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Truthmatters

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These guys are pretty good.

I enjoy their sound.

Too bad they are about speaking hate for the entire Muslim religion.

You see there are a shit load of Muslims in the world and we cant kill them all.

The extremist are not the norm and pretending they are is what will give us the religious war this group seems to think is inevitable.

This is why I have so much trouble with all organized religion, they always end up wanting to fullfill their own prophecies.
 

Chips Rafferty

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ScreamingEagle

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mattskramer

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[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pD-t6tcBji4[/ame]

http://www.alighthouse.com/flag.htm

The above are two different styles that, from my perspective, to some degree, say the same thing. Though the USA has some spots in its past and we still face serious issues and differences today, there is no other place where I would rather be than in America.

Relatively speaking, there is freedom, opportunity, and safety in America. If you try to climb your ladder of success and slip, there are safety nets to catch you and help you stand up. There are incentives to encourage you to start climbing again.

Though we have strong socio-political differences and different opinions on what is best for America, we donÂ’t generally try to exterminate each different group because of those differences. We have different religions but we donÂ’t have a theocracy. We vote for people to represent up and if they do a poor enough job of representing us, we can vote to replace them.

All things considered, I think that the USA is a pretty good nation, if not the best. Right off hand, I canÂ’t think of any place where IÂ’d rather be.

Oh. One more comment along these lines. If you can think of another place where you would rather be, America will not prohibit you from leaving.
 

RetiredGySgt

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There, in a nutshell, is the difference between you and me, and most other people in the world, Kaffy.

I would be mortally embarrassed at such a nauseatingly indecent display of self-adoration.

The only indecent thing around here is people like you that are not proud of their own country. You do not like where ever it is you live? Move to what ever place you think is better.
 

Truthmatters

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Thanks so much for this ,I have not heard it in a very long time!

It brought tears to my eyes this 4th of July morning and I thank you for them.

When all the kids get up Im going to make them each watch this and remind them of the wonderful country the were so very lucky to be born into and all the brave and wonderful people who sacraficed so much to keep this dream alive.

To pretend America has always lived up to the great dream of our for fathers every momment we have exsisted is to pretend we are faultless and perfect.

The founders knew perfect people dont exsist which is why they designed this great system in which the deeds of lesser men and the corruption of average men could NOT take the freedoms away.

Our founders knew they were not perfect and no man was perfect but that together we could ask each other to try to bring into each our lives the best man can offer which is constantly striving to put ourselfs back on the path of honor and freedom when we do stray.

They knew the Best in Man can overcome our slights with time allowed.

They designed a system which would allow the time in which we could catch ourselfs and stop our lower instincts from taking over.

It my at times seem to Slow a form of government but there was method to their madness.

I LOVE this country and I thank those men and all who defend the gifts those men brough us!

Happy Birthday my dear country!
 

Chips Rafferty

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:cuckoo:
The only indecent thing around here is people like you that are not proud of their own country. You do not like where ever it is you live? Move to what ever place you think is better.

Tell me, Forrest. What is so decent and praiseworthy about self-love? Because that is all the “patriotism” is – narcissism on a national scale.

If you were born in Afghanistan instead of Bigheadistan you would be a nationalistic Afghan Muslim, in Mumbai a hidebound Hindu, in Eire a patriotic Rat-catcher.

Think of it, Chesty, if your mother had got the hots for a Hajji you would be head down and arse up in some militant Mosque right about now. :badgrin:

I'm fucked if I can see how reflexively falling in love with the geographical location you were born in, just because YOU were born in it, somehow becomes virtue personified.

Anyway, if yourÂ’re as fucking gung-ho as you make out you are, why arenÂ’t you in Eye-wrack bushwhacking blind Eyewracki street vendors and crippled paper boys? ;)
 

Mr.Conley

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:cuckoo:

Tell me, Forrest. What is so decent and praiseworthy about self-love? Because that is all the “patriotism” is – narcissism on a national scale.

If you were born in Afghanistan instead of Bigheadistan you would be a nationalistic Afghan Muslim, in Mumbai a hidebound Hindu, in Eire a patriotic Rat-catcher.

Think of it, Chesty, if your mother had got the hots for a Hajji you would be head down and arse up in some militant Mosque right about now. :badgrin:

I'm fucked if I can see how reflexively falling in love with the geographical location you were born in, just because YOU were born in it, somehow becomes virtue personified.

Anyway, if yourÂ’re as fucking gung-ho as you make out you are, why arenÂ’t you in Eye-wrack bushwhacking blind Eyewracki street vendors and crippled paper boys? ;)
Patriotism, properly defined, can be a virtue. Normally I stand firmly in your camp: the misfortune of being born in location X isn't worth my time. Yet, if you take a somewhat different perspective on the issue, I believe a case can be constructed.

Generally, most people define patriotism as holding and/or exhibiting support for one's country and/or the people, culture, values of a particular region. I like to take a different approach. Instead of expressing my loyalty towards a particular geographic entity, I support this country because of the values she expresses and how she acts to uphold them.

America was founded on the then radical notion that all men are equal and, more importantly, that no person has the right or ability to control or harm another without their consent. From this radical idea arose a plethora of other truths including freedom, liberty, responsibility, individuality, limited government among many others. It is this ideas, these truths, these values, that this country is founded on and it is these values that this country is duty bound to preserve, protect, and, someday, bring to those who know them not. As long as America stands for the ideas that form the foundation of our democracy, I can be proud of her for good reason.
 

Chips Rafferty

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Patriotism, properly defined, can be a virtue. Normally I stand firmly in your camp: the misfortune of being born in location X isn't worth my time. Yet, if you take a somewhat different perspective on the issue, I believe a case can be constructed.

