Can we talk about what Obama actually DID?

[bendog]

The Senate passed a bipartisan bill with 68 votes...seriously, in this divided government, 68 votes in the Senate on an immigration bill that the Boehner has refused to allow the full House to vote on...because it will pass. This bill was passed by the Senate over 500 days ago.

Why is it they need a bill?

They don't need one now, because Obama has redefined "wedge issue." It's a triangular piece of wood, he puts between the butt cheeks of the gop that he brings his Marxist socialist Muslim boots down upon, hard.

 

[jc456]

Here is your problem.

We DON'T agree that the immigration system is fucked up.

The system is just fine.

It is the people administering the program that are fucked up. I think we should press criminal charges against them Myself.

If we simply enforced our existing immigration laws, there would be no problem at all.

Well, that is not true Darkwind, we do have problems with our immigration policy and it extends from when Immigration reform was passed under President Reagan. President Reagan's plan had border enforcement and very harsh penalties for American Companies hiring illegals....with his Amnesty.

When the bill finally passed, Congress STRIPPED the hard penalties for employers that hire illegals and didn't fund increased border security for a couple more decades.

THIS is where Reagan's Immigration Reform went wrong....and THIS is why we have more illegals today than ever before....not Reagan's Amnesty....Reagan gives very eloquent reasons why....amnesty was important....but Congress gutting the bill of any teeth to stop illegal immigration from continuing, is where the bill failed us.

Congress needs to put some teeth in an immigration policy that stops illegal immigration from continuing and harsh penalties for employers that hire illegals stops illegal immigration at its ROOT.

These people are coming here to better their lives by getting jobs.

No jobs to be had for new illegals, no one wanting to risk death to cross the border to get here....for no jobs available for them.

1. It was a law written by a Democrat Congress. Calling it Reagan's bill does not lend much in the way of credibility to your argument.

2. There are laws still on the books regarding immigration that predate the 80's amnesty bill, which was to be a "One Time" deal.

So, again, let Me reiterate. Enforce the immigration laws that are on the books, and companies along with border jumpers, get fined, penalized and/or jailed or deported.

The real problem with immigration is its lack of enforcement. Plain and simple.

Start with enforcing current law. Then look at what area's are lacking...

Then...........and get this....


Fix ONLY those areas that are lacking. Like border enforcement and the like.

The bill passed by the Senate is a farce, as is ANY bill that claims to be "comprehensive".

you've misunderstood, Reagan's Proposal on Immigration was GOOD, it had teeth, with its amnesty...

congress chose to STRIP Reagan's Immigration proposal of teeth...

Still, you miss understand. This in no way, prevents other laws (prior laws and existing laws) from being enforced. It is STILL illegal for companies to hire border jumpers. It is STILL illegal for border jumpers to pick produce without a work visa. It is STILL illegal to allow border jumpers to remain in this country.

These laws exist, and CAN be enforced. The fact that they are NOT enforced is the entire problem with our immigration system.

Problems like companies providing incentive for border jumpers to remain hidden in the shadows, taking jobs from US Citizens, can be fixed by simply enforcing existing laws.

Our borders are not secure enough? We don't need an 'comprehensive immigration bill' to cover hit. Enforce current law. Given the very worst case scenario, write a law that enforces the border.

NOTHING ELSE should be in the bill.

Companies finding loopholes to hiring border jumpers? Enforce existing laws. If they are not enough....write a law that jails Executives who bypass the existing law. NOTHING ELSE should be in that bill.

No person not here legally, should be allowed to remain. If they have children born here, give them a Social Security card and tell them to return when they are 18.

Stop breaking up families and deport ALL OF THEM.

Oh, and write a law that does ONLY that, and nothing else.

Americans are dying to pick the produce.

dude they are Americans, you mean US citizens right?

 

[jc456]

The Senate passed a bipartisan bill with 68 votes...seriously, in this divided government, 68 votes in the Senate on an immigration bill that the Boehner has refused to allow the full House to vote on...because it will pass. This bill was passed by the Senate over 500 days ago.

Why is it they need a bill?

They don't need one now, because Obama has redefined "wedge issue." It's a triangular piece of wood, he puts between the butt cheeks of the gop that he brings his Marxist socialist Muslim boots down upon, hard.

they never needed one.Again, Obama injects himself once he is a traitor!!!

 

[jc456]

Politically it is a clever move. POTUS has boxed the GOP into a corner they should have seen this coming and have known threatening the pres would not work. Basically, you got beat at your own game in a masterful move.

Check- your move GOP. Better think long and hard about your next move. Dummies.

Pass a bill or update the current one and enforce it. POTUS will veto whatever you pass for round 1. Obviously you need to be told this since you missed the last political trick pulled on you. Amateurs.

I would do nothing. I would start enforcing the laws on the books and let it go from there. As soon as Obama tries his treasonist act, he should be declared a traitor and at the end of his term arrested.

 

[bendog]

Politically it is a clever move. POTUS has boxed the GOP into a corner they should have seen this coming and have known threatening the pres would not work. Basically, you got beat at your own game in a masterful move.

Check- your move GOP. Better think long and hard about your next move. Dummies.

