*What Is Death To An Ahteist*?

[Dr.House]

You are correct in one thing. I do not accept your definition or application of the word "faith" as it describes my debate.

I didn't write the dictionary, clueless one...

You are the one providing your own definition...

You don't debate... Stick to refreshing your thread for hours and hours... It's something you know how to do...

 

[Youwerecreated]

You have poor deduction skills. The supposition of a flat earth was not "evidence". That statement shows possibly that you are desperate to find supporting material to counter my debate. There is not a scientist on the planet that would call that bit of rubbish "evidence" of anything but stupidity.

I have "faith" in my observation skills. I have "faith" in owning a mind that rarely assumes anything important without a hard look and an attempt to verify. Even THEN I maintain an open mind because many things that seemed to make more sense than not have been proven to not be true at all. It is all in degrees ... there is no absolute understanding..YET. They know there was a "bang" but they have no real confirmed idea what was before that. That does not mean they have NO idea at all. No real scientist would just stop and abandon exploration just because the answers to these questions are difficult to arrive at with a certainty.

I have never since I can recall anything at all been so stupid as to believe anything so ridiculous as a flat earth. It is just too easy to check out and discover that it plainly is not possible.

I get it that you have what you believe is "faith". I believe what you have is something else. I believe what you have is fear....not unlike many people. Assuming a God is the answer to all of your fear is probably necessary to keep you safe and sane. Without that comfort you would feel very alone. That is natural and "normal".

I need no such reassurance.

Huggy a person shows more character when they can just admit when they're wrong ,the word applies to your view.

If a person believes something without physical evidence that persons belief is based on faith.

Mathmatically you can put a figure on anything you like ,that does not mean it will happen because of your odds you figured.

There is either life out there or there is not,based on empirical evidence there is no life out there.

Giving up in the face of an assault on truth and reason is a skill learned by Christians...me?...not so much.

I think you were starting to sense a shift of this thread towards real science.

 

[Cootaloot]

See I don't know if this has been said or not yet bc I really didn't read all the post but I think the reason you have a mind set that there is a place your going to after you die it puts the mind at easy now me if I think about the fact of death I freak out bc the thought of not thinking or being anywhere scares the shit out of me

 

[HUGGY]

You are applying unscientific inferrences in your conclusions... Assuming any life elsewhere would behave as it does here... That's like the flat-earthers believed before they knew the world was round... They drew their conclusions based on what they knew at the time...

There is no physical evidence of life on other worlds, but you have a faith in your beliefs that there might be, despite the absence of evidence... I really don't care if you believe in the existence of God or not... I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of mocking someone else's faith in their beliefs while ignoring your own...

I'm using the dictionary version of the word "faith"... You can make up your own if you want, but I'll stick to the published version...

You have poor deduction skills. The supposition of a flat earth was not "evidence". That statement shows possibly that you are desperate to find supporting material to counter my debate. There is not a scientist on the planet that would call that bit of rubbish "evidence" of anything but stupidity.

I have "faith" in my observation skills. I have "faith" in owning a mind that rarely assumes anything important without a hard look and an attempt to verify. Even THEN I maintain an open mind because many things that seemed to make more sense than not have been proven to not be true at all. It is all in degrees ... there is no absolute understanding..YET. They know there was a "bang" but they have no real confirmed idea what was before that. That does not mean they have NO idea at all. No real scientist would just stop and abandon exploration just because the answers to these questions are difficult to arrive at with a certainty.

I have never since I can recall anything at all been so stupid as to believe anything so ridiculous as a flat earth. It is just too easy to check out and discover that it plainly is not possible.

I get it that you have what you believe is "faith". I believe what you have is something else. I believe what you have is fear....not unlike many people. Assuming a God is the answer to all of your fear is probably necessary to keep you safe and sane. Without that comfort you would feel very alone. That is natural and "normal".

I need no such reassurance.

Huggy who is showing fear here,you can't seem grasp that your belief is based on faith.

I am just curious as to why you won't admit it ?

Do you believe being honest with yourself is showing weakness ?

Have you not noticed how you guys continue to deflect and try to explain the obvious ?

Have you noticed when cornered you turn to petty insults insinuating you're superior in your reasoning skills and it's clear that is not the case.

Don't get me wrong i am not trying to insult you. I am just trying to have A civil give and take with you.

I don't take a misunderestimation as an insult ...intended or not. This format is O K but not nearly as satisfying as real life. Civil? Boring... But it will have to do here at USMB...

I can see why you transfer your "flight" choice unto others...I'm more in the "fight" camp. Just last Saturday afternoon a deranged person attacked me screaming he was going to kill me. My reaction was to knock his ass out. It didn't even occur to me to retreat. If I responded to situations as you Christians do I would miss out on the pleasure of standing over someone that misjudged my demeanor and ability and calmly explaining to them the error of their ways. It is amazing how the human brain can change opinion and "beliefs" on a dime when it has no other choice but to accept a mistake. The transformation from "I am going to kill you" to a heartfelt "I am sorry" is most rewarding to witness. Some people just need three severe punches to the face and a kick in the balls to get their attention. I especially enjoy watching the mind clear coming out of a knockout with the erroneous information beat out of them they seem to actually take advantage of the moment and see things they way they really are. In MY world THAT is called losing an argument. This is the internets... hardly equivalent.