Generally, most people define patriotism as holding and/or exhibiting support for one's country and/or the people, culture, values of a particular region. I like to take a different approach. Instead of expressing my loyalty towards a particular geographic entity, I support this country because of the values she expresses and how she acts to uphold them.

America was founded on the then radical notion that all men are equal and, more importantly, that no person has the right or ability to control or harm another without their consent. From this radical idea arose a plethora of other truths including freedom, liberty, responsibility, individuality, limited government among many others. It is this ideas, these truths, these values, that this country is founded on and it is these values that this country is duty bound to preserve, protect, and, someday, bring to those who know them not. As long as America stands for the ideas that form the foundation of our democracy, I can be proud of her for good reason.

...and when said country has consistently betrayed - virtually before they were even written! - these noble sentiments, what does a patriot do then?
 

mattskramer

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If you were born in Afghanistan instead of Bigheadistan you would be a nationalistic Afghan Muslim, in Mumbai a hidebound Hindu, in Eire a patriotic Rat-catcher.

Think of it, Chesty, if your mother had got the hots for a Hajji you would be head down and arse up in some militant Mosque right about now.

I'm fucked if I can see how reflexively falling in love with the geographical location you were born in, just because YOU were born in it, somehow becomes virtue personified.

I think that you have a weak argument. How many people from what other nations come to America? How many people in America give up their citizenship and move to other nations?

I am not a xenophobe but I think that America is one of the greatest nations on earth. It has a speckled past and it still has problems but it provides great opportunity.
 

Mr.Conley

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...and when said country has consistently betrayed - virtually before they were even written! - these noble sentiments, what does a patriot do then?

The patriot does what I do: weep the passing of a once mighty nation and work to make things right. Fight to set the path right.
 

Chips Rafferty

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Patriotism, properly defined, can be a virtue. Normally I stand firmly in your camp: the misfortune of being born in location X isn't worth my time. Yet, if you take a somewhat different perspective on the issue, I believe a case can be constructed.

Generally, most people define patriotism as holding and/or exhibiting support for one's country and/or the people, culture, values of a particular region. I like to take a different approach. Instead of expressing my loyalty towards a particular geographic entity, I support this country because of the values she expresses and how she acts to uphold them.

America was founded on the then radical notion that all men are equal and, more importantly, that no person has the right or ability to control or harm another without their consent. From this radical idea arose a plethora of other truths including freedom, liberty, responsibility, individuality, limited government among many others. It is this ideas, these truths, these values, that this country is founded on and it is these values that this country is duty bound to preserve, protect, and, someday, bring to those who know them not. As long as America stands for the ideas that form the foundation of our democracy, I can be proud of her for good reason.

Don't forget that the Mammon worshipping, money grubbing \!/s that wrote this flowery self-congratulatory drivel were slave-holders and sweated labour Barons no better the the British nobility they ousted!

It is this ideas, these truths, these values, that this country is founded on and it is these values that this country is duty bound to preserve, protect, and, someday, bring to those who know them not

Me and the world would much rather that you had started practicing these ideals before you began exporting them. :rolleyes:
 

actsnoblemartin

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do you think criticizing your government is or is not patriotic, please give me a reason other then liberals suck, or conservatives evil.

Thank you.

Don't forget that the Mammon worshipping, money grubbing \!/s that wrote this flowery self-congratulatory drivel were slave-holders and sweated labour Barons no better the the British nobility they ousted!



Me and the world would much rather that you had started practicing these ideals before you began exporting them. :rolleyes:
 

Chips Rafferty

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I think that you have a weak argument. How many people from what other nations come to America? How many people in America give up their citizenship and move to other nations?

I am not a xenophobe but I think that America is one of the greatest nations on earth. It has a speckled past and it still has problems but it provides great opportunity.

Wanna hazard a guess as to how many people from nations in the Axis of Evil say the same thing?

I'm sure many more "Chicoms" than Americans say the same things.

So democratically speaking China must be a far better place to live than America. :eusa_think:
 

lieberalism

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There you have it folks. A liberal admits his love for china. is it any reason why normal americans despise liberalism?
 

mattskramer

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There you have it folks. A liberal admits his love for china. is it any reason why normal americans despise liberalism?

Could you present some specifics? I read through the posts on this thread. I found some criticism of America. I did not see where someone loves China. Even if someone were to love China, does that mean that he hates America or that “normal” Americas should hate the ideology of the one who loves China? Please direct me to some specific statements that drew you to the conclusion that you made.
 

RetiredGySgt

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Could you present some specifics? I read through the posts on this thread. I found some criticism of America. I did not see where someone loves China. Even if someone were to love China, does that mean that he hates America or that “normal” Americas should hate the ideology of the one who loves China? Please direct me to some specific statements that drew you to the conclusion that you made.

Chips did not say he loves China, which is where the claim comes from, BUT Chips CLEARLY hates the Government of the United States and any person that supports it, republican, democrat or independent.
 

mattskramer

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Chips did not say he loves China, which is where the claim comes from, BUT Chips CLEARLY hates the Government of the United States and any person that supports it, republican, democrat or independent.

Wow. Is that true, Chips? Do you really hate America’s republican system of government – or is it that you simply have some criticisms? I know that no political system is perfect. Each has its advantages and disadvantages. What political systems do you like the best?
 

Dr Grump

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The only indecent thing around here is people like you that are not proud of their own country. You do not like where ever it is you live? Move to what ever place you think is better.

There is a big difference being proud of where you live and trying to denigrate others for where they live. Or trying to make out that where you live is the best place in the world, while where others live is a shithole.
 

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