Biden admits Stimulous was a failure

[Kevin_Kennedy]

How so? The Stimulus money put in to the economy was money borrowed from foreigners, so what exactly did you mean Kevin by it coming at the expense of some other job? I don't understand?

Care

Actually, since Americans have reduced their spending and increased their savings rate since the recession hit, it's being financed more and more by Americans. Does that change your analysis?

In fact, Kevin's point is more valid if the debt is being financed by foreigners. In that case, interest service on the debt becomes a net transfer of wealth out of our economy. If Americans are financing the debt, interest service on it becomes a redistribution of wealth within our economy.

This is true, the American taxpayers are on the line for more than the stimulus was if the money was borrowed to fund it. However, no matter how it was financed the stimulus package hurts the economy.

 

[007]

Key Quotes from Biden on the StimulusFrom NBC's "Meet the Press":

"No one realized how bad the economy was. The projections, in fact, turned out to be worse. But we took the mainstream model as to what we thought -- and everyone else thought -- the unemployment rate would be."

"Everyone guessed wrong at the time the estimate was made about what the state of the economy was at the moment this was passed."

"The bottom line is that jobs are being created that would not have been there before."

"Can I claim credit that all of that's due to the recovery package? No. But it clearly has had an impact."

i think he was being brutally honest.

Any other politician(like Obama as example or his press secretary) would have glossed it over with sugar much more so imo....

care

Then why didn't they wait? Well... I already know why... because obama was riding a wave of popularity and the dems finally had a majority, so it was time to pay up on election promises and spend, spend, spend on liberal things dems had wanted for years. Stimulus... ppphht... not hardly. It was a dem spending orgy, and nothing more. It was never intended to stimulate anything. If biden was going to be "brutally honest," he'd have said that.

 

[Navy1960]

Okay here are some items on the Stimulus Bill that are going to create just millions of jobs.

1. $1.7 million for pig odor research in Iowa
2. $2 million “for the promotion of astronomy” in Hawaii
3. $332,000 for the design and construction of a school sidewalk in Franklin, Texas (and this is not a local issue?)
4. $2.1 million for the Center for Grape Genetics in New York
5. $650,000 for beaver management in North Carolina and Mississippi
6. $1 million for mormon cricket control in Utah
7. $300,000 for the Montana World Trade Center
8. $200,000 for a tattoo removal violence outreach program that could help gang members or others shed visible signs of their past
9. $475,000 to build a parking garage in Provo City, Utah
10. $1.7 million "for a honey bee factory" in Weslaco, TX

Make no mistake this Stimulus was not meant to create jobs, it was meant to give a pat on the back in the form of "PORK" to all those who supported the election of the current president. Had this bill really intended to create jobs or save them, then it would have gone directly into the market to create them or to the consumers who spend the money to actually "STIMULATE" the economy, or here's an idea how about paying off some of that massive deficit? What a concept there huh? actually paying our bills for a change.

 

[Sarah G]

Key Quotes from Biden on the StimulusFrom NBC's "Meet the Press":

"No one realized how bad the economy was. The projections, in fact, turned out to be worse. But we took the mainstream model as to what we thought -- and everyone else thought -- the unemployment rate would be."

"Everyone guessed wrong at the time the estimate was made about what the state of the economy was at the moment this was passed."

"The bottom line is that jobs are being created that would not have been there before."

"Can I claim credit that all of that's due to the recovery package? No. But it clearly has had an impact."

i think he was being brutally honest.

Any other politician(like Obama as example or his press secretary) would have glossed it over with sugar much more so imo....

care

Then why didn't they wait? Well... I already know why... because obama was riding a wave of popularity and the dems finally had a majority, so it was time to pay up on election promises and spend, spend, spend on liberal things dems had wanted for years. Stimulus... ppphht... not hardly. It was a dem spending orgy, and nothing more. It was never intended to stimulate anything. If biden was going to be "brutally honest," he'd have said that.

Was... had... past tense?

They're on to healthcare now and Republicans are still stuck in the muck under the bridge to the past. Republican leadership is at war with David Letterman for God's sake.

Do you think Republicans will ever step up and start working for America again?

 

[Tech_Esq]

i think he was being brutally honest.

Any other politician(like Obama as example or his press secretary) would have glossed it over with sugar much more so imo....

care

Then why didn't they wait? Well... I already know why... because obama was riding a wave of popularity and the dems finally had a majority, so it was time to pay up on election promises and spend, spend, spend on liberal things dems had wanted for years. Stimulus... ppphht... not hardly. It was a dem spending orgy, and nothing more. It was never intended to stimulate anything. If biden was going to be "brutally honest," he'd have said that.