But ya can't have cake all of the time.... this will do until something more interesting comes along. I'm just thankful it does from time to time...

So as you can tell .. I am a much nicer person here than in reality. I am much more forgiving and tolerant of others. Convincing yourself that you have beaten me will only degrade your own estimation of your true ability and erode any foundation you are attempting to build with me in a history of debate.

No worries...when you actually win a point I will concede it. I play golf. Keeping fair and honest score is the essence of that game.

 

[HUGGY]

OK... We have reached a snag... an obstacle to the debate. This impedance is the definition of the word "faith". Faith to non believers is not the same word as to those that believe. To someone like myself it is just another word implying or describing something known or reinforced through trial and error or maybe following something ..an idea reinforced with evidence.. It doesn't mean much more than that. To a Christian the word in itself isn't enough, so it's meaning is expanded dramatically to encompass a whole larger mindset and characterization of the act of giving one's whole focus in life and the choosing of and defending a life's path. Faith to a Christian is a sacrifice, a statement of adoration, a commitment and a guarantee of sorts to adhere to the teachings of Christianity. It is more of a defense than anything.

When Christians say a non believer has "faith" they transfer their own meaning of the word to someone that doesn't even think like that.

Are you trying to punt Huggy ?

No. But if I do I will bury you on the one or two yard line.

 

[Youwerecreated]

You have poor deduction skills. The supposition of a flat earth was not "evidence". That statement shows possibly that you are desperate to find supporting material to counter my debate. There is not a scientist on the planet that would call that bit of rubbish "evidence" of anything but stupidity.

I have "faith" in my observation skills. I have "faith" in owning a mind that rarely assumes anything important without a hard look and an attempt to verify. Even THEN I maintain an open mind because many things that seemed to make more sense than not have been proven to not be true at all. It is all in degrees ... there is no absolute understanding..YET. They know there was a "bang" but they have no real confirmed idea what was before that. That does not mean they have NO idea at all. No real scientist would just stop and abandon exploration just because the answers to these questions are difficult to arrive at with a certainty.

I have never since I can recall anything at all been so stupid as to believe anything so ridiculous as a flat earth. It is just too easy to check out and discover that it plainly is not possible.

I get it that you have what you believe is "faith". I believe what you have is something else. I believe what you have is fear....not unlike many people. Assuming a God is the answer to all of your fear is probably necessary to keep you safe and sane. Without that comfort you would feel very alone. That is natural and "normal".

I need no such reassurance.

Huggy who is showing fear here,you can't seem grasp that your belief is based on faith.

I am just curious as to why you won't admit it ?

Do you believe being honest with yourself is showing weakness ?

Have you not noticed how you guys continue to deflect and try to explain the obvious ?

Have you noticed when cornered you turn to petty insults insinuating you're superior in your reasoning skills and it's clear that is not the case.

Don't get me wrong i am not trying to insult you. I am just trying to have A civil give and take with you.

I don't take a misunderestimation as an insult ...intended or not. This format is O K but not nearly as satisfying as real life. Civil? Boring... But it will have to do here at USMB...

I can see why you transfer your "flight" choice unto others...I'm more in the "fight" camp. Just last Saturday afternoon a deranged person attacked me screaming he was going to kill me. My reaction was to knock his ass out. It didn't even occur to me to retreat. If I responded to situations as you Christians do I would miss out on the pleasure of standing over someone that misjudged my demeanor and ability and calmly explaining to them the error of their ways. It is amazing how the human brain can change opinion and "beliefs" on a dime when it has no other choice but to accept a mistake. The transformation from "I am going to kill you" to a heartfelt "I am sorry" is most rewarding to witness. Some people just need three severe punches to the face and a kick in the balls to get their attention. I especially enjoy watching the mind clear coming out of a knockout with the erroneous information beat out of them they seem to actually take advantage of the moment and see things they way they really are. In MY world THAT is called losing an argument. This is the internets... hardly equivalent.

But ya can't have cake all of the time.... this will do until something more interesting comes along. I'm just thankful it does from time to time...

So as you can tell .. I am a much nicer person here than in reality. I am much more forgiving and tolerant of others. Convincing yourself that you have beaten me will only degrade your own estimation of your true ability and erode any foundation you are attempting to build with me in a history of debate.

No worries...when you actually win a point I will concede it. I play golf. Keeping fair and honest score is the essence of that game.

It's about what is right ,not winning a debate for me.

I am concerned with peoples reasons to reject the one and only reason we are here.

I have been instructed by the author of my favorite book to search out the ones with the right heart condition.

If that means showing them their worldly views are just that ,than so be it.

 

[Youwerecreated]

OK... We have reached a snag... an obstacle to the debate. This impedance is the definition of the word "faith". Faith to non believers is not the same word as to those that believe. To someone like myself it is just another word implying or describing something known or reinforced through trial and error or maybe following something ..an idea reinforced with evidence.. It doesn't mean much more than that. To a Christian the word in itself isn't enough, so it's meaning is expanded dramatically to encompass a whole larger mindset and characterization of the act of giving one's whole focus in life and the choosing of and defending a life's path. Faith to a Christian is a sacrifice, a statement of adoration, a commitment and a guarantee of sorts to adhere to the teachings of Christianity. It is more of a defense than anything.

