Buying the college vote

[SFC Ollie]

Gee maybe we can adopt a system like Germany where the State run School decides if your child goes to college or their selection of a trade school for them..........

 

[Jarhead]

Gee maybe we can adopt a system like Germany where the State run School decides if your child goes to college or their selection of a trade school for them..........

If college becomes an entitlement and no one wants to get their hands dirty in a career......there may be no choice but to do that.

 

[rightwinger]

Tis very true. Perception is reality.

The funny thing is that I don't think the kids are buying it. They want FREE COLLEGE - not affordable.

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

And exactly who will run the lathes in a machine shop? Drive the buses so people can get to work? Pick up garbage on collection day? Run the mailroom? Answer the phones? Pick the lettuce? Drive the taxi?

College grads?

I used the term education, not college education

Lathe operators need to be trained, truck drivers need a CDL, plumbers and electricians and welders need to be trained. My son went to a tech school for welding. Many of these schools are nothing more than scams pushing kids to take out high priced student loans and offering marginal training

I also said qualified students. This includes motivated students. Let the slackers fall by the wayside and pick lettuce

 

[Jarhead]

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

And exactly who will run the lathes in a machine shop? Drive the buses so people can get to work? Pick up garbage on collection day? Run the mailroom? Answer the phones? Pick the lettuce? Drive the taxi?

College grads?

I used the term education, not college education

Lathe operators need to be trained, truck drivers need a CDL, plumbers and electricians and welders need to be trained. My son went to a tech school for welding. Many of these schools are nothing more than scams pushing kids to take out high priced student loans and offering marginal training

I also said qualified students. This includes motivated students. Let the slackers fall by the wayside and pick lettuce

And who will decide who is worthy of free college and who is worthy of an education in CNC machining?
Grades?
So then we have the issue of inconsistancy in qulaity of education in each school district.....even if it doesnt exist.....

If one is not willing to invest in their children, then why should the tax payer do it?

 

[edthecynic]

If these idiots fall for this, they are stupid.

Today obama announced how he is going to save them all "a lot of money" on their Monthly payments.

So how much money? from 4.50 to 7.50 a month total.

Woot, talk about a wind fall.

What's messed up is he is trying to buy them with a maximum of $4-8 a month.

Whats even more messed up, some people will like him for that.

How many times have I said CON$ always argue both sides of every issue??!!!!

No wonder CON$ don't want people to go to college and learn how to do math!!!

The OP argues that Obama is buying student's votes by forgiving a vast majority of the money borrowed to pay for college. Others agree and an example is given where over the course of 20 years the student saves $183,780 ($212,000 - $28,220) a savings of $765.75 per month over the 20 years. But alternately other CON$ say the savings to students is $5 to $7 per month, and using the max of $7 per month, which comes to a savings of $1,680 over the same 20 years.

So basically the CON$ are arguing that the same Obama policy saves the student almost nothing or almost everything!!!
And not a single CON$ervative will EVER see any conflict between the two arguments about the same policy.

Can you understand why I said I needed help with the math? It's not just me.

Yes I understand, you are a CON$ervative.

But seriously, why won't any CON$ address the fact that they will demonize Obama whether the policy costs the taxpayer a lot of money, $183,780.00, or almost nothing, $1,680.00???? This is a perfect example of how CON$ will fabricate a rationalization for their hate no matter what the actual circumstances!!!

 

[naturegirl]

Tis very true. Perception is reality.

The funny thing is that I don't think the kids are buying it. They want FREE COLLEGE - not affordable.

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

Ding, ding, ding..........for those that are qualified, yes they are deserving. Those that are committed to learning, those that work hard to get an education, those that truly can't afford it.

Not EVERYONE is qualified for a college education. I know too many that are long time students, never holding a real job, going home to mommy and daddy every summer. Spending Christmas in Colorado skiing, yet they can't afford to pay their loans..........

The taxpayers don't owe the "entitlement generation" any more than our parents owed us.

