alan grayson threatens lawsuit on citizenship grounds if ted cruz is the gop nominee

In the most detailed examination yet of Senator John McCain’s eligibility to be president, a law professor at the University of Arizona has concluded that neither Mr. McCain’s birth in 1936 in the Panama Canal Zone nor the fact that his parents were American citizens is enough to satisfy the constitutional requirement that the president must be a “natural-born citizen.”


The analysis, by Prof. Gabriel J. Chin, focused on a 1937 law that has been largely overlooked in the debate over Mr. McCain’s eligibility to be president. The law conferred citizenship on children of American parents born in the Canal Zone after 1904, and it made John McCain a citizen just before his first birthday. But the law came too late, Professor Chin argued, to make Mr. McCain a natural-born citizen.

“It’s preposterous that a technicality like this can make a difference in an advanced democracy,” Professor Chin said. “But this is the constitutional text that we have.”

Several legal experts said that Professor Chin’s analysis was careful and plausible. But they added that nothing was very likely to follow from it.

Photo
11mccain.500.jpg

A 1936 picture shows the future presidential candidate John McCain in the arms of his grandfather John Sidney McCain in the Canal Zone. His father, John Sidney McCain Jr., is at left. CreditMcCain Presidential Campaign, via Associated Press
“No court will get close to it, and everyone else is on board, so there’s a constitutional consensus, the merits of arguments such as this one aside,” said Peter J. Spiro, an authority on the law of citizenship at Temple University.

Mr. McCain has dismissed any suggestion that he does not meet the citizenship test.

In April, the Senate approved a nonbinding resolution declaring that Mr. McCain is eligible to be president. Its sponsors said the nation’s founders would have never intended to deny the presidency to the offspring of military personnel stationed out of the country.

A lawsuit challenging Mr. McCain’s qualifications is pending in the Federal District Court in Concord, N.H.

There are, Professor Chin argued in his analysis, only two ways to become a natural-born citizen. One, specified in the Constitution, is to be born in the United States. The other way is to be covered by a law enacted by Congress at the time of one’s birth.

Professor Chin wrote that simply being born in the Canal Zone did not satisfy the 14th Amendment, which says that “all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States.”

A series of early-20th-century decisions known as the Insular Cases, he wrote, ruled that unincorporated territories acquired by the United States were not part of the nation for constitutional purposes. The Insular Cases did not directly address the Canal Zone. But the zone was generally considered an unincorporated territory before it was returned to Panama in 1999, and some people born in the Canal Zone when it was under American jurisdiction have been deported from the United States or convicted of being here illegally.

The second way Mr. McCain could have, and ultimately did, become a citizen was by statute, Professor Chin wrote. In Rogers v. Bellei in 1971, the Supreme Court said Congress had broad authority to decide whether and when children born to American citizens abroad are citizens.



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At the time of Mr. McCain’s birth, the relevant law granted citizenship to any child born to an American parent “out of the limits and jurisdiction of the United States.” Professor Chin said the term “limits and jurisdiction” left a crucial gap. The Canal Zone was beyond the limits of the United States but not beyond its jurisdiction, and thus the law did not apply to Mr. McCain.

In 1937, Congress addressed the problem, enacting a law that granted citizenship to people born in the Canal Zone after 1904. That made Mr. McCain a citizen, but not one who was naturally born, Professor Chin said, because the citizenship was conferred after his birth.

In his paper and in an interview, Professor Chin, a registered Democrat, said he had no political motive in raising the question.

In March, Laurence H. Tribe, a law professor at Harvard and an adviser to Senator Barack Obama, prepared a memorandum on these questions with Theodore B. Olson, a former solicitor general in the Bush administration. The memorandum concluded that Mr. McCain is a natural-born citizen based on the place of his birth, the citizenship of his parents and their service to the country.

In an interview on Thursday, Mr. Olson, whose firm represents Mr. McCain in the New Hampshire lawsuit, said Congress could not have intended to leave the gap described by Professor Chin. The 1937 law, Mr. Olson said, was not a fix but a way to clarify what Congress had meant all along.

Professor Tribe agreed. Reading the “limits and jurisdiction” clause as Professor Chin does, Professor Tribe said, “is to attribute a crazy design to Congress” that “would create an irrational gap.”

Brian Rogers, a McCain spokesman, said the campaign concurred and was confident Mr. McCain is eligible to serve.

In the motion to dismiss the New Hampshire suit, Mr. McCain’s lawyers said an individual citizen like the plaintiff, a Nashua man named Fred Hollander, lacks proof of direct injury and cannot sue.

Daniel P. Tokaji, an election law expert at Ohio State University, agreed. “It is awfully unlikely that a federal court would say that an individual voter has standing,” he said. “It is questionable whether anyone would have standing to raise that claim. You’d have to think a federal court would look for every possible way to avoid deciding the issue.”

so are you agreeing with Chin or with the paid agents of McCain?
 
[
BTW the man your defending is using some creepy psychological data mining group in his campaign. Data mined largely from unsuspecting Facebook users.

