US submarine hits underwater object in South China Sea

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Was this instance a seamount? I'd so, why didn't they know about it? It's not like the PRC being in the South China Sea is a brand new surprise. They've been at for years.

You have to have detailed charts in order to "see" the bottom of the ocean and sometimes they miss things or never surveyed exactly where it was.

 

[Rogue AI]

You have to have detailed charts in order to "see" the bottom of the ocean and sometimes they miss things or never surveyed exactly where it was.

That seems like a problem that should have been solved decades ago. It's not like we didn't see the South China Sea as a potential hot spot. Such an obvious and destructive failure is unacceptable. The technology to accurately map the sea floor has been around long enough. We can hardly be covert if we crash our subs and have to surface.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That seems like a problem that should have been solved decades ago. It's not like we didn't see the South China Sea as a potential hot spot. Such an obvious and destructive failure is unacceptable. The technology to accurately map the sea floor has been around long enough. We can hardly be covert if we crash our subs and have to surface.

What problem? Do you know how little of the sea floor has been mapped? Only 20%!

 

[Rogue AI]

What problem? Do you know how little of the sea floor has been mapped? Only 20%!

Yep, and we have the technology to do better. I expect when we know of a potential military hot spot we would take the necessary precautions to protect our military assets. This failure is just one more mark against our military leadership. There are no excuses at this point.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Yep, and we have the technology to do better. I expect when we know of a potential military hot spot we would take the necessary precautions to protect our military assets. This failure is just one more mark against our military leadership. There are no excuses at this point.

We do? The ocean is like one big bathtub with an occasionally rough bottom.

Just the South China Sea is over 1.351 million square miles. Stick to a topic you know before making wild-assed assertions.

 

[Rogue AI]

We do? The ocean is like one big bathtub with an occasionally rough bottom.

Just the South China Sea is over 1.351 million square miles. Stick to a topic you know before making wild-assed assertions.

How was the 20% that is mapped done? Are you saying we don't have the technology to do it? BS. Hitting a stationary object is not an acceptable outcome in an area we know to be a hot spot. It is hardly a wild assed assertion to have expectations our military would adequately prepare in a manner that would not put our multi-million dollar equipment at risk. Your penchant for excuses matches our military leadership, nothing is solved that way. Pathetic.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

The solution to China is the U.S. getting its boot off of Japan and letting Bushido flourish.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

How was the 20% that is mapped done? Are you saying we don't have the technology to do it? BS. Hitting a stationary object is not an acceptable outcome in an area we know to be a hot spot. It is hardly a wild assed assertion to have expectations our military would adequately prepare in a manner that would not put our multi-million dollar equipment at risk. Your penchant for excuses matches our military leadership, nothing is solved that way. Pathetic.

The mapping is done using sonar, and the US Navy has specific ships operated by a civilian crew with Navy personnel attached.

The question I have for you is where do they start the mapping? You can't do the mapping, update the charts, and provide the information to the submarine very quickly. Also how do you know they are mapping the correct part of that 1.351 million square miles?

Our military leadership has nothing to do with this issue. Respectfully, you need to get off your know-nothing high horse.

I was a qualified submariner (enlisted) and Surface Warfare officer, whose first assignment included the additional duty as an anti-submarine warfare evaluator, meaning myself and the ASW Officer were the prime officers assigned to prosecute submarine targets. He would stand watch for 12 hours and then I would take over for the next 12 hours. We conducted all of the ship's movements and weapon's systems from deep inside the ship, not from the bridge.

I know what I am talking about.

 

[Rogue AI]

The mapping is done using sonar, and the US Navy has specific ships operated by a civilian crew with Navy personnel attached.

The question I have for you is where do they start the mapping? You can't do the mapping, update the charts, and provide the information to the submarine very quickly. Also how do you know they are mapping the correct part of that 1.351 million square miles?

Our military leadership has nothing to do with this issue. Respectfully, you need to get off your know-nothing high horse.

I was a qualified submariner (enlisted) and Surface Warfare officer, whose first assignment included the additional duty as an anti-submarine warfare evaluator, meaning myself and the ASW Officer were the prime officers assigned to prosecute submarine targets. He would stand watch for 12 hours and then I would take over for the next 12 hours. We conducted all of the ship's movements and weapon's systems from deep inside the ship, not from the bridge.

I know what I am talking about.

They should have started years ago, before China actually had a permanent presence and started making artificial islands. Whining about how hard something is won't fix it. Making endless excuses don't get results. Spare me your holier than thou bullshit.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

They should have started years ago, before China actually had a permanent presence and started making artificial islands. Whining about how hard something is won't fix it. Making endless excuses don't get results. Spare me your holier than thou bullshit.

Who appointed you God and allowed you to change the laws of physics and the sheer size of our planet. Yet, you couldn't answer my simple question: Where do you start?

You are the one with a holier than though attitude.

 

[Rogue AI]

Who appointed you God and allowed you to change the laws of physics and the sheer size of our planet. Yet, you couldn't answer my simple question: Where do you start?

You are the one with a holier than though attitude.

Change the laws of physics? What sort of nonsense is that? You admitted we have mapped 20% of the ocean floor, now you claim it would be against the laws of physics? Wow.

Sadly, it's a little late to start now, and that is the failure. You excuse the failure because it would be hard. Excusing failure only breeds more.