 

[edthecynic]

Tis very true. Perception is reality.

The funny thing is that I don't think the kids are buying it. They want FREE COLLEGE - not affordable.

But perception depends on the bias of the observer!
To those who desire to see Obama as a big spender, the exaggeration of the cost of this program to the taxpayer per student will be unlimited, not just a "mere" $183,780.

October 27, 2011
RUSH: These student loans are gonna end up costing the taxpayers anywhere between $800,000 and $900,000 per student.

And to those who desire to see Americans who vote for Obama as stupid, the benefit to the student will be insignificant.

October 27, 2011
RUSH: It's a farce. It's a total farce. It misleads and it deceives students, and it's gonna end up saving students $8. This is one of the biggest jokes to come down the pike in a long time, and I'm gonna set it straight. It's a convoluted, intricately woven web of deceit. But that's what I do here is make the complex understandable.

And to those who spout the GOP propaganda, it is both at the same time in the same rant because they know their target audience will hear only the part they want to believe.

 

[mudwhistle]

Tis very true. Perception is reality.

The funny thing is that I don't think the kids are buying it. They want FREE COLLEGE - not affordable.

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

China is a great example???

Okay.

Btw, most HS grads can't read on a college level now.
Only the wealthy can really afford higher education.
Most couldn't hack it even if they could afford it simply because they need to attend a prep-school to get to the level they need for success in college. How many can afford that?

Food for thought: The goal of technology is to simplify, not to make more complex. That way everyone can use it.

 

[rightwinger]

And exactly who will run the lathes in a machine shop? Drive the buses so people can get to work? Pick up garbage on collection day? Run the mailroom? Answer the phones? Pick the lettuce? Drive the taxi?

College grads?

I used the term education, not college education

Lathe operators need to be trained, truck drivers need a CDL, plumbers and electricians and welders need to be trained. My son went to a tech school for welding. Many of these schools are nothing more than scams pushing kids to take out high priced student loans and offering marginal training

I also said qualified students. This includes motivated students. Let the slackers fall by the wayside and pick lettuce

And who will decide who is worthy of free college and who is worthy of an education in CNC machining?
Grades?
So then we have the issue of inconsistancy in qulaity of education in each school district.....even if it doesnt exist.....

If one is not willing to invest in their children, then why should the tax payer do it?

Decisions can be made on who makes the cut and who doesn't. Just like decision are made today

Let the kid decide where he goes. Apply to college or apply to trade school. If you don't make the cut, go into your own pocket.

You know who should be investing in your children? The people who are hiring them. They are the ones making a huge profit off the skills provided by the taxpayer or the parents. Let private corporations start coughing up for college and technical educations

 

[rightwinger]

Tis very true. Perception is reality.

The funny thing is that I don't think the kids are buying it. They want FREE COLLEGE - not affordable.

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

China is a great example???

Okay.

Btw, most HS grads can't read on a college level now.
Only the wealthy can really afford higher education.
Most couildn't hack it even if they could afford it simply because they need to attend a prep-school to get to the level they need for success in college. How many can affird that?

Food for thought: The goal of technology is to simplify, not to make more complex. That way everyone can use it.

China is stepping up to the plate and ensuring their best qualified students do not fall through the cracks. China is far from a bunch of rice pickers. They are rapidly advancing in technological fields. Meanwhile, we demean our educated as elite and throw ever increasing college costs as an impediment to higher education

Technology does simplify and technology is constantly evolving. Those countries on the cutting edge of technology will succeed while those who wait for technology to find them will trail

 

[logical4u]

Right now, graduates enrolled in the federal government’s student loan Income-Based Repayment Plan make monthly payments of 15 percent of their discretionary income — and all debt is forgiven after 25 years. Congress has already passed a law to change that program to require students to make payments of just 10 percent of their monthly discretionary income — and to forgive the loan after just 20 years. That law will take effect in 2014 — unless Obama has his way. The president would like to promote the start date to 2012. Hmm. What else happens in 2012?