Ted Cruz campaign using firm that harvested data on millions of unwitting Facebook users

One of the typical things Obama Birthers did was try to equate eligibility issues with his policies.

You are doing the same with Cruz.

I defend Cruz's eligiblity- as I defended Obama's- because Cruz is eligible.

There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above
 
Citizenship in the United States, being a citizen, is a status that entails specific rights, duties and benefits.Citizenship is understood as a "right to have rights" since it serves as a foundation for a bundle of subsequent rights, such as the right to live and work in the United States and to receive federal assistance.[2]

There are two primary sources of citizenship: birthright citizenship, in which a person is presumed to be a citizen provided that they are born within the territorial limits of the United States, or other circumstances existing at the time of their birth (for example, citizenship of a parent),[3] and naturalization, a process in which an immigrant applies for citizenship and is accepted. These two pathways to citizenship are specified in the Citizenship Clause of the Constitution's 1868 Fourteenth Amendment which reads:

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

National citizenship signifies membership in the country as a whole; state citizenship, in contrast, signifies a relation between a person and a particular state and has application generally limited to domestic matters. State citizenship may affect (1) tax decisions and (2) eligibility for some state-provided benefits such ashigher education and (3) eligibility for state political posts such as U.S. Senator.

In Article One of the Constitution, the power to establish a "uniform rule of naturalization" is granted explicitly to Congress.

U.S. law permits multiple citizenship. A citizen of another country naturalized as a U.S. citizen may retain their previous citizenship, though they must renounce allegiance to the other country. A U.S. citizen retains U.S. citizenship when becoming the citizen of another country, should that country's laws allow it. Citizenship can be renounced by American citizens who also hold another citizenship via a formal procedure at a U.S. Embassy,[4][5] and it can also be restored.[6]

CitizenshipVTaxStatus.gif

Citizenship Status v. Tax Status


e=mc2 :)

Nice copy and paste of Birther imaginary forms of citizenship.
 
[
BTW the man your defending is using some creepy psychological data mining group in his campaign. Data mined largely from unsuspecting Facebook users.

Ted Cruz campaign using firm that harvested data on millions of unwitting Facebook users

One of the typical things Obama Birthers did was try to equate eligibility issues with his policies.

You are doing the same with Cruz.

I defend Cruz's eligiblity- as I defended Obama's- because Cruz is eligible.

There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.
 
i know, the birther thing again, doesn't seem to want to go away.

anyway republicans want sick people to die quickly. grayson is back. he is the dizzying hugo chavez of our American congress.

Alan Grayson Threatens Lawsuit on Citizenship Grounds if Ted Cruz Is the GOP Nominee - Breitbart

if you google die quickly, you get this:




COLMES: Well, his mother was born here, so I guess like Obama, though it’s interesting to me the people who had a problem with Obama, though it’s interesting to me that the people who had a problem with Obama’s birth certificate don’t have a problem with Ted Cruz who literally was born in another country and renounced his Canadian citizenry.

GRAYSON: I don’t know … the Constitution says natural-born Americans, so now we’re counting Canadians as natural born Americans? How does that work? I’m waiting for the moment that he gets the nomination and then I will file that beautiful lawsuit saying that he’s unqualified for the job because he’s ineligible.

COLMES: So you’re saying should he get the nomination, Alan Grayson will file a lawsuit against his candidacy.

GRAYSON: Absolutely! Call me crazy but I think the president of America should be an American.

COLMES: Now I wonder, does he qualify because of having an American mother can considered an American citizen and in fact he renounced his Canadian citizenship to be an American citizen, but you’re talking about American birth, but I believe if that’s one of you parents —

GRAYSON: Look, even the anchor babies are actually born here. He doesn’t even meet that qualification.

COLMES: Right. And although I don’t like the term anchor babies, it’s been embraced by people like Donald Trump and Ted Cruz — not Ted Cruz — Marco Rubio who may in fact be one, as I understand.

GRAYSON: Oh, it’s shocking. In Cruz’s case, it is obvious what happened. The Canadians got pissed off at us for acid rain, so they gave us Ted Cruz.


grayson is not considered to be one of the high intellectuals of the DC congress...
alan colmes is just plain creepy.

I had an Alan Grayson this morning...a double flusha....
 
One of the typical things Obama Birthers did was try to equate eligibility issues with his policies.

You are doing the same with Cruz.

I defend Cruz's eligiblity- as I defended Obama's- because Cruz is eligible.

There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?
 
Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules
 
There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?
 
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.
 
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

What is that child called?

A Natural born citizen.
 
One of the typical things Obama Birthers did was try to equate eligibility issues with his policies.

You are doing the same with Cruz.

I defend Cruz's eligiblity- as I defended Obama's- because Cruz is eligible.

There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

It's not an either/or, fuckstain.
 
Congress can pass rules of naturalization, if it wants to say this happens automatically in certain situations then it can......it can certainly not say a person was naturally born. If it or the courts think they can they are mistaken.



There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

DC's still peddling his brand-new, "I'm so fucking clever to have made this up first!" theory of a third type of citizenship.
 
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.

