Will America Go Communist?

[georgephillip]

Quantitative easing is private industry literally walking into our (read-tax dollars) treasury, and walking off with whatever they wish

why? , because we have a failing economy, failing fiat system

Do you believe it's true a government that issues its own money can pay for goods and service and financial assets without collecting money in the form of taxes OR DEBT ISSUANCE in advance of such purchases?

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

Which version of inflation are you referring to?

Different types of inflation - Economics Help

1. "Can control demand-pull inflation[5] by taxation and bond issuance, which remove excess money from circulation (although the political will to do so may not always exist);
2. Does not need to compete with the private sector for scarce savings by issuing bonds."

Modern Monetary Theory - Wikipedia

 

[Andylusion]

You're blaming capitalism for things it isn't responsible for.

It's responsible for QE4, QE3, QE2, QE1

and if you didn't hear me that's .......

QE4, QE3, QE2, QE1

~S~

Capitalism didn't do that. What are you talking about?

Are you really saying that a government controlled, government run, government funded system.... is now Capitalist? Not possible. You can't have government do everything, and then claim Capitalism did it.

 

[Andylusion]

Quantitative easing is private industry literally walking into our (read-tax dollars) treasury, and walking off with whatever they wish

why? , because we have a failing economy, failing fiat system

Do you believe it's true a government that issues its own money can pay for goods and service and financial assets without collecting money in the form of taxes OR DEBT ISSUANCE in advance of such purchases?

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

Which version of inflation are you referring to?

Different types of inflation - Economics Help

1. "Can control demand-pull inflation[5] by taxation and bond issuance, which remove excess money from circulation (although the political will to do so may not always exist);
2. Does not need to compete with the private sector for scarce savings by issuing bonds."

Modern Monetary Theory - Wikipedia

That is the dumbest thing I have ever seen.
You are telling me that you can lower prices by raising taxes? When has that ever happened in the entire history of the world. Detailed examples please.

The only way you lower prices with higher taxes, is if you raise taxes enough to flat out destroy the economy. When everyone is out of work, and has no money to buy anything, then yes prices will drop, along with the living standards of the entire country.

 

[Flash]

All we need is another Democrat House, Senate and President to tremendously advance the Moon Bat agenda to make this country a Socialist shithole.

The only thing that could save us could be the 60 vote cloture rule in the Senate.

Obama and the Democrat filth did a tremendous amount of damage in 2009 and 2010. Imagine that for four or eight years. We would be so fucked. The economy would go to shit to fiance the welfare state and we would lose a significant number of our Liberties. Taxes would sky rocket. Just imagine Kommie Kalifornia on a national scale. Only no other place to run to like many people are doing now. Scary, isn't it?

 

[Andylusion]

Debatable. My understanding is that the QE4, is simply swapping assets for credits, and then swap them back.

Nope.

It's the banks walking into our treasury and taking our tax dollars

we are literally being ripped off

due to a failed fiat, failed economy, failed system...

~S~

Well that's funny, because I got that information directly from Ben Bernanke, who testified in front of congress.
So either, you need to file criminal charges against the Fed.... or maybe you are wrong about that.

“Now, you might ask the question, well, the Fed is going out and buying 2 trillion dollars of securities – how did we pay for that? And the answer is that we paid for those securities by crediting the bank accounts of the people who sold them to us, and those accounts, at the banks, showed up as reserves that the banks would hold with the Fed. So the Fed is a bank for the banks. Banks can hold deposit accounts with the Fed, essentially, and those are called reserve accounts. And so as the purchases of securities occurred, the way we paid for them was basically by increasing the amount of reserves that banks had in their accounts with the Fed.
-Ben Barneke​

So.... Unless you think he's lying, the fact is, the banks have not just walked out with tons of money.

The Fed purchased assets from the banks. Interestingly the Fed has been making large profits from these operations, which go to the government. I'm still against this, because I think it is a high risk of abusing in the future, but the Fed has been making $100 Billion dollar profits for years, because of the assets they have acquired from QE.

