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Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must.You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.
Like you.
No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.
And I taught my children that as well.
No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.
What more is there to say than that?
Spending your youth in a grey cubicle slaving away in front of a computer for hours builds character? Working for the approval of others? Even if I was a leech, why wouldn't I want to live without having to labor? I don't want to work I want to learn and read and enjoy walks in nature. So if it's possible for me to get those things without work, why would I, logically, refuse?Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must.You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.
No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.
What more is there to say than that?
That's what I thought.
Nope, I'm not jesting. We work because that's the way to build character, to gain respect, to set an example of productivity.
You just have never HAD to work, so you don't appreciate it. You expect others to provide for you. As I already pointed out. That makes you a societal leech with no character.
.Saying "do it or you die" doesn't address the ethical aspect of the situation. Or it does...but really just confirms my belief that there is something unethical at work here. No pun intended..
how about not starving to death as an underlying, unavoidable value where stealing from someone else for your food is not an option - and yes the capitalist system is flawed when people and churches use it as a religion.
for sustenance and Spiritual wellbeing a manageable game plan is virtually an unavoidable necessity.
the alliance of church and bushiness vs government is a clue.
.
Saying "do it or you die" doesn't address the ethical aspect of the situation. Or it does...but really just confirms my belief that there is something unethical at work here. No pun intended.
Spending your youth in a grey cubicle slaving away in front of a computer for hours builds character? Working for the approval of others? Even if I was a leech, why wouldn't I want to live without having to labor? I don't want to work I want to learn and read and enjoy walks in nature. So if it's possible for me to get those things without work, why would I, logically, refuse?Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must.You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.
No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.
What more is there to say than that?
That's what I thought.
Nope, I'm not jesting. We work because that's the way to build character, to gain respect, to set an example of productivity.
You just have never HAD to work, so you don't appreciate it. You expect others to provide for you. As I already pointed out. That makes you a societal leech with no character.
And indeed if they are going to work to feed me, why should I not accept benefit from that? They can labor and I am free to do as I please. And do tell, how did your work as a maid build character?Spending your youth in a grey cubicle slaving away in front of a computer for hours builds character? Working for the approval of others? Even if I was a leech, why wouldn't I want to live without having to labor? I don't want to work I want to learn and read and enjoy walks in nature. So if it's possible for me to get those things without work, why would I, logically, refuse?Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must.You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.
No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.
What more is there to say than that?
That's what I thought.
Nope, I'm not jesting. We work because that's the way to build character, to gain respect, to set an example of productivity.
You just have never HAD to work, so you don't appreciate it. You expect others to provide for you. As I already pointed out. That makes you a societal leech with no character.
If that's the work available that you've gotten into, yes, it does.
But in my family, we start working at 14 and it's not cubicle work. My sons worked driving wheat truck, my uncles worked in the woods, my dad went into the service. I started babysitting at 9 or 10, when I turned 14 I started working as a motel maid. My daughter turns 14 next month, she has a job as a busser waiting for her at a nearby Chinese restaurant.
They will do low skill jobs while they are young and before they build their skill set. As they get older they will increase their skill set and prestige. My daughter has been a volunteer at our local boys and girls club for a year as well. She didn't get paid for it.
I teach my children not to beg or accept charity, but to give to those who do and to not begrudge it when they give it. I teach my children that working with people you don't like or respect is part of being a grown up, and it's what we do because we are adults and people of character who support ourselves.
But you just keep sitting on your ass and whining. I'm sure someone will work to feed you.
It taught me the value of the things I took for granted that were provided by someone else until I was old enough to provide them myself.And indeed if they are going to work to feed me, why should I not accept benefit from that? They can labor and I am free to do as I please. And do tell, how did your work as a maid build character?Spending your youth in a grey cubicle slaving away in front of a computer for hours builds character? Working for the approval of others? Even if I was a leech, why wouldn't I want to live without having to labor? I don't want to work I want to learn and read and enjoy walks in nature. So if it's possible for me to get those things without work, why would I, logically, refuse?Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must.No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.
What more is there to say than that?
That's what I thought.
Nope, I'm not jesting. We work because that's the way to build character, to gain respect, to set an example of productivity.
You just have never HAD to work, so you don't appreciate it. You expect others to provide for you. As I already pointed out. That makes you a societal leech with no character.
If that's the work available that you've gotten into, yes, it does.
But in my family, we start working at 14 and it's not cubicle work. My sons worked driving wheat truck, my uncles worked in the woods, my dad went into the service. I started babysitting at 9 or 10, when I turned 14 I started working as a motel maid. My daughter turns 14 next month, she has a job as a busser waiting for her at a nearby Chinese restaurant.
They will do low skill jobs while they are young and before they build their skill set. As they get older they will increase their skill set and prestige. My daughter has been a volunteer at our local boys and girls club for a year as well. She didn't get paid for it.
I teach my children not to beg or accept charity, but to give to those who do and to not begrudge it when they give it. I teach my children that working with people you don't like or respect is part of being a grown up, and it's what we do because we are adults and people of character who support ourselves.
But you just keep sitting on your ass and whining. I'm sure someone will work to feed you.
What do YOU assert? Instead of griping about the zany value system of American workers, let's hear about your better mousetrap.But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?
What do YOU assert? Instead of griping about the zany value system of American workers, let's hear about your better mousetrap.But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?
I think he's just a young kid, KG. He introduced himself last week sounding like a communist, but I don't think he's really got any idea what he's talking about. He found a trash site someplace that spouted stuff that sounded good and he's trying it on for size.What do YOU assert? Instead of griping about the zany value system of American workers, let's hear about your better mousetrap.But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?
He seems to think people who work are stupid.
I think he's just a young kid, KG. He introduced himself last week sounding like a communist, but I don't think he's really got any idea what he's talking about. He found a trash site someplace that spouted stuff that sounded good and he's trying it on for size.What do YOU assert? Instead of griping about the zany value system of American workers, let's hear about your better mousetrap.But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?
He seems to think people who work are stupid.
My point is, he doesn't know WHAT he believes. Obvious holes in his basic education.I think he's just a young kid, KG. He introduced himself last week sounding like a communist, but I don't think he's really got any idea what he's talking about. He found a trash site someplace that spouted stuff that sounded good and he's trying it on for size.What do YOU assert? Instead of griping about the zany value system of American workers, let's hear about your better mousetrap.But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?
He seems to think people who work are stupid.
Age is no excuse. My kids NEVER believed that sort of garbage.
