Wealth Tax: Yeah! Why do Warren Buffett and Bill gates need so much money in their Trust?

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
 

Blues Man

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
 

dblack

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"Why do Warren Buffett and Bill gates need so much money in their Trust?"

They don't. But that's not really the question. The question is, "Why did society decide to give them that money in the first place, and why should government overrule that decision?"
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
And if pay goes down, they know it.
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
 

hadit

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.
Increase TAXES and revenue will drop as fewer people will work and more spending as our courrpt are ALWAYS pushing for will occur pushing us further into debt you dip. Don't you ever read the history?
Increase taxes and tax payers will care about debt, making spending increases political suicide.
As I think you said previously, that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase. Unfortunately, congresscritters are human too, and would take measures to avoid tying their pet spending to tax increases. They would declare their spending to be "emergency", for just one example, and use omnibus spending bills even more than they do now where everything is tossed into one bill and passed before anyone really digs into them.
 

Blues Man

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
It hasn't happened yet and the rich have owned our political system for 200 years.
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.
Increase TAXES and revenue will drop as fewer people will work and more spending as our courrpt are ALWAYS pushing for will occur pushing us further into debt you dip. Don't you ever read the history?
Increase taxes and tax payers will care about debt, making spending increases political suicide.
As I think you said previously, that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase. Unfortunately, congresscritters are human too, and would take measures to avoid tying their pet spending to tax increases. They would declare their spending to be "emergency", for just one example, and use omnibus spending bills even more than they do now where everything is tossed into one bill and passed before anyone really digs into them.
Interesting point. Maybe we should tie tax increases to deficits then.
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
It hasn't happened yet and the rich have owned our political system for 200 years.
And they pay drastically less in taxes. Tax cuts fuel big gov.
 

dblack

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... that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase.
A "price tag" amendment would be a huge improvement to our government. If people know how much a given program is going to cost us - if every bill must provide its own revenue - we'd get much more honest decisions from voters. As it is, it all goes on the credit card, which we have no intention of paying off.
 

Blues Man

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
It hasn't happened yet and the rich have owned our political system for 200 years.
And they pay drastically less in taxes. Tax cuts fuel big gov.
Even when the rich paid 70% the government never cut spending.

If you give the government more revenue they will simply spend that too.

In reality the government doesn't care how much revenue they take in they will spend more every year no matter what.

The one and only way to stop government spending is to take away its ability to borrow money and pass a balanced budget amendment
 

Brain357

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... that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase.
A "price tag" amendment would be a huge improvement to our government. If people know how much a given program is going to cost us - if every bill must provide its own revenue - we'd get much more honest decisions from voters. As it is, it all goes on the credit card, which we have no intention of paying off.
People love government programs and military spending when they don’t pay for it.
 

dblack

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.
Increase TAXES and revenue will drop as fewer people will work and more spending as our courrpt are ALWAYS pushing for will occur pushing us further into debt you dip. Don't you ever read the history?
Increase taxes and tax payers will care about debt, making spending increases political suicide.
As I think you said previously, that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase. Unfortunately, congresscritters are human too, and would take measures to avoid tying their pet spending to tax increases. They would declare their spending to be "emergency", for just one example, and use omnibus spending bills even more than they do now where everything is tossed into one bill and passed before anyone really digs into them.
Interesting point. Maybe we should tie tax increases to deficits then.
We should. People doubt my libertarian cred when I advocate for higher taxes. But I think it's a crucial component of keeping the growth of government in check. We should raise taxes (across the board, for everyone - none of this targeting scapegoats bullshit) until the budget is actually balanced. Then we can have an honest discussion of how much government people really want, and how much they're willing to pay for it.
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
It hasn't happened yet and the rich have owned our political system for 200 years.
And they pay drastically less in taxes. Tax cuts fuel big gov.
Even when the rich paid 70% the government never cut spending.

If you give the government more revenue they will simply spend that too.