Pass a bill or update the current one and enforce it. POTUS will veto whatever you pass for round 1. Obviously you need to be told this since you missed the last political trick pulled on you. Amateurs.

I would do nothing. I would start enforcing the laws on the books and let it go from there. As soon as Obama tries his treasonist act, he should be declared a traitor and at the end of his term arrested.

The gop can't enforce anything, because only the DOJ can intitiate deporting anyone.

 

[bendog]

The Senate passed a bipartisan bill with 68 votes...seriously, in this divided government, 68 votes in the Senate on an immigration bill that the Boehner has refused to allow the full House to vote on...because it will pass. This bill was passed by the Senate over 500 days ago.

Why is it they need a bill?

They don't need one now, because Obama has redefined "wedge issue." It's a triangular piece of wood, he puts between the butt cheeks of the gop that he brings his Marxist socialist Muslim boots down upon, hard.

they never needed one.Again, Obama injects himself once he is a traitor!!!

Exactly, McConnell and Boehner were lying there asses off on calls for bipartisan immigration reform. Obama called them on it. Those in the gop like Jeb, McCain, Graham and Christie are left out in the dark. And the naysayers who want everyone deported are likewise stymied for two years. And this is set up for a 2016 campaign issue. Pass the popcorn.

 

[TemplarKormac]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

You're missing the fact that Obama, among others are nullifying the power of our Legislature by executive fiat. Moreover, Republicans and Democrats have differing opinions on how to fix the system. Democrats would much rather grant amnesty/citizenship (in my mind further damaging the system), Republicans would much rather deport the lot of them.

For our legislative body to have any power, a president must act within his means.

 

[Borillar]

Can we talk about what Obama actually DID?

Sure, he lied his ass off, sided with foreign criminals over Americans, and ignored the will of the American people. Voters told Obama NO we don't agree with you and Obama said fuck y'all.

So did Reagan, it's something that has been going on since the early eighties. When union busters got Reagan, the ex president of the screen actors guild, to be anti-union...

I don't disagree, Reagan, Bush, Obama all screwed over Americans siding with illegals. Under Reagan's amnesty the damn border was supposed to be secured but of course lying Democrats reneged on that part of the deal. And 10 years later studies proved Reagan's amnesty was a net loss for our economy.

It was suppose to be secured under Bush but it was a half assed job that was left undone....

Again no argument from me. This sometimes confuses the left but we conservatives have NO PROBLEM calling Republican presidents on the carpet and slamming them for things like this. The left on the other hand, a Dem president could kill and eat a puppy and they would defend him.

BS. One hardly ever sees a conservative slam a Republican president. That breaks the "11th Commandment". When the massive clusterfuck Bush was president, you couldn't criticize him for fear of being trashed as un-American. You're either with us or against us - no middle ground with Republicans. Now, years after the fact, you will find some muted criticism of Bush, but always with a qualifier that some Democrat at some time did something as bad. Bush lied us into a war, but Clinton got a blowjob.

 

[Darkwind]

Well......I'm thinking, that they have to wait to actually be sworn in to write a bill.

Well yes, that would be true.

So I guess that means you haven't seen anything either.

.

Well first Harry Reid will do nothing. So what's the point of brining any new bill in until the new congress is in session.

Okay, I'll try this one more time.

Have you seen anything about the Republicans creating a new bill to give to Obama after the new Congress has been sworn in?

So far, I've seen two responses from the GOP:

1. "This is unconstitutional! He can't do this! He's a monarch!" and
2. "We don't need to present a new bill because (insert various excuses to not write a new bill here)"

So, last try, I'll assume you have not heard otherwise.

Correct?

.

no I haven't and I told you why? Dude what the f is wrong with you?

Well, who knows what the f is wrong with me.

But I did notice that you twice went back to the "they can't do anything until they're sworn in" schtick, which I have already pointed out. That looks like a dodge, so I tried to make things absolutely as clear and simple as possible to avoid future dodge attempts.

So you haven't heard anything. Great. That's because they're dodging too.

Just as I said.

.

It is NOT a dodge. Sheesh.....The Republicans cannot do anything until they take actual control of Congress. How hard is that to understand?

BTW.....If you haven't heard about the various bills and debates on how to work the law to address issues of immigration, then you have had your head in a hole somewhere. The GOP has always said they want to address the issue of immigration by topic (meaning piecemeal) rather than a comprehensive bill. To say that they have not said what they are going to do is really a lame attempt to move the conversation away from the fact that no one can detail exactly what is wrong with the current immigration laws let alone the need to pass more worthless laws.

Simply enforce what exists first. Then analyze if something needs to be tweaked.

How hard can it be?

 

[Care4all]

Well yes, that would be true.

So I guess that means you haven't seen anything either.

.

Well first Harry Reid will do nothing. So what's the point of brining any new bill in until the new congress is in session.

Okay, I'll try this one more time.

Have you seen anything about the Republicans creating a new bill to give to Obama after the new Congress has been sworn in?

So far, I've seen two responses from the GOP:

1. "This is unconstitutional! He can't do this! He's a monarch!" and
2. "We don't need to present a new bill because (insert various excuses to not write a new bill here)"

So, last try, I'll assume you have not heard otherwise.