Again, if your claim was true, then we should have seen massive inflation by now. We have not.

 

[Andylusion]

Nope. Quantitative easing is where the government creates money out of thin air.

>>>>

governments do not create money; the central bank does. ... It can issue bonds and ask the central bank to buy them. The central bank then pays the government with money it creates, and the government in turn uses that money to finance the deficit. This process is called debt monetization.


~S~

Governments do not create money.... the central bank does..... which exists, and is regulated and controlled, and operates directly at the behest of the Government.

Dumb dumb dumb statement. Government = Central Bank. They are the same. If the government does it, the Central Bank does it. If the Central Bank does it, government does it. They are one and the same.

My local bank..... never once have I seen the CEO of my local bank, testify before congress. Nor have I seen them argue on national policy. Nor have I seen government make demand or recommendations to my local bank.

Central bank.... routine. Entirely routine. Claiming they are different, is absolute nonsense.

 

[Andylusion]

As for big pharma.... only partly true. There are examples, where government regulation has resulted in citizens being ripped off.

Other than that, quite frankly without Big Pharma, you wouldn't have any drugs to cry about being ripped off for.

Without government-funded research, Big Pharma would never extort enough profit from consumers to bribe corrupt politicians for lucrative regulations:

US Drug Prices vs The World

"Each month, Jane * breaks the law. She does this to stay alive.

"Jane is a Type I diabetic, which means she requires insulin to keep living.

"The problem is a 10 mL bottle of insulin in the U.S. has a list price of about $450.

"Jane estimates it would cost her $3,000 a month to stay alive without insurance..."

"Jane buys her insulin illegally from Canada, where a comparable bottle of insulin costs about $21."

I would agree with that.... STOP FUNDING RESEARCH STUPID.

This is how dumb you left-wingers are. You demand we fund research.... and the companies are like... errr.... Okay! And then after you fund the research, you scream and whine and complain that someone profits from it.

You brainless idiotic moron..... YOU funded their research you ridiculous fool. You can't fly to Washington, toss money everywhere, and then turn into a screaming toddler "THEY ARE MAKING A PROFIT FROM OUR MONEY!".

What is wrong with you people??? How can you be this stupid, and still breath? YOU DID THIS. YOU! >>YOU<< caused this.

The problem with the drug industry is entirely due to left-wingers like you.

If we engaged in free-market capitalism, NONE OF THIS WOULD HAPPEN. Guaranteed.

 

[Bush92]

Don't ask Bernie.
Ask Trotsky or Trump.
From 1934:

"Introduction from Fourth International

"The campaign against Marxist ideas sponsored by the capitalist witchhunters today aims to implant the false impression that Communism is completely alien to American life and opposed to the welfare of the American people.

"In the Thirties, during the rapid spread of anti-capitalist feelings following the Great Depression, there was considerable popular interest in the prospects of a Communist America.

"On this account the editors of Liberty Magazine turned to Leon Trotsky for a bird’s-eye view of what the Communist future holds for the United States..."

"'At present most Americans regard communism solely in the light of the experience of the Soviet Union.

"'They fear lest Sovietism in America would produce the same material result as it has brought for the culturally backward peoples of the Soviet Union...."

"Actually American soviets will be as different from the Russian soviets as the United States of President Roosevelt differs from the Russian Empire of Czar Nicholas II.

"Yet communism can come in America only through revolution, just as independence and democracy came in America.

"The American temperament is energetic and violent, and it will insist on breaking a good many dishes and upsetting a good many apple carts before communism is firmly established.

"Americans are enthusiasts and sportsmen before they are specialists and statesmen, and it would be contrary to the American tradition to make a major change without choosing sides and cracking heads."

Will Trump upset the capitalists' apple carts?

How many heads will crack before next November?

Leon Trotsky: If America Should Go Communist (1934)

Never! Before December 7th, 1941 I would have gladly served in the the German Army and killed as many communist as my rounds produced.

 

[B. Kidd]

All we need is another Democrat House, Senate and President to tremendously advance the Moon Bat agenda to make this country a Socialist shithole.