In reality the government doesn't care how much revenue they take in they will spend more every year no matter what.
Yet we didn’t have a deficit problem back then . Deficit problems started with Reagan who cut taxes...
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.
Increase TAXES and revenue will drop as fewer people will work and more spending as our courrpt are ALWAYS pushing for will occur pushing us further into debt you dip. Don't you ever read the history?
Increase taxes and tax payers will care about debt, making spending increases political suicide.
As I think you said previously, that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase. Unfortunately, congresscritters are human too, and would take measures to avoid tying their pet spending to tax increases. They would declare their spending to be "emergency", for just one example, and use omnibus spending bills even more than they do now where everything is tossed into one bill and passed before anyone really digs into them.
Interesting point. Maybe we should tie tax increases to deficits then.
We should. People doubt my libertarian cred when I advocate for higher taxes. But I think it's a crucial component of keeping the growth of government in check. We should raise taxes (across the board, for everyone - none of this targeting scapegoats bullshit) until the budget is actually balanced. Then we can have an honest discussion of how much government people really want, and how much they're willing to pay for it.
Exactly!
 

Brain357

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.
Increase TAXES and revenue will drop as fewer people will work and more spending as our courrpt are ALWAYS pushing for will occur pushing us further into debt you dip. Don't you ever read the history?
Increase taxes and tax payers will care about debt, making spending increases political suicide.
As I think you said previously, that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase. Unfortunately, congresscritters are human too, and would take measures to avoid tying their pet spending to tax increases. They would declare their spending to be "emergency", for just one example, and use omnibus spending bills even more than they do now where everything is tossed into one bill and passed before anyone really digs into them.
Interesting point. Maybe we should tie tax increases to deficits then.
We should. People doubt my libertarian cred when I advocate for higher taxes. But I think it's a crucial component of keeping the growth of government in check. We should raise taxes (across the board, for everyone - none of this targeting scapegoats bullshit) until the budget is actually balanced. Then we can have an honest discussion of how much government people really want, and how much they're willing to pay for it.
Also, my expectation is this would lead to lower taxes long term. Just the savings in debt interest could eventually be a tax cut.
 

Blues Man

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
But, the problem with that is, if we get into this idea that, hey, if we need more money, then we can just raise taxes. It gives no incentive to reduce spending if government thinks they can keep raising taxes to cover spending.

You have to cut spending because there is a limit to how much you can tax the people. At some point, people will be giving more money to the government than they keep for themselves....we're almost already there.

People in general don't care, and don't even think about the debt, they think about how much money they have in their paychecks. Most people don't even realize what the government is using all of their money for, they just take it for granted that "when payday comes, the government gets their cut and I get mine".

When you raise taxes, government doesn't say "oh hey, we have more money, let's do something so we can lower taxes later", they say "hey, we have more money now, so we can spend more" or, often, "we have to raise taxes to cover what we've already spent".

The debt ceiling keeps going up and up, every year it seems like we run into the debt ceiling and they keep raising it. That represents money that has to be paid back to someone, with interest. If you keep incurring debt, you can't make the payments if you never increase taxes. This is why I think we need to focus on spending cuts. We have to get spending under control so we can maybe someday lower taxes.

I'm no economist, but I did stay at a holiday Inn express last night......and I also realize that if you keep borrowing more money, you have to keep increasing your taxes to cover that borrowing.
Tax payers will only pay so much before anger.
Most tax payers have no clue what they actually pay in taxes.
They know how much their paychecks are. When a tax increase cuts pay, they will not be happy. Everyone loves their freebies now. The right loves military spending cause they have never paid for it. The left loves big gov cause they don’t pay for it. Everybody hates taxes...
All they know is the net.

Most people have absolutely no clue how much they pay in taxes besides no one is talking about raising taxes on most working people
Don’t underestimate the rich influence on politics. If they are unhappy about a tax increase, policy will be to cut spending.
It hasn't happened yet and the rich have owned our political system for 200 years.
And they pay drastically less in taxes. Tax cuts fuel big gov.
Even when the rich paid 70% the government never cut spending.