Correct?

.

no I haven't and I told you why? Dude what the f is wrong with you?

Well, who knows what the f is wrong with me.

But I did notice that you twice went back to the "they can't do anything until they're sworn in" schtick, which I have already pointed out. That looks like a dodge, so I tried to make things absolutely as clear and simple as possible to avoid future dodge attempts.

So you haven't heard anything. Great. That's because they're dodging too.

Just as I said.

.

It is NOT a dodge. Sheesh.....The Republicans cannot do anything until they take actual control of Congress. How hard is that to understand?

BTW.....If you haven't heard about the various bills and debates on how to work the law to address issues of immigration, then you have had your head in a hole somewhere. The GOP has always said they want to address the issue of immigration by topic (meaning piecemeal) rather than a comprehensive bill. To say that they have not said what they are going to do is really a lame attempt to move the conversation away from the fact that no one can detail exactly what is wrong with the current immigration laws let alone the need to pass more worthless laws.

Simply enforce what exists first. Then analyze if something needs to be tweaked.

How hard can it be?

WHY? The House already is a Republican majority and have hundreds of bills they have passed...mostly on one issue...killing obamacare but none the less, they passed the House....

The Republican house can certainly begin with immigration reform the way the republicans would like to see it and get it passed with their majority, and once the senate becomes The Republican majority, they can send over their republican bill.

Why do you think repubs need to wait for the Senate to change hands and the Senate has to initiate an immigration reform bill?

 

[blackhawk]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

The fact that Obama does not have the legal authority to do what he did a fact he himself has stated over 20 times during the last few years. It is very disturbing when a President any President can say over and over I do not have the authority to do something and then just decide yes I do. Also this will not end with Obama the Presidents who follow him will try to increase the size and scope of the executive order as well.Which leads to the questions how much power is to much in the executive branch and once you reach that point how do you take it away and restore the balance? To many on both sides are becoming way to comfortable with this ends justifiys the means mindset.

 

[Care4all]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

The fact that Obama does not have the legal authority to do what he did a fact he himself has stated over 20 times during the last few years. It is very disturbing when a President any President can say over and over I do not have the authority to do something and then just decide yes I do. Also this will not end with Obama the Presidents who follow him will try to increase the size and scope of the executive order as well.Which leads to the questions how much power is to much in the executive branch and once you reach that point how do you take it away and restore the balance? To many on both sides are becoming way to comfortable with this ends justifiys the means mindset.

Actually you are incorrect...President Obama never said he could not do, what he did....NEVER, NOT ONCE, let alone the 20 times you/the right wing media says he did. He was speaking about comprehensive immigration reform including amnesty...

He did not give amnesty....

In FACT, Pres. Obama has said many many times that he intended to do what he could legally do on immigration, within the law...primarily IF congress took no action themselves....and this is what he did, exactly what he said he would do...within the law.

 

[blackhawk]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

The fact that Obama does not have the legal authority to do what he did a fact he himself has stated over 20 times during the last few years. It is very disturbing when a President any President can say over and over I do not have the authority to do something and then just decide yes I do. Also this will not end with Obama the Presidents who follow him will try to increase the size and scope of the executive order as well.Which leads to the questions how much power is to much in the executive branch and once you reach that point how do you take it away and restore the balance? To many on both sides are becoming way to comfortable with this ends justifiys the means mindset.

Actually you are incorrect...President Obama never said he could not do, what he did....NEVER, NOT ONCE, let alone the 20 times you/the right wing media says he did. He was speaking about comprehensive immigration reform including amnesty...

He did not give amnesty....

In FACT, Pres. Obama has said many many times that he intended to do what he could legally do on immigration, within the law...primarily IF congress took no action themselves....and this is what he did, exactly what he said he would do...within the law.

Your partisan denials do not change the facts.

1. “We’ve got a government designed by the Founders so that there’d be checks and balances. You don’t want a president who’s too powerful or a Congress that’s too powerful or a court that’s too powerful. Everybody’s got their own role. Congress’s job is to pass legislation. The president can veto it or he can sign it. … I believe in the Constitution and I will obey the Constitution of the United States. We're not going to use signing statements as a way of doing an end-run around Congress.” (5/19/08)

2. “Comprehensive reform, that's how we're going to solve this problem. … Anybody who tells you it's going to be easy or that I can wave a magic wand and make it happen hasn't been paying attention to how this town works.” (5/5/10)

3. “[T]here are those in the immigrants’ rights community who have argued passionately that we should simply provide those who are [here] illegally with legal status, or at least ignore the laws on the books and put an end to deportation until we have better laws. ... I believe such an indiscriminate approach would be both unwise and unfair. It would suggest to those thinking about coming here illegally that there will be no repercussions for such a decision. And this could lead to a surge in more illegal immigration. And it would also ignore the millions of people around the world who are waiting in line to come here legally. Ultimately, our nation, like all nations, has the right and obligation to control its borders and set laws for residency and citizenship. And no matter how decent they are, no matter their reasons, the 11 million who broke these laws should be held accountable.” (7/1/10)

4. “I do have an obligation to make sure that I am following some of the rules. I can't simply ignore lawsthat are out there. I've got to work to make sure that they are changed.” (10/14/10)