Was... had... past tense?

They're on to healthcare now and Republicans are still stuck in the muck under the bridge to the past. Republican leadership is at war with David Letterman for God's sake.

Do you think Republicans will ever step up and start working for America again?

Actually Republicans are prepared and will offer an alternative bill on health care.

This despite a warning by the powerful chairman of the Senate Finance committee Max Bacus that if representative of organizations continue to meet with the Republicans, he will assume they have cast their lot with the republicans and he will ensure they have no voice in the Democrat plan.

 

[Navy1960]

$75,000,000.00 million for a program to end smoking
$400,000,000.00 for researching sexually transmitted diseases
$200,000,000.00 to force the military to buy environmentally-friendly electric cars
$50,000,000.00 million for the National Endowment for the Arts

All this and more, and people are accusing the Republicans of not working for the american people on healthcare? Where was the concern for paying for healthcare when they were giving money away to study pig farts. The facts are, this bill could have just about funded the entire healthcare debacle for 10 years and not one single Republican voted for this stimulus in the house so who was it that was really working for the American people on this one, and who was it that was diving into the pork barrel?

 

[Valerie]

$75,000,000.00 million for a program to end smoking
$400,000,000.00 for researching sexually transmitted diseases
$200,000,000.00 to force the military to buy environmentally-friendly electric cars
$50,000,000.00 million for the National Endowment for the Arts

All this and more, and people are accusing the Republicans of not working for the american people on healthcare? Where was the concern for paying for healthcare when they were giving money away to study pig farts. The facts are, this bill could have just about funded the entire healthcare debacle for 10 years and not one single Republican voted for this stimulus in the house so who was it that was really working for the American people on this one, and who was it that was diving into the pork barrel?

You make some great points, Navy! Americans are being fooled into believing nationalized health care is in their best interest.

 

[Sarah G]

Then why didn't they wait? Well... I already know why... because obama was riding a wave of popularity and the dems finally had a majority, so it was time to pay up on election promises and spend, spend, spend on liberal things dems had wanted for years. Stimulus... ppphht... not hardly. It was a dem spending orgy, and nothing more. It was never intended to stimulate anything. If biden was going to be "brutally honest," he'd have said that.

Was... had... past tense?

They're on to healthcare now and Republicans are still stuck in the muck under the bridge to the past. Republican leadership is at war with David Letterman for God's sake.

Do you think Republicans will ever step up and start working for America again?

Actually Republicans are prepared and will offer an alternative bill on health care.

This despite a warning by the powerful chairman of the Senate Finance committee Max Bacus that if representative of organizations continue to meet with the Republicans, he will assume they have cast their lot with the republicans and he will ensure they have no voice in the Democrat plan.

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

 

[Yurt]

Was... had... past tense?

They're on to healthcare now and Republicans are still stuck in the muck under the bridge to the past. Republican leadership is at war with David Letterman for God's sake.

Do you think Republicans will ever step up and start working for America again?

Actually Republicans are prepared and will offer an alternative bill on health care.

This despite a warning by the powerful chairman of the Senate Finance committee Max Bacus that if representative of organizations continue to meet with the Republicans, he will assume they have cast their lot with the republicans and he will ensure they have no voice in the Democrat plan.

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

how unamerican of you....

 

[Navy1960]

$75,000,000.00 million for a program to end smoking
$400,000,000.00 for researching sexually transmitted diseases
$200,000,000.00 to force the military to buy environmentally-friendly electric cars
$50,000,000.00 million for the National Endowment for the Arts

All this and more, and people are accusing the Republicans of not working for the american people on healthcare? Where was the concern for paying for healthcare when they were giving money away to study pig farts. The facts are, this bill could have just about funded the entire healthcare debacle for 10 years and not one single Republican voted for this stimulus in the house so who was it that was really working for the American people on this one, and who was it that was diving into the pork barrel?

You make some great points, Navy! Americans are being fooled into believing nationalized health care is in their best interest.

Valerie, I hoenstly believe that the costs of healthcare can be brought under control by promoting a friendly competetive environment for business to thrive, therefor allowing people access to affordable insurance and healthcare. All this noble talk about how concerned some members of congress are and are willing to spend another 1.2 Trillion dollars we DONT have all in the name of healthcare is nothing but another vote getting sham. As I stated above had this members of congress had any intentions at all about Healthcare and had it been at the top of the list for the American people along with jobs, then they would have not given millions on stupid projects, some of them I listed abive that have nothing at all to do with helping Americans or saving their jobs.