If you give the government more revenue they will simply spend that too.

In reality the government doesn't care how much revenue they take in they will spend more every year no matter what.
Yet we didn’t have a deficit problem back then . Deficit problems started with Reagan who cut taxes...
We've been running deficits almost every year since 1929
 

struth

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... that could work if every spending bill containing new spending also contained a corresponding tax increase.
A "price tag" amendment would be a huge improvement to our government. If people know how much a given program is going to cost us - if every bill must provide its own revenue - we'd get much more honest decisions from voters. As it is, it all goes on the credit card, which we have no intention of paying off.
People love government programs and military spending when they don’t pay for it.
This is true, and while Govt spending is the worse kind of spending.

There are four ways to spend money:
1) spend your own money, on yourself. Typically people are very conservative in this manner, because they know what they need, and they care about the money they earned
2) spend your own money, on someone else. Typically people are a little less conservative. Think of buying your wife, girlfriend, or mother flowers, or taking them out to dinner
3) spending someone elses money, on themselves. Think of having an expense account, yeah you might buy yourself that steak dinner while out on a business trip, but you might not get the lobster because you'd have to answer for it.
4) spending someone elses money, on someone else: this is Govt....they don't earn it, and they have nobody to answer to....very reckless, not to mention, really likely doesn't have a clue of the need of that someone else.
 

jc456

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
Why is it always increase taxes rather than cut spending? If we cut out all the frivolous spending, we wouldn't need to keep raising taxes.

Also, its impossible to pay off the debt as there is more money owed than there is in existence. Every dollar borrowed is borrowed with interest, even if you gave back every dollar that was ever borrowed, you'd still owe the interest, which can only be paid by borrowing more money.

Its an endless cycle that can only be slowed by decreasing the rate of spending.
Because nobody cares about debt without a tax increase. Remember the tea party? They complained and complained about debt until they got tax cuts and then they disappeared. Meanwhile deficits increased drastically. The only way spending cuts will happen is if we get a tax increase and make people care about debt. Nobody cares about debt, they care about taxes.
Spending never stops, it is the cause of debt, anywhere. Not tax cuts or tax increases. We want spending cuts. Not one politician will ever run on that . Why term limits is the only debt relief
But you don't want spending cuts. When repubs had full control they passed tax cuts and a huge military spending INCREASE! And all the repubs rejoiced. Now if there had been a tax increase associated with that spending increase you'd not be so happy.
dude, I want spending cuts, I've never preached anything other than that to cut the debt. you're in error about me. I believe tax cuts are good for my fellow americans. I want people to keep their own money.
 

jc456

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We will need to pay off debt somehow.
We need to stop spending---------making billionaires and politicians richer.
I would argue we need to stop cutting taxes and require a tax increase for any spending. We keep cutting taxes so nobody cares about debt. They will care when taxes increase.
You obviously don't pay taxes----

CUT SPENDING --the government steals more than enough of my money. They are just robbing taxpayers and fyi ONCE AGAIN..you are completely ignorant if you think the billionaires don't have loopholes to get out of paying taxes leaving the middle class and lower upper class to pay for all of this graft and corruption. This is why billionaires donate aka BUY politicians-----

CUT spending----------make every dime be accounted for..........
I pay a shit ton of taxes. Increase taxes and spending will be cut. Until then people don’t care and debt will grow.


Clinton increased taxes on the rich and cut spending.

The result, balanced budget, billions in surplus, the money stolen from the social security fund paid back and a plan to have the Reagan/bush national debt paid off by 2010.

Too bad the republicans and bush boy trashed it.

Obama raised taxes on the rich and cut spending.

The result, the record 1.4 trillion deficit was slashed by nearly 1 trillion down to 400 and something billion. He didn't leave a plan to have the national debt paid off.

Too bad the republicans and trump trashed it.

trump left a record deficit and debt. With no plan to pay it off.

It's as I've been saying for years and you have been saying in this thread. Raising taxes on the rich and cutting spending decreases deficits and debt.
facts truly elude you don't they?
 

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