Can the US afford that $5tr?

[Saigon]

Toro -

It may not be hard to fimd $200 billion per year, but that only gets you back to Point Zero.

That does not reduce the deficit, that just means it does not get any larger.

 

[naturegirl]

Toro -

It may not be hard to fimd $200 billion per year, but that only gets you back to Point Zero.

That does not reduce the deficit, that just means it does not get any larger.

LMBO, that would be a huge improvement in what we've experienced lately.

 

[Mac1958]

Mac -

I really have no idea where you are going with this.

As I said about 3 pages back - I think everyone who is even vaguely interested in this story knows the $5 trillion figure refers to a kind of worse case scenario.

We can't talk about any other figure because Romney hasn't told us what the loopholes (and their potential value) might be. If he eventually does so and we end up with a shortfall of $3 trillion then I guess most of us will use that figure.

Saigon, there's no plan or hidden agenda here. I've just reached a point - probably exacerbated by the campaign - where the non-stop intellectual dishonesty in political debate is gonna give me a freakin' stroke. I don't understand why people can't just be honest, and it's occurred to me recently that it's insulting to me to think that people are assuming they get away with it.

Romney's "plan" is to "pay" for the tax cuts by closing tax loopholes and increasing tax receipts to the federal government via increased economic activity. And I truly don't understand why this needs to be so complicated. My best guess is that his opponents are simply being obtuse, which to me is yet another form of intellectual dishonesty. And that's where I get pretty cranky.

That's about it.

.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Skull Pilot -

So you are saying that Romney can cut $5 trillion from current spending - while also ploughing more into defence?

Where do you think the $5 trillion cuts will come from, exactly?

If you actually believe anyone can make 5 trillion in cuts then you're more naive than I thought.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Skull Pilot -

So you are saying that Romney can cut $5 trillion from current spending - while also ploughing more into defence?

Where do you think the $5 trillion cuts will come from, exactly?

If you actually believe anyone can make 5 trillion in cuts then you're more naive than I thought.

He's not naive, he's a fucking dummy

 

[Saigon]

Toro -

It may not be hard to fimd $200 billion per year, but that only gets you back to Point Zero.

That does not reduce the deficit, that just means it does not get any larger.

LMBO, that would be a huge improvement in what we've experienced lately.

No, you have misundertood.

No one is claiming that the deficit would not grow under Romney, because we do not know that yet.

What IS being claimed is that Romney's plan to cut taxes is likely to cost the US $5 trillion.

I assume you think this is a great idea.

 

[Saigon]

Skull Pilot -

So you are saying that Romney can cut $5 trillion from current spending - while also ploughing more into defence?

Where do you think the $5 trillion cuts will come from, exactly?

If you actually believe anyone can make 5 trillion in cuts then you're more naive than I thought.

He's not naive, he's a fucking dummy

Then don't vote for him.

 

[Saigon]

Mac -

I really have no idea where you are going with this.

As I said about 3 pages back - I think everyone who is even vaguely interested in this story knows the $5 trillion figure refers to a kind of worse case scenario.

We can't talk about any other figure because Romney hasn't told us what the loopholes (and their potential value) might be. If he eventually does so and we end up with a shortfall of $3 trillion then I guess most of us will use that figure.

Saigon, there's no plan or hidden agenda here. I've just reached a point - probably exacerbated by the campaign - where the non-stop intellectual dishonesty in political debate is gonna give me a freakin' stroke. I don't understand why people can't just be honest, and it's occurred to me recently that it's insulting to me to think that people are assuming they get away with it.

Romney's "plan" is to "pay" for the tax cuts by closing tax loopholes and increasing tax receipts to the federal government via increased economic activity. And I truly don't understand why this needs to be so complicated. My best guess is that his opponents are simply being obtuse, which to me is yet another form of intellectual dishonesty. And that's where I get pretty cranky.

That's about it.

.

There's not much there I disagree with.

But as mentioned earlier, I think a certain amount of shorthand is appropriate given everyone seem to get the basic idea of the story. It's a bit complicated to explain the entire basis of Romney's plan everytime someone refers to the tax cuts.

I doubt there is any real desire to mislead anyone there by suggesting that is a net figure.

 

[Toro]

Toro -

It may not be hard to fimd $200 billion per year, but that only gets you back to Point Zero.

That does not reduce the deficit, that just means it does not get any larger.

The question in the OP was whether or not we can afford $5 trillion in tax cuts, not whether how we are going to get the deficit down to zero. I posted a study which refuted the notion that Romney's plan would cost $5 trillion. Instead, it concluded it would cost $2 trillion before any closures in loopholes.

