'Bout 37 hours left.. Time to see how many folks are brain-washed

[dilloduck]

take care of yourself !!!!

un-fucking amazing-----the US tries to defend itself from terrorists around the world and they are pissed because it scares them.

 

[Zhukov]

nation states do abide by international law. or else they face U.N sanctions.

Yes, and we've all witnessed just how frighteningly effective those are.

either way why reduce yourself to their level

I don't believe we have. If you believe what we are doing today around the world is in any way equivalent to what the Islamofascists would like to do to us, as you are implying it is, then it probably isn't worth arguing the point with you.

America is a great nation and there is zero evidence that the situation in iraq has prevented a single terrorist attack

The fact that there is one fewer madman who hates this country, has ties to international terrorists, has the capability to manufacture sophisticated chemical and biological weapons, and has the power of a state behind him is good enough for me.

Iraq never attacked you EVER

They attacked us constantly between the two wars.

 

[Bonnie]

look i think you are better informed in this than me, but he stimulated the economy by running up a big defict and by weaking the value of the dollar. middleclass are over taxed so tax the rich even more as they have too much. i propose a cribs tax. A $10000000 special tax if you appear on the show

Overtaxing any class of people is totally counter productive to any economy. The point is to lower taxes, and have business expand which takes the unemployed off unemployment and now you have more people added to tax payer status, that means more people paying into the government and each person paying less in taxes, but the amount going into the government increases. Its very simple really. It's a great wya for everyone to prosper not just certain classes. And the rich pay more huge amounts in taxes. Everytime you tax someone you penalize them for achieving something , thats completley counterproductive, and it is Socialism, and that never works!! It's not governement's job to take form those that work and give to those that don't............Bully for Europe of that's how they like it there, a lot of us here don't. And Bush has deficits for a few reasons, the war is costly but necessary, secondly when the terrorists struck us on 9/11 it created a resession which we are now coming out of quite healthily.

 

[Redz]

Yes, and we've all witnessed just how frighteningly effective those are.


I don't believe we have. If you believe what we are doing today around the world is in any way equivalent to what the Islamofascists would like to do to us, as you are implying it is, then it probably isn't worth arguing the point with you.

The fact that there is one fewer madman who hates this country, has ties to international terrorists, has the capability to manufacture sophisticated chemical and biological weapons, and has the power of a state behind him is good enough for me.


They attacked us constantly between the two wars.

yes for example the millions who died in iraq because of american supported un sanctions, the economic ruin visited on iraq and cuba. sanctions can and are effective because they cost nations money and sadly thats all that counts

i am not impling that, i'm just impling that the notion of preemptive strike is flawed and will lead to political chaos if other nations start doing it.

good that saddams gone,but now there is just a lawless mess of country perfect for loads of terrorists to go to. its terrorist disney land!

when? did they ever actually attack american soil?

 

[dilloduck]

when? did they ever actually attack american soil?

An American vessel is legally American soil

 

[Redz]

An American vessel is legally American soil

that you have to get technical shows how weak your arguments are!!!!!!
did they ever attack the mainland or any civilians???

 

[dilloduck]

that you have to get technical shows how weak your arguments are!!!!!!
did they ever attack the mainland or any civilians???

Hold up a sec here----You are the one saying that the US technically had no reason to invade Iraq. Pick your poison!

 

[Fmr jarhead]

Maybe ask Scott Speicher if Iraq ever attacked an American.....

It is not a weak arguement that the US was shot at on a dily basis, enforcing the sanctions put in place by the UN. You can't have it both ways, my friend. If the US enforces the no fly zone, and is shot at, then, yes we were attacked.

Pretty simple to understand (especially if you are one of the men or women who were being fired upon by the Iraqis).

 

[Redz]

9/11 it created a resession which we are now coming out of quite healthily.

good economic points bonnie, but its not simple its really complex.
everybody wants to pay less tax. thats just human nature. your earlier point about small business was good. i just think the rich can afford to pay more. i believe that the state should provide certain things for its citizens, like welfare.
i think you would appreciate it more if you lost your job.
9/11 didn't create that recession, sure it cost the economy a lot of money and more importantly lives,but the recession was happening already and had started in summer 2001, politicans just like to blame it on 9/11, once again abusing the memory of those who died

 

[Zhukov]

yes for example the millions who died in iraq because of american supported un sanctions, the economic ruin visited on iraq and cuba. sanctions can and are effective because they cost nations money and sadly thats all that counts

American supported UN sanctions. That's some sad spin Redz. Guess what event lifted those sanctions? Maybe if the world was a little more assertive (or a little less greedy?) we wouldn't have to rely un ineffectual punitive measures like economic sanctions

i am not impling that, i'm just impling that the notion of preemptive strike is flawed and will lead to political chaos if other nations start doing it.

