those things to man from God.
It is too deep for your shallow mind.
We don't believe the government gives us rights, it takes away rights.
Paul Ryan keeps saying our rights come from nature and God not the government.
Actually, they come from "we the people" and we decide the rights that government ourselves?
So someone wrote down a truth.
Because that someone was part of a founding government makes it less true???
Something can't be a truth because you "believe" it to be.
Truth requires logical deducing.
I believe in our right to life, liberty and persuit of happiness.
I believe that in order to have the best human existence, we should have those.
But as far as proving we're "born with them," just because we find them ample? Makes no sense.
Are there those who truly believe that the founding documents say that the government PROVIDES our rights?
Proof please.
That is not what I'm arguing. You need not believe me or the hundreds of years of case law that support the idea of where rights come from. You need only read the law of the land. It's quite clear on the subject.
Again, if you're going to steer me to legal documents or case law to justify this or that social conception of rights, you're making my point for me.
They're not baked into the metaphysical fabric of reality, they're baked into the social institutions and legal frameworks (as well as public opinion and ideology) that comprise civilization.
Declaration of Independence is not law, merely a statement of why we left Great Britain.
Our Constitution is a secular document, which in no way states our rights are God given.