Vernal Equinox & Spring: Michael or Lucifer

Spring & Summer... Michael & Lucifer...

  • Spring= Michael... Summer= Lucifer

  • Spring= Lucifer... Summer= Michael


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Goddess_Ashtara

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Tis almost upon us! The Spring Equinox approaches!

Tomorrow, at 5:45 CDT, the Spring/ Vernal Equinox will occur, and it is a sacred time for many people... Pagan or otherwise.

I seek to ask something of all of you. I would like your opinion on the following matter.

Within my own pantheon, the Judeo-Christian figures of Lucifer and Michael hold a significant position. I seek to identify them with a season, for artistic and spiritual reasons, and to include in my own personal table of correspondences.

Already, the Autumn I have devoted to Ishtar, and the Winter I have devoted to Ereshkigal/ Lilith.

Who then, should I devote the Spring to? Michael? Or Lucifer?

Spring is a time of Light and Life, and many other things. Its element is Air, its tarot suit is Swords. During the Spring Equinox, day and night are both approximately 12 hours long.

What of the Summer? It is the hottest, brightest time of the year. Its element is Fire, its tarot sign is Wands. During the Summer Solstice, we enjoy the most daylight of the calender year, and then the days begin to get darker and darker.

Michael is often associated with the element of Fire, and Lucifer the Air, yet Lucifer, viewed as Iblis, was created from Fire, and Michael from Light. Lucifer is known as the Light Bringer, which can be of significance to Spring or Summer... yet the suit of Swords seems for fitting of Michael (Michael is often depicted with a sword) and Wands seem more fitting of Lucifer (as a master of Sorcery). As Satan, Lucifer is obviously more relevant to Fire, and Michael, being of a Heavenly and Celestial nature, seems to be more relevant to Air.

Thus far I have attached Spring to Michael and Summer to Lucifer, but, because it can be argued that both are relevant to both seasons, I am contemplating a revision, and wish to see what others thought of the subject.

(I am aware that the words "Lucifer" and "Satan" do not mean the same thing, and despite some compelling similarities between the two archetypes, they needn't be viewed as One and the same. Feel free to allow your feelings on such to affect your judgement and reasoning behind your decision.)

Discuss as you Will...

(By the way...there is a Total Solar eclipse tomorrow and a Supermoon ^_^)

 

Pogo

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Why not a NOTA choice?

Not a big fan of Judeo-Xian angles... :dunno:

Kudos for bringing up the Equinox though as well as the eclipse. More awareness of Nature is sorely needed, no doubt about that at all. Matter o' fact I blame the Judeo-Xian dichotomous paradigm for that discrepancy in the first place.
 
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Goddess_Ashtara

Goddess_Ashtara

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Why not a NOTA choice?

Not a big fan of Judeo-Xian angles... :dunno:

Kudos for bringing up the Equinox though.

Because either way, I will continue to represent them both in art and ritual. You needn't believe in them or even be fond of their archetypes. I only wonder which ones you feel would be more relevant to Spring or Summer.

C'mon. Tis a chance to get creative! There is no wrong choice on the poll.

 

Asclepias

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Tis almost upon us! The Spring Equinox approaches!

Tomorrow, at 5:45 CDT, the Spring/ Vernal Equinox will occur, and it is a sacred time for many people... Pagan or otherwise.

I seek to ask something of all of you. I would like your opinion on the following matter.

Within my own pantheon, the Judeo-Christian figures of Lucifer and Michael hold a significant position. I seek to identify them with a season, for artistic and spiritual reasons, and to include in my own personal table of correspondences.

Already, the Autumn I have devoted to Ishtar, and the Winter I have devoted to Ereshkigal/ Lilith.

Who then, should I devote the Spring to? Michael? Or Lucifer?

Spring is a time of Light and Life, and many other things. Its element is Air, its tarot suit is Swords. During the Spring Equinox, day and night are both approximately 12 hours long.

What of the Summer? It is the hottest, brightest time of the year. Its element is Fire, its tarot sign is Wands. During the Summer Solstice, we enjoy the most daylight of the calender year, and then the days begin to get darker and darker.

Michael is often associated with the element of Fire, and Lucifer the Air, yet Lucifer, viewed as Iblis, was created from Fire, and Michael from Light. Lucifer is known as the Light Bringer, which can be of significance to Spring or Summer... yet the suit of Swords seems for fitting of Michael (Michael is often depicted with a sword) and Wands seem more fitting of Lucifer (as a master of Sorcery). As Satan, Lucifer is obviously more relevant to Fire, and Michael, being of a Heavenly and Celestial nature, seems to be more relevant to Air.

Thus far I have attached Spring to Michael and Summer to Lucifer, but, because it can be argued that both are relevant to both seasons, I am contemplating a revision, and wish to see what others thought of the subject.