When Christians say a non believer has "faith" they transfer their own meaning of the word to someone that doesn't even think like that.

Are you trying to punt Huggy ?

No. But if I do I will bury you on the one or two yard line.

This is me being a little worldly,i am a football god,please forgive me Jesus.

 

[HUGGY]

Huggy who is showing fear here,you can't seem grasp that your belief is based on faith.

I am just curious as to why you won't admit it ?

Do you believe being honest with yourself is showing weakness ?

Have you not noticed how you guys continue to deflect and try to explain the obvious ?

Have you noticed when cornered you turn to petty insults insinuating you're superior in your reasoning skills and it's clear that is not the case.

Don't get me wrong i am not trying to insult you. I am just trying to have A civil give and take with you.

I don't take a misunderestimation as an insult ...intended or not. This format is O K but not nearly as satisfying as real life. Civil? Boring... But it will have to do here at USMB...

I can see why you transfer your "flight" choice unto others...I'm more in the "fight" camp. Just last Saturday afternoon a deranged person attacked me screaming he was going to kill me. My reaction was to knock his ass out. It didn't even occur to me to retreat. If I responded to situations as you Christians do I would miss out on the pleasure of standing over someone that misjudged my demeanor and ability and calmly explaining to them the error of their ways. It is amazing how the human brain can change opinion and "beliefs" on a dime when it has no other choice but to accept a mistake. The transformation from "I am going to kill you" to a heartfelt "I am sorry" is most rewarding to witness. Some people just need three severe punches to the face and a kick in the balls to get their attention. I especially enjoy watching the mind clear coming out of a knockout with the erroneous information beat out of them they seem to actually take advantage of the moment and see things they way they really are. In MY world THAT is called losing an argument. This is the internets... hardly equivalent.

But ya can't have cake all of the time.... this will do until something more interesting comes along. I'm just thankful it does from time to time...

So as you can tell .. I am a much nicer person here than in reality. I am much more forgiving and tolerant of others. Convincing yourself that you have beaten me will only degrade your own estimation of your true ability and erode any foundation you are attempting to build with me in a history of debate.

No worries...when you actually win a point I will concede it. I play golf. Keeping fair and honest score is the essence of that game.

It's about what is right ,not winning a debate for me.

I am concerned with peoples reasons to reject the one and only reason we are here.

I have been instructed by the author of my favorite book to search out the ones with the right heart condition.

If that means showing them their worldly views are just that ,than so be it.

1st ..pt.. Right can mean ANYTHING .it is just a satisfaction of your preconception. I like winning.

2nd ..pt...There in lays my problem with Christians. You feel obligated to butt into other peoples lives with your nonsense.

3rd.. pt..No need. I'm all about the worldly view.

I will give you credit for a civil debate though. That makes you a much better person than the HouseGimp. That pathetic little twit actually negged me for disagreeing with him on the definition of "faith". At least you seem to be a man about your convictions. I can respect that. He is a Christian in name only and a weak fraud. You should debate him on "faith"...he is one of the most un-Christian-like posters on this MB. I believe that little lamb needs more guidance than I do.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I don't take a misunderestimation as an insult ...intended or not. This format is O K but not nearly as satisfying as real life. Civil? Boring... But it will have to do here at USMB...

I can see why you transfer your "flight" choice unto others...I'm more in the "fight" camp. Just last Saturday afternoon a deranged person attacked me screaming he was going to kill me. My reaction was to knock his ass out. It didn't even occur to me to retreat. If I responded to situations as you Christians do I would miss out on the pleasure of standing over someone that misjudged my demeanor and ability and calmly explaining to them the error of their ways. It is amazing how the human brain can change opinion and "beliefs" on a dime when it has no other choice but to accept a mistake. The transformation from "I am going to kill you" to a heartfelt "I am sorry" is most rewarding to witness. Some people just need three severe punches to the face and a kick in the balls to get their attention. I especially enjoy watching the mind clear coming out of a knockout with the erroneous information beat out of them they seem to actually take advantage of the moment and see things they way they really are. In MY world THAT is called losing an argument. This is the internets... hardly equivalent.

But ya can't have cake all of the time.... this will do until something more interesting comes along. I'm just thankful it does from time to time...

So as you can tell .. I am a much nicer person here than in reality. I am much more forgiving and tolerant of others. Convincing yourself that you have beaten me will only degrade your own estimation of your true ability and erode any foundation you are attempting to build with me in a history of debate.

No worries...when you actually win a point I will concede it. I play golf. Keeping fair and honest score is the essence of that game.

It's about what is right ,not winning a debate for me.

I am concerned with peoples reasons to reject the one and only reason we are here.

I have been instructed by the author of my favorite book to search out the ones with the right heart condition.

If that means showing them their worldly views are just that ,than so be it.

1st ..pt.. Right can mean ANYTHING .it is just a satisfaction of your preconception. I like winning.