The only thing that could save us could be the 60 vote cloture rule in the Senate.

Obama and the Democrat filth did a tremendous amount of damage in 2009 and 2010. Imagine that for four or eight years. We would be so fucked. The economy would go to shit to fiance the welfare state and we would lose a significant number of our Liberties. Taxes would sky rocket. Just imagine Kommie Kalifornia on a national scale. Only no other place to run to like many people are doing now. Scary, isn't it?

Grossly inhumane too; a wolf hidden by a sheep's clothing, falsely propagandized as being socially just and humane.

 

[Andylusion]

Nope. Quantitative easing is where the government creates money out of thin air.

>>>>

governments do not create money; the central bank does. ... It can issue bonds and ask the central bank to buy them. The central bank then pays the government with money it creates, and the government in turn uses that money to finance the deficit. This process is called debt monetization.


~S~

The Fed is an arm of the government, moron.

Well, except it isn't. It is a privately owned entity

Well except for the fact that the government runs it, controls it, regulates it... basically every single thing about the Central Bank, is government.

Trump Announces Jerome Powell as New Fed Chairman

Senate Confirms Janet Yellen As Federal Reserve Chair

What Does the Fed Chairman Do?

So lets review.... the Federal Reserve chairmen, a position with all the other board members, only exists because government created it, and has to be nominated by the president, and confirmed by the Senate.

Do tell, captain privately owned..... Which CEO or board member of Bankcorp, PNC, or Capital One, was nominated or confirmed by government?

Answer of course is... None. Because they are 'actually' private. Federal Reserve is not private by any stretch.

Need more proof?

The Fed Delivered $80.2 Billion in Profits to the Treasury in 2017

The Fed signed over $80 Billion in profit to the US Treasury.
Which of the actual private banks, have just handed over billions of dollars in profit to the Government? Answer.... none. Because they are actually "private". The Fed Reserve is not.

 

[Andylusion]

Yes, I believe the US will go Communist, or Socialist... However, Trump has nothing to do with it. It won't happen for a couple of more presidents I wager.

Everyone I think can agree that your side of evil and horror, is winning. We have the clearest examples in the world of Socialist ideology destroying every country it has ever been tried, and we still have a self proclaimed communist running for high office, and he's not running as joke.

If my side is winning, why is a corrupt pathological liar/crony-capitalist/con man living in the White House?

Bernie Sanders hasn't changed since he began his political career. He is a moderate welfare-state Social Democrat who is not even a socialist (much less a communist) who is still stubbornly shy about criticizing corporate Democrats like Biden.

You are right about one thing.
He is not running as a joke.

Trump will die in prison.
Bernie and SDNY will put him there.

Because your side is the side of corruption and evil. Trump is a result of your ideology. He is. That's why I didn't vote for Trump.

There's is only one reason Trump is in office... it's because of Hillary and Bernie. If your side wasn't progressing towards socialism, Trump would have never been elected.

 

[Andylusion]

So clearly the rule of the stupid is growing in the country. So yes, I think American will at some point end up Socialist. It would take an amazing reformation of morals and education, to reverse this, and I don't see that the stupid people controlling the left wing will let anything good ever happen.

You support an illiterate, lying moron, yet you call the opposition stupid?

Trump isn't capable of stringing six sentences together without losing his train of "thought." He is so completely ignorant he doesn't even know what he doesn't know and probably cares even less.

He's gone back on his "populist" promises by bringing Wall Street advisers into his Cabinet and inner circle. He's allowing corporations to pollute the commons and rip off consumers. His unstable foreign policy has made the US a global laughingstock. And instead of ending illegal wars in the Middle East, he is throwing more troops into the quagmires.

Too much winning?
Only for morons.

Well yes. As I said before... you people elected Trump. If you people didn't exist, Trump would never have been in office.

 

[bripat9643]

Quantitative easing is private industry literally walking into our (read-tax dollars) treasury, and walking off with whatever they wish

why? , because we have a failing economy, failing fiat system

Do you believe it's true a government that issues its own money can pay for goods and service and financial assets without collecting money in the form of taxes OR DEBT ISSUANCE in advance of such purchases?