Obama’s politically-motivated plan to help college students repay their loans « Hot Air

10% of DISCRETIONARY income; then 20 years - bye bye.

Discretionary income is money you have after you've paid off all of your bills. Discretionary income is income after subtracting taxes and normal expenses (such as rent or mortgage, utilities, insurance, medical, transportation, property maintenance, child support, inflation, food and sundries, &c.) to maintain a certain standard of living.[5] It is the amount of an individual's income available for spending after the essentials (such as food, clothing, and shelter) have been taken care of:

Let's say, Johnny owes 120K and gets a decent job making 40K.

How much will he screw the taxpayers for?

Can someone help me with the math?

If these idiots fall for this, they are stupid.

Today obama announced how he is going to save them all "a lot of money" on their Monthly payments.

So how much money? from 4.50 to 7.50 a month total.

Woot, talk about a wind fall.

Yes, the "one" is all for enslaving the college grads (those with loans) for under 10 dollars a month, and it sounds like a lot of them are willing to sign up. That will land them as gov't employees. Do you think they will be interested in providing "service" to the taxpayers?

 

[Jarhead]

I used the term education, not college education

Lathe operators need to be trained, truck drivers need a CDL, plumbers and electricians and welders need to be trained. My son went to a tech school for welding. Many of these schools are nothing more than scams pushing kids to take out high priced student loans and offering marginal training

I also said qualified students. This includes motivated students. Let the slackers fall by the wayside and pick lettuce

And who will decide who is worthy of free college and who is worthy of an education in CNC machining?
Grades?
So then we have the issue of inconsistancy in qulaity of education in each school district.....even if it doesnt exist.....

If one is not willing to invest in their children, then why should the tax payer do it?

Decisions can be made on who makes the cut and who doesn't. Just like decision are made today

Let the kid decide where he goes. Apply to college or apply to trade school. If you don't make the cut, go into your own pocket.

You know who should be investing in your children? The people who are hiring them. They are the ones making a huge profit off the skills provided by the taxpayer or the parents. Let private corporations start coughing up for college and technical educations

Many already do.

Tuition reimbursement for courses/degrees realted to what your hired to do is commonplace....and ironically......NOT in unionized companies....in privately owned and publicly traded companies....but the unions rarely care about negotiating items that help better the employee from an educational standpoint.

Ironic but true. Not an intentional attack on unions....but it is something supporters of unions should question.

 

[naturegirl]

Is a free education for those who are qualified, that bad a thing for this country? Is a free education less desirable for a society than an education you have to pay $100,000 plus for?

An educated workforce is good for an economy. It is critical in today's society that you have a highly educated worker to do increasingly complex skills. Do we want to return to a society where most the workers can't read and write and only the wealthy can afford higher education?

Much of the world, including China provide free higher education

China is a great example???

Okay.

Btw, most HS grads can't read on a college level now.
Only the wealthy can really afford higher education.
Most couildn't hack it even if they could afford it simply because they need to attend a prep-school to get to the level they need for success in college. How many can affird that?

Food for thought: The goal of technology is to simplify, not to make more complex. That way everyone can use it.

China is stepping up to the plate and ensuring their best qualified students do not fall through the cracks. China is far from a bunch of rice pickers. They are rapidly advancing in technological fields. Meanwhile, we demean our educated as elite and throw ever increasing college costs as an impediment to higher education

Technology does simplify and technology is constantly evolving. Those countries on the cutting edge of technology will succeed while those who wait for technology to find them will trail

Yea, how much time do Chinese students spend in school each day?? From elementary to HS?? Are they prepared for college when they graduate government school?? Most US children aren't.

