When covid19 cases surge

[Redfish]

We were discussing the results of premature reopening. That hospitals have beds and ventilator will do nothing to lower the fatality rate. If millions are sickened by the reopening, hundreds of thousands will die UNLESS we develop an effective treatment and/or an effective vaccine.

those things are in work as we speak. We will have treatments and vaccines. but they will do no good if our country is destroyed while we wait. Yes, some will die. People die every day, death is a mandatory part of life. None of us want to expedite it, but its coming to all of us eventually.

Sadly, those with underlying serious medical conditions are vulnerable to every illness known to man and are much more likely to die from them.

the government cannot protect us from the realities of life.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

We were discussing the results of premature reopening. That hospitals have beds and ventilator will do nothing to lower the fatality rate. If millions are sickened by the reopening, hundreds of thousands will die UNLESS we develop an effective treatment and/or an effective vaccine.

If ventilators don't do anything then why is every country asking for them? We have effective treatments already. Vaccine is a pipe dream. Flu vaccines only work 45-50% of the time. People die from heart disease daily but we don't stop eating burgers. We have millions of alcoholics, we don't stop selling liquor. We will manage it like we manage other calamities. Relax, snowflake.

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

The leadership of the country knew what the response of the people would be to the Draconian lockdowns, what should they have done instead? What will Sleepy Joe do, if he seizes power in January?

There would be far less objections to lockdown measures if Trump had actually cared about ANYONE besides himself and his reelection and come out in actual support of such measures. Instead, he has undermined his own administration's efforts at virus control from Day 1. His blitheringly irresponsible behavior is to blame for tens of thousands of needless American deaths and hundreds of thousands sickened. The man should be thrown in the deepest darkest dungeon this nation possesses.

You mean fewer objections. Rest of your post is whiny bullshit. Most people care about themselves first and foremost as well as their families. If you blame him for any deaths then you're an idiot.

 

[Redfish]

the flu meds work on the symptoms, they do not cure it or kill the virus. the flu vaccines seem to work,

do you remember a similar concern with the bird flu, SARS, West Nile, and even things like Y2K were going to kill us all. but somehow we survived, and we will survive this one too, if we still have a country to survive in.

COVID-19 has a higher transmissibility ratio and a higher fatality rate. Most will survive, but if you don't do anything about it, millions will die. Apparently, that's okay with you.

Its not OK with me, but there is nothing you or I can do about it. If we allow our country to fall apart, more will die from that than from the virus.

Attitudes like yours are exactly what the Chinese were counting on. They were losing the economic war, now you are helping them back to a win. Think about what this is actually about. its not about medicine or even human deaths, its about economics and power.

 

[Redfish]

We were discussing the results of premature reopening. That hospitals have beds and ventilator will do nothing to lower the fatality rate. If millions are sickened by the reopening, hundreds of thousands will die UNLESS we develop an effective treatment and/or an effective vaccine.

If ventilators don't do anything then why is every country asking for them? We have effective treatments already. Vaccine is a pipe dream. Flu vaccines only work 45-50% of the time. People die from heart disease daily but we don't stop eating burgers. We have millions of alcoholics, we don't stop selling liquor. We will manage it like we manage other calamities. Relax, snowflake.

exactly correct

 

[Mac-7]

The PPE needs to be brought home and manufactured here, same with Pharma.... medicines.... it's a national security risk, having them elsewhere, which this pandemic, has made that clear, imo.

I think there may a national consensus on that

 

[DOTR]

Should we all be able to sue the governors and other politicians who opened up too early?

What about the "protestors" who pressured them to do so?

There are clear guidelines for reopening that are being ignored.

Can we sue the tRump *administration* for not enforcing them?

How about for their generally inept response and attempts to dodge responsibility for it?

Like in South Dakota? Remember the “exponential” increase you hoped for?

 

[Polishprince]

The leadership of the country knew what the response of the people would be to the Draconian lockdowns, what should they have done instead? What will Sleepy Joe do, if he seizes power in January?

There would be far less objections to lockdown measures if Trump had actually cared about ANYONE besides himself and his reelection and come out in actual support of such measures. Instead, he has undermined his own administration's efforts at virus control from Day 1. His blitheringly irresponsible behavior is to blame for tens of thousands of needless American deaths and hundreds of thousands sickened. The man should be thrown in the deepest darkest dungeon this nation possesses.

So in your view,if Biden were our autocrat, everyone would be gun ho about the Lockdown and everyone would be enthusiastic?

 

[AzogtheDefiler]

The leadership of the country knew what the response of the people would be to the Draconian lockdowns, what should they have done instead? What will Sleepy Joe do, if he seizes power in January?

There would be far less objections to lockdown measures if Trump had actually cared about ANYONE besides himself and his reelection and come out in actual support of such measures. Instead, he has undermined his own administration's efforts at virus control from Day 1. His blitheringly irresponsible behavior is to blame for tens of thousands of needless American deaths and hundreds of thousands sickened. The man should be thrown in the deepest darkest dungeon this nation possesses.

