Coal Use Is Reaching Record Levels In India And China

[Markle]

So, your argument is that if the house is already on fire, what we should do is pour on a gallon of gasoline. Hard to point our finger at them when we are failing to address the problem.

How are"we" not addressing the problem?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

But if the 1% can make more money, the "Conservatives" here are just fine with that.

If they're using coal in India and China....they shouldn't make any money?
Even if it prevents starvation in India and China, they shouldn't use coal?
Poor people should stay poor, because coal is bad?

 

[Doc7505]

It's crazy that the world was 2C warmer with 120 ppm less CO2, right?

Maybe you should be telling these things to both Xi Jinping and Ram Nath Kovind. I'm sure that they will carefully listen to you you and still go on their merry ways.
No matter what we do the CO2 and CH4 will continue to rise. It not only due to world manufacturing. There are many factors involved and America cannot solve it alone.

 

[ding]

Maybe you should be telling these things to both Xi Jinping and Ram Nath Kovind. I'm sure that they will carefully listen to you you and still go on their merry ways.
No matter what we do the CO2 and CH4 will continue to rise. It not only due to world manufacturing. There are many factors involved and America cannot solve it alone.

But you believe that if the planet has more CO2 it should be warmer, right?

That is what you believe, right? More CO2 equals more temperature, right?

 

[ding]

There are many factors involved and America cannot solve it alone.

Many factors for what? That less CO2 led to warmer temperatures? I'm all ears? Please do tell me about it.

Or is it that the many factors is that the US is not the problem with CO2 emissions so we'd have to help pay for other countries to reduce their CO2?

 

[Markle]

The previous interglacial had, at it's peak, 300 ppm of CO2, and about 700 ppb of CH4. At present, we are at 410+ ppm of CO2 and 1450+ ppb of CH4. The only reason we are not much warmer than we are at present is the thermal inertia of our oceans. However, we are rapidly warming, and what is already in the pipeline will put us well above the previous temperatures. One must also remember that at only a 20 PPM increase, the sea levels were about 20 feet higher.

Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not.

As you know too, the USA could halt the production of all greenhouse gases and that wouldn't affect the world one iota.

China has hundreds of ultra-clean coal plants under construction and in planning. They also have more nuclear power plants under construction and in the planning stage than the rest of the world combined.

China learned from us that vital to a strong economy is cheap, plentiful energy. China is rapidly moving in that direction all while the Democrats, led by the far-left, are pushing and shoving us toward far more expensive energy and less reliable grids.

 

[Doc7505]

Many factors for what? That less CO2 led to warmer temperatures? I'm all ears? Please do tell me about it.

Or is it that the many factors is that the US is not the problem with CO2 emissions so we'd have to help pay for other countries to reduce their CO2?

~~~~~~
Look at it this way:
With all that ice it will cool the oceans again.

Scientists warn Antarctic glacier could collapse, raise sea levels at least a foot

Scientists are warning an Antarctic glacier could collapse and cause sea levels to raise at least a foot in the next decade. The scientists said Monday at the American Geophysical Union&n…

thehill.com

​

 

[ding]

~~~~~~
Look at it this way:
With all that ice it will cool the oceans again.

Scientists warn Antarctic glacier could collapse, raise sea levels at least a foot

Scientists are warning an Antarctic glacier could collapse and cause sea levels to raise at least a foot in the next decade. The scientists said Monday at the American Geophysical Union&n…

thehill.com

​

That's usually what happens in an interglacial cycle. We still have another 2C to go to reach the temperature of previous interglacial cycles.

The last interglacial cycle sea level was 26 ft higher than today. And you can't blame man for that, now can you?

 

[Old Rocks]

Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not.

As you know too, the USA could halt the production of all greenhouse gases and that wouldn't affect the world one iota.

China has hundreds of ultra-clean coal plants under construction and in planning. They also have more nuclear power plants under construction and in the planning stage than the rest of the world combined.

China learned from us that vital to a strong economy is cheap, plentiful energy. China is rapidly moving in that direction all while the Democrats, led by the far-left, are pushing and shoving us toward far more expensive energy and less reliable grids.

Pure bullshit. No nation is putting in more renewables than China. Unfortunately, no nation is burning more coal than China. As they try to meet the rising expectations of the populace, they need more energy. An unfortunate box they have themselves in, because no nation is suffering more from a changing climate than China.

If we stopped producing GHGs, that would be the second biggest emitter of GHGs gone down to zero. China is #1, US is #2, and India is #3.

Even factoring in grid scale energy storage, renewables, solar and wind, and now the least expensive form of new generation.

Levelized Cost of Energy+

Levelized Cost of Energy+

www.lazard.com

 

[Markle]

Pure bullshit. No nation is putting in more renewables than China. Unfortunately, no nation is burning more coal than China. As they try to meet the rising expectations of the populace, they need more energy. An unfortunate box they have themselves in, because no nation is suffering more from a changing climate than China.

If we stopped producing GHGs, that would be the second biggest emitter of GHGs gone down to zero. China is #1, US is #2, and India is #3.

Even factoring in grid scale energy storage, renewables, solar and wind, and now the least expensive form of new generation.
View attachment 577729

Levelized Cost of Energy+

Levelized Cost of Energy+

www.lazard.com

Not at all surprising. I ask one question and you throw up a bunch of stuff totally unrelated to the issue being discussed.

No one said China was not producing and using every possible form of energy.

Allow me to bring you back to the request you ignored. "Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not."

 

[Old Rocks]

Not at all surprising. I ask one question and you throw up a bunch of stuff totally unrelated to the issue being discussed.