 

[Tech_Esq]

Was... had... past tense?

They're on to healthcare now and Republicans are still stuck in the muck under the bridge to the past. Republican leadership is at war with David Letterman for God's sake.

Do you think Republicans will ever step up and start working for America again?

Actually Republicans are prepared and will offer an alternative bill on health care.

This despite a warning by the powerful chairman of the Senate Finance committee Max Bacus that if representative of organizations continue to meet with the Republicans, he will assume they have cast their lot with the republicans and he will ensure they have no voice in the Democrat plan.

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

 

[oreo]

Any chance Biden is off the ticket in 2012?

The way it's going, it would not surprise me if Hillary challenged BO again in 2012.

To be honest with you, I am surprised Hillary is still in his admininstration & has not resigned yet.

I bet she has NIGHTMARES for ever accepting Secretary of State. Obama is going south quickly--& as long as she remains in this administration she goes down the john with him.

In my opinion--she has committed political suicide for accepting the Secretary of State position. She should have stayed in the Senate -- where she would have wheeled a lot of power. It's like Obama has stuck her in a closet--we never see her or hear her comments. It's always Joe Biden--or someone else within the administration remarking on foreign policy. It's like she doesn't even exist in this admininstration.

 

[Sarah G]

Actually Republicans are prepared and will offer an alternative bill on health care.

This despite a warning by the powerful chairman of the Senate Finance committee Max Bacus that if representative of organizations continue to meet with the Republicans, he will assume they have cast their lot with the republicans and he will ensure they have no voice in the Democrat plan.

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

Typical neocon rhetorical spin here.

America voted a resounding Democratic majority in this time. That means Repubs don't get to demand anything. If they want a voice, they need to start supporting Dem programs even if it is with some intelligent debate of course.

Nobody is going to listen to them whining and obstructing like they are now.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

Typical neocon rhetorical spin here.

America voted a resounding Democratic majority in this time. That means Repubs don't get to demand anything. If they want a voice, they need to start supporting Dem programs even if it is with some intelligent debate of course.

Nobody is going to listen to them whining and obstructing like they are now.

Except people voted in Republicans as well, expecting that their views would be heard.

 

[Valerie]

$75,000,000.00 million for a program to end smoking
$400,000,000.00 for researching sexually transmitted diseases
$200,000,000.00 to force the military to buy environmentally-friendly electric cars
$50,000,000.00 million for the National Endowment for the Arts

All this and more, and people are accusing the Republicans of not working for the american people on healthcare? Where was the concern for paying for healthcare when they were giving money away to study pig farts. The facts are, this bill could have just about funded the entire healthcare debacle for 10 years and not one single Republican voted for this stimulus in the house so who was it that was really working for the American people on this one, and who was it that was diving into the pork barrel?

You make some great points, Navy! Americans are being fooled into believing nationalized health care is in their best interest.

Valerie, I honestly believe that the costs of healthcare can be brought under control by promoting a friendly competitive environment for business to thrive, therefor allowing people access to affordable insurance and healthcare. All this noble talk about how concerned some members of congress are and are willing to spend another 1.2 Trillion dollars we DONT have all in the name of healthcare is nothing but another vote getting sham. As I stated above had this members of congress had any intentions at all about Healthcare and had it been at the top of the list for the American people along with jobs, then they would have not given millions on stupid projects, some of them I listed above that have nothing at all to do with helping Americans or saving their jobs.

I totally agree. How many decades of "doing it for the children" does it take until we realize we're being totally bamboozled? No problem, the next political bozo will just step-up and say something like, "Well, we didn't know then what we know now" yada yada.

"No one realized how bad the economy was. The projections, in fact, turned out to be worse. But we took the mainstream model as to what we thought -- and everyone else thought -- the unemployment rate would be."

"Everyone guessed wrong at the time the estimate was made about what the state of the economy was at the moment this was passed."

Alrighty then, NOW we're supposed to believe all the experts who agree nationalized health care is the best solution for the children! ??? In related news, I heard four out of five foxes agree the chicken coop doesn't need to be guarded either.

 

[Sinatra]

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

Typical neocon rhetorical spin here.

