Were Adam & Eve Jewish?

[rosends]

Why didn't God just skip the Levites and give the laws to the Jews in the first place?

He started to but the people freaked out.

 

[Woodznutz]

He started to but the people freaked out.

Got a scripture for that (I'm thinking somewhere in 1 Samuel). Saul replaced the judges, of the twelve only two were Jews.

 

[rosends]

Got a scripture for that (I'm thinking somewhere in 1 Samuel). Saul replaced the judges, of the twelve only two were Jews.

(Exodus 20:15-18):
’The entire people saw the thunder and the flames, the sound of the shofar and the smoking mountain; the people saw and trembled and stood from afar. They said to Moshe:’You speak to us and we shall hear; let G-d not speak to us lest we die’. Moses said to the people:’Do not fear, for in order to elevate you has G-d come; so that awe of Him shall be upon your faces, so that you shall not sin’.The people stood from afar and Moshe approached the thick cloud where G-d was’.

 

[TheInfiniteSadness]

Doesn't the Bible forbid incest.

1. Adam and Eve were first people on earth.
2. Some of their sons were married.
3. The only women in the world at the time were their mother and sisters
4. They had no choice but to marry their sisters

 

[Woodznutz]

(Exodus 20:15-18):
’The entire people saw the thunder and the flames, the sound of the shofar and the smoking mountain; the people saw and trembled and stood from afar. They said to Moshe:’You speak to us and we shall hear; let G-d not speak to us lest we die’. Moses said to the people:’Do not fear, for in order to elevate you has G-d come; so that awe of Him shall be upon your faces, so that you shall not sin’.The people stood from afar and Moshe approached the thick cloud where G-d was’.

The only 'authority' given to a Jew in the Book of Exodus was overseeing the building of the tabernacle and other items used for worship. However, the Aaronic priesthood was established by God in Exodus. In the following book LEVIticus, more laws,statutes and judgements were revealed, to be administered by the sons of Aaron. Nowhere are Jews even mentioned.

 

[rosends]

The only 'authority' given to a Jew in the Book of Exodus was overseeing the building of the tabernacle and other items used for worship. However, the Aaronic priesthood was established by God in Exodus. In the following book LEVIticus, more laws,statutes and judgements were revealed, to be administered by the sons of Aaron. Nowhere are Jews even mentioned.

Jews aren't mentioned because the word didn't exist yet.I just quoted text which shows that God have authority to Moses to speak all the laws to the people. You don't have to like it, but there it is. (By the way, if your claim is that because the word "Jew" didn't exist, no authority was given to "Jews" then you are making a semantic argument, and you also then would say that the overseeing of anything wasn't given to a "Jew" either.

 

[Sherlock Holmes]

Serious question. At what point did Judaism come into being, as opposed to being a gentile?

No and neither was Moses Jewish. Jews simply did not exist until the birth of Judah.

 

[Woodznutz]

Jews aren't mentioned because the word didn't exist yet.I just quoted text which shows that God have authority to Moses to speak all the laws to the people. You don't have to like it, but there it is. (By the way, if your claim is that because the word "Jew" didn't exist, no authority was given to "Jews" then you are making a semantic argument, and you also then would say that the overseeing of anything wasn't given to a "Jew" either.

I was going to use the term "Judahite" but I chose "Jews" because that's the term we are using in this discussion. I know that the Jews venerate Moses (Moshe) but he was a Levite, not a Judahite. There is nothing in all of OT scripture that suggests a Jewish/Judahite priesthood nor anything that suggests that the Jews/Judahites were commissioned to explain the Law to anyone. The Jews have taken the Law down a bottomless rabbit hole with no authority to do so.

 

[rosends]

I was going to use the term "Judahite" but I chose "Jews" because that's the term we are using in this discussion. I know that the Jews venerate Moses (Moshe) but he was a Levite, not a Judahite.

Moses was from the tribe of Levi, but all tribes were children of Israel so there is no distinction to be made there. The use of the term "Judahite" makes no sense unless you intend to define each individual by his tribe in the desert.

There is nothing in all of OT scripture that suggests a Jewish/Judahite priesthood nor anything that suggests that the Jews/Judahites were commissioned to explain the Law to anyone. The Jews have taken the Law down a bottomless rabbit hole with no authority to do so.

So now you are talking about the Jews' explaining the law to non-Jews? Why is that about authority. We know Jewish laws, so we can explain them to others. Would you rather not understand the law? That's fine, too.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Serious question. At what point did Judaism come into being, as opposed to being a gentile?

