Zone1 What does the Bible say about "the world"?

[FoghornLeghorn]

The Bible and "of the world"

While we are certainly in the world, we are instructed not to be "of" the world.

All of the verses below are from the ESV Bible.

1 John 5:19
We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one.

John 15:19
If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

Romans 12:2
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.

1 John 2:15-17
Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world. And the world is passing away along with its desires, but whoever does the will of God abides forever.

1 John 4:4
Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.

John 17:11
And I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one.

James 1:27
Religion that is pure and undefiled before God the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.

John 1:10
He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him.

2 Corinthians 1:12
For our boast is this, the testimony of our conscience, that we behaved in the world with simplicity and godly sincerity, not by earthly wisdom but by the grace of God, and supremely so toward you.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. (Note: God loves all who are in the world despite their wickedness and wants all to repent and follow the Son, Jesus).

1 Corinthians 5:9-10
I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world.

1 Corinthians:1:21-23
For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles.

John 16:33
I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

1 John 5:5
Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

Job 1:7
The Lord said to Satan, “From where have you come?” Satan answered the Lord and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.”

 

[Winston]

Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

Matthew 4: 8-9

All the kingdoms of the world were Satan's to give.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

Matthew 4: 8-9

All the kingdoms of the world were Satan's to give.

^ That is correct.

 

[FoghornLeghorn]

Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

Matthew 4: 8-9

All the kingdoms of the world were Satan's to give.

Excellent. I'll add it to the list!

 

[Foxfyre]

The Bible and "of the world"

While we are certainly in the world, we are instructed not to be "of" the world.

All of the verses below are from the ESV Bible.

1 John 5:19
We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one.

John 15:19
If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

Romans 12:2
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.

1 John 2:15-17
Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world. And the world is passing away along with its desires, but whoever does the will of God abides forever.

1 John 4:4
Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world.

John 17:11
And I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one.

James 1:27
Religion that is pure and undefiled before God the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.

John 1:10
He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him.

2 Corinthians 1:12
For our boast is this, the testimony of our conscience, that we behaved in the world with simplicity and godly sincerity, not by earthly wisdom but by the grace of God, and supremely so toward you.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. (Note: God loves all who are in the world despite their wickedness and wants all to repent and follow the Son, Jesus).

1 Corinthians 5:9-10
I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people— not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world.

1 Corinthians:1:21-23
For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles.

John 16:33
I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

1 John 5:5
Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

Job 1:7
The Lord said to Satan, “From where have you come?” Satan answered the Lord and said, “From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.”

The Gospel according to Foxfyre (and her opinion only):

The writers of the Old and New Testaments were all Jewish. The Old Testament identifies the people who would be ultimately called the Jews as God's chosen people. They were to be set apart, different from all others, rejecting the polytheism and idolatry of the pagans all around them and obeying the laws and commands of the one God of Abraham.

Using the same techniques of symbolism, metaphor, allegory, parable coming from their Jewish heritage and traditions, it would only be natural for that to be included in New Testament manuscripts. "The world" is a metaphor for the pagan and heretic polytheists/idolaters/false prophets etc. that the Christian must see himself/herself set apart from and to not allow corruption or syncretism from those who do not know and worship and receive guidance from the Risen Christ/Holy Spirit.

 

[FoghornLeghorn]

The Gospel according to Foxfyre (and her opinion only):

The writers of the Old and New Testaments were all Jewish. The Old Testament identifies the people who would be ultimately called the Jews as God's chosen people. They were to be set apart, different from all others, rejecting the polytheism and idolatry of the pagans all around them and obeying the laws and commands of the one God of Abraham.

Using the same techniques of symbolism, metaphor, allegory, parable coming from their Jewish heritage and traditions, it would only be natural for that to be included in New Testament manuscripts. "The world" is a metaphor for the pagan and heretic polytheists/idolaters/false prophets etc. that the Christian must see himself/herself set apart from and to not allow corruption or syncretism from those who do not know and worship and receive guidance from the Risen Christ/Holy Spirit.