5. “I am president, I am not king. I can't do these things just by myself. We have a system of government that requires the Congress to work with the Executive Branch to make it happen. I'm committed to making it happen, but I've got to have some partners to do it. … The main thing we have to do to stop deportations is to change the laws. … [T]he most important thing that we can do is to change the law because the way the system works – again, I just want to repeat, I'm president, I'm not king. If Congress has laws on the books that says that people who are here who are not documented have to be deported, then I can exercise some flexibility in terms of where we deploy our resources, to focus on people who are really causing problems as a opposed to families who are just trying to work and support themselves. But there's a limit to the discretion that I can show because I am obliged to execute the law. That's what the Executive Branch means. I can't just make the laws up by myself.So the most important thing that we can do is focus on changing the underlying laws.” (10/25/10)

6. “America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the President, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job. But I can advocate for changes in the law so that we have a country that is both respectful of the law but also continues to be a great nation of immigrants. … With respect to the notion that I can just suspend deportations through executive order, that’s just not the case, because there are laws on the books that Congress has passed …. [W]e’ve got three branches of government. Congress passes the law. The executive branch’s job is to enforce and implement those laws. And then the judiciary has to interpret the laws. There are enough laws on the books by Congress that are very clear in terms of how we have to enforce our immigration system that for me to simply through executive order ignore those congressional mandates would not conform with my appropriate role as President.” (3/28/11)

7. “I can't solve this problem by myself. … [W]e're going to have to have bipartisan support in order to make it happen. … I can't do it by myself. We're going to have to change the laws in Congress, but I'm confident we can make it happen.” (4/20/11)

8. “I know some here wish that I could just bypass Congress and change the law myself. But that’s not how democracy works. See, democracy is hard. But it’s right.Changing our laws means doing the hard work of changing minds and changing votes, one by one.” (4/29/11)

9. “Sometimes when I talk to immigration advocates, they wish I could just bypass Congress and change the law myself. But that’s not how a democracy works. What we really need to do is to keep up the fight to pass genuine, comprehensive reform. That is the ultimate solution to this problem. That's what I’m committed to doing.” (5/10/11)

10.“I swore an oath to uphold the laws on the books …. Now, I know some people want me to bypass Congress and change the laws on my own. Believe me, the idea of doing things on my own is very tempting. I promise you. Not just on immigration reform. But that's not how our system works. That’s not how our democracy functions. That's not how our Constitution is written.” (7/25/11)

11. “So what we’ve tried to do is within the constraints of the laws on the books, we’ve tried to be as fair, humane, just as we can, recognizing, though, that the laws themselves need to be changed. … The most important thing for your viewers and listeners and readers to understand is that in order to change our laws, we’ve got to get it through the House of Representatives, which is currently controlled by Republicans, and we’ve got to get 60 votes in the Senate. … Administratively, we can't ignore the law. … I just have to continue to say this notion that somehow I can just change the laws unilaterally is just not true. We are doing everything we can administratively. But the fact of the matter is there are laws on the books that I have to enforce. And I think there’s been a great disservice done to the cause of getting the DREAM Act passed and getting comprehensive immigration passed by perpetrating the notion that somehow, by myself, I can go and do these things. It’s just not true. … We live in a democracy. You have to pass bills through the legislature, and then I can sign it. And if all the attention is focused away from the legislative process, then that is going to lead to a constant dead-end. We have to recognize how the system works, and then apply pressure to those places where votes can be gotten and, ultimately, we can get this thing solved.” (9/28/11)

In June 2012, President Obama unilaterally granted deferred action for childhood arrivals (DACA), allowing “eligible individuals who do not present a risk to national security or public safety … to request temporary relief from deportation proceedings and apply for work authorization.” He then argued that he had already done everything he could legally do on his own:

13.“Now, what I’ve always said is, as the head of the executive branch, there’s a limit to what I can do. Part of the reason that deportations went up was Congress put a whole lot of money into it, and when you have a lot of resources and a lot more agents involved, then there are going to be higher numbers. What we’ve said is, let’s make sure that you’re not misdirecting those resources. But we’re still going to, ultimately, have to change the laws in order to avoid some of the heartbreaking stories that you see coming up occasionally. And that’s why this continues to be a top priority of mine. … And we will continue to make sure that how we enforce is done as fairly and justly as possible. But until we have a law in place that provides a pathway for legalization and/or citizenship for the folks in question, we’re going to continue to be bound by the law. … And so part of the challenge as President is constantly saying, ‘what authorities do I have?’” (9/20/12)

14.“We are a nation of immigrants. … But we're also a nation of laws. So what I've said is, we need to fix a broken immigration system. And I've done everything that I can on my own[.]” (10/16/12)

15.“I'm not a king. I am the head of the executive branch of government. I'm required to follow the law. And that's what we've done. But what I've also said is, let's make sure that we're applying the law in a way that takes into account people's humanity. That's the reason that we moved forward on deferred action. Within the confines of the law we said, we have some discretion in terms of how we apply this law.” (1/30/13)