2nd ..pt...There in lays my problem with Christians. You feel obligated to butt into other peoples lives with your nonsense.

3rd.. pt..No need. I'm all about the worldly view.

I would just like to see you win this time.

I'm not butting in,you don't have to respond.

Yes that is obvious, you will reject the obvious truth to hold on to that worldly view.

 

[Montrovant]

You are applying unscientific inferrences in your conclusions... Assuming any life elsewhere would behave as it does here... That's like the flat-earthers believed before they knew the world was round... They drew their conclusions based on what they knew at the time...

There is no physical evidence of life on other worlds, but you have a faith in your beliefs that there might be, despite the absence of evidence... I really don't care if you believe in the existence of God or not... I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of mocking someone else's faith in their beliefs while ignoring your own...

I'm using the dictionary version of the word "faith"... You can make up your own if you want, but I'll stick to the published version...

You have poor deduction skills. The supposition of a flat earth was not "evidence". That statement shows possibly that you are desperate to find supporting material to counter my debate. There is not a scientist on the planet that would call that bit of rubbish "evidence" of anything but stupidity.

This is why you are nothing but a joke here... You automatically dismiss the facts that you don't want to hear like a child sticking his fingers in his ears and singling la-la-la-la...

There was no known "evidence" that the world was round before the theory was postulated and then subsequently proven... Both sides had had a faith in their belief as to the shape of the world at the time...

There is no "evidence" of life on other worlds, but you are free to prove your theory that there is... Until then you will continue to hod onto your faith in the belief that there might be...


I am not arguing or debating creationism vs. evolution... You're free to take that up with other posters, but I won't join you... My replies are only to show that you have a faith in the belief that there might be ET's floating around in space... The interesting fact is you mock Christians for having faith in their belief of God... Awesome textbook display of hipocrisy...

I have never since I can recall anything at all been so stupid as to believe anything so ridiculous as a flat earth. It is just too easy to check out and discover that it plainly is not possible.

I have never claimed that you did... People at the time of Colombus did until the theory whas shown to be wrong... That likely removed the faith they had in that belief...

I get it that you have what you believe is "faith". I believe what you have is something else. I believe what you have is fear....not unlike many people. Assuming a God is the answer to all of your fear is probably necessary to keep you safe and sane. Without that comfort you would feel very alone. That is natural and "normal".

I need no such reassurance.

You are free to have this false belief, but I fear nothing and I am not going to debate that with any foolish internet poster who can't even accept the definition of "faith" when provided...

You remain clueless....

I felt the need to comment on the bolded part of your quote. Faith that something might be true? So I could say I have faith that god might exist, say that I have faith that god might not exist, and be correct with both?
You are making faith = belief, of any kind, in anything. Perhaps you are misspeaking?

 

[HUGGY]

YWC,

"I am concerned with peoples reasons to reject the one and only reason we are here."

Ah!...back on topic.

You are taught that your "faith" is superior to others convictions. Number one..that is just not true. Just the fact that you give yourself to this ideology depletes your ability to make that judgment. If you concede that you must filter all of your opinion through the tint of the glasses you have chosen to don then what come out is no less jaded than what goes in. All you end up sharing is the rote from the bible and not your own words.

Secondly... I am not obligated to share your belief in what you have been told is your "mission". How can I be anything but annoyed when You do not offer the same rules you expect? I believe that your God does not exist. My belief in that is not dependent on your permission. Yet somehow you still seem to cling to some mythical "right" that you have a special reason that sets you apart and above my rights. I really do not care what you think your God has told you what to do when it comes to any part of my life. I am not lost. I don't need or want to be found. From my point of view your religion is no less fraudulent than any cult. Yours is the mindset of ALL people that follow All cults. I find it amazing that you cannot see that.

 

[MarcATL]

Hold applause.

In order to have a rational intelligent conversation on any subject there has to be agreement on the definitions and usage of the wordage. This debate was surprisingly good until the definition of "faith" was stretched beyond it's author's and keepers(dictionary) scope and intent by House and yourself. I enjoy good debate but it gets tedious when the energy to define common minutia exceeds the pleasure of discourse. I do not agree that "faith" encompasses all desire to follow information to fact in the learning process.

No he made the same point i made that you are relying on faith to believe as you do,that life exists out there on other planets with zero evidence for proof.

I have given plenty of evidence showing intelligent design.

I have also shown the necessity for the intelligent design and that it had a purpose to be designed.

Are you telling us a natural process is gonna think up all that a body needs to function ?

I didn't leave you out.

You guys have difficulty absorbing the scientific method. Proof is not finding a magic do-all key to a door or a ready made map to the treasure conveniently noted in modern English.

You are trying too hard to prove you erroneous definition of faith and ignoring any common definition of evidence.

Seldom at a crime scene is the murderer standing next to the corpse with a smoking gun in his hand and the victims skin under his fingernails when the CSI team shows up. That seems to be the level of evidence you are demanding from this debate. The way science works is more like The police get a call of a disturbance. That starts a time-line. Then they poke around and knock on the door and no one answers but maybe the latch is broken. Then they go inside and discover some broken stuff and a tiny amount of blood but no victim. They need to find the occupant of the house. Not there..no one knows where. They go back to those that reported the noise and it sounds like "something" happened in the house.