Thanks for sharing!

 

[norwegen]

Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

Matthew 4: 8-9

All the kingdoms of the world were Satan's to give.

He stood atop a high mountain to see all the kingdoms of the world. On a sphere, this is impossible, no matter how high the mountain is.

We know from this passage alone that the world is not a planet. Other passages indicate the same.

 

[norwegen]

The Gospel according to Foxfyre (and her opinion only):

The writers of the Old and New Testaments were all Jewish. The Old Testament identifies the people who would be ultimately called the Jews as God's chosen people. They were to be set apart, different from all others, rejecting the polytheism and idolatry of the pagans all around them and obeying the laws and commands of the one God of Abraham.

Using the same techniques of symbolism, metaphor, allegory, parable coming from their Jewish heritage and traditions, it would only be natural for that to be included in New Testament manuscripts. "The world" is a metaphor for the pagan and heretic polytheists/idolaters/false prophets etc. that the Christian must see himself/herself set apart from and to not allow corruption or syncretism from those who do not know and worship and receive guidance from the Risen Christ/Holy Spirit.

That's a reasonable conclusion, I think. On a practical level, the world is a limited geographical area. Parts of Europe, Asia, and Africa were the Israelites' knowledge of the world. It was a world that rested on pillars like a disc. Samuel’s mother Hannah is one who described the world this way (1 Sam 2:8), as are Job and the Psalmist Asaph (9:6; 75:3). The four corners of the earth were as far as one could imagine it, as expressed in Isaiah 11:12 and Revelation 7:1, for example.

The book of Esther mentions India to the east (1:1). Paul hopes to reach Spain to the west (Rom 15:24). The southernmost region mentioned in the Bible is Ethiopia, and the northernmost is probably Armenia. In the centuries of Israelite history, this is as big as the world would ever get. Approximately 7,000 miles east to west and 3,000 miles north to south.

The world was simply what they knew. It was where Jews lived, the antagonists who are central to the entire narrative.

 

[Foxfyre]

That's a reasonable conclusion, I think. On a practical level, the world is a limited geographical area. Parts of Europe, Asia, and Africa were the Israelites' knowledge of the world. It was a world that rested on pillars like a disc. Samuel’s mother Hannah is one who described the world this way (1 Sam 2:8), as are Job and the Psalmist Asaph (9:6; 75:3). The four corners of the earth were as far as one could imagine it, as expressed in Isaiah 11:12 and Revelation 7:1, for example.

The book of Esther mentions India to the east (1:1). Paul hopes to reach Spain to the west (Rom 15:24). The southernmost region mentioned in the Bible is Ethiopia, and the northernmost is probably Armenia. In the centuries of Israelite history, this is as big as the world would ever get. Approximately 7,000 miles east to west and 3,000 miles north to south.

The world was simply what they knew. It was where Jews lived, the antagonists who are central to the entire narrative.

Yes the flat earth theory seemingly is supported by the Bible because all the writers of the Bible were so geographically isolated. Except for those traveling between Egypt and the Promised Land and Paul and possible Peter who traveled to Rome, pretty much all had never traveled more than 100 miles from their original home.

Their descriptions, symbolisms, metaphors were guided by what they had experienced, could see/observe, had been told. Theirs was a flat earth because they were not men of science but of faith. Their earth was flat, broken by low mountains, because that is what they could see.

 

[norwegen]

Yes the flat earth theory seemingly is supported by the Bible because all the writers of the Bible were so geographically isolated. Except for those traveling between Egypt and the Promised Land and Paul and possible Peter who traveled to Rome, pretty much all had never traveled more than 100 miles from their original home.

Their descriptions, symbolisms, metaphors were guided by what they had experienced, could see/observe, had been told. Theirs was a flat earth because they were not men of science but of faith. Their earth was flat, broken by low mountains, because that is what they could see.