16.“I’m not a king. You know, my job as the head of the executive branch ultimately is to carry out the law. And, you know, when it comes to enforcement of our immigration laws, we’ve got some discretion. We can prioritize what we do. But we can’t simply ignore the law.When it comes to the dreamers, we were able to identify that group and say, ‘These folks are generally not a risk. They’re not involved in crime. … And so let’s prioritize our enforcement resources.’ But to sort through all the possible cases of everybody who might have a sympathetic story to tell is very difficult to do. This is why we need comprehensive immigration reform. To make sure that once and for all, in a way that is, you know, ratified by Congress, we can say that there is a pathway to citizenship for people who are staying out of trouble, who are trying to do the right thing, who’ve put down roots here. … My job is to carry out the law. And so Congress gives us a whole bunch of resources. They give us an order that we’ve got to go out there and enforce the laws that are on the books. … If this was an issue that I could do unilaterally I would have done it a long time ago. … The way our system works is Congress has to pass legislation. I then get an opportunity to sign it and implement it.” (1/30/13)

17.“This is something I’ve struggled with throughout my presidency. The problem is that I’m the president of the United States, I’m not the emperor of the United States.My job is to execute laws that are passed. And Congress right now has not changed what I consider to be a broken immigration system. And what that means is that we have certain obligations to enforce the laws that are in place even if we think that in many cases the results may be tragic.” (2/14/13)

18.“I think that it is very important for us to recognize that the way to solve this problem has to be legislative. I can do some things and have done some things that make a difference in the lives of people by determining how our enforcement should focus. … And we’ve been able to provide help through deferred action for young people …. But this is a problem that needs to be fixed legislatively.” (7/16/13)

19.“My job in the executive branch is supposed to be to carry out the laws that are passed. Congress has said ‘here is the law’ when it comes to those who are undocumented, and they've allocated a whole bunch of money for enforcement. And, what I have been able to do is to make a legal argument that I think is absolutely right, which is that given the resources that we have, we can't do everything that Congress has asked us to do. What we can do is then carve out the DREAM Act folks, saying young people who have basically grown up here are Americans that we should welcome. … But if we start broadening that, then essentially I would be ignoring the law in a way that I think would be very difficult to defend legally. So that's not an option. … What I've said is there is a there's a path to get this done, and that's through Congress.” (9/17/13)

20. “f, in fact, I could solve all these problems without passing laws in Congress, then I would do so. But we’re also a nation of laws. That’s part of our tradition. And so the easy way out is to try to yell and pretend like I can do something by violating our laws. And what I’m proposing is the harder path, which is to use our democratic processes to achieve the same goal that you want to achieve. … It is not simply a matter of us just saying we’re going to violate the law. That’s not our tradition. The great thing about this country is we have this wonderful process of democracy, and sometimes it is messy, and sometimes it is hard, but ultimately, justice and truth win out.” (11/25/13)

21.“I am the Champion-in-Chief of comprehensive immigration reform. But what I’ve said in the past remains true, which is until Congress passes a new law, then I am constrained in terms of what I am able to do. What I’ve done is to use my prosecutorial discretion, because you can’t enforce the laws across the board for 11 or 12 million people, there aren’t the resources there. What we’ve said is focus on folks who are engaged in criminal activity, focus on people who are engaged in gang activity. Do not focus on young people, who we’re calling DREAMers …. That already stretched my administrative capacity very far. But I was confident that that was the right thing to do. But at a certain point the reason that these deportations are taking place is, Congress said, ‘you have to enforce these laws.’ They fund the hiring of officials at the department that’s charged with enforcing. And I cannot ignore those laws any more than I could ignore, you know, any of the other laws that are on the books. That’s why it’s so important for us to get comprehensive immigration reform done this year.” (3/6/14)

22. “I think that I never have a green light [to push the limits of executive power]. I’m bound by the Constitution; I’m bound by separation of powers. There are some things we can’t do. Congress has the power of the purse, for example. … Congress has to pass a budget and authorize spending. So I don’t have a green light. … My preference in all these instances is to work with Congress, because not only can Congress do more, but it’s going to be longer-lasting.” (8/6/14)

 

[Yarddog]

Since when does a president have the right to force congress to write a bill? Keep hearing him say that immigration is broken,
but thats only because the laws are not enforced. Once people are allowed to stay here, who is going to enforce all the rules
that supposedly go along with Obamas action? No, nothing will be enforced because the end goal is amnesty, next the people
who are allowed to stay will bring there family members. reallisticaly i think its more like 50 million, because their already lying about
the base numbers.

All Obama has done is work hard to find a way around Congress by changing the definition of things, never forget these people in
Washington are mostly lawyers. They see the world through Academia and idealistic constructs. when Obama says he's trying to
prevent a tradgedy, its not the tradgedy of inner city black kids trying to get a future. Hes talking about the plight of foreign national
families. How about Writing a Bill to tell the Mexican government to get off their ASS and start taking care of their own people. They
have plenty of oil all they need is a little help to upgrade their process.

 

[BluesLegend]

Sure, he lied his ass off, sided with foreign criminals over Americans, and ignored the will of the American people. Voters told Obama NO we don't agree with you and Obama said fuck y'all.

So did Reagan, it's something that has been going on since the early eighties. When union busters got Reagan, the ex president of the screen actors guild, to be anti-union...

