Can Palestinians Govern "Palestine?"

[Hollie]

It is unreasonable to expect a normal functioning democracy while Palestine is divided and under occupation. About 6 million Polish citizens died between 1939 and 1945 as a result of the Nazi occupation, half of whom were Polish Jews. Overall, during German occupation Polish territory, 1939–1945, the Germans murdered 5,470,000–5,670,000 Poles, including nearly 3,000,000 Jews. There were no elections in Poland during this time.

I think it's a mistake to propose that any future Arab-Moslem government in either of the Pal'istans will be any different than what exists now (a dictatorship typical of all the other Arab-islamist dictatorships that define the Arab-Moslem Middle East).

All of the freedoms that we in the West have fought for and struggled to maintain, all of our accomplishments in the arena of social justice, so many of the benefits of Western civilization that we take for granted are derived from precepts that are antithetical to Islamism. The secular environments in academia and the workplace of the West, which have facilitated the achievements we've made in the sciences, technology, economics, medicine, the arts, and beyond, are also absent in the moslem world. Any philosophy or ideology which deviates from or contradicts the religion is called bid'ah (innovation). Living under a government run by man's law (democracy) instead of muhammud's (swish) law (sharia) is shirk and thus inimical to Islam. Therefore, the modern Western precepts of human rights, justice, and civil liberties have been denied to Moslems, except in the West, of course.

You are not dealing with my post which illustrated how in the so-called West there was no democracy as such as well as bogus science based on racism within living memory.

It is for a people (such as the Palestinians) to decide what sort of government it will eventually have but this cannot be expected in their condition under a brutal occupation and blockade. The half-century occupation should be ended in the interests of the Palestinians indeed and for the Israelis who are living in a country that is in perpetual hostility with its nearest neighbors.

I think you need to reconsider your comment regarding Pal'istanians choosing their own government. Obviously, the Gaza'istan version of Pal'istanians chose the government they wanted. They elected a rabidly hateful islamic terrorist franchise that serves only to exploit a UN funded welfare fraud. The Pals got what they wanted and Hamas is giving them the very "government" they now cannot remove. In a phrase, it's called 'Pal'istanian' Mentaity™.

Who is responsible for this brutal occupation and blockade™ your writing about? Gaza is not occupied. The border controls that are in place both by Israeli and Egyptian forces is a necessary step by those respective governments to prevent attacks from the very islamic terrorist franchise that the Pal'istanian Gazans put into government.

I will not be replying to any more of your posts on the grounds that you cannot bring yourself to even write the words Palestinians and Gaza. I consider your choice of words instead to be offensive.

That, of course, is your choice.

I will reiterate however, that the Gazan Pal'istanians knew precisely the goals and objectives of Hamas when they elected that Islamic terrorist franchise to office.

Take the Hamas Charter.... please (ba dum bump... *cymbals*). It is very explicit in delineating what its goals are and those goals are not focused on moving toward a productive economy and first world society.

 

[Phoenall]

It is unreasonable to expect a normal functioning democracy while Palestine is divided and under occupation. About 6 million Polish citizens died between 1939 and 1945 as a result of the Nazi occupation, half of whom were Polish Jews. Overall, during German occupation Polish territory, 1939–1945, the Germans murdered 5,470,000–5,670,000 Poles, including nearly 3,000,000 Jews. There were no elections in Poland during this time.

I think it's a mistake to propose that any future Arab-Moslem government in either of the Pal'istans will be any different than what exists now (a dictatorship typical of all the other Arab-islamist dictatorships that define the Arab-Moslem Middle East).

All of the freedoms that we in the West have fought for and struggled to maintain, all of our accomplishments in the arena of social justice, so many of the benefits of Western civilization that we take for granted are derived from precepts that are antithetical to Islamism. The secular environments in academia and the workplace of the West, which have facilitated the achievements we've made in the sciences, technology, economics, medicine, the arts, and beyond, are also absent in the moslem world. Any philosophy or ideology which deviates from or contradicts the religion is called bid'ah (innovation). Living under a government run by man's law (democracy) instead of muhammud's (swish) law (sharia) is shirk and thus inimical to Islam. Therefore, the modern Western precepts of human rights, justice, and civil liberties have been denied to Moslems, except in the West, of course.

You are not dealing with my post which illustrated how in the so-called West there was no democracy as such as well as bogus science based on racism within living memory.

It is for a people (such as the Palestinians) to decide what sort of government it will eventually have but this cannot be expected in their condition under a brutal occupation and blockade. The half-century occupation should be ended in the interests of the Palestinians indeed and for the Israelis who are living in a country that is in perpetual hostility with its nearest neighbors.