By middle school, the competitive pressure to get into any high school—not just the top ones—is palpable. Admission is determined almost exclusively by performance on a single test, and only about 70 percent of students who finish middle school go on to high school. Even in primary school, parents start investing money in math Olympiads or musical-instrument training for children whose test-scores might make them borderline candidates for acceptance; extraordinary talent in math or music could be just enough to make the difference. Moving to different neighborhoods to get into better schools is a common strategy, as are hiring private tutors and making $1,000 “donations” to magnet-like middle schools.

And the workload ratchets up in middle school, too. Students spend from 7 am to 8 am at school reading, either in English or Chinese, and reciting to teachers. School ends at 5 pm, but the dinner break is shortened for an hour of “play time”—or physical fitness—beginning at 6 pm. After that, students stay at school for “evening sessions,” which function like study halls or tutoring periods. Students do homework and study, while teachers assist them. Physics, chemistry, biology and political science are tacked on to the elementary school course-load, as well as electives like calligraphy and computer science.

With under 30 percent of high-school graduates getting into college—based entirely on how students do on a “one-shot, one-kill test,” as Zhang put it—most students spend almost all waking hours studying. The subject areas of high-school courses don’t differ much from those in middle school, though phys-ed typically ends after 10th grade. Evening sessions at the high-school level conclude at 11 pm. And, for the many students who attend public boarding schools far from their hometowns, most of their lunch and dinner breaks are spent hitting the books. “Lack of sleep is very common for Chinese high-school students,” Zhang said.

http://hechingered.org/content/a-day-in-the-life-of-chinese-students_3826/

People really shouldn't spew stuff they know nothing about.

 

[logical4u]

As it is now, a good portion of college students do not capitalize properly on the college experience. To them it is paty, have fun...and, oh yeah...gotta go to class.
Many go for the 5 year program for 4 years of credits.
Make it cheaper, and easier to get in and things will get even worse.

Agree

Too many get "degrees" in things that are not marketable. Then they want to cry because no one will pay them what "they" think "they" are worth.

They will not do the "hard" courses where there are still jobs just waiting for qualified people.

 

[editec]

OK...so we overhaul the education system and make it simple for everyone to get a college degree.

SO now we will have 5 college degree unemployed vying for 2 college degree jobs....and 1 non degree person vying for 3 non degree jobs.

And ther end result? College degreed people doing non degreed jobs.....at the cost of the tax payer.

You know...there are many social programs that seem "honorable" on paper....but you must think about the long term ramifications.

Jar,

You make a good point.

Yes I do NOT think that education will solve every one of society's ills.


Formost among those ills, (as it regards this issue, at least) is this:

When are we going to ADMIT that technology is making an every increasing amount of people REDUNDANT and basically economically UNEMPLOYABLE?


Bottom line?

NOT 1% of the human population will be able to educate themselves faster than techology will replace HUMAN LABOR with technology.

We are just now beginning to see the effects of this disrupting our ecponomi9c system.

But the speed at which this is happening is advancing so rapidly that it is catching us unaware and unable to even IMAGINE how we solve this problem.

Basically until we change the social cntract (one that is based on SCARCITY) to a social contract (based on the PLENTY that technology is creating for us) we (meaning all of mankind) are going to continue down the road to a THIRD WORLD ECONOMY.

Why?

Because in a society where technology rapidly replaces workers?

ONLY CAPITAL wins.

Workers, and more and more worker, find themselves no longer employable.

And no amount of educating our children is going solve THAT problem.

As long as kids are getting, for example, fine arts degrees and expecting that to take them to the promise land they are going to be fucked. The kids in engineering, or programs that will design and/or repair the new technology will have jobs. However it takes effort to get degrees that will actually benefit the individual.

Yes that is what is happening on the MICRO level.

What I am talking about and the problem facing us is on the MACRO level.

Why?

Because guess what?

Engineers and programmers are NOT immune to this trend.

We cannot all be knowledge workers.

All but the most creative and brilliant knowledge workers are going to be replaced by marchines, agorthms and the changes in the bueinss models that flow from those increases in productivity.