I don't disagree, Reagan, Bush, Obama all screwed over Americans siding with illegals. Under Reagan's amnesty the damn border was supposed to be secured but of course lying Democrats reneged on that part of the deal. And 10 years later studies proved Reagan's amnesty was a net loss for our economy.

It was suppose to be secured under Bush but it was a half assed job that was left undone....

Again no argument from me. This sometimes confuses the left but we conservatives have NO PROBLEM calling Republican presidents on the carpet and slamming them for things like this. The left on the other hand, a Dem president could kill and eat a puppy and they would defend him.

BS. One hardly ever sees a conservative slam a Republican president. That breaks the "11th Commandment". When the massive clusterfuck Bush was president, you couldn't criticize him for fear of being trashed as un-American. You're either with us or against us - no middle ground with Republicans. Now, years after the fact, you will find some muted criticism of Bush, but always with a qualifier that some Democrat at some time did something as bad. Bush lied us into a war, but Clinton got a blowjob.

Translation, you don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Care4all]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

The fact that Obama does not have the legal authority to do what he did a fact he himself has stated over 20 times during the last few years. It is very disturbing when a President any President can say over and over I do not have the authority to do something and then just decide yes I do. Also this will not end with Obama the Presidents who follow him will try to increase the size and scope of the executive order as well.Which leads to the questions how much power is to much in the executive branch and once you reach that point how do you take it away and restore the balance? To many on both sides are becoming way to comfortable with this ends justifiys the means mindset.

Actually you are incorrect...President Obama never said he could not do, what he did....NEVER, NOT ONCE, let alone the 20 times you/the right wing media says he did. He was speaking about comprehensive immigration reform including amnesty...

He did not give amnesty....

In FACT, Pres. Obama has said many many times that he intended to do what he could legally do on immigration, within the law...primarily IF congress took no action themselves....and this is what he did, exactly what he said he would do...within the law.

Your partisan denials do not change the facts.

1. “We’ve got a government designed by the Founders so that there’d be checks and balances. You don’t want a president who’s too powerful or a Congress that’s too powerful or a court that’s too powerful. Everybody’s got their own role. Congress’s job is to pass legislation. The president can veto it or he can sign it. … I believe in the Constitution and I will obey the Constitution of the United States. We're not going to use signing statements as a way of doing an end-run around Congress.” (5/19/08)

2. “Comprehensive reform, that's how we're going to solve this problem. … Anybody who tells you it's going to be easy or that I can wave a magic wand and make it happen hasn't been paying attention to how this town works.” (5/5/10)

3. “[T]here are those in the immigrants’ rights community who have argued passionately that we should simply provide those who are [here] illegally with legal status, or at least ignore the laws on the books and put an end to deportation until we have better laws. ... I believe such an indiscriminate approach would be both unwise and unfair. It would suggest to those thinking about coming here illegally that there will be no repercussions for such a decision. And this could lead to a surge in more illegal immigration. And it would also ignore the millions of people around the world who are waiting in line to come here legally. Ultimately, our nation, like all nations, has the right and obligation to control its borders and set laws for residency and citizenship. And no matter how decent they are, no matter their reasons, the 11 million who broke these laws should be held accountable.” (7/1/10)

4. “I do have an obligation to make sure that I am following some of the rules. I can't simply ignore lawsthat are out there. I've got to work to make sure that they are changed.” (10/14/10)

5. “I am president, I am not king. I can't do these things just by myself. We have a system of government that requires the Congress to work with the Executive Branch to make it happen. I'm committed to making it happen, but I've got to have some partners to do it. … The main thing we have to do to stop deportations is to change the laws. … [T]he most important thing that we can do is to change the law because the way the system works – again, I just want to repeat, I'm president, I'm not king. If Congress has laws on the books that says that people who are here who are not documented have to be deported, then I can exercise some flexibility in terms of where we deploy our resources, to focus on people who are really causing problems as a opposed to families who are just trying to work and support themselves. But there's a limit to the discretion that I can show because I am obliged to execute the law. That's what the Executive Branch means. I can't just make the laws up by myself.So the most important thing that we can do is focus on changing the underlying laws.” (10/25/10)

6. “America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the President, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job. But I can advocate for changes in the law so that we have a country that is both respectful of the law but also continues to be a great nation of immigrants. … With respect to the notion that I can just suspend deportations through executive order, that’s just not the case, because there are laws on the books that Congress has passed …. [W]e’ve got three branches of government. Congress passes the law. The executive branch’s job is to enforce and implement those laws. And then the judiciary has to interpret the laws. There are enough laws on the books by Congress that are very clear in terms of how we have to enforce our immigration system that for me to simply through executive order ignore those congressional mandates would not conform with my appropriate role as President.” (3/28/11)

7. “I can't solve this problem by myself. … [W]e're going to have to have bipartisan support in order to make it happen. … I can't do it by myself. We're going to have to change the laws in Congress, but I'm confident we can make it happen.” (4/20/11)

8. “I know some here wish that I could just bypass Congress and change the law myself. But that’s not how democracy works. See, democracy is hard. But it’s right.Changing our laws means doing the hard work of changing minds and changing votes, one by one.” (4/29/11)