Which is why the law provides residency requirements for the parents. Duuuuhhhh.

You would know that if you bothered to research the actual laws, instead of making up your own version.
 
he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

What is that child called?

A Natural born citizen.

Actually, no. Under those circumstances, the mother doesn't meet the residency requirements to convey citizenship to her child.

It's not like this shit isn't available on the Internet, so what is so damned difficult about people looking it up, reading it, and comprehending it?
 
There are two kinds of citizens according to the Constitution- natural born citizens and naturalized.

When was Cruz naturalized?

So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

DC's still peddling his brand-new, "I'm so fucking clever to have made this up first!" theory of a third type of citizenship.

There are a number of people who just go with what they feel would be right for citizenship.

I am up for agreeing that when it comes to citizens born outside the country that there are some legitimate questions- unlike for those born within the country- but for me it all reduces to the fact that there are only two kinds of citizens- born- and naturalized.

And Cruz was born a U.S. citizen- just as McCain was.

If the voters were to choose Cruz- Congress would confirm his election without a single dissent- just like they did President Obama..
 
And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

What is that child called?

A Natural born citizen.

Actually, no. Under those circumstances, the mother doesn't meet the residency requirements to convey citizenship to her child.

It's not like this shit isn't available on the Internet, so what is so damned difficult about people looking it up, reading it, and comprehending it?

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

And how does the mother not meet residency requirements in the scenario I presented?

The candidate would have to meet the residency requirements to be President- but in the case I presented above- born in the United States is all that is required. There is no residency requirement for a mother to convey citizenship to her child born in the United States.

Born to two citizen parents was just put there to annoy those who want to pretend that is also a requirement.
 
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above.
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

DC's still peddling his brand-new, "I'm so fucking clever to have made this up first!" theory of a third type of citizenship.

There are a number of people who just go with what they feel would be right for citizenship.

I am up for agreeing that when it comes to citizens born outside the country that there are some legitimate questions- unlike for those born within the country- but for me it all reduces to the fact that there are only two kinds of citizens- born- and naturalized.

And Cruz was born a U.S. citizen- just as McCain was.

If the voters were to choose Cruz- Congress would confirm his election without a single dissent- just like they did President Obama..

Basically, yes.

The truth is, there IS rather intricately-applied law and precedent on this subject, because it actually DOES come up quite a bit for everyday people. It's just that dopes who haven't had to deal with it have only become aware of it on the rare occasions that someone in that situation runs for office.

Lawyers who deal with cases of immigration and international tax law and various other specialties, for example, can tell you very clearly what the laws say and how the courts have applied them.
 
well apparently automatically when he was born, according to current rules

Okay- under what naturalization law does that fall?

you tell me, the courts have apparently found some excuse for making this so.

But imagine a child born to a us citizen woman who raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas. Does it make sense for this child to be a US citizen?.....I think not.

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

What is that child called?

A Natural born citizen.

Actually, no. Under those circumstances, the mother doesn't meet the residency requirements to convey citizenship to her child.

It's not like this shit isn't available on the Internet, so what is so damned difficult about people looking it up, reading it, and comprehending it?

Imagine a child born in the United States to two U.S. citizen parents- who the mother raises her child with her ISIS husband overseas.

And how does the mother not meet residency requirements in the scenario I presented?

The candidate would have to meet the residency requirements to be President- but in the case I presented above- born in the United States is all that is required. There is no residency requirement for a mother to convey citizenship to her child born in the United States.

Born to two citizen parents was just put there to annoy those who want to pretend that is also a requirement.

Um, there IS a residency requirement for the citizen parent.

Go read the law. I'm tired of quoting it over and over and over and having people just skim past it and re-assert their errors.
 
So Cruz was never naturalized.

If Cruz is not a naturalized citizen- what kind of citizen is he?

A) Natural Born

sigh, same answer I gave above

he was a natural born citizen of Canada not the US.

And when did he become a naturalized citizen of the United States?

DC's still peddling his brand-new, "I'm so fucking clever to have made this up first!" theory of a third type of citizenship.

There are a number of people who just go with what they feel would be right for citizenship.

I am up for agreeing that when it comes to citizens born outside the country that there are some legitimate questions- unlike for those born within the country- but for me it all reduces to the fact that there are only two kinds of citizens- born- and naturalized.

And Cruz was born a U.S. citizen- just as McCain was.

If the voters were to choose Cruz- Congress would confirm his election without a single dissent- just like they did President Obama..

Basically, yes.

The truth is, there IS rather intricately-applied law and precedent on this subject, because it actually DOES come up quite a bit for everyday people. It's just that dopes who haven't had to deal with it have only become aware of it on the rare occasions that someone in that situation runs for office.

Lawyers who deal with cases of immigration and international tax law and various other specialties, for example, can tell you very clearly what the laws say and how the courts have applied them.

No not really.

There are several opinions on the issue- which is why articles like Chin's have come out.

I am not aware of a single case which has determined that a child born outside the United States is a natural born citizen. I have seen many convincing opinions that argue that a child born outside the United States who was born a U.S. Citizen is a natural born citizen.
 

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