Soem of you may be immune to this problem in your working lifetimes, but I promise you you kids will NOT be.

 

[flacaltenn]

Jar,

You make a good point.

Yes I do NOT think that education will solve every one of society's ills.


Formost among those ills, (as it regards this issue, at least) is this:

When are we going to ADMIT that technology is making an every increasing amount of people REDUNDANT and basically economically UNEMPLOYABLE?


Bottom line?

NOT 1% of the human population will be able to educate themselves faster than techology will replace HUMAN LABOR with technology.

We are just now beginning to see the effects of this disrupting our ecponomi9c system.

But the speed at which this is happening is advancing so rapidly that it is catching us unaware and unable to even IMAGINE how we solve this problem.

Basically until we change the social cntract (one that is based on SCARCITY) to a social contract (based on the PLENTY that technology is creating for us) we (meaning all of mankind) are going to continue down the road to a THIRD WORLD ECONOMY.

Why?

Because in a society where technology rapidly replaces workers?

ONLY CAPITAL wins.

Workers, and more and more worker, find themselves no longer employable.

And no amount of educating our children is going solve THAT problem.

As long as kids are getting, for example, fine arts degrees and expecting that to take them to the promise land they are going to be fucked. The kids in engineering, or programs that will design and/or repair the new technology will have jobs. However it takes effort to get degrees that will actually benefit the individual.

Yes that is what is happening on the MICRO level.

What I am talking about and the problem facing us is on the MACRO level.

Why?

Because guess what?

Engineers and programmers are NOT immune to this trend.

We cannot all be knowledge workers.

All but the most creative and brilliant knowledge workers are going to be replaced by marchines, agorthms and the changes in the bueinss models that flow from those increases in productivity.

Soem of you may be immune to this problem in your working lifetimes, but I promise you you kids will NOT be.

Not really. Look at LucasFilm, Industrial Light & Magic, Pixar.. These folks revolutionized the entertainment industry. I have many friends who were the spark for these bizs.. They replaced ARMIES of "lower skill" animation workers but created an entire NEW INDUSTRY for making films of ALL types. In those companies today there is still room for an entire RANGE of skills, but it's the core technology competency that ENABLED that expansion..

Our task to SURVIVE in the MACRO world is to have policy that ASSISTS in creating entire NEW INDUSTRIES like these folks did.

You DON'T have to BE a rocket scientist to build a rocket -- but you need rocket scientists to start a rocket company.. That's the summary truth. And folks that CAN'T be "knowledge workers" are gonna suffer in the future. ALL vocational level training will increase knowledge skills. In fact, folks that don't consider education to be a life long process are gonna suffer..

Engineers and Scientists are NOT totally immune that's correct. But that won't stop the increasing DEMAND for their skills. Some design tasks are now "automated" but the automation factor has barely kept up with the increasing complexity of the designs themselves. No lack of engineers here. We now put in a handheld device what used to take racks of equipment to accomplish but in the end, it requires the same amount of design labor. I don't waste time worrying about automation..

What I do worry about --- is the GOVT GUARANTEEING OUTCOMES regardless of the choices that people make. That is EXACTLY what's going on here. So you can continue to choose Women's Studies and Art History with absolutely no attention to whether society will pay you for your knowledge and service. No risk.. No consequences to your decisions.

THAT -- is gonna produce a society where labor is NOT prepared to compete in a Global world.. And the GOVT shouldn't be meddling by removing REALITY from life in a risk-free manner..

 

[rightwinger]

China is a great example???

Okay.

Btw, most HS grads can't read on a college level now.
Only the wealthy can really afford higher education.
Most couildn't hack it even if they could afford it simply because they need to attend a prep-school to get to the level they need for success in college. How many can affird that?

Food for thought: The goal of technology is to simplify, not to make more complex. That way everyone can use it.