The occupation could have been stopped in 1967 if the arab muslims had stopped attacking Israel. As the rules say the arab muslims have to be violence free for 1 year before Israel will lift the occupation, to date they cant last 1 day.

 

[Hollie]

It is unreasonable to expect a normal functioning democracy while Palestine is divided and under occupation. About 6 million Polish citizens died between 1939 and 1945 as a result of the Nazi occupation, half of whom were Polish Jews. Overall, during German occupation Polish territory, 1939–1945, the Germans murdered 5,470,000–5,670,000 Poles, including nearly 3,000,000 Jews. There were no elections in Poland during this time.

I think it's a mistake to propose that any future Arab-Moslem government in either of the Pal'istans will be any different than what exists now (a dictatorship typical of all the other Arab-islamist dictatorships that define the Arab-Moslem Middle East).

All of the freedoms that we in the West have fought for and struggled to maintain, all of our accomplishments in the arena of social justice, so many of the benefits of Western civilization that we take for granted are derived from precepts that are antithetical to Islamism. The secular environments in academia and the workplace of the West, which have facilitated the achievements we've made in the sciences, technology, economics, medicine, the arts, and beyond, are also absent in the moslem world. Any philosophy or ideology which deviates from or contradicts the religion is called bid'ah (innovation). Living under a government run by man's law (democracy) instead of muhammud's (swish) law (sharia) is shirk and thus inimical to Islam. Therefore, the modern Western precepts of human rights, justice, and civil liberties have been denied to Moslems, except in the West, of course.

You are not dealing with my post which illustrated how in the so-called West there was no democracy as such as well as bogus science based on racism within living memory.

It is for a people (such as the Palestinians) to decide what sort of government it will eventually have but this cannot be expected in their condition under a brutal occupation and blockade. The half-century occupation should be ended in the interests of the Palestinians indeed and for the Israelis who are living in a country that is in perpetual hostility with its nearest neighbors.

The occupation could have been stopped in 1967 if the arab muslims had stopped attacking Israel. As the rules say the arab muslims have to be violence free for 1 year before Israel will lift the occupation, to date they cant last 1 day.

Yep. And the Pal'istanians had an opportunity in 2006 subsequent to Israel's withdrawal from Gaza to take steps that would demonstrate a desire to provide Gaza with a market economy.

Instead, they were in too much of a hurry to spend their welfare checks on materials for rockets to antagonize Israel.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, blah, blah,blah.​

What part of Resolution 181 did Israel abide by?

 

[Hollie]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, blah, blah,blah.​

What part of Resolution 181 did Israel abide by?

Who needs facts when met with your well researched and unassailable "blab, blah, blah"?

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly​

It was their right to reject the partition of their country.

 

[Hollie]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly​

It was their right to reject the partition of their country.

The "country of Pal'istan"? Was this "country" an exclusive Arab country?

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly​

It was their right to reject the partition of their country.

The "country of Pal'istan"? Was this "country" an exclusive Arab country?

No, only racists worry about such things.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government"​

Like I said before. Another government imposed by foreigners.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You act as if I did not answer that question.

What part of Resolution 181 did Israel abide by?

(ANSWER) - FOUND IN POST #144 ABOVE!

The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

You have to remember, the Jewish Agency and the Provisional Government DID NOT have to meet the 1947-1948 P F Tinmore standard. It had to coordinate, and complete the Steps Preparatory to Independence to the satisfaction of the incoming Successor Government.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[Hollie]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Come on and get real.

In the case of the 1948 Independence of Israel, it was the Arab League that demonstrated the external interference and not Israel.​

You are forgetting that the foreigners declared Israel inside Palestine at the point of a gun.

But you do not think that is external interference along with other violations of Palestinian rights. Rights that the UN has affirmed have been violated.

(COMMENT)

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC). The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

Resolution 181 (II) made the stipulation that " Independent Arab and Jewish States and the Special International Regime for the City of Jerusalem, set forth in part III of this plan, shall come into existence in Palestine two months after the evacuation of the armed forces of the mandatory Power has been completed but in any case not later than 1 October 1948. The boundaries of the Arab State, the Jewish State, and the City of Jerusalem shall be as described in parts II and III below."

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

"On 14 May 1948, Britain relinquished its Mandate over Palestine and disengaged its forces. On the same day, the Jewish Agency proclaimed the establishment of the State of Israel on the territory allotted to it by the partition plan. Fierce hostilities immediately broke out between the Arab and Jewish communities. The next day, regular troops of the neighbouring Arab States entered the territory to assist the Palestinian Arabs."
SOURCE: The Question of Palestine and the United Nations
​

This is the UN History - Chapter 2, Page 9-10 of the Source.