Do you start to see how this goes? We are WAY short of announcing a murder let alone who might have done it. Yet there is evidence and witnesses that suggest the possibility of something bad happened. The police have no "faith" that anything bad happened yet where they will be needed. They only go on what they see. At best the lead detective,..having been called and arrived, looks at what evidence they have and makes a determination to do anything at all. For all they know the occupants had an argument ..somebody dropped the french fries with the ketsup on them and the couple left on a vacation. As it turns out the door latch had been in disrepair for a long time. None of the police asked each other if any of them had "faith" a crime had been committed. They just filled out a report to account for their time and left. None of the evidence was proof..but it was evidence. So the couple never make it back and the detectives go back to the house and look harder for MORE evidence and they find a baseball bat with a little blood on it and the relatives say there had been a falling out..blah blah blah..All this is MORE evidence and the police believe there might have been a crime after all. OR at least the couple is missing...that's all they know for sure. They are only going to work on a missing persons case at this time..

So what's the point? Evidence. The added facts that build a case. Could we find life? Maybe..but first we need to find a sun like ours with a planet in the right zone to have liquid water. That would be MORE evidence and farther down the time-line. Still not enough to form an opinion of life but without it there is no life as we know it. So we keep looking for clues. Do the scientist have faith there is life yet? Of course not. Would they "like" to find life out there? Maybe. Would I? Probably not. If we find something advanced or they find us first all we know about every form of life is that it eats some other form of life or at the very least benefits from the death of some other form of life.

I'm guessing if an advanced life form discovered our planet and there was something here they needed or wanted..they would just take it. Is that "faith"? No it is an observation of what we know of life. I kinda would prefer we didn't give away our existence in some foolish attempt to meet our celestial neighbors... that may very well think we taste good.

Relevance?

It is relevant in that the real debate is the existence of a GOD with a time line having been established at the time of Moses..if we can believe the Bibles at all. This is because without the theory of this mythical creature there is nothing at all to debate and the evidence of which I support is the ONLY evidence gathered so far that builds a case for life on other worlds or not.

Based on this answer, I'd like to see how you would respond to this question/these questions: http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...ing-and-or-purpose-of-life-to-an-atheist.html

 

[HUGGY]

No he made the same point i made that you are relying on faith to believe as you do,that life exists out there on other planets with zero evidence for proof.

I have given plenty of evidence showing intelligent design.

I have also shown the necessity for the intelligent design and that it had a purpose to be designed.

Are you telling us a natural process is gonna think up all that a body needs to function ?

I didn't leave you out.

You guys have difficulty absorbing the scientific method. Proof is not finding a magic do-all key to a door or a ready made map to the treasure conveniently noted in modern English.

You are trying too hard to prove you erroneous definition of faith and ignoring any common definition of evidence.

Seldom at a crime scene is the murderer standing next to the corpse with a smoking gun in his hand and the victims skin under his fingernails when the CSI team shows up. That seems to be the level of evidence you are demanding from this debate. The way science works is more like The police get a call of a disturbance. That starts a time-line. Then they poke around and knock on the door and no one answers but maybe the latch is broken. Then they go inside and discover some broken stuff and a tiny amount of blood but no victim. They need to find the occupant of the house. Not there..no one knows where. They go back to those that reported the noise and it sounds like "something" happened in the house.

Do you start to see how this goes? We are WAY short of announcing a murder let alone who might have done it. Yet there is evidence and witnesses that suggest the possibility of something bad happened. The police have no "faith" that anything bad happened yet where they will be needed. They only go on what they see. At best the lead detective,..having been called and arrived, looks at what evidence they have and makes a determination to do anything at all. For all they know the occupants had an argument ..somebody dropped the french fries with the ketsup on them and the couple left on a vacation. As it turns out the door latch had been in disrepair for a long time. None of the police asked each other if any of them had "faith" a crime had been committed. They just filled out a report to account for their time and left. None of the evidence was proof..but it was evidence. So the couple never make it back and the detectives go back to the house and look harder for MORE evidence and they find a baseball bat with a little blood on it and the relatives say there had been a falling out..blah blah blah..All this is MORE evidence and the police believe there might have been a crime after all. OR at least the couple is missing...that's all they know for sure. They are only going to work on a missing persons case at this time..

So what's the point? Evidence. The added facts that build a case. Could we find life? Maybe..but first we need to find a sun like ours with a planet in the right zone to have liquid water. That would be MORE evidence and farther down the time-line. Still not enough to form an opinion of life but without it there is no life as we know it. So we keep looking for clues. Do the scientist have faith there is life yet? Of course not. Would they "like" to find life out there? Maybe. Would I? Probably not. If we find something advanced or they find us first all we know about every form of life is that it eats some other form of life or at the very least benefits from the death of some other form of life.

I'm guessing if an advanced life form discovered our planet and there was something here they needed or wanted..they would just take it. Is that "faith"? No it is an observation of what we know of life. I kinda would prefer we didn't give away our existence in some foolish attempt to meet our celestial neighbors... that may very well think we taste good.

Relevance?