If you wish to start a thread on who would be a better President to close the deficit, feel free. Our current President said that if he would cut the deficit in half by the end of his first term and wound up that he couldn't pass a budget for three years. So if you stack up what Romney will do versus what Obama did, I'll take a chance with Romney since Obama failed.

[youtube]SaQUU2ZL6D8[/youtube]

 

[Oddball]

Only a pure Marxist could ask whether gubmint can "afford" to let people keep their earnings.

Hayzoos Christos!

 

[Charles_Main]

Where will the $5 trillion to find Romney's tax plan come from?

Fairly obviously it isn't all going to come from closing the odd loophole....

Can the US really afford to borrow another $5 trillion?

You have a hard time understanding things don't you. He explained it in the debate. What is not made up Closing Loop Holes, can and will be made up by the Increased Economic Activity and increased size of the tax base.

He Promised no Tax Cuts unless they can be done with out increasing the Debt.

The Problem is you Liberals do not understand that Increased Numbers of People working, and Increased Economic Activity leads to Increased Revenue.

Perhaps that is why your President is clueless as to how to get this Economy going, because he does not understand that the only way you will Balance our Budget, and pay down our Debt, Is though Economic Growth, Not higher taxes on the Rich.

You question Romney, But I don't ever see you Question Obama, Who claims he can Cut the Deficit by 4 Trillion simply by Raising rates on the Rich. That math clearly does not add up, yet you don't question him.

 

[Toro]

So, put another way Saigon, no, we probably can't afford Romney's tax plan. But we can't afford another four years of Obama either. We have already seen what Obama can do. He has been poor. I say we give Romney a shot. It's hard to believe he'd be much worse.

 

[Saigon]

So, put another way Saigon, no, we probably can't afford Romney's tax plan. But we can't afford another four years of Obama either. We have already seen what Obama can do. He has been poor. I say we give Romney a shot. It's hard to believe he'd be much worse.

It's worth reading the Washington Post article I linked earlier - they said Obama had been poor - and Romney would be ruinous.

 

[Saigon]

You have a hard time understanding things don't you. He explained it in the debate. What is not made up Closing Loop Holes, can and will be made up by the Increased Economic Activity and increased size of the tax base.

Charles -

Oh, he explained it, did he?

Which loopholes did he say he would close?

 

[Saigon]

Only a pure Marxist could ask whether gubmint can "afford" to let people keep their earnings.

Hayzoos Christos!

And I'm sure the many, many creditors the US owes money too will be delighted to hear that.

Jesus wept....paying down your sovereign debt is NOT Marxist - it's common sense.

 

[Charles_Main]

You have a hard time understanding things don't you. He explained it in the debate. What is not made up Closing Loop Holes, can and will be made up by the Increased Economic Activity and increased size of the tax base.

Charles -

Oh, he explained it, did he?

Which loopholes did he say he would close?

He didn't specify, and said he would go to Congress and work with Both sides to work out the Details bub, all you needed to do was Listen to hear that. See when it comes to something this serious, you don't lead by coming in with a hard set of Demands and Telling Congress to do it your way or the Highway. A real leader brings the 2 sides together and helps them work out a compromise that works. This is what he did in Mass, and I see no reason to believe he wont try and do the same as President.

Again, Do you ask for the same Explanations from Obama? He has made some pretty Bold Promises this time, after failing to live up to many of His Bold Promises last time, Yet you just take him at his word?

 

[Oddball]

So, put another way Saigon, no, we probably can't afford Romney's tax plan. But we can't afford another four years of Obama either. We have already seen what Obama can do. He has been poor. I say we give Romney a shot. It's hard to believe he'd be much worse.

It's worth reading the Washington Post article I linked earlier - they said Obama had been poor - and Romney would be ruinous.

Byline: By Editorial Board

Wow...Boiking's media toadies at WaPo say that his opponent's plan sucks eggs!

Whodathunkit?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Where will the $5 trillion to find Romney's tax plan come from?

Fairly obviously it isn't all going to come from closing the odd loophole....

Can the US really afford to borrow another $5 trillion?

One time and one time only.
THERE IS NO PLAN FOR A $ 5 TRILLION DOLLAR TAX CUT..
Never was and there is not now.

 

[Rocko]

If you actually believe anyone can make 5 trillion in cuts then you're more naive than I thought.

He's not naive, he's a fucking dummy

Then don't vote for him.

I think he's talking about you.

 

[Katzndogz]

The 5 trillion number came from democrats. They said it, they heard it, that makes it true. But it doesn't really.

Following the democrat plan the economy stagnates at its current plateau so there is no place to get money but by raising taxes. Republicans would grow the economy and get more people into the workforce to pay taxes. Democrats believe the more people on welfare the better things are and the economy doesn't need to grow. Welfare is a perpetual motion machine. It's enough to stimulate the economy all by itself. It's just not true.