This leaves no doubt that the Arab League Forces crossed their Frontier Boundaries and became the "external influence" attempting to prevent the Jewish Agency - Provisional Government of Israel, from exercising their right of self-determination.

Since that time, while both Egypt (1979) and Jordan (1994) have both come to Peace Terms with Israel. In 1983 The Government of the State of Israel and the Government of the Republic of Lebanon signed a May 1983; it was never ratified by the Lebanese government due to strong Syrian opposition to the treaty. Syria, has its own special problems. The People of Palestine have no single voice and no single policy.

(QUESTION)

In any multinational organization like the UN, it is like a heard of cats. There will be many and varied opinion on any issue you bring before them. I don't know of a single international court hearing that has ruled on any Israel has violated any international law concerning rights.

Most Respectfully,
R

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government"​

Like I said before. Another government imposed by foreigners.

Look on the bright side, it provides an opportunity to spend even more time seething with hatred.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You act as if I did not answer that question.

What part of Resolution 181 did Israel abide by?

(ANSWER) - FOUND IN POST #144 ABOVE!

The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

You have to remember, the Jewish Agency and the Provisional Government DID NOT have to meet the 1947-1948 P F Tinmore standard. It had to coordinate, and complete the Steps Preparatory to Independence to the satisfaction of the incoming Successor Government.

Most Respectfully,
R

Nice duck.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

This is 100% Correct.

It was noted in the First Special Report to the UN Security Council that "Powerful Arab interests, both inside and outside Palestine, are defying the resolution of the General Assembly and are engaged in a deliberate effort to alter by force the settlement envisaged therein." In order to prevent further implementation of the Recommendations Adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)]:

It was their right to reject the partition of their country.

(COMMENT)

I hope you will remember that in Posting #115, I made note of your very claim.

The Palestinians exercised their right of self-determination when they declined to participate in the development in a UNSCOP Recommendations.

The Palestinians exercised their right of self-determination when they decided to reject A/RES/181(II).

Right, wrong or indifferent --- we all (Including the Arab Palestinians) have to live with the consequences from the choices they make. Sometimes the consequences will be favorable, and sometime not.

But the Arab Palestinians do know that if they do not work for a prosperous future, but instead only work to hamper the progress of others, then the probability of success in favor of the Arab Palestinians gradually become less and less favorable. That is why the Human Development Index Rating for Israel is so much higher than any of the Arab League nations, even the filthy oil rich nations. If it was just about money, then saudi Arabia would much further ahead than Israel. But it is not. It is about the sweat and sacrifice the people put in to the positive aspects of the nation they are building.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You are always trying to criticize the best parts of people, places and events.

On 15 May 1948, the UK as the assigned Mandatory, retired from the territory. The "Successor Government" for Palestine, became the UN Palestine Commission (UNPC).

Like I said before. Another government imposed by foreigners.

(OBSERVATION)

ARTICLE 16.

Turkey hereby renounces all rights and title whatsoever over or respecting the territories situated outside the frontiers laid down in the present Treaty and the islands other than those over which her sovereignty is recognised by the said Treaty, the future of these territories and islands being settled or to be settled by the parties concerned.
SOURCE: Part I Treaty of Lausanne
​

(COMMENT)

You keep saying "foreigners" as if the Victors over the Central Powers were to be found in the population of Arab Palestinians. (NOT)

It was a government imposed by the successors under Article 16 of the Treaty of Lausanne; after the shift from the Enemy Occupied Territory Administration to the Mandate Civil Administration as decided by the Allied Powers.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Again, you are being contrite.

Nice duck.

(COMMENT)

What is that you wanted the Jewish Agency to do (exactly)?

What is it with your agenda? Do you just want to complain about the ability of the Jewish Agency to get a better result then did they Arab Agency?

Oh yeah, that is right. The Arab Palestinians declined to participate.

What particular task are you looking for? Let's discuss your actual objective complaint?

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

Again, you are being contrite.

Nice duck.

(COMMENT)

What is that you wanted the Jewish Agency to do (exactly)?

What is it with your agenda? Do you just want to complain about the ability of the Jewish Agency to get a better result then did they Arab Agency?

Oh yeah, that is right. The Arab Palestinians declined to participate.

What particular task are you looking for? Let's discuss your actual objective complaint?

Most Respectfully,
R

There were many parts to Resolution 181.

• Proposed borders
• Land for two states.
• International Jerusalem.
• Rights of the people.
• Citizenship.
• UN control of the millitary.
• Constitutions.