Is the Pope Catholic?

Does a bear shit in the woods?

At any rate, we know that neither one had a belly button!

 

[Woodznutz]

Moses was from the tribe of Levi, but all tribes were children of Israel so there is no distinction to be made there. The use of the term "Judahite" makes no sense unless you intend to define each individual by his tribe in the desert.

So now you are talking about the Jews' explaining the law to non-Jews? Why is that about authority. We know Jewish laws, so we can explain them to others. Would you rather not understand the law? That's fine, too.

Tribal distinctions are made throughout the Bible, even into the NT.

We gentiles aren't interested in Jewish ideas about the Law. We can read for ourselves.

 

[Woodznutz]

So now you are talking about the Jews' explaining the law to non-Jews? Why is that about authority. We know Jewish laws, so we can explain them to others. Would you rather not understand the law? That's fine, too.

I talking about your assertion that the Levites needed the Judahites/Jews to explain the Law to them. There were no gentiles involved in that part of Israelite history.

 

[rosends]

Tribal distinctions are made throughout the Bible, even into the NT.

first, who cares about the gospels. Second, they were distinctions but did not change the group identity marker.

We gentiles aren't interested in Jewish ideas about the Law. We can read for ourselves.

No, you can't. If you think you can, let me know. I'll give you stuff to read.

 

[rosends]

I talking about your assertion that the Levites needed the Judahites/Jews to explain the Law to them. There were no gentiles involved in that part of Israelite history.

God gives the laws to Moses. He teaches a variety of people (the elders from all the tribes). The elders then teach things to the people.

for more details, see The Torah of Moshe by Rabbi Yirmiyahu Ullman - <a href='http://www.rabbiullman.com'>www.rabbiullman.com</a>.

and Why Moses' way of teaching Israel left Yehoshuah out (Eruvin 54b)?

 

[Woodznutz]

first, who cares about the gospels. Second, they were distinctions but did not change the group identity marker.

The "group identity marker" is Israelite, not Jewish, until the split. Then the name Israel stayed with the ten tribes.

No, you can't. If you think you can, let me know. I'll give you stuff to read.

Only if we can trade stuff.

 

[rosends]

The "group identity marker" is Israelite, not Jewish, until the split. Then the name Israel stayed with the ten tribes.

The children of Israel was the identity marker. The word "Israelite" has no biblical place.

Only if we can trade stuff.

I don't need anything in return. You claim you can read it. I'll give you some and you read it for me. Pretty basic. Just let me know.

 

[Woodznutz]

The children of Israel was the identity marker. The word "Israelite" has no biblical place.

I don't need anything in return. You claim you can read it. I'll give you some and you read it for me. Pretty basic. Just let me know.

What you will give me is the oral tradition of the Jews, which is not scriptural. I rely on actual scripture for my understanding.

All the children of Israel were Israelites regardless of tribal distinction. The term "Israelites" appears 16 times in the OT. Just click on any of these, then compare them to your Bible.

• Old Testament (16)
• Exodus (1)
• Leviticus (1)
• Joshua (4)
• Judges (1)
• 1 Samuel (5)
• 2 Samuel (1)
• 2 Kings (2)
• 1 Chronicles (1)

 

[rosends]

What you will give me is the oral tradition of the Jews, which is not scriptural. I rely on actual scripture for my understanding.

then you can't understand the text. But that's no surprise.

All the children of Israel were Israelites regardless of tribal distinction. The term "Israelites" appears 16 times in the OT. Just click on any of these, then compare them to your Bible.

• Old Testament (16)
• Exodus (1)
• Leviticus (1)
• Joshua (4)
• Judges (1)
• 1 Samuel (5)
• 2 Samuel (1)
• 2 Kings (2)
• 1 Chronicles (1)

thank you for confirming that you can't read the text. The text never says "Israelites." The Hebrew word it uses is "Israel" and that's it.

 

[Woodznutz]

then you can't understand the text. But that's no surprise.

thank you for confirming that you can't read the text. The text never says "Israelites." The Hebrew word it uses is "Israel" and that's it.

The Bible I use was translated for the English-speaking people. We've done pretty well with it since.

 

[Woodznutz]

then you can't understand the text. But that's no surprise.

thank you for confirming that you can't read the text. The text never says "Israelites." The Hebrew word it uses is "Israel" and that's it.

This is the rabbit hole I mentioned.