Jesus said the gospel of the kingdom would be proclaimed throughout the whole world before the end would come (Mt 24:14). Later, Paul declared that the gospel had come to the world (Rom 1:8, 16:25-26). And soon the end came.

This might be a good place to actually start understanding the Israelite worldview, rather than jumping to conclusions with our modern western perspectives, which Christians are wont to do.

To the Israelites, and indeed all the Canaanites, the world is flat and geographically much less expansive than we moderns know it to be. How, then, does the creation story of Genesis include South Americans and Australians? If the world were a disc whose most distant outpost from Jerusalem would eventually be Spain, then could not the creation be solely about Adam? Adam did live among other people, after all: the people of Nod, as the Bible calls them. Israel’s genealogy traces back to Adam, as in Luke chapter 3. The creation story is about these people, the impetus for it being their covenant with God, or the breath of life they receive from Him. We know that the biblical descriptions of the beginning do not align with empirical evidence, and they don’t have to. These descriptions merely serve as a setting for the divine communion on which Adam would embark. Scientific accuracy is clearly not the author’s focus.

Likewise, the flood of Noah’s time could not have been global. The world was regional. Hence the flood was regional.

 

[Foxfyre]

Jesus said the gospel of the kingdom would be proclaimed throughout the whole world before the end would come (Mt 24:14). Later, Paul declared that the gospel had come to the world (Rom 1:8, 16:25-26). And soon the end came.

This might be a good place to actually start understanding the Israelite worldview, rather than jumping to conclusions with our modern western perspectives, which Christians are wont to do.

To the Israelites, and indeed all the Canaanites, the world is flat and geographically much less expansive than we moderns know it to be. How, then, does the creation story of Genesis include South Americans and Australians? If the world were a disc whose most distant outpost from Jerusalem would eventually be Spain, then could not the creation be solely about Adam? Adam did live among other people, after all: the people of Nod, as the Bible calls them. Israel’s genealogy traces back to Adam, as in Luke chapter 3. The creation story is about these people, the impetus for it being their covenant with God, or the breath of life they receive from Him. We know that the biblical descriptions of the beginning do not align with empirical evidence, and they don’t have to. These descriptions merely serve as a setting for the divine communion on which Adam would embark. Scientific accuracy is clearly not the author’s focus.

Likewise, the flood of Noah’s time could not have been global. The world was regional. Hence the flood was regional.

I will share my perspective as I understand it with my education, opportunity to see, observe, etc. I've been seven miles above sea level so that I could observe the curvature of the Earth. I have been educated in the basics of general science and geography. I have traveled far from my original home plus friends and family who have traveled much further have shared information from those travels.

So for me to accept Biblical descriptions/accounts as symbolism, metaphor, allegory written by people with far more limited experience is easy.

But I will never tell anyone that they are wrong who believe those descriptions are accurate.

Why? Because their faith harms no one and it is valuable to them. I think our God considers our relationship with Him to be far more important than details of our theology.

 

[Zebra]

Yes the flat earth theory seemingly is supported by the Bible because all the writers of the Bible were so geographically isolated. Except for those traveling between Egypt and the Promised Land and Paul and possible Peter who traveled to Rome, pretty much all had never traveled more than 100 miles from their original home.

Their descriptions, symbolisms, metaphors were guided by what they had experienced, could see/observe, had been told. Theirs was a flat earth because they were not men of science but of faith. Their earth was flat, broken by low mountains, because that is what they could see.

and the sun can stand still!

 

[Foxfyre]

and the sun can stand still!

Yes. If you have no way to think otherwise, you would think the sun revolves around the Earth. Context, experience, culture, perception--it all factors into the context of the Bible. Unless we read it through the eyes of those who wrote down the words, their experience, their culture, what they were able to observe and know, we will often misinterpret what the text is actually saying.