Where was Israel on these issues?

 

[Hossfly]

P F Tinmore, et al,

You act as if I did not answer that question.

What part of Resolution 181 did Israel abide by?

(ANSWER) - FOUND IN POST #144 ABOVE!

The Jewish Agency completed the Steps Preparatory to Independence, to the satisfaction of the "Successor Government for Palestine." Pursuant to the Recommendations adopted by the General Assembly [A/RES/181(II)], the Jewish Agency, (under Part I - Section B Clause 4) and a declaration was made (having establish a Provisional Government) to the United Nations by the provisional government in accordance with the General Assembly Recommendation (Part 1, Section C). At the public announcement of the UNPC Adjournment (Sine Die) it was noted that: "The Commission has not been dissolved. In fact the resolution of last November 29 has been implemented."

You have to remember, the Jewish Agency and the Provisional Government DID NOT have to meet the 1947-1948 P F Tinmore standard. It had to coordinate, and complete the Steps Preparatory to Independence to the satisfaction of the incoming Successor Government.

Most Respectfully,
R

Nice duck.

Speaking of ducks, it looks as though the West Bank is going to the polls and Gaza Strip is not. That's one fine duck. Apparently the Palestinian High Court doesn't think Gaza is mature enough to govern themselves.

Judiciary in Gaza does not have necessary ‘guarantees’ for elections, says court
The Palestinian high court on Monday ordered municipal elections to be held only in the West Bank and not in the Hamas-controlled Gaza Strip, though a new date for the suspended polls was not set.

The ruling could bring to an end hopes that the municipal elections would be the first polls since 2006 in which both Hamas and Palestinian president Mahmud Abbas’s Fatah would participate.

“The court orders the implementation of the government’s decision on the holding of local elections,” court president Hisham al-Hatoo ruled before a packed courtroom in the West Bank city of Ramallah. He said however the judiciary in Gaza did not have necessary “guarantees” in place for the holding of the polls. The elections had initially been set for October 8.


On September 8, the court suspended the polls following disputes between Fatah and Hamas over candidate lists.

Hamas immediately dismissed Monday’s decision as “political”.


Palestinian court orders polls only in West Bank

 

[SAYIT]

...Apparently the Palestinian High Court doesn't think Gaza is mature enough to govern themselves.
Palestinian court orders polls only in West Bank

Not only highly predictable, the "High" Court's ruling exposes once again the Pal's inability (or unwillingness) to establish the rule of law and justice in the Territories. Instead they continue to operate under the rule of tyranny and oppression, both necessary for the continuation of their war against Israel.

As noted in the OP:
While this (suspension of elections) is not an unusual move in places where the rule of law plays second fiddle to the ruling regime's whim, it illustrates the failure of Palestinians to establish an electoral democracy and a genuinely functional state.

The ascension of Hamas prompted the PA's Fatah ruling party to tighten their grip on their share of power which is most of the West Bank, creating 2 separate and competing national gov'ts.

While Fatah's intention - the exclusion of a known terrorist gang from governance - may have been pragmatic, the result has been to engender oppression.

As things now stand the PA must either to form a single gov't with the rule of law and peaceful coexistence as its goals or to continue with Gaza and the WB as separate entities and perhaps create a WB Palestinian State sans Gaza.

The choice is, as always, theirs.

 

[P F Tinmore]

...Apparently the Palestinian High Court doesn't think Gaza is mature enough to govern themselves.
Palestinian court orders polls only in West Bank

Not only highly predictable, the "High" Court's ruling exposes once again the Pal's inability (or unwillingness) to establish the rule of law and justice in the Territories. Instead they continue to operate under the rule of tyranny and oppression, both necessary for the continuation of their war against Israel.

As noted in the OP:
While this (suspension of elections) is not an unusual move in places where the rule of law plays second fiddle to the ruling regime's whim, it illustrates the failure of Palestinians to establish an electoral democracy and a genuinely functional state.

The ascension of Hamas prompted the PA's Fatah ruling party to tighten their grip on their share of power which is most of the West Bank, creating 2 separate and competing national gov'ts.

While Fatah's intention - the exclusion of a known terrorist gang from governance - may have been pragmatic, the result has been to engender oppression.

As things now stand the PA must either to form a single gov't with the rule of law and peaceful coexistence as its goals or to continue with Gaza and the WB as separate entities and perhaps create a WB Palestinian State sans Gaza.

The choice is, as always, theirs.

There are no guarantees in the West Bank either where many Hamas leaders are illegally detained by the illegal government.