(I am aware that the words "Lucifer" and "Satan" do not mean the same thing, and despite some compelling similarities between the two archetypes, they needn't be viewed as One and the same. Feel free to allow your feelings on such to affect your judgement and reasoning behind your decision.)

Discuss as you Will...

(By the way...there is a Total Solar eclipse tomorrow and a Supermoon ^_^)

Neither. You should dedicate it to Ashe. Spring is definitely a woman.
 

emilynghiem

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I am more aligned with Asclepias.
Why not dedicate Spring to Mother Earth/Nature and all Mothers?
And Summer can be dedicated to all Daughters of the Earth. Why not call everyone out to join in celebrating?

As for Michael, this is used by Jehovah's Witnesses to represent God's judgment which Christians attribute to Jesus,
where JW claim that Michael and Jesus are one. (But I go with the interpretation of Michael as God's Mercy so this
is more on the level of the Holy Spirit, the third part of the Holy Trinity, where I believe the collective church body is female.)

Lucifer - Where did the Word come from and what is its True Meaning
I found this explanation that Lucifer as the morning star was falsely confused with Satan and the fallen angel story.

[I wish we could have a master list of all these symbols and names, agree what terms MEAN what concepts, and prevent from misapplying terms like "God/Christ" (that are supposed to refer to positive universal concepts) to complain about the opposite, destructive negative actions that are attributed or called "Antichrist."
Why can't we agree on the alignment of terms with meanings, throw a huge peace festival to celebrate "the alignment of all the stars and planets", and receive renewal together!]
 

Pogo

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Yeah, insofar as Lucifer means "bringer of light", seems to me he (I mean "it"-- what, do angels fuck?) belongs more with the Winter Solstice.
 
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Goddess_Ashtara

Goddess_Ashtara

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Neither. You should dedicate it to Ashe. Spring is definitely a woman.

Actually, in traditional witchcraft, Autumn/ Cups/ Water and Winter/ Pentacles/ Earth are predominantly considered feminine, whereas Spring/ Swords/ Air and Summer/ Staves/ Fire are considered predominantly masculine.

You say dedicate Spring to "Ashe". I did dedicate the Fall to the goddess Ishtar/ Astaroth/ Ashtoreth.

 

Pogo

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Neither. You should dedicate it to Ashe. Spring is definitely a woman.

Actually, in traditional witchcraft, Autumn/ Cups/ Water and Winter/ Pentacles/ Earth are predominantly considered feminine, whereas Spring/ Swords/ Air and Summer/ Staves/ Fire are considered predominantly masculine.

You say dedicate Spring to "Ashe". I did dedicate the Fall to the goddess Ishtar/ Astaroth/ Ashtoreth.

Yup. Astrology too.
 

Asclepias

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Neither. You should dedicate it to Ashe. Spring is definitely a woman.

Actually, in traditional witchcraft, Autumn/ Cups/ Water and Winter/ Pentacles/ Earth are predominantly considered feminine, whereas Spring/ Swords/ Air and Summer/ Staves/ Fire are considered predominantly masculine.

You say dedicate Spring to "Ashe". I did dedicate the Fall to the goddess Ishtar/ Astaroth/ Ashtoreth.

Totally missed that.
 
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Goddess_Ashtara

Goddess_Ashtara

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I am more aligned with Asclepias.
Why not dedicate Spring to Mother Earth/Nature and all Mothers?
And Summer can be dedicated to all Daughters of the Earth. Why not call everyone out to join in celebrating?

As for Michael, this is used by Jehovah's Witnesses to represent God's judgment which Christians attribute to Jesus,
where JW claim that Michael and Jesus are one. (But I go with the interpretation of Michael as God's Mercy so this
is more on the level of the Holy Spirit, the third part of the Holy Trinity, where I believe the collective church body is female.)

Lucifer - Where did the Word come from and what is its True Meaning
I found this explanation that Lucifer as the morning star was falsely confused with Satan and the fallen angel story.

[I wish we could have a master list of all these symbols and names, agree what terms MEAN what concepts, and prevent from misapplying terms like "God/Christ" (that are supposed to refer to positive universal concepts) to complain about the opposite, destructive negative actions that are attributed or called "Antichrist."
Why can't we agree on the alignment of terms with meanings, throw a huge peace festival to celebrate "the alignment of all the stars and planets", and receive renewal together!]

Emily... you seem to be under the false impression that this topic is about something other than my own personal Sumero-Abrahamic pantheon and how I wish to represent it in my art.

The point of this topic was to acquire opinions from people who, when given the choice between Lucifer and Michael, would associate one deific archetype with the Spring and the other with Summer, regardless if and how they believe in them or not... to potentially aid in the creative direction of some of my own current artistic projects. That is what this was about. Not mother goddesses and motherhood, or "daughters of the earth"... and most certainly not "peace festivals".