It is relevant in that the real debate is the existence of a GOD with a time line having been established at the time of Moses..if we can believe the Bibles at all. This is because without the theory of this mythical creature there is nothing at all to debate and the evidence of which I support is the ONLY evidence gathered so far that builds a case for life on other worlds or not.

Based on this answer, I'd like to see how you would respond to this question/these questions: http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...ing-and-or-purpose-of-life-to-an-atheist.html

The meaning to life is only what one asks of the opportunity and what you may or may not want to invest in the survival and edification of future humans.. It is all that is truly yours to waste or build on as you choose. It means nothing more. If any wisdom or value is worth sharing it will be known or perhaps not if one chooses not to share.

The earth has been assaulted by several extraterrestrial bodies. We would not even be here if it had not. The smaller dinosaurs were mostly very efficient predators and without their demise we would have never existed. I doubt that lizards would have ever developed into beings with our level of intelligence. They lived for millions of years and did not seem to need to think and solve complicated problems to survive. Starting from the rodents we came from our branch of the tree has been around just a fraction of the time of the dinosaurs. It seems that life wasn't that hard to evolve...intelligent life...at least our level of intelligence may be very rare. There are probably billions of earth type planets out there and possibly life of some form on most of them that have liquid water. The crap shoot of the collisions seems to have had to happen in a pretty specific order to provide an animal friendly environment devoid of most of the predators. If the destruction was too total then the next generation would just be the same reptilian or aquatic life forms. The secret to our survival was that the big, fast and dangerous stuff got wiped out leaving the door open for some burrowing rat like creatures that emerged into a world with few natural predators. It seems that the current set of carnivores didn't get started any earlier than the non carnivores so there was a fair chance at survival for our ancestors. As in most things timing is everything. Intelligence much more so than just life seems to have been very lucky.

 

[Youwerecreated]

YWC,

"I am concerned with peoples reasons to reject the one and only reason we are here."

Ah!...back on topic.

You are taught that your "faith" is superior to others convictions. Number one..that is just not true. Just the fact that you give yourself to this ideology depletes your ability to make that judgment. If you concede that you must filter all of your opinion through the tint of the glasses you have chosen to don then what come out is no less jaded than what goes in. All you end up sharing is the rote from the bible and not your own words.

Secondly... I am not obligated to share your belief in what you have been told is your "mission". How can I be anything but annoyed when You do not offer the same rules you expect? I believe that your God does not exist. My belief in that is not dependent on your permission. Yet somehow you still seem to cling to some mythical "right" that you have a special reason that sets you apart and above my rights. I really do not care what you think your God has told you what to do when it comes to any part of my life. I am not lost. I don't need or want to be found. From my point of view your religion is no less fraudulent than any cult. Yours is the mindset of ALL people that follow All cults. I find it amazing that you cannot see that.

No offense Huggy, God is calling the ones with the right heart condition and the ones with the right heart condition will respond positively. You and i having our give and takes lets the ones with the right heart condition see the truth.


I don't put any of mans religions above another but i do believe Christ is the only true God.

I believe the bible has no rival.

God said he will save his people from every kingdom of the earth.

God said he will judge the ignorant.

You see God has the ability to look into our hearts and know what we are,it is the heart that determines your fate.

Huggy the truth will set you free,mans religion has nothing to do with it.

Psa 15:1 A Psalm of David. Jehovah, who shall dwell in Your tabernacle? Who shall dwell on Your holy hill?
Psa 15:2 He who walks uprightly, and works righteousness, and speaks the truth in his heart;

Joh 18:37 Pilate then said to Him, Are you a king then? Jesus answered, You say it that I am a king. To this end I was born, and for this cause I came into the world, that I should bear witness to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I didn't leave you out.

You guys have difficulty absorbing the scientific method. Proof is not finding a magic do-all key to a door or a ready made map to the treasure conveniently noted in modern English.

You are trying too hard to prove you erroneous definition of faith and ignoring any common definition of evidence.

Seldom at a crime scene is the murderer standing next to the corpse with a smoking gun in his hand and the victims skin under his fingernails when the CSI team shows up. That seems to be the level of evidence you are demanding from this debate. The way science works is more like The police get a call of a disturbance. That starts a time-line. Then they poke around and knock on the door and no one answers but maybe the latch is broken. Then they go inside and discover some broken stuff and a tiny amount of blood but no victim. They need to find the occupant of the house. Not there..no one knows where. They go back to those that reported the noise and it sounds like "something" happened in the house.

Do you start to see how this goes? We are WAY short of announcing a murder let alone who might have done it. Yet there is evidence and witnesses that suggest the possibility of something bad happened. The police have no "faith" that anything bad happened yet where they will be needed. They only go on what they see. At best the lead detective,..having been called and arrived, looks at what evidence they have and makes a determination to do anything at all. For all they know the occupants had an argument ..somebody dropped the french fries with the ketsup on them and the couple left on a vacation. As it turns out the door latch had been in disrepair for a long time. None of the police asked each other if any of them had "faith" a crime had been committed. They just filled out a report to account for their time and left. None of the evidence was proof..but it was evidence. So the couple never make it back and the detectives go back to the house and look harder for MORE evidence and they find a baseball bat with a little blood on it and the relatives say there had been a falling out..blah blah blah..All this is MORE evidence and the police believe there might have been a crime after all. OR at least the couple is missing...that's all they know for sure. They are only going to work on a missing persons case at this time..