America voted a resounding Democratic majority in this time. That means Repubs don't get to demand anything. If they want a voice, they need to start supporting Dem programs even if it is with some intelligent debate of course.

Nobody is going to listen to them whining and obstructing like they are now.

Please define neocon for us - in your own words.

Thank you.

 

[Tech_Esq]

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

Typical neocon rhetorical spin here.

America voted a resounding Democratic majority in this time. That means Repubs don't get to demand anything. If they want a voice, they need to start supporting Dem programs even if it is with some intelligent debate of course.

Nobody is going to listen to them whining and obstructing like they are now.

If you knew anything about me, you would know I'm no neo-con. So, you get a FAILURE of analysis on that point.

The victory margin of Obama was 9.5 million votes out of 130 million cast. Or 7%. Hardly resounding. Hardly a mandate.

The Democrats didn't do a good enough job supporting the Republican program to expect the Republicans to stop being Republicans and start being Democrats. Maybe when you guys are in the minority again, you'll rethink how much you want to support the Republican program.

There are 59 million people expecting the Republicans to act like Republicans and not Democrats. They had damned well better do it or we'll get some people in there that can.

 

[Valerie]

Do you suppose that the Democratic majority is ready to accept Republican plans for healthcare at this point? Rs have proven themselves to be all about obstruction and the antiquated HMO and insurance company mindset.

I don't think they should have a voice either unless they are willing to support Democrats.

So basically you just want all Republicans to die. Is that about it?

If they support Democrats, they are Democrats. There's no use in having two democrat parties. We only need one, that's plenty.

You were saying that Rs are fighting with Letterman and not doing their job. When I pointed out they were doing their job, you said they shouldn't do it and if they did it, nobody should listen. Got it! Rabid Dembot.

Typical neocon rhetorical spin here.

America voted a resounding Democratic majority in this time. That means Repubs don't get to demand anything. If they want a voice, they need to start supporting Dem programs even if it is with some intelligent debate of course.

Nobody is going to listen to them whining and obstructing like they are now.

This election was more of a repudiation of Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, et al than an endorsement of any particular Democratic policies per se. We only had two choices.
I'm glad the Republicans are fighting against nationalized health care because I think it would be a huge mistake.

 

[Navy1960]

Liberalism is a broad class of political philosophies that considers individual liberty and equality to be the most important political goals.[1]

Liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. Within liberalism, there are various streams of thought which compete over the use of the term "liberal" and may propose very different policies, but they are generally united by their support for political liberalism, which encompasses support for: freedom of thought and speech, limitations on the power of governments, the rule of law, an individual's right to private property,[2] and a transparent system of government.[3][4][5] All liberals, as well as some adherents of other political ideologies, support some variant of the form of government known as liberal democracy, with open and fair elections, where all citizens have equal rights by law

Liberalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Are you sure you want to call yourself a liberal? by the true definition as a liberal you would be advocating freedom of choice here.

Socialism refers to any one of various economic theories of economic organization advocating state or cooperative ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods, and a society characterized by equal opportunities/means for all individuals with a more egalitarian method of compensation based on the full product of the laborer.[1][2] Modern socialism originated in the late 18th-century intellectual and working class political movement that criticized the effects of industrialization and private ownership on society. Karl Marx posited that socialism (a stage in which the working class controlled the state and owned the means of production before the state and classes withered away) would be achieved via class struggle and a proletarian revolution, and would be a transitional stage between capitalism and communism (the final stage in which class dichotomies and the state itself ceased to exist).
Socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So then wouldn't a person who is advocating Govt. takeovers of healthcare, auto industries, banks, and another other form form of Govt. regulation into the private sector be considered a neo-socialist?

 

[oreo]

Biden "apologizes" tells "Meet the Press" that "everyone guessed wrong" on the impact of the stimulus, economy was worse off than anyone thought. Backs away from the estimate that the funds could create or save 3.5 million jobs, instead promises 600,000 by the end of the summer.


Well--that explains it--they were "guessing with our money."

I believe the orginal "shove it down our throats rhetoric"-- was that we were told that this 787 BILLION dollar so-called economic stimulus bill that really isn't a stimulus--was supposed to "save" or create 6 MILLION new jobs. What happened to that?

Now we're down to "saving" whatever that means--or creating 600,000 jobs by summers end with the so-called economic stimulus bill that really isn't a stimulus bill.

You know--the same bill that no democrat actually read--before they signed off on it--in their fire department "speed" to "save" the economy.