China is stepping up to the plate and ensuring their best qualified students do not fall through the cracks. China is far from a bunch of rice pickers. They are rapidly advancing in technological fields. Meanwhile, we demean our educated as elite and throw ever increasing college costs as an impediment to higher education

Technology does simplify and technology is constantly evolving. Those countries on the cutting edge of technology will succeed while those who wait for technology to find them will trail

Yea, how much time do Chinese students spend in school each day?? From elementary to HS?? Are they prepared for college when they graduate government school?? Most US children aren't.

By middle school, the competitive pressure to get into any high school—not just the top ones—is palpable. Admission is determined almost exclusively by performance on a single test, and only about 70 percent of students who finish middle school go on to high school. Even in primary school, parents start investing money in math Olympiads or musical-instrument training for children whose test-scores might make them borderline candidates for acceptance; extraordinary talent in math or music could be just enough to make the difference. Moving to different neighborhoods to get into better schools is a common strategy, as are hiring private tutors and making $1,000 “donations” to magnet-like middle schools.

And the workload ratchets up in middle school, too. Students spend from 7 am to 8 am at school reading, either in English or Chinese, and reciting to teachers. School ends at 5 pm, but the dinner break is shortened for an hour of “play time”—or physical fitness—beginning at 6 pm. After that, students stay at school for “evening sessions,” which function like study halls or tutoring periods. Students do homework and study, while teachers assist them. Physics, chemistry, biology and political science are tacked on to the elementary school course-load, as well as electives like calligraphy and computer science.

With under 30 percent of high-school graduates getting into college—based entirely on how students do on a “one-shot, one-kill test,” as Zhang put it—most students spend almost all waking hours studying. The subject areas of high-school courses don’t differ much from those in middle school, though phys-ed typically ends after 10th grade. Evening sessions at the high-school level conclude at 11 pm. And, for the many students who attend public boarding schools far from their hometowns, most of their lunch and dinner breaks are spent hitting the books. “Lack of sleep is very common for Chinese high-school students,” Zhang said.

HechingerEd Blog | A day in the life of Chinese students

People really shouldn't spew stuff they know nothing about.

Meanwhile, the US spends its educational dollars on No Child Left Behind whose sole purpose is to turn D students into C students

 

[geauxtohell]

Funny. I got a loan for my last semester of undergrad. My parents guaranteed me four years and it took me an extra semester.

The terms of that loan were that I had a six month grace period from graduation to get a job, etc., then interest started adding onto it and I had to make payments.

I had to go overseas for two years immediately after college. Came back, and my first paycheck in the states had that as a deduction - garnished. I didn't know what it was (had forgotten...it happens *blush*) and found out. So, I paid it off in one check to get it out of the way.

Boy, loans sure have changed.

Not really. It's still basically the same. The 6 month grace period is still there and a loan for a single semester is a rarity. Most students are paying loans for 4 years of school.

There is no way I (or 99% of other medical students) could finance a medical degree without loans. The average Medical School debt is into the $150,000 range. I really searched through all my couch cushions but came up sufficiently short.

So, on the one hand, there is a societal need for physicians and lawyers and on the other hand the cost is beyond the reasonable ability of anyone to finance it. So, golly gee, we have a conundrum! How do we help motivated students to become physicians (and nurses and dentists and vets and lawyers)? I guess we could come up with something pragmatic.

Ironically, loans used to be deferred during medical residencies and guess what? Physicians still managed to pay off their loans in around 10 years when they actually had the income to make large payments.

IBR has been enacted so medical residents (and other people starting out at the bottom of the salary scale) aren't forced into the poor house when they are at the low end of the wage pool.

I fail to see why this bothers you guys so much. I am sure someone will be stupid enough to try and string out a loan for 20 years. Guess what? They are only hurting themselves.

As Dave Ramsey says, it's better to be debt free. It's just common sense.

Well, I think quoting myself is pompous and arrogant, but as I am the one person on this thread that will actually use this program (as will all my peers) and have researched it, I don't feel anyone has accurately summed up the program.

