31 American Troops Killed In Afghanistan...

[goshinj]

This is a terrible loss for our country. It seems very odd though that the helicopter shot down had several members of Seal Team 6 on it. Seems like they actually had some kind of intelligence on it or something. Just seems fishy. Most importantly, why do we in this country(military, media, etc.) give out information on special op's or for that matter anything to do with crucial military engagements. All we heard after bin ladens death was seal team 6, seal team 6, seal team 6, and on and on and for gods sake, it doesn't matter. We shouldn't even know who did it. That's the problem with national security in this country, no one can keep their mouth shut. I sure as hell didn't need to know who exactly it was that killed bin laden, as long as he was dead, then end of discussion...........That's it, no more. I'm tired of the media and everyone blowing covert op's and important info out of proportion for the world to see. Simply sad, that's all I can say. God bless all of those families who lost loved ones in this tragedy and you are in my prayers. Thanks for your time.

 

[Poli_Sigh]

While this indeed a horrific tragedy, I seriously doubt very many of our troops would want to come home from a job half finished. We must face the evils of the world at some point and the choices are to do it on their turf or ours. Many, such as myself, believe it should be on their turf for the greater good.

As honorable as that stuff about not leaving a war half finished may sound here at home, we'd do well to remember Viet Nam. After 11 futile punishing years, not only did we leave that war half finished, we left the country in the hands of the enemy. Why? Because Americans understood that to continue sacrificing American lives to a war that could never be won held no honor for anyone.

 

[nitroz]

We have mostly been on the defensive only. We would set up a base or camp and let the terrorists come to us. And if we go to villages to help, its usually an ambush.

I say we go on the offensive and keep on it throughout Afghanistan.

 

[LadyGunSlinger]

I'm sick at heart.. I went to bed last night after reading this with tears in my eyes. May God bless the families of these lost heroes. May God bless our nation who has lost it's way and may he impart wisdom to a foolish and dangerous President sitting in the Oval Office. These men died for a nation who will forever owe a debt that cannot be repaid just as those before them. A nation deep in mourning today, we salute all of you..

 

[Divine Wind]

NATO Crash: Team Seal Six Members Killed in Afghanistan - ABC News

American communities are mourning the loss of 30 U.S. troops who were killed when Afghan insurgents shot down a helicopter carrying the most elite forces in the US military -- Navy SEALs along with Air Force and Army personnel, U.S. officials said.

....U.S. special operations teams carry out up to a dozen missions a day in Afghanistan.

But since 9/11 there have been 32 SEALS killed, but 22 in one day is devastating. There are just 300 men in SEAL Team six.

I had no idea SEAL Team Six was so large. My condolences to the families of all those who were killed.

 

[geauxtohell]

Dumbfuck....Blackhawks also fly in the mountains too, they train in my hometown of Colorado Springs from Fort Carson.

They piled into the Chinook because it can carry more people, I should know after doing it in the Colorado mountains before.

I've never liked the Chinook for dangerous inserts, it is big and loud. A blackhawk is better but it carries less people, so someone soldout stealth for a larger strike force onboard.

Being the crack operations guys you claim to be, you would certainly know that TF 160 was undoubtedly flying these Chinooks and that their platforms are a little *ahem* different then the typical fair.

I would assume you would also know that, in a mountainous region like Wardak, the C-47 is one of the few platforms that has the horsepower to get around the Mountains in that part of the country.

Either way, this is a bad deal. The mission is still inherently dangerous and helicopter operations in that country is a very dangerous undertaking. I was almost in a crash on a routine flight to Bagram.

My condolences to the families of the fallen. American and Afghan.

Blackhawks don't have the lift to get over the mountains in Wardak with a full cargo, especially if it was a high and narrow LZ. Plus, you have to secure multiple LZs, with increases your risk.

I should know. I did it in Afghanistan.

I also don't know where this bullshit about the Chinook being "slow" is coming from. Big? Yes. Slow? No. It's a fast platform with the double turbines.

It looks like this Chinook was shot down when they were responding to another team on the ground that was pinned down. That means the Taliban was already there and expecting the QRS. They knocked it out with an RPG. It was Redwing all over again. The Taliban learns from their mistakes and successes.

At any rate, it's obnoxious to listen to people Monday morning quarterback operational planning. I am sure the staff officers with Special Operations, to include the aviation guys with 160th SOAR, had a good reason for using the chinooks.

 

[Brian175]

Here's a few facts I've garnered from reading articles and my personal knowledge of deploying with JSOC JTFs multiple times:

The CH-47 was from an Army Reserve unit, 160th is a limited resource.
3/160th and I believe now 4/160th(newly formed) generally flies SF and SEALs, so they are generally tasked to CJSOTFs.
This leaves a couple Battalions from 160th to fly state side for JSOC training and overseas for combat operations. That's a very small contingent to fly a whole JTF, so AR/NG birds augment JSOC.

Rangers were on the ground, came under heavy fire called in for a QRF/IRF of said bird. A QRF/IRF is generally built into a mission. The difference lie that a QRF is on standby on the airfield, an IRF is overhead in the air.

My speculation comes in that this QRF was not built into the mission and either was diverted from another mission or was hastily put together after Rangers took fire as generally ST6 doesn't sit on the sidelines for Rangers. It could also be true that it was an IRF and was just a really unorthodox mission. Perhaps ST6 took a breather and took the IRF mission, which pretty much just involves sleeping on a bird while Rangers took primary going after the HVT. Only a few people know.

I've seen mix articles on whether they were infiling or exfiling, but most say exfiling.

A rotary wing is loud no matter what the platform, stealth is only useful in that you perform an offset exfil 3-5 km from the intended target.