9. “Sometimes when I talk to immigration advocates, they wish I could just bypass Congress and change the law myself. But that’s not how a democracy works. What we really need to do is to keep up the fight to pass genuine, comprehensive reform. That is the ultimate solution to this problem. That's what I’m committed to doing.” (5/10/11)

10.“I swore an oath to uphold the laws on the books …. Now, I know some people want me to bypass Congress and change the laws on my own. Believe me, the idea of doing things on my own is very tempting. I promise you. Not just on immigration reform. But that's not how our system works. That’s not how our democracy functions. That's not how our Constitution is written.” (7/25/11)

11. “So what we’ve tried to do is within the constraints of the laws on the books, we’ve tried to be as fair, humane, just as we can, recognizing, though, that the laws themselves need to be changed. … The most important thing for your viewers and listeners and readers to understand is that in order to change our laws, we’ve got to get it through the House of Representatives, which is currently controlled by Republicans, and we’ve got to get 60 votes in the Senate. … Administratively, we can't ignore the law. … I just have to continue to say this notion that somehow I can just change the laws unilaterally is just not true. We are doing everything we can administratively. But the fact of the matter is there are laws on the books that I have to enforce. And I think there’s been a great disservice done to the cause of getting the DREAM Act passed and getting comprehensive immigration passed by perpetrating the notion that somehow, by myself, I can go and do these things. It’s just not true. … We live in a democracy. You have to pass bills through the legislature, and then I can sign it. And if all the attention is focused away from the legislative process, then that is going to lead to a constant dead-end. We have to recognize how the system works, and then apply pressure to those places where votes can be gotten and, ultimately, we can get this thing solved.” (9/28/11)

In June 2012, President Obama unilaterally granted deferred action for childhood arrivals (DACA), allowing “eligible individuals who do not present a risk to national security or public safety … to request temporary relief from deportation proceedings and apply for work authorization.” He then argued that he had already done everything he could legally do on his own:

13.“Now, what I’ve always said is, as the head of the executive branch, there’s a limit to what I can do. Part of the reason that deportations went up was Congress put a whole lot of money into it, and when you have a lot of resources and a lot more agents involved, then there are going to be higher numbers. What we’ve said is, let’s make sure that you’re not misdirecting those resources. But we’re still going to, ultimately, have to change the laws in order to avoid some of the heartbreaking stories that you see coming up occasionally. And that’s why this continues to be a top priority of mine. … And we will continue to make sure that how we enforce is done as fairly and justly as possible. But until we have a law in place that provides a pathway for legalization and/or citizenship for the folks in question, we’re going to continue to be bound by the law. … And so part of the challenge as President is constantly saying, ‘what authorities do I have?’” (9/20/12)

14.“We are a nation of immigrants. … But we're also a nation of laws. So what I've said is, we need to fix a broken immigration system. And I've done everything that I can on my own[.]” (10/16/12)

15.“I'm not a king. I am the head of the executive branch of government. I'm required to follow the law. And that's what we've done. But what I've also said is, let's make sure that we're applying the law in a way that takes into account people's humanity. That's the reason that we moved forward on deferred action. Within the confines of the law we said, we have some discretion in terms of how we apply this law.” (1/30/13)

16.“I’m not a king. You know, my job as the head of the executive branch ultimately is to carry out the law. And, you know, when it comes to enforcement of our immigration laws, we’ve got some discretion. We can prioritize what we do. But we can’t simply ignore the law.When it comes to the dreamers, we were able to identify that group and say, ‘These folks are generally not a risk. They’re not involved in crime. … And so let’s prioritize our enforcement resources.’ But to sort through all the possible cases of everybody who might have a sympathetic story to tell is very difficult to do. This is why we need comprehensive immigration reform. To make sure that once and for all, in a way that is, you know, ratified by Congress, we can say that there is a pathway to citizenship for people who are staying out of trouble, who are trying to do the right thing, who’ve put down roots here. … My job is to carry out the law. And so Congress gives us a whole bunch of resources. They give us an order that we’ve got to go out there and enforce the laws that are on the books. … If this was an issue that I could do unilaterally I would have done it a long time ago. … The way our system works is Congress has to pass legislation. I then get an opportunity to sign it and implement it.” (1/30/13)

17.“This is something I’ve struggled with throughout my presidency. The problem is that I’m the president of the United States, I’m not the emperor of the United States.My job is to execute laws that are passed. And Congress right now has not changed what I consider to be a broken immigration system. And what that means is that we have certain obligations to enforce the laws that are in place even if we think that in many cases the results may be tragic.” (2/14/13)

18.“I think that it is very important for us to recognize that the way to solve this problem has to be legislative. I can do some things and have done some things that make a difference in the lives of people by determining how our enforcement should focus. … And we’ve been able to provide help through deferred action for young people …. But this is a problem that needs to be fixed legislatively.” (7/16/13)