The underlying fallacy here is that someone would work for $25K for the rest of their life and not attempt to obtain a workable income. Using $25 K is absurd onto itself. It's a ridiculously low ball salary (obviously used (with the further assumption that person would never get a raise or promotion) to show how little of the principle is paid off. It's 5K below the national average for social work.

Of course, data will vary depending on the university and the area of the country. And not every major is included in the NACE survey; nursing, for example, is notably absent. At New York University, nursing graduates make $62,000 in their first post-college year. But NYU grads are luckier than average. The school’s sociology majors were offered $42,300 this year, compared with $31,096 in the country as a whole.

Money-Making Majors - Forbes.com

Why didn't they use the $62K figure? Because then the math actually works out. $6.2K X 20 = $124,000. By my calculation, the tuition of an NYU nursing degree is around $80K when you figure everything in.

http://www.nyu.edu/nursing/bulletin/bsprogram.pdf

And that assumes the nurse never gets a raise.

The other fallacy is that students would "get over" by having their paying on their debt for 20 years. That's idiotic. I am sure a few bad actors will be stupid enough to try that, but it's not going to be common. Most people want to be debt free, as much as you guys love to bitch about people who are trying to squeeze into the rapidly declining middle class.

In fact, this whole line of logic is bizarre to me. "Buying votes"? What about trying to help this country raise it's education level and taxable income?

In the end, most of you guys are bitching simply to bitch. Which is fine, but most of your complaints are poorly founded. I'll be using IBR. I will have my loans paid off long before 20 years. I don't care what you guys think about it.

 

[flacaltenn]

GeauxtoHell::

No one here is complaining about YOUR position in this program. You and the wife made good choices. As a result -- YOU and I will be subsidizing folks who didnt' make good choices. That's never good policy.. I don't care what side you're on...

As for salaries increasing over time.. That's never a guarantee. I went to school with people who looked FORWARD to driving a cab. And they were only there to skirt ANOTHER GOVT risk -- the last gasp of the military draft. We are now giving another incentive for "low expectations". Hell, the "public service" option will get ya a reasonable salary and benefits for 10 years of service AND the student loan goes away.. RUN UP THAT LOAN TAB?????

Of course.... Why put any of YOUR money at risk? It's an evil side effect of this kind of incentive.


Betcha when you were walking the campus -- you never thought you'd be paying 4 or 8 times more on your loan than 1/2 those other students with loans -- did ya??

 

[edthecynic]

Obama’s politically-motivated plan to help college students repay their loans « Hot Air

10% of DISCRETIONARY income; then 20 years - bye bye.



Let's say, Johnny owes 120K and gets a decent job making 40K.

How much will he screw the taxpayers for?

Can someone help me with the math?

If these idiots fall for this, they are stupid.

Today obama announced how he is going to save them all "a lot of money" on their Monthly payments.

So how much money? from 4.50 to 7.50 a month total.

Woot, talk about a wind fall.

Yes, the "one" is all for enslaving the college grads (those with loans) for under 10 dollars a month, and it sounds like a lot of them are willing to sign up. That will land them as gov't employees. Do you think they will be interested in providing "service" to the taxpayers?

So let me see if I have this straight.

A college degree that costs $212,000 will enslave the stupid student who is paying back all of it except for under $2,000 while costing the taxpayer almost a million dollars per student.

October 27, 2011
RUSH: You know, Suzy Creamcheese gets into George Washington University and borrows from the government the requisite $212,000 to obtain an undergraduate degree

October 27, 2011
RUSH: These student loans are gonna end up costing the taxpayers anywhere between $800,000 and $900,000 per student.

October 27, 2011
RUSH: It's a farce. It's a total farce. It misleads and it deceives students, and it's gonna end up saving students $8. This is one of the biggest jokes to come down the pike in a long time, and I'm gonna set it straight. It's a convoluted, intricately woven web of deceit. But that's what I do here is make the complex understandable.