No one said China was not producing and using every possible form of energy.

Allow me to bring you back to the request you ignored. "Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not."

OK.

Abstract​

Climate change is a critical factor affecting biodiversity. However, the quantitative relationship between temperature change and extinction is unclear. Here, we analyze magnitudes and rates of temperature change and extinction rates of marine fossils through the past 450 million years (Myr). The results show that both the rate and magnitude of temperature change are significantly positively correlated with the extinction rate of marine animals. Major mass extinctions in the Phanerozoic can be linked to thresholds in climate change (warming or cooling) that equate to magnitudes >5.2 °C and rates >10 °C/Myr. The significant relationship between temperature change and extinction still exists when we exclude the five largest mass extinctions of the Phanerozoic. Our findings predict that a temperature increase of 5.2 °C above the pre-industrial level at present rates of increase would likely result in mass extinction comparable to that of the major Phanerozoic events, even without other, non-climatic anthropogenic impacts.

Thresholds of temperature change for mass extinctions - Nature Communications

The linkage between temperature change and extinction rates in the fossil record is well-known qualitatively but little explored quantitatively. Here the authors investigate the relationship of marine animal extinctions with rate and magnitude of temperature change across the last 450 million...

www.nature.com

 

[Indeependent]

So, your argument is that if the house is already on fire, what we should do is pour on a gallon of gasoline. Hard to point our finger at them when we are failing to address the problem.

There is no argument.
That fact is that India and China are giving everyone else THE MIDDLE FINGER.

 

[Old Rocks]

How Modern Emissions Compare to Ancient, Extinction-Level Events​

Researchers find that a pulse of volcanic activity spanning several hundred years released as much carbon dioxide into the atmosphere as anthropogenic emissions projections for the 21st century.

How Modern Emissions Compare to Ancient, Extinction-Level Events - Eos

Researchers find that a pulse of volcanic activity spanning several hundred years released as much carbon dioxide into the atmosphere as anthropogenic emissions projections for the 21st century.

eos.org

 

[Old Rocks]

There is no argument.
That fact is that India and China are giving everyone else THE MIDDLE FINGER.

Then so are we, as we are the #2 emitter of GHGs.

 

[Indeependent]

Then so are we, as we are the #2 emitter of GHGs.

The entire Green Talk is bullshit since it costs way more to be green until we figure out the technology.

 

[Old Rocks]

Taking this reasoning forward in time, Rothman predicts that, given the recent rise in carbon dioxide emissions over a relatively short timescale, a sixth extinction will depend on whether a critical amount of carbon is added to the oceans. That amount, he calculates, is about 310 gigatons, which he estimates to be roughly equivalent to the amount of carbon that human activities will have added to the world’s oceans by the year 2100.

Does this mean that mass extinction will soon follow at the turn of the century? Rothman says it would take some time — about 10,000 years — for such ecological disasters to play out. However, he says that by 2100 the world may have tipped into “unknown territory.”

“This is not saying that disaster occurs the next day,” Rothman says. “It’s saying that, if left unchecked, the carbon cycle would move into a realm which would be no longer stable, and would behave in a way that would be difficult to predict. In the geologic past, this type of behavior is associated with mass extinction.

Mathematics predicts a sixth mass extinction

By 2100, oceans may hold enough carbon to launch mass extermination of species in future millennia.

news.mit.edu

 

[Old Rocks]

Not at all surprising. I ask one question and you throw up a bunch of stuff totally unrelated to the issue being discussed.

No one said China was not producing and using every possible form of energy.

Allow me to bring you back to the request you ignored. "Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not."

http://www.drroyspencer.com/2021/12/uah-global-temperature-update-for-november-2021-0-08-deg-c/

 

[Concerned American]

he estimates

Sounds like the good ol' democrat mantra. Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda while the ones sounding the alarm the loudest are buying beachfront in MA and FL. We hear the same thing with covid. Estimations and projections. BS. Show some facts and some leaders that believe and practice what they are trying to convince everyone else to do.

 

[initforme]

The air in China is bad. Is it fair to make people sick? Where's the balance. I'm not against coal I believe we should force coal companies to double miners wages. If they dont they are fined heavily.

 

[Markle]

OK.

Abstract​

Climate change is a critical factor affecting biodiversity. However, the quantitative relationship between temperature change and extinction is unclear. Here, we analyze magnitudes and rates of temperature change and extinction rates of marine fossils through the past 450 million years (Myr). The results show that both the rate and magnitude of temperature change are significantly positively correlated with the extinction rate of marine animals. Major mass extinctions in the Phanerozoic can be linked to thresholds in climate change (warming or cooling) that equate to magnitudes >5.2 °C and rates >10 °C/Myr. The significant relationship between temperature change and extinction still exists when we exclude the five largest mass extinctions of the Phanerozoic. Our findings predict that a temperature increase of 5.2 °C above the pre-industrial level at present rates of increase would likely result in mass extinction comparable to that of the major Phanerozoic events, even without other, non-climatic anthropogenic impacts.

Thresholds of temperature change for mass extinctions - Nature Communications

The linkage between temperature change and extinction rates in the fossil record is well-known qualitatively but little explored quantitatively. Here the authors investigate the relationship of marine animal extinctions with rate and magnitude of temperature change across the last 450 million...

www.nature.com

You still refuse to answer the question. Why not just say you lied in a futile attempt to make a false point?

Allow me to bring you back to the request you ignored. "Please show us your reliable source and working links proving that we are rapidly warning. As you know we are not."