Wagner boss slams Putin's army after Ukraine retakes parts of Bakhmut

[José]

Johnny is pretty smart... (for a slow horse, at least).

 

[toomuchtime_]

Point taken, Donald....

I just wanted to give a "bird's eye view" of the conflict in order to visualize its root causes...

There is only one "root cause"; a crazy old man thought he could bluff his way to a quick victory in Ukraine.

 

[rightwinger]

There is only one "root cause"; a crazy old man thought he could bluff his way to a quick victory in Ukraine.

Putin was not bluffing

He believed what his Generals told him about how great his Army was

 

[José]

Originally posted by toomuchtime
There is only one "root cause"; a crazy old man thought he could bluff his way to a quick victory in Ukraine.

Ukraine will continue to exist because the ukrainian national identity is real.

Even the Kremlin's walls know that russian rule west of the Dnieper is suicide, insanity to the 10th power. Russia would be flooded by body bags for as long as the occupation persisted.

It will be a rump state, a shadow of the prosperous country it could have been if the West had treated not only Russia but the politically divided country of Ukraine itself with respect but it will continue to exist.

And for people who see Russia as the villain in this story I have "good news" for you:

It will certainly be a hyper-nationalistic ukrainian state where even thoughts in russian will be outlawed. So nationalist that only the serious threat of massive russian retaliation will make this new Ukraine respect its new borders.

So everybody chill out... Ukraine is in no danger of ceasing to exist.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Putin was not bluffing

He believed what his Generals told him about how great his Army was

Did he believe it or did he think he could bluff the Ukrainians and the West into believing a Russia victory was inevitable and surrender?

If it was a bluff, which I believe, it certainly succeeded at first with the Biden administration, which at first offered to move Zelensky and his family safely out of Ukraine and only after the Ukrainians routed the Russian army from Kiev considered helping Ukraine resist the invasion.

Perhaps Putin even knew Russia could not prevail in a long war, but was so convinced a large show of force that would quickly capture Kiev would so dishearten the Ukrainians and the West, that there would be no resistance, but the Ukrainians shocked the world when they forced the Russians to retreat in disarray from Kiev, and Putin refused to accept the fact his bluff had failed and continued to bluff unspecified terrible consequences for every setback, right down to today.

 

[rightwinger]

Did he believe it or did he think he could bluff the Ukrainians and the West into believing a Russia victory was inevitable and surrender?

If it was a bluff, which I believe, it certainly succeeded at first with the Biden administration, which at first offered to move Zelensky and his family safely out of Ukraine and only after the Ukrainians routed the Russian army from Kiev considered helping Ukraine resist the invasion.

Perhaps Putin even knew Russia could not prevail in a long war, but was so convinced a large show of force that would quickly capture Kiev would so dishearten the Ukrainians and the West, that there would be no resistance, but the Ukrainians shocked the world when they forced the Russians to retreat in disarray from Kiev, and Putin refused to accept the fact his bluff had failed and continued to bluff unspecified terrible consequences for every setback, right down to today.

If so, his “bluff” ended up in a 30 mile traffic jam on the way to Kyev
I think he expected Zelensky to surrender Kyev and escape to safety in the west. Zelensky stayed put

 

[toomuchtime_]

Ukraine will continue to exist because the ukrainian national identity is real.

Even the Kremlin's walls know that russian rule west of the Dnieper is suicide, insanity to the 10th power. Russia would be flooded by body bags for as long as the occupation persisted.

It will be a rump state, a shadow of the prosperous country it could have been if the West had treated not only Russia but the politically divided country of Ukraine itself with respect but it will continue to exist.

And for people who see Russia as the villain in this story I have "good news" for you:

It will certainly be a hyper-nationalistic ukrainian state where even thoughts in russian will be outlawed. So nationalist that only the serious threat of massive russian retaliation will make this new Ukraine respect its new borders.

So everybody chill out... Ukraine is in no danger of ceasing to exist.

Trying to hold on to any part of Ukraine will be suicide for Russia. The war will not end until Russia withdraws from all of Ukraine. Russia cannot win this war and it cannot afford to pursue it for very long without destroying itself. How can you look at Russia being forced to roll out WWII tanks and enduring the humiliation of having fake hypersonic missiles and imagine any other end?

This war was caused by nothing but a series of bad decisions by Putin and there is no soft landing for Russia.

 

[rightwinger]

Trying to hold on to any part of Ukraine will be suicide for Russia. The war will not end until Russia withdraws from all of Ukraine. Russia cannot win this war and it cannot afford to pursue it for very long without destroying itself. How can you look at Russia being forced to roll out WWII tanks and enduring the humiliation of having fake hypersonic missiles and imagine any other end?

This war was caused by nothing but a series of bad decisions by Putin and there is no soft landing for Russia.

Looks like Ukraine has started its counteroffensive against Russia
We will see how it goes

 

[toomuchtime_]

Looks like Ukraine has started its counteroffensive against Russia
We will see how it goes

Very early stages. We still don't know where the main attack will be.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Guessing here.

Several strikes along the supply routes from Russia through the four oblasts to the Black Sea. The oblasts will easily fall to the Ukies and permit them to block to the northeast while turning to strike at Crimea.

Could Ukraine counteroffensive "crack" Russian army?