I hardly have a holier than thou attitude, I simply have expectations. Too bad our so-called leadership does not.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Change the laws of physics? What sort of nonsense is that? You admitted we have mapped 20% of the ocean floor, now you claim it would be against the laws of physics? Wow.

Sadly, it's a little late to start now, and that is the failure. You excuse the failure because it would be hard. Excusing failure only breeds more.

I hardly have a holier than thou attitude, I simply have expectations. Too bad our so-called leadership does not.

The speed and distance that sound travels through water are physics. Y0u said we had the technology to do this easily, so which is it? Do you admit you have no clue as to our technology of the physics which limits it?

How many submarines have collided with undersea objects, assuming this later one qualifies as such? How many billions of dollars do you want to expend to prevent a few accidents that may occur in decades?

I found this article you should read.

Why Multi-Billion Dollar Nuclear Submarines Still Run Into Things Underwater

A veteran submariner explains the challenges crews face navigating complex undersea environments that they can't even see.

www.thedrive.com

After reading that, you should know that everything I have told you is true.

 

[Captain Caveman]

I wonder if they bumped into Bin Laden's coffin?

 

[WinterBorn]

Normally I wade into any conversations involving the US Submarine Force. But the Admiral has it handled.

As for a comprehensive mapping of the world's oceans, it would be a monumental task. Technology? Yes, we have it. But the ocean floor is dynamic, not static. By the time we finished mapping the other 80% of the oceans, they would have changed enough to make the maps largely worthless. Especially considering how rare these collisions are.

 

[Rogue AI]

The speed and distance that sound travels through water are physics. Y0u said we had the technology to do this easily, so which is it? Do you admit you have no clue as to our technology of the physics which limits it?

How many submarines have collided with undersea objects, assuming this later one qualifies as such? How many billions of dollars do you want to expend to prevent a few accidents that may occur in decades?

I found this article you should read.

Why Multi-Billion Dollar Nuclear Submarines Still Run Into Things Underwater

A veteran submariner explains the challenges crews face navigating complex undersea environments that they can't even see.

www.thedrive.com

After reading that, you should know that everything I have told you is true.

There are multiple options, especially with the advances in unmanned underwater robotics. To pretend we are limited to whatever narrow specifications you set is ridiculous. Just keep excusing failure, no doubt we'll continue to see it.

It is more than preventing accidents. Fortunately in this instance the US was not conducting a wartime mission. Being reckless and stupid with our first strike equipment is really not a good strategy. If what you say is true is hardly relevant if the results end in failure and embarrassment for the country. We need better solutions, and that doesn't happen if we keep allowing BS excuses.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

There are multiple options, especially with the advances in unmanned underwater robotics. To pretend we are limited to whatever narrow specifications you set is ridiculous. Just keep excusing failure, no doubt we'll continue to see it.

It is more than preventing accidents. Fortunately in this instance the US was not conducting a wartime mission. Being reckless and stupid with our first strike equipment is really not a good strategy. If what you say is true is hardly relevant if the results end in failure and embarrassment for the country. We need better solutions, and that doesn't happen if we keep allowing BS excuses.

Are you familiar with the helicopter crash off San Diego on August 31st, 2021?

Did you know they just recovered the remains of the crew and they knew where the helicopter went down? Why did it take so long?

Answer: The water was about a mile deep!

You obviously did not read the article I provided. Why is that? Do you a reading problem and could not find a child to read it to you?

 

[WinterBorn]

There are multiple options, especially with the advances in unmanned underwater robotics. To pretend we are limited to whatever narrow specifications you set is ridiculous. Just keep excusing failure, no doubt we'll continue to see it.

It is more than preventing accidents. Fortunately in this instance the US was not conducting a wartime mission. Being reckless and stupid with our first strike equipment is really not a good strategy. If what you say is true is hardly relevant if the results end in failure and embarrassment for the country. We need better solutions, and that doesn't happen if we keep allowing BS excuses.

Every military operation has cost/value evaluations. The cost of mapping the entire ocean floor would be astronomical. And the value would be limited.

 

[Rogue AI]

Are you familiar with the helicopter crash off San Diego on August 31st, 2021?

Did you know they just recovered the remains of the crew and they knew where the helicopter went down? Why did it take so long?

Answer: The water was about a mile deep!

You obviously did not read the article I provided. Why is that? Do you a reading problem and could not find a child to read it to you?

I understand that the oceans are deep, what does that have to doing the job right? Again, you are whining that because it's hard, we shouldn't do it. How sad. That sort of wussy thinking will set us back decades, when we need to moving forward to keep ahead of our enemies.

If I read your little article I'll do it on my time, not your command.

 

[WinterBorn]

I understand that the oceans are deep, what does that have to doing the job right? Again, you are whining that because it's hard, we shouldn't do it. How sad. That sort of wussy thinking will set us back decades, when we need to moving forward to keep ahead of our enemies.

If I read your little article I'll do it on my time, not your command.

The US started really using subs in WWI. It was a small fleet, but effective.

In that 100 years, can you tell me how many time a US submarine has hit an underwater object that comprehensive mapping would have prevented?

It sounds like you have a great, albeit expensive, solution for a problem that does not really exist.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Why not flood the zone with things that looks like sub to enemy sonar and ping away for accurate readings to be relayed to the actual nearby, but not too, boomer?