Will Trump Be Beating The Pardons?

[justoffal]

OK, this is speculative at this point, I have no website to link to yet, this is coming straight from attorney Tom Fitton I just saw interviewed on television and I will try to relate as best I can the gist of the discussion:

THERE MAY BE LEGAL GROUNDS FOR BEATING THESE PARDONS.

The issue of Nixon's blanket pardon came up and the remark was: Well, that pardon was never challenged, but there may be legal grounds to challenge these.

• For one thing, once a pardon is issued, there is a lot of paperwork and procedures the government must undertake--- Biden issued many of these pardons SO LATE in his term that this process was never fully undertaken yet and those who would do it are no longer there.
• Trump apparently has grounds to refuse to accept pardons under certain conditions.
• In the case of Gen. Milley, he can be recalled to duty then court-martialed. It would then be up to HIM to present the pardon as HIS legal defense as a test of it.
• As to the J6 Committee, apparently the pardon lacks a lot of specificity in exactly WHO is being pardoned! In many cases it fails to NAME NAMES, as such, it can be dismissed on grounds of legal ambiguity. No pardon has ever been issued for "these guys."
• Blanket pardons which do not specify what they are being pardoned of or why in cases where the pardonee is neither charged with any crime nor has any conviction are largely unprecedented, have never been issued preemptively this way before and such pardons have never been challenged in court.
• Further, the sneaky way in which Biden waited until the final 24 hours or even just 20 minutes before leaving office to issue some of these pardons may add further legal jeopardy upon the merits of their holding up in court.
• The timing and the scope of these pardons – including the Hunter Biden pardon – worry many experts, and cast a shadow of guilt upon the recipients. Adam Schiff calls them unnecessary and if accepted, removes 5th Amendment protections from the recipients.
• One thing that concerns me is one of Trump's own EOs stating that the government is now barred from weaponizing justice against people; I'm not sure the wording of that EO or the reason behind it and wonder if it could get in his way if defendants try to argue that criminal cases brought against them is a form of weaponized "retribution."

Short story is that work is underway to test these pardons and challenge them, certainly Milley who committed an act of treason in conspiring with the Chinese behind the President's back to usurp the POTUS' authority and those connected to the J6 Committee. Nothing was yet said about Biden family pardons, but I thought people here might be interested to know as right now, I've not yet heard anything formally released about this in the media.

ITMT, the picture of General Milley has been taken down off the wall at the Pentagon.

Here is some reading relating to the story:

Do Biden’s preemptive pardons offer a safety valve or set bad precedent?

Joe Biden’s eleventh-hour preemptive pardons for his family and Trump critics are raising further questions about the use of presidential pardons.

www.csmonitor.com

Mark Milley's portrait removed from Pentagon hall

Mark Milley's portrait as chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff was taken down from the Pentagon hallway where all of the paintings of the previous chairmen are located.

abcnews.go.com

Further cogent information and intelligent comment is invited.

Unfortunately I'm going to have to say that the pardoms should remain sacrosanct. It's based on an election and a choice made by the elected person. People can have buyer's remorse afterwards I suppose but I don't believe that any of the pardons should be tampered with.

You have to take the good with the bad. Pardons exist for a very good reason A reason which is not about to go away anytime in the near future.

Don't weaken the system is my position.

 

[toobfreak]

Unfortunately I'm going to have to say that the pardoms should remain sacrosanct. It's based on an election and a choice made by the elected person.

Nope, Biden's selection was engineered by their own admission, and it wasn't Biden's choice, Biden is incompetent and has been signing stuff that he doesn't even know what he is signing. Further, the DOJ has declared him unfit to stand trial. An incompetent person is not legally fit to direct his own life, they are put in a conservatorship. Worse, it sets a horrible precedent that future presidents can commit untoward crimes, heinous behavior, then duck out legal responsibility in the end by just pardoning themselves.

Don't weaken the system is my position.

The system is already weakened, destroyed. If there are legal grounds to render these pardons illegal, null and void, or to get around them so that justice can be served, we must do it to SAVE the system, set an example showing future presidents that such heinous crimes cannot be gotten away with.

 

[justoffal]

Nope, Biden's selection was engineered by their own admission, and it wasn't Biden's choice, Biden is incompetent and has been signing stuff that he doesn't even know what he is signing. Further, the DOJ has declared him unfit to stand trial. An incompetent person is not legally fit to direct his own life, they are put in a conservatorship. Worse, it sets a horrible precedent that future presidents can commit untoward crimes, heinous behavior, then duck out legal responsibility in the end by just pardoning themselves.


The system is already weakened, destroyed. If there are legal grounds to render these pardons illegal, null and void, or to get around them so that justice can be served, we must do it to SAVE the system, set an example showing future presidents that such heinous crimes cannot be gotten away with.

Yes that is an interesting twist inasmuch as Biden's competency is concerned.
It would be very bad for them if evidence came forward that Biden was not actually making that decision.

 

[toobfreak]

Yes that is an interesting twist inasmuch as Biden's competency is concerned.

It is already on the table.

It would be very bad for them if evidence came forward that Biden was not actually making that decision.

That has already been proven part of the record.
People are looking hard at this, the constitutionality of a blanket pardon where no crime is defined to be pardoned from, to even a group of people not even defined.
No blanket pardon has ever been challenged.
Biden has already been ruled incompetent, should an incompetent person be holding the nuclear football? Then what legality are his pardons?
Beyond that, even if the pardons stand, there is the option of charging those pardoned for their crimes in state court. The pardons only pardon you federally.

 

[justoffal]

It is already on the table.


That has already been proven part of the record.
People are looking hard at this, the constitutionality of a blanket pardon where no crime is defined to be pardoned from, to even a group of people not even defined.
No blanket pardon has ever been challenged.
Biden has already been ruled incompetent, should an incompetent person be holding the nuclear football? Then what legality are his pardons?
Beyond that, even if the pardons stand, there is the option of charging those pardoned for their crimes in state court. The pardons only pardon you federally.

Well that looks to be quite the legal mess on the way. I don't think we've ever encounted anything quite like this.

 

[toobfreak]

Well that looks to be quite the legal mess on the way. I don't think we've ever encounted anything quite like this.

ENTER

 

[justoffal]

ENTER

Indeed