If it is justified they have our support. If not, then they most likely will not, and they'd better be prepared for that. No, this notion will not lead to chaos, what leads to chaos is when evil is alowed to spread while the world does nothing.

good that saddams gone,but now there is just a lawless mess of country perfect for loads of terrorists to go to. its terrorist disney land!

If they enjoy dying by the hundreds and thousands, I suppose it is.

when? did they ever actually attack american soil?

Once upon a time there was this thing called the Persian Golf War.
During this war Saddam Hussein invaded and occupied a sovereign nation with the intent of absorbing it into his own country.
By the power of the United States of America and our allies his forces were pushed from Kuwait and largely destroyed.
As a consequence of this defeat Saddam Hussein signed a treaty that required his acceptance of no fly zones over portions of Iraq and the unimpeded enforcement of those no fly zones by coalition aircraft.
On a near daily basis he engaged in intimidation by radar lock, and on numerous occasions actually launched missiles at American and English fighter jets.
This, by any definition, is a violation of international law and an act of war.

 

[Redz]

Hold up a sec here----You are the one saying that the US technically had no reason to invade Iraq. Pick your poison!

i never said they had no reason to attack iraq, just that when they did they established the notion of a preemptive attack. this principal when its logically applied to other countries leads to chaos, as any nation can just attack another nation whom it suspects may attack it as some stage. this is crazy and you know it

 

[dilloduck]

good economic points bonnie, but its not simple its really complex.
everybody wants to pay less tax. thats just human nature. your earlier point about small business was good. i just think the rich can afford to pay more. i believe that the state should provide certain things for its citizens, like welfare.
i think you would appreciate it more if you lost your job.
9/11 didn't create that recession, sure it cost the economy a lot of money and more importantly lives,but the recession was happening already and had started in summer 2001, politicans just like to blame it on 9/11, once again abusing the memory of those who died

our economy got worse partly due to 9/11. Neither one of them are abusing anyones memory. You however are ignorant of the facts and your lucky you have people to educate and inform you. Thank the American taxpayer!

 

[dilloduck]

i never said they had no reason to attack iraq, just that when they did they established the notion of a preemptive attack. this principal when its logically applied to other countries leads to chaos, as any nation can just attack another nation whom it suspects may attack it as some stage. this is crazy and you know it

You were splitting hairs whether it was "justified" or not ! What IS crazy is that you actually believe no one will ever attack you without giving you a fair warning and a good reason! It happened here. Deal with it your own way when it happens there or are you to good to be attacked?

 

[Shattered]

good economic points bonnie, but its not simple its really complex.
everybody wants to pay less tax. thats just human nature. your earlier point about small business was good. i just think the rich can afford to pay more. i believe that the state should provide certain things for its citizens, like welfare.
i think you would appreciate it more if you lost your job.
9/11 didn't create that recession, sure it cost the economy a lot of money and more importantly lives,but the recession was happening already and had started in summer 2001, politicans just like to blame it on 9/11, once again abusing the memory of those who died

Sure, the rich CAN afford to pay more, but give me a single good reason why they should be penalized just to cover your ass, when they're the ones busting their ass to EARN more money.

The State ISN'T providing "things" for its citizens, like welfare. I'M providing it, and every OTHER person who crawls their ass out of bed on a daily basis to go to work to EARN the money that's being handed to welfare recipients.

Therefore, since it's partially MY money, I say welfare should be cut completely off after a period of not more than 6 months. If you're on welfare, and you're spitting out children, you get cut off immediately. If you're sucking up my money, I say you can't afford to have more children.