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

It can, but that will destroy the value of the currency. Hyperinflation lies down that road.

Which version of inflation are you referring to?

Different types of inflation - Economics Help

1. "Can control demand-pull inflation[5] by taxation and bond issuance, which remove excess money from circulation (although the political will to do so may not always exist);
2. Does not need to compete with the private sector for scarce savings by issuing bonds."

Modern Monetary Theory - Wikipedia

There's only one kind of inflation. The ones you list are all propaganda. They are diversions from the true culprit: the government printing money.

 

[JustAGuy1]

Nope. Quantitative easing is where the government creates money out of thin air.

>>>>

governments do not create money; the central bank does. ... It can issue bonds and ask the central bank to buy them. The central bank then pays the government with money it creates, and the government in turn uses that money to finance the deficit. This process is called debt monetization.


~S~

The Fed is an arm of the government, moron.

Well, except it isn't. It is a privately owned entity

Well except for the fact that the government runs it, controls it, regulates it... basically every single thing about the Central Bank, is government.

Trump Announces Jerome Powell as New Fed Chairman

Senate Confirms Janet Yellen As Federal Reserve Chair

What Does the Fed Chairman Do?

So lets review.... the Federal Reserve chairmen, a position with all the other board members, only exists because government created it, and has to be nominated by the president, and confirmed by the Senate.

Do tell, captain privately owned..... Which CEO or board member of Bankcorp, PNC, or Capital One, was nominated or confirmed by government?

Answer of course is... None. Because they are 'actually' private. Federal Reserve is not private by any stretch.

Need more proof?

The Fed Delivered $80.2 Billion in Profits to the Treasury in 2017

The Fed signed over $80 Billion in profit to the US Treasury.
Which of the actual private banks, have just handed over billions of dollars in profit to the Government? Answer.... none. Because they are actually "private". The Fed Reserve is not.

LOL do yourself a favor and go back to the beginning. Start in 1913 and work your way forward. Eventually you will run into the BIS. Then get back to me.

 

[Andylusion]

A prefect example is NYC. NYC has years of clear cut history where socialist rent controls and public housing policies have destroyed housing for the public... this is why NYC moved away from those policies. Well, last year they openly embraced those policies, much to the dismay of many of the fools who supported Cuomo

Wall Street's endless gluttony for profits is driving the housing crisis

After the crash: How Wall Street is driving up homelessness

"After the real estate bubble popped, taking the U.S. economy with it, more than 9 million homes were foreclosed or sold at a loss, leading to fears that tracts of abandoned neighborhoods would become 'ghost towns.'

"While this happened in some areas of the country, elsewhere, the empty homes were an opportunity—most of all for Wall Street investors that swooped in to buy properties in bulk and rent them out at a profit.

"In the decade since the crash, 7 million more households have become renters, while only 1 million more have become homeowners, according to Census data.

"And 'institutional landlords,' as the Wall Street investors are called, have become a major driver of the affordable housing woes many Americans are now facing—from steep rent payments all the way to eviction."

But that's a problem of the public. That's supply and demand in action.

Look... if more people wanted to buy homes, and had the credit, or the money to buy homes..... then the demand for rentals would decline, and the demand for homes to purchase would increase..... Then naturally more people would be offering homes, and fewer would be offering rentals.

The reason more people are offering rentals, and fewer homes to sell, is simply because less people want to buy a home, and more people want to rent one.

That's how markets work. This is how I know you people are idiots... because you actually think that somehow the people selling, dictate what people buy. You think the tail wags the dog. No, the dog wags that tail.

If I am offering a place to rent, and no one rents it... I don't just go bankrupt. I either lower the price on the rental until I can rent it... OR... if the rental price is too low, then I sell the property.

If everyone wanted to buy, and no one wanted to rent... I would have to sell. I'm not going to just go bankrupt on a vacant rental.