So in your view,if Biden were our autocrat, everyone would be gun ho about the Lockdown and everyone would be enthusiastic?

Crick is an idiot. So expect an idiotic response from him. BHO was his God and Savior. I actually believe Trump has been very transparent throughout this process.

 

[Mac-7]

Take the $500 Billion bail out for the global corporations who manufacture in China away from them and fund the food banks for the next two to three years!

Thats an excellent idea

and no money for cruise lines registered in foreign countries

You think that's an excellent idea? That would eliminate a majority of our current PPE supply and three fourths of the merchandise WalMart sells. And when it was replaced with material made elsewhere, the quality would be reduced and the price would be increased. And why, exactly, would you do that? Nationalistic bigotry? Thought so.

We could give it to them later as a relocation credit

Its not national bigoty

but a reaction to and protection from globalist stupidity which got us into this mess to begin with

Globalism is a global development. But you'd rather be the next North Korea or Myanmmar. Haven't they been incredible economic success stories

I dont think the rational alternative is as bleak as that

so dont try to “buy the pot” with me

we want balanced trade where middle class Americans are not losing their jobs to shoeless chinese working for pennies

it I/we will settle for a diverse supply chain from asia that does not include china

meaning we get our transistors and other small parts from vietnam, thailand, the philippines ect instead of being at the mercy of our #1 enemy

 

[Mac-7]

As it turns out - he didnt

too busy humping the frau I suppose

Please show us where he has erred.

The professor assumed a 3% fatality rate and the chinese disease is not even a fraction of that

 

[Mac-7]

What is "too early"? Because it doesn't matter when we open up, there is going to be a surge in cases.

If we wait 10 years to open up, there is going to be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 year, there will be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 month, or one more week, there will be a surge in cases.

So basically your arguement is, we need to stay locked down until everyone commits suicide from non-stop isolation, to avoid deaths.

The fewer infected individuals in the population, the smaller will be the surge. And if we were, hypothetically, to wait till we had developed and distributed a working vaccine, we could have no surge at all. Just the development of an effective treatment before reopening would at least dramatically reduce the suffering, size and deaths of a surge.

We cant wait a year or two for that to happen

We cant wait a year or two for that to happen

We want a million deaths and we want them now!

******* gouhls.

that is certainly the dem/lib position on this, they want half the population killed and the economy destroyed-----------then they can let their god Soros rule supreme

that is certainly the dem/lib position on this, they want half the population killed and the economy destroyed-----------then they can let their god Soros rule supreme

The libs are trying to preserve life. It's your team that needs a million bodies to claim herd immunity, dope.

The libs are being impractical

they expect Americans to sit home for years if necessary and collect government welfare checks

that is outside the bounds of reality

 

[Lesh]

COVID-19 has a higher transmissibility ratio and a higher fatality rate. Most will survive, but if you don't do anything about it, millions will die. Apparently, that's okay with you.

Apparently it is fine...because ya know "it's only old folks. They were gonna die anyway"

How many times and in how many ways have Trumpers told us that on this very forum...

 

[Polishprince]

COVID-19 has a higher transmissibility ratio and a higher fatality rate. Most will survive, but if you don't do anything about it, millions will die. Apparently, that's okay with you.

Apparently it is fine...because ya know "it's only old folks. They were gonna die anyway"

How many times and in how many ways have Trumpers told us that on this very forum...

Everyone dies. But what's interesting is that liberals don't care about the millions that die from abortion, or get whacked by Illegal Aliens and Street Gangs, or die from cancer or emphysema

 

[Lesh]

The professor assumed a 3% fatality rate and the chinese disease is not even a fraction of that

You're basing that on a fantasy

The actual mortality is 5.6%. That's likely high...no one disputes that but that's confirmed cases Because of LACK OF TESTING we don't know the real number of infected...just as we don't know the real death count.

Experts trying to account for all of that put the CRF (mortality rate) at between .9% and 1.2%

Assuming 70% infection rate ...that translates to somewhere in the area of 3 MILLION dead unless we mitigate.

That includes mostly people over 50 and those with ANY kind of medical issue

 

[Lesh]

Apparently it is fine...because ya know "it's only old folks. They were gonna die anyway"

How many times and in how many ways have Trumpers told us that on this very forum...

Everyone dies. But what's interesting is that liberals don't care about the millions that die from abortion, or get whacked by Illegal Aliens and Street Gangs, or die from cancer or emphysema

Do you have some pathological need to prove me right?

 

[Mac-7]

The actual mortality is 5.6%. That's likely high...no one disputes that but that's confirmed cases Because of LACK OF TESTING we don't know the real number of infected...just as we don't know the real death count.

5.6% is a criminally bad estimate

when all the facts are in the chinese virus is likely to be only slightly more deadly than the common flu

 

[Andylusion]

What is "too early"? Because it doesn't matter when we open up, there is going to be a surge in cases.