 

[Redz]

American supported UN sanctions. Guess what event lifted those sanctions?
If it is justified they have our support. If not, then they most likely will not, and they'd better be prepared for that. No, this notion will not lead to chaos, what leads to chaos is when evil is alowed to spread while the world does nothing.
During this war Saddam Hussein invaded and occupied a sovereign nation with the intent of absorbing it into his own country.
By the power of the United States of America and our allies his forces were pushed from Kuwait and largely destroyed.
As a consequence of this defeat Saddam Hussein signed a treaty that required his acceptance of no fly zones over portions of Iraq and the unimpeded enforcement of those no fly zones by coalition aircraft.
On a near daily basis he engaged in intimidation by radar lock, and on numerous occasions actually launched missiles at American and English fighter jets.
This, by any definition, is a violation of international law and an act of war.

where to start??
lifted the sanctions once they occupied the country how generious
who decides whats justified?? now that the idea of attacking a soverign nation is acceptable, anyone can do anything to another country. who decides whats evil??
rummy?? get real. there is no good and there is no evil, just a bunch of people on a spinning rock in space
whoever wins tommorrow iraq will be a grave for poor young americans for years.
Radar Lock!!!
you should have nuked them all Eh?
i mean an actual iraqi goverment attack on U.S soil which never ever happened!

 

[Flying Duck]

I love the use of the term "sovereign nation" to refer to Saddam's Iraq. (Implied message: Mass murder and oppression is OK if conducted by a "sovereign nation.")

 

[dilloduck]

where to start??
lifted the sanctions once they occupied the country how generious
who decides whats justified?? now that the idea of attacking a soverign nation is acceptable, anyone can do anything to another country. who decides whats evil??
rummy?? get real. there is no good and there is no evil, just a bunch of people on a spinning rock in space
whoever wins tommorrow iraq will be a grave for poor young americans for years.
Radar Lock!!!
you should have nuked them all Eh?
i mean an actual iraqi goverment attack on U.S soil which never ever happened!

OK i'll bite--what should the US have done to make Ireland feel safer?

 

[Redz]

Sure, the rich CAN afford to pay more, but give me a single good reason why they should be penalized just to cover your ass, when they're the ones busting their ass to EARN more money.

The State ISN'T providing "things" for its citizens, like welfare. I'M providing it, and every OTHER person who crawls their ass out of bed on a daily basis to go to work to EARN the money that's being handed to welfare recipients.

Therefore, since it's partially MY money, I say welfare should be cut completely off after a period of not more than 6 months. If you're on welfare, and you're spitting out children, you get cut off immediately. If you're sucking up ,y money, I say you can't afford to have more children.

you know that economic growth is very dependant on population growth, so you had better hope they spit out more kids.
yes it is your money but if you lost your job you would't think like that. how much after your homeloan and food are taken care of do you really need?
are u religious? cos thinking like that about the poor and marginalised ain't good for your soul

 

[Bonnie]

good economic points bonnie, but its not simple its really complex.
everybody wants to pay less tax. thats just human nature. your earlier point about small business was good. i just think the rich can afford to pay more. i believe that the state should provide certain things for its citizens, like welfare.


i think you would appreciate it more if you lost your job.
9/11 didn't create that recession, sure it cost the economy a lot of money and more importantly lives,but the recession was happening already and had started in summer 2001, politicans just like to blame it on 9/11, once again abusing the memory of those who died

One, we already do provide a safety net for those truly in need, problem is many who can work are abusing the system, and the Democrats are fueling this through class envy because it gives them a permanent base of voters. We have a permanent entitlement mentality in this country because of this. Many believe ..because they have been told by the Libs that government is the only and total solution to every one of their needs.........Talk about exploitation.

Two, I have had my own business for many years now, and have found it hard to expand and hire more people the way I would like to because of the current tax system that Bush is trying to fix, and the Democrats fight him tooth and nail on.

Third, The rich are the exact people who invest risk capitol, and start companies, and take chances, they pay a good deal of taxes, there is no need to tax them into oblivion. There is much too much governemnt waste that can be cut instead. The Democrats won't do that becasue once more people actually got on their feet financially the Dems would no longer have a job.

and fourthly, If what you assert is true that the recession started the summer of 2001, then we ought to be looking at the previous administration aka Clinton for putting us there then!!!!!!!!

 

[Redz]

OK i'll bite--what should the US done to make Ireland feel safer?

how about a real effort to solve israel-palestine
AND
Bring every one of your 400000 troops based overseas home, they would be happier and safer and so would the rest of the world.