So the buyers are who have the power in the system. The buyers, the people who create the demand, are who dictate the market. The sellers do not dictate the market.

FURTHER..........

You people on the left, rarely look at the real causes of the problems. You just put in place a bunch of policies that destroy people's lives, and then blame Capitalism.

You guys are the ones who have caused housing prices to go up in many areas. It's that simple. You guys have done this.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Quantitative easing is where the government creates money out of thin air.

That's not accurate.

It's the exact truth.

Hmm, afraid not.

I'm afraid so.

Yeah, but you don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Rocko]

You're blaming capitalism for things it isn't responsible for.

It's responsible for QE4, QE3, QE2, QE1

and if you didn't hear me that's .......

QE4, QE3, QE2, QE1

~S~

capitalism is not responsible for that you dope

 

[Andylusion]

Greece
Cuba
Venezuela
France to some extent
North Korea

Pretty much every country that has openly moved toward your system.

Such an idiotic response on every level. Those countries were not ruined by the things I mentioned. Nor could you make an argument that they were, which is why you didn't even try.

Second, your last part reinforced the stupidity of the response, as literally every developed, modern country on earth in existence has those things I mentioned.

Stupid on parade....

Of course I could. Good heavens dude, in Greece, in the 1990s people were screaming that the pension system was non-sustainable. They have said for YEARS that the Greek government has a mass transit system that simply could not be operated profitably. They said for years that the health care system was too expensive.

And every single time anyone anywhere attempted to reform any of it, the left-wingers and screamers came out and stopped them. Many people predicted for over a decade prior that Greece was on the path to destruction.

Same with Cuba. There is not endless money for everything you want. Free health care, and now they can't even get Aspirin. Free education, and people come out of Cuba with a medical degree, that doesn't even qualify them to be a nurse in the US. Cuba used to be a first world country, that had comparable standards to the US. Now they are so far backwards, they just got cell phones a few years ago.

Same with Venezuela. Free housing, and now they have a housing crisis. Free education, and now they have no teachers, and no students. (unless you go to the private schools). Free food, and there is no food.
Venezuela's Teachers And Students Skip School For Survival

It never ends. I could go on and on and on.

Why did the mass protests break out in France? Go read the articles. Because people were living poverty life styles, while working what would be middle class jobs in the US. Why were middle class workers living in poverty in France?

Because they were being taxed to death. And why were they being taxed to death???? Government education, health care, pensions, mass transit and on and on and on.

Over and over and over again... every country that has adopted your system, ends up in ruins.

Why do you think the Nordic countries have en mass, moved toward the right?
Why even Scandinavia is moving to the right

Because paying nearly 200% tax on cars, sucks.
https://www.thelocal.dk/20151120/whats-the-deal-with-denmarks-car-registration-tax

But that's how you pay for endless programs, and health care, and education, and mass transit and and and and and.

Someone has to pay the bill for your endless spending. And it's isn't the rich. They simply move their assets elsewhere.

Rich people can move to a new country, the same why you can move to an apartment across the street. If you could save 5% on taxes by moving across the road, you would do it. We all would. For a super wealthy person, moving to another country is like a lower mid-class person moving across the street.

So they are simply not going to pay for all your crap. You know is going to pay for it? The lower and middle class people.

That's why Denmark was charging 200% tax on a car. Screw the poor and middle class, and then wonder why your system doesn't work.

 

[Rocko]

Debatable. My understanding is that the QE4, is simply swapping assets for credits, and then swap them back.

Nope.

It's the banks walking into our treasury and taking our tax dollars

we are literally being ripped off

due to a failed fiat, failed economy, failed system...

~S~

monetary policy and the fed is something you have no clue about. But keep yammering. You’re entertaining

 

[Rocko]

Nope. Quantitative easing is where the government creates money out of thin air.

>>>>

governments do not create money; the central bank does. ... It can issue bonds and ask the central bank to buy them. The central bank then pays the government with money it creates, and the government in turn uses that money to finance the deficit. This process is called debt monetization.


~S~

um the treasury creates money by printing it, idiot