So what's the point? Evidence. The added facts that build a case. Could we find life? Maybe..but first we need to find a sun like ours with a planet in the right zone to have liquid water. That would be MORE evidence and farther down the time-line. Still not enough to form an opinion of life but without it there is no life as we know it. So we keep looking for clues. Do the scientist have faith there is life yet? Of course not. Would they "like" to find life out there? Maybe. Would I? Probably not. If we find something advanced or they find us first all we know about every form of life is that it eats some other form of life or at the very least benefits from the death of some other form of life.

I'm guessing if an advanced life form discovered our planet and there was something here they needed or wanted..they would just take it. Is that "faith"? No it is an observation of what we know of life. I kinda would prefer we didn't give away our existence in some foolish attempt to meet our celestial neighbors... that may very well think we taste good.

Relevance?

It is relevant in that the real debate is the existence of a GOD with a time line having been established at the time of Moses..if we can believe the Bibles at all. This is because without the theory of this mythical creature there is nothing at all to debate and the evidence of which I support is the ONLY evidence gathered so far that builds a case for life on other worlds or not.

Based on this answer, I'd like to see how you would respond to this question/these questions: http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...ing-and-or-purpose-of-life-to-an-atheist.html

The meaning to life is only what one asks of the opportunity and what you may or may not want to invest in the survival and edification of future humans.. It is all that is truly yours to waste or build on as you choose. It means nothing more. If any wisdom or value is worth sharing it will be known or perhaps not if one chooses not to share.

The earth has been assaulted by several extraterrestrial bodies. We would not even be here if it had not. The smaller dinosaurs were mostly very efficient predators and without their demise we would have never existed. I doubt that lizards would have ever developed into beings with our level of intelligence. They lived for millions of years and did not seem to need to think and solve complicated problems to survive. Starting from the rodents we came from our branch of the tree has been around just a fraction of the time of the dinosaurs. It seems that life wasn't that hard to evolve...intelligent life...at least our level of intelligence may be very rare. There are probably billions of earth type planets out there and possibly life of some form on most of them that have liquid water. The crap shoot of the collisions seems to have had to happen in a pretty specific order to provide an animal friendly environment devoid of most of the predators. If the destruction was too total then the next generation would just be the same reptilian or aquatic life forms. The secret to our survival was that the big, fast and dangerous stuff got wiped out leaving the door open for some burrowing rat like creatures that emerged into a world with few natural predators. It seems that the current set of carnivores didn't get started any earlier than the non carnivores so there was a fair chance at survival for our ancestors. As in most things timing is everything. Intelligence much more so than just life seems to have been very lucky.

Explain extraterrestrial bodies ?

 

[HUGGY]

Based on this answer, I'd like to see how you would respond to this question/these questions: http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...ing-and-or-purpose-of-life-to-an-atheist.html

The meaning to life is only what one asks of the opportunity and what you may or may not want to invest in the survival and edification of future humans.. It is all that is truly yours to waste or build on as you choose. It means nothing more. If any wisdom or value is worth sharing it will be known or perhaps not if one chooses not to share.

The earth has been assaulted by several extraterrestrial bodies. We would not even be here if it had not. The smaller dinosaurs were mostly very efficient predators and without their demise we would have never existed. I doubt that lizards would have ever developed into beings with our level of intelligence. They lived for millions of years and did not seem to need to think and solve complicated problems to survive. Starting from the rodents we came from our branch of the tree has been around just a fraction of the time of the dinosaurs. It seems that life wasn't that hard to evolve...intelligent life...at least our level of intelligence may be very rare. There are probably billions of earth type planets out there and possibly life of some form on most of them that have liquid water. The crap shoot of the collisions seems to have had to happen in a pretty specific order to provide an animal friendly environment devoid of most of the predators. If the destruction was too total then the next generation would just be the same reptilian or aquatic life forms. The secret to our survival was that the big, fast and dangerous stuff got wiped out leaving the door open for some burrowing rat like creatures that emerged into a world with few natural predators. It seems that the current set of carnivores didn't get started any earlier than the non carnivores so there was a fair chance at survival for our ancestors. As in most things timing is everything. Intelligence much more so than just life seems to have been very lucky.

Explain extraterrestrial bodies ?

Asteroids, comets..etc... What created the moon was too large to call an asteroid. Probably a small planet that strayed out of it's solar orbit for whatever reason.

 

[chesswarsnow]

Sorry bout that,

See I don't know if this has been said or not yet bc I really didn't read all the post but I think the reason you have a mind set that there is a place your going to after you die it puts the mind at easy now me if I think about the fact of death I freak out bc the thought of not thinking or being anywhere scares the shit out of me

1. As well as you should be freaked out.
2. Its just plain hideous to think for an atheist or anyone, that when you die, you just simply *stop existing*.
3. No roaming or floating in darkness, no deep sleep in the grave where you dream about your life time on earth, nope, just *nothing*.
4. That should scare the **** out of you, if you are sane and an atheist.
5. But on the other hand, theres me, a man who has been assured from God directly.
6. There is life after death folks, and its real, you will go to heaven, as long as you are saved.
7. Jesus Saves.