So please, if it is your Will, contribute in a way that is relevant to this topic. Tis an "either/or" question, with an optional "why". There is no "neither", because that does not aid in my artwork at all. If anything, allow yourself to subconsciously make a decision. At least that I can work with.
 
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emilynghiem

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I am more aligned with Asclepias.
Why not dedicate Spring to Mother Earth/Nature and all Mothers?
And Summer can be dedicated to all Daughters of the Earth. Why not call everyone out to join in celebrating?

As for Michael, this is used by Jehovah's Witnesses to represent God's judgment which Christians attribute to Jesus,
where JW claim that Michael and Jesus are one. (But I go with the interpretation of Michael as God's Mercy so this
is more on the level of the Holy Spirit, the third part of the Holy Trinity, where I believe the collective church body is female.)

Lucifer - Where did the Word come from and what is its True Meaning
I found this explanation that Lucifer as the morning star was falsely confused with Satan and the fallen angel story.

[I wish we could have a master list of all these symbols and names, agree what terms MEAN what concepts, and prevent from misapplying terms like "God/Christ" (that are supposed to refer to positive universal concepts) to complain about the opposite, destructive negative actions that are attributed or called "Antichrist."
Why can't we agree on the alignment of terms with meanings, throw a huge peace festival to celebrate "the alignment of all the stars and planets", and receive renewal together!]

Emily... you seem to be under the false impression that this topic is about something other than my own personal Sumero-Abrahamic pantheon and how I wish to represent it in my art.

The point of this topic was to acquire opinions from people who, when given the choice between Lucifer and Michael, would associate one deific archetype with the Spring and the other with Summer, regardless if and how they believe in them or not... to potentially aid in the creative direction of some of my own current artistic projects. That is what this was about. Not mother goddesses and motherhood, or "daughters of the earth"... and most certainly not "peace festivals".

So please, if it is your Will, contribute in a way that is relevant to this topic. Tis an "either/or" question, with an optional "why". There is no "neither", because that does not aid in my artwork at all. If anything, allow yourself to subconsciously make a decision. At least that I can work with.
OK so you are saying artistically you already set it up as those two choices?

I am guessing Lucifer goes with Summer
and Michael goes with Spring.

OK now that I understand your set up, I did go back and answer the poll. Do I win a cookie?
 
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Goddess_Ashtara

Goddess_Ashtara

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Not one other person has voted on this poll.

Wow.

 
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Goddess_Ashtara

Goddess_Ashtara

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OK so you are saying artistically you already set it up as those two choices?

I am guessing Lucifer goes with Summer
and Michael goes with Spring.

OK now that I understand your set up, I did go back and answer the poll. Do I win a cookie?



 

Disir

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Ok, I have entered a level of boredom that I haven't reached in quite awhile.

Your Lucifer should be associated with swords. I dislike the seasons as laid out by the Judeo-Christian tradition.

Swords=winter.

In the Judeo part of Judeo-Christian, your Lucifer or Satan is simply the accuser and an illusion. The swords cut through illusion. Following the elements it is wands, cups, swords, and pentacles.

Wands are the creative force, the energy. I have a great idea to......
Cups are the emotional element, the passion, emotional extremes. We could do this and this and this and I can have it all.
Swords cut through the shit, stumbling blocks, limitations and challenges. Hmmm.........no I can't do this, this and this but I can do this right here. Your Lucifer or Satan belongs here. If that is your spring so be it.
Pentacles, earth or the physical realm is the actual end result of the initial creative force.
 
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Pogo

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Not one other person has voted on this poll.

Wow.

I toldja, I can't vote without a "NOTA" choice. :eusa_snooty:


OK so you are saying artistically you already set it up as those two choices?

I am guessing Lucifer goes with Summer
and Michael goes with Spring.

OK now that I understand your set up, I did go back and answer the poll. Do I win a cookie?
Nobody said anything about cookies. If cookies await, my vote is most definitely for sale.
Especially if they're shortbread. With a hint of anise. :eusa_shifty:
 
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Pogo

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Ok, I have entered a level of boredom that I haven't reached in quite awhile.

Your Lucifer should be associated with swords. I dislike the seasons as laid out by the Judeo-Christian tradition.

Swords=winter.

In the Judeo part of Judeo-Christian, your Lucifer or Satan is simply the accuser and an illusion. The swords cut through illusion. Following the elements it is wands, cups, swords, and pentacles.

Wands are the creative force, the energy. I have a great idea to......
Cups are the emotional element, the passion, emotional extremes. We could do this and this and this and I can have it all.
Swords cut through the shit, stumbling blocks, limitations and challenges. Hmmm.........no I can't do this, this and this but I can do this right here. Your Lucifer or Satan belongs here. If that is your spring so be it.
Pentacles, earth or the physical realm is the actual end result of the initial creative force.
The "rock-paper-scissors" school of Tarot?
 

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