19.“My job in the executive branch is supposed to be to carry out the laws that are passed. Congress has said ‘here is the law’ when it comes to those who are undocumented, and they've allocated a whole bunch of money for enforcement. And, what I have been able to do is to make a legal argument that I think is absolutely right, which is that given the resources that we have, we can't do everything that Congress has asked us to do. What we can do is then carve out the DREAM Act folks, saying young people who have basically grown up here are Americans that we should welcome. … But if we start broadening that, then essentially I would be ignoring the law in a way that I think would be very difficult to defend legally. So that's not an option. … What I've said is there is a there's a path to get this done, and that's through Congress.” (9/17/13)

20. “f, in fact, I could solve all these problems without passing laws in Congress, then I would do so. But we’re also a nation of laws. That’s part of our tradition. And so the easy way out is to try to yell and pretend like I can do something by violating our laws. And what I’m proposing is the harder path, which is to use our democratic processes to achieve the same goal that you want to achieve. … It is not simply a matter of us just saying we’re going to violate the law. That’s not our tradition. The great thing about this country is we have this wonderful process of democracy, and sometimes it is messy, and sometimes it is hard, but ultimately, justice and truth win out.” (11/25/13)

21.“I am the Champion-in-Chief of comprehensive immigration reform. But what I’ve said in the past remains true, which is until Congress passes a new law, then I am constrained in terms of what I am able to do. What I’ve done is to use my prosecutorial discretion, because you can’t enforce the laws across the board for 11 or 12 million people, there aren’t the resources there. What we’ve said is focus on folks who are engaged in criminal activity, focus on people who are engaged in gang activity. Do not focus on young people, who we’re calling DREAMers …. That already stretched my administrative capacity very far. But I was confident that that was the right thing to do. But at a certain point the reason that these deportations are taking place is, Congress said, ‘you have to enforce these laws.’ They fund the hiring of officials at the department that’s charged with enforcing. And I cannot ignore those laws any more than I could ignore, you know, any of the other laws that are on the books. That’s why it’s so important for us to get comprehensive immigration reform done this year.” (3/6/14)

22. “I think that I never have a green light [to push the limits of executive power]. I’m bound by the Constitution; I’m bound by separation of powers. There are some things we can’t do. Congress has the power of the purse, for example. … Congress has to pass a budget and authorize spending. So I don’t have a green light. … My preference in all these instances is to work with Congress, because not only can Congress do more, but it’s going to be longer-lasting.” (8/6/14)

Yes, none of those statements pertain to what he actually did, which is prioritize deportations within the law, with the workforce that he has been funded for by congress. Telling his workforce that since they are short handed, the illegals that they should focus on deporting or prosecuting, are the illegals in gangs, the illegals who are felons or who have committed crimes etc...

it is prioritizing.

Along with fulfilling the Sense of Congress who have said it was important not to break up the families of the American citizen child:

“We were influenced by the fact that Congress already recognized the relationship between child citizens and parents as a relationship Congress wants to protect,” the (administration) official said. “This was a sort of implementation of that congressional policy as opposed to the parents of Dreamers, which would be … slightly different …. We thought it was important to tie it to a congressional policy.”Obama announces immigration action plan - POLITICO

That is not changing the law, this is supporting those who congress has stated previously they wanted to protect.

That is enforcing the law within the realm of the workforce he has available and within the realm of illegal immigrants of whom congress has said they want to protect ...

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

"Can we talk about what Obama actually DID?"

Not with conservatives, no.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

What you're missing is that for most republicans immigration is a losing issue, where a significant number of the republican base is opposed to any type of immigration reform due to unwarranted fears that immigration will 'change America,' and no republican politician would dare upset the base.

Hence the demagoguery by most on the right with regard to lies about 'amnesty' and a 'path to citizenship.'

 

[Mac1958]

To many on both sides are becoming way to comfortable with this ends justifiys the means mindset.

Yup.

It's one thing to have radicalized partisan ideologues running around, we've always had them.

It's another when they're in elected office, or financially controlling those in elected office.

.

 

[candycorn]

.

Boy, I'm really failing to get this conversation going on other threads, so I'll try to start one.

From what I've seen the main takeaway from this act is that most illegals will not be deported if they have not been here long enough; they have to pass criminal and security background checks, they have to pay taxes and prove their eligibility to stay.

Seems like much ado about not that much to me.

I also heard him challenge the GOP Congress to pass a bill that will override this act. So, as I asked on another thread -- don't we all agree that our immigration system is fucked up? Don't we want to fix something that is important and fucked up?

And why, precisely, wouldn't the GOP jump at this opportunity to pass a bill and put it on Obama's desk?

What am I missing?

.

My problem is I don't trust the guy....

There is a problem with how we got here.
He can't wait a bit longer to get a bill passed?
We have a new Congress convening he is in such a rush he can't do it the right way....

Yeah I know the people have waited too long....

How about this....

Obama said at least 25 times he can't do what he now says he can....

Anyone want to explain what changed.
Did Valerie Jarrett proclaim him emperor and God....
Seriously....

How now all of a sudden Obama has powers he did not have a year ago....

And lastly...This is not the first time some sort of Amnesty has been done...
Why can't we enforce the laws on the books....
Are we going to have to go through this every 10 - 20 years...

I'll Join Mac1958 on this....

When you say, "Why can't we enforce the laws on the books....", are you talking about
tracking down
incarcerating
trying
convicting
deporting
eleven million people?