Regards,
SirJamesofTexas

 

[Youwerecreated]

The meaning to life is only what one asks of the opportunity and what you may or may not want to invest in the survival and edification of future humans.. It is all that is truly yours to waste or build on as you choose. It means nothing more. If any wisdom or value is worth sharing it will be known or perhaps not if one chooses not to share.

The earth has been assaulted by several extraterrestrial bodies. We would not even be here if it had not. The smaller dinosaurs were mostly very efficient predators and without their demise we would have never existed. I doubt that lizards would have ever developed into beings with our level of intelligence. They lived for millions of years and did not seem to need to think and solve complicated problems to survive. Starting from the rodents we came from our branch of the tree has been around just a fraction of the time of the dinosaurs. It seems that life wasn't that hard to evolve...intelligent life...at least our level of intelligence may be very rare. There are probably billions of earth type planets out there and possibly life of some form on most of them that have liquid water. The crap shoot of the collisions seems to have had to happen in a pretty specific order to provide an animal friendly environment devoid of most of the predators. If the destruction was too total then the next generation would just be the same reptilian or aquatic life forms. The secret to our survival was that the big, fast and dangerous stuff got wiped out leaving the door open for some burrowing rat like creatures that emerged into a world with few natural predators. It seems that the current set of carnivores didn't get started any earlier than the non carnivores so there was a fair chance at survival for our ancestors. As in most things timing is everything. Intelligence much more so than just life seems to have been very lucky.

Explain extraterrestrial bodies ?

Asteroids, comets..etc... What created the moon was too large to call an asteroid. Probably a small planet that strayed out of it's solar orbit for whatever reason.

Thank you for that clarification.

So you believe these objects struck the earth and killed the tiny dinosaurs and if that hadn't happened we would not be here because we would be lunch to these tiny dinosaurs ?

How do you know that dinosaurs were meat eaters ?

Whoa wait a minute, i thought dinosaurs were part of the evolution chain.

Do you not see the many predators that are present today and very skillful hunters ,but yet we are still here.

We have them by sea and land.

 

[HUGGY]

Explain extraterrestrial bodies ?

Asteroids, comets..etc... What created the moon was too large to call an asteroid. Probably a small planet that strayed out of it's solar orbit for whatever reason.

Thank you for that clarification.

So you believe these objects struck the earth and killed the tiny dinosaurs and if that hadn't happened we would not be here because we would be lunch to these tiny dinosaurs ?

How do you know that dinosaurs were meat eaters ?

Whoa wait a minute, i thought dinosaurs were part of the evolution chain.

Do you not see the many predators that are present today and very skillful hunters ,but yet we are still here.

We have them by sea and land.

Wow! I had the erroneous impression that you were better educated. What I put down earlier was just a very brief outline skipping 99.999 percent of what happened. The point of the previous information was intended to remind someone that should already know the basic facts just how much luck played in the evolution of intelligent beings. It would take several pages of cliff notes to bring you up to speed.

But to briefly answer your questions.. yes, their teeth, yes, then they were wiped out but the world was transformed during their reign and their death provided quite a bit of nutrition that tided over the small remaining burrowing animals, yes but they didn't have a head start which is important, most of the life on earth both land and sea was wiped out and resurfaced as evolved into new species.

You should really put your bible down periodically and read some science.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Asteroids, comets..etc... What created the moon was too large to call an asteroid. Probably a small planet that strayed out of it's solar orbit for whatever reason.

Thank you for that clarification.

So you believe these objects struck the earth and killed the tiny dinosaurs and if that hadn't happened we would not be here because we would be lunch to these tiny dinosaurs ?

How do you know that dinosaurs were meat eaters ?

Whoa wait a minute, i thought dinosaurs were part of the evolution chain.

Do you not see the many predators that are present today and very skillful hunters ,but yet we are still here.

We have them by sea and land.

Wow! I had the erroneous impression that you were better educated. What I put down earlier was just a very brief outline skipping 99.999 percent of what happened. The point of the previous information was intended to remind someone that should already know the basic facts just how much luck played in the evolution of intelligent beings. It would take several pages of cliff notes to bring you up to speed.

But to briefly answer your questions.. yes, their teeth, yes, then they were wiped out but the world was transformed during their reign and their death provided quite a bit of nutrition that tided over the small remaining burrowing animals, yes but they didn't have a head start which is important, most of the life on earth both land and sea was wiped out and resurfaced as evolved into new species.

You should really put your bible down periodically and read some science.

So you're arrogantly trying to hide the fact you contradicted yourself nice.

So tell me if no one was there to witness the dinosaurs what makes you think they were meat eaters is this more speculation on your part ?

Just the shape of their teeth tells you if they were vegetarian or not ?

Wow look at this terrifying creature it has teeth of a meat eater.

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Science what would you like to discuss genetics,evolution,geology,molecular biology,fossils,astronomy,so which one would you like to discuss ?

I guess you didn't detect my sarcasm.