If we wait 10 years to open up, there is going to be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 year, there will be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 month, or one more week, there will be a surge in cases.

So basically your arguement is, we need to stay locked down until everyone commits suicide from non-stop isolation, to avoid deaths.

The fewer infected individuals in the population, the smaller will be the surge. And if we were, hypothetically, to wait till we had developed and distributed a working vaccine, we could have no surge at all. Just the development of an effective treatment before reopening would at least dramatically reduce the suffering, size and deaths of a surge.

wait till we had developed and distributed a working vaccine

Right, and that's a great theory. Just like how our vaccine for cancer has worked so well.

Should we have locked down the country in hopes of a vaccine for AIDs? How many millions would have committed suicide by now?

Now I'm all for the creation of a vaccine, but you simply can't shut down the entire country based on nothing more than a hope.

If you want to wait a week or two to see if the recent tests work out, ok then. Maybe I can buy that.

The fewer infected individuals in the population

We already know that there are unknown hundreds of infected individuals. Maybe you missed it, but New Jersey did Covid testing of all pregnant mothers, and a good 25% of them were already infected with Covid showing no symptoms.

Meaning, upwards of tens of millions of people in this country likely have covid, or had covid already, without anyone knowing.

So this idea that if we don't have fewer infected individuals when the lock down is lifted.... ridiculous. Sorry, but that position is already destroyed by the facts.

Covid is not like Ebola where we could lock this thing down. It's more like the common cold. You are trying to hold back the ocean, with some sand castle like protections. They are not working, and won't work.

Again, Sweden. Sweden and Japan both, figured this out. They didn't even trying to stop Covid. They warned those who were risky to take precautions, and otherwise keep their societies open and free. Contrary to all the doom and nay-sayers, the end of the world mass deaths never happened.

Just the development of an effective treatment before reopening would at least dramatically reduce the suffering, size and deaths of a surge.

Again, fantastic idea. If you can put a concrete time frame on this, maybe I would buy it.

But the reality is, people's lives are being destroyed right now. People DYING right NOW. NOW. Right NOW they are dying.

How does the coronavirus pandemic affect suicide rates?

Some indicators suggest a rising call volume at crisis centers.

thehill.com

Isolating people, is in fact dangerous to their mental health. And the people screaming at Trump for saying it, are ridiculous. We tried putting convicts in prison, in isolation, and many of them lost their minds.

People are not just losing social contact, they are also losing their jobs, their careers, their homes, and their families.

Listen.... people are dying RIGHT NOW, because of your policies.

So when you say "we just need to wait for a treatment...." Yeah, and how many people are going to die in the process of waiting? How many deaths do you need before you care? At what point does this "do-gooder" policy become it's only level of tyranny and evil?

And honestly, it is possible that question may not even matter. People are simply not going to abide by the lock down. Honestly, people are just flat out refusing to do it.

Even where I am right now, in my condo area, you know what is going on? There's a dozen kids outside playing, screaming and running around, playing games. Have been all week.

So, at some level you need to ditch this policy that is causing problems and harm, and accomplishing nothing.

If you want to say.... one more week... ok make your case for how long it should last, but it has to end... and soon.

 

[Andylusion]

Everyone freaked out when we were told 2 million Americans were going to die

but that came from the wacko professor in England with his computer model that had cum stains on the keyboard

but now we know better

Were you aware that long term estimates still say that without a vaccine or effective treatment, US casualties by the end of next year could exceed 800,000?

And they had similar insanely high numbers for Japan and Sweden because they refused to lock down.

Didn't happen.

 

[Andylusion]

What is "too early"? Because it doesn't matter when we open up, there is going to be a surge in cases.

If we wait 10 years to open up, there is going to be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 year, there will be a surge in cases. If we wait 1 month, or one more week, there will be a surge in cases.

So basically your arguement is, we need to stay locked down until everyone commits suicide from non-stop isolation, to avoid deaths.

The fewer infected individuals in the population, the smaller will be the surge. And if we were, hypothetically, to wait till we had developed and distributed a working vaccine, we could have no surge at all. Just the development of an effective treatment before reopening would at least dramatically reduce the suffering, size and deaths of a surge.

We cant wait a year or two for that to happen

We cant wait a year or two for that to happen

We want a million deaths and we want them now!

******* gouhls.

that is certainly the dem/lib position on this, they want half the population killed and the economy destroyed-----------then they can let their god Soros rule supreme

that is certainly the dem/lib position on this, they want half the population killed and the economy destroyed-----------then they can let their god Soros rule supreme

The libs are trying to preserve life. It's your team that needs a million bodies to claim herd immunity, dope.

The libs are being impractical

they expect Americans to sit home for years if necessary and collect government welfare checks

that is outside the bounds of reality

That's why we're here to vote hard against them. They are insane.