Thomas Paine Father of American Democracy?

[Dante]

It's an interesting question. Did he bring us the democratic notion of citizens who don't own property having the vote and being able to hold political office?

Did he really deserve to be treated the way he was on news of his death?

How much were some of his earlier views in sync with those of Jefferson?

Thomas Paine - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[whitehall]

Paine was a British subject and may have been a pirate in his early years. He later lived in France and became friends with Benjamin Franklin. He was only in the American colonies for about two years before the American Revolution. There is no evidence that he was involved in the Declaration of Independence but his revolutionary pamphlets might have given Jefferson and others some ideas.

 

[BackAgain]

Thankfully, we don’t have a “democracy.”

 

[DudleySmith]

He wasn't a Founder, just Franklin's secretary and a pamphleteer. He was never elected to anything and was promptly forgotten after the war was over. The only reason he is constantly brought up is because he was an atheist, and a lot of faggots hope to make him a big giant leader of the Revolution n stuff. Never mind almost all the Founders were Christians, including Jefferson and Franklin, and none would allow faggots to groom kids in schools back then either.

 

[whitehall]

Paine's history indicates that he didn't get along well with others. He was fired from a bureaucratic job in England. The French Revolution might have been his passion when he met Benjamin Franklin and he ended up in the Colonies at the right time in history. Apparently he was a gifted writer but he was fired from another bureaucrat job by the newly formed Colonial government.

 

[Dante]

Paine was a British subject and may have been a pirate in his early years. He later lived in France and became friends with Benjamin Franklin. He was only in the American colonies for about two years before the American Revolution. There is no evidence that he was involved in the Declaration of Independence but his revolutionary pamphlets might have given Jefferson and others some ideas.

None of Paine's arguments in Common Sense were new. He led the charge for democracy in the new nation. He was a popular/direct democracy kinda guy.


He took a citizen oath after he got on North American soil.

Like Trump he was nasty, turning on everybody as time went on.


Paine became notorious because of his pamphlets and attacks on his former allies, who he felt had betrayed him. In The Age of Reason and other writings, he advocated Deism, promoted reason and freethought, and argued against religion in general and Christian doctrine in particular.[9][10][11][12] In 1796, he published a bitter open letter to George Washington, whom he denounced as an incompetent general and a hypocrite. He published the pamphlet Agrarian Justice (1797), discussing the origins of property and introducing the concept of a guaranteed minimum income through a one-time inheritance tax on landowners. In 1802, he returned to the U.S. He died on June 8, 1809. Only six people attended his funeral, as he had been ostracized for his ridicule of Christianity[13] and his attacks on the nation's leaders.

 

[Dante]

Thankfully, we don’t have a “democracy.”

We have a democratic republic.

What do you think changing who has the franchise and who serves in office is all about? And Liddle did Jefferson know, his words (55) in the declaration spurned more democratic principles in realities.

Do you ever read history after graduating high school back in the last century?

 

[Dante]

He wasn't a Founder, just Franklin's secretary and a pamphleteer. He was never elected to anything and was promptly forgotten after the war was over. The only reason he is constantly brought up is because he was an atheist, and a lot of faggots hope to make him a big giant leader of the Revolution n stuff. Never mind almost all the Founders were Christians, including Jefferson and Franklin, and none would allow faggots to groom kids in schools back then either.

I am no fan on Paine, but to state his is not considered a founder?



What the heck?

 

[Dante]

Paine's history indicates that he didn't get along well with others.

Like Trump?

 

[Dante]

Paine's history indicates that he didn't get along well with others. He was fired from a bureaucratic job in England. The French Revolution might have been his passion when he met Benjamin Franklin and he ended up in the Colonies at the right time in history. Apparently he was a gifted writer but he was fired from another bureaucrat job by the newly formed Colonial government.

Paine and Jefferson were huge fans of the brutal and vicious shit happening in France (Jefferson who later tied hiding shit on this) .

You have described Paine's career in a nutshell.

 

[BackAgain]

We have a democratic republic

No we don’t. We have Constitutional republic. Huge difference.

What do you think changing who has the franchise and who serves in office is all about? And Liddle did Jefferson know, his words (55) in the declaration spurned more democratic principles in realities.

Yiur question presupposes that you have any clue what your words mean. They don’t. In a democracy, the people rule via the majority. So if a majority decide that you libturds should all be shipped to the South Pole, off you go. That cannot be done in a Constitutional republic where our sovereignty is explicitly and purposefully limited to avoid such tyranny.

Do you ever read history after graduating high school back in the last century?

It is clear that you never understood a damn thing about what you read in history government or civics classes.

 

[BackAgain]

Like Trump?

Like you.

 

[whitehall]

None of Paine's arguments in Common Sense were new. He led the charge for democracy in the new nation. He was a popular/direct democracy kinda guy.


He took a citizen oath after he got on North American soil.

Like Trump he was nasty, turning on everybody as time went on.


Paine became notorious because of his pamphlets and attacks on his former allies, who he felt had betrayed him. In The Age of Reason and other writings, he advocated Deism, promoted reason and freethought, and argued against religion in general and Christian doctrine in particular.[9][10][11][12] In 1796, he published a bitter open letter to George Washington, whom he denounced as an incompetent general and a hypocrite. He published the pamphlet Agrarian Justice (1797), discussing the origins of property and introducing the concept of a guaranteed minimum income through a one-time inheritance tax on landowners. In 1802, he returned to the U.S. He died on June 8, 1809. Only six people attended his funeral, as he had been ostracized for his ridicule of Christianity[13] and his attacks on the nation's leaders.

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Maybe you have a skewed opinion of history based on hatred for a modern politician. Paine was in bad shape when he arrived in the Colonies and would have died if Franklin's surgeon didn't rescue him from a ship that was infested with typhoid. He recovered and wrote some provocative pamphlets that the revolutionary colonists liked. Fair enough but fast forward to the late 20th century when an entrepreneur named Trump risked capital and created jobs and rebuilt the declining city of NY. Why do lefties hate him so much?

 

[Dante]

Maybe you have a skewed opinion of history based on hatred for a modern politician. Paine was in bad shape when he arrived in the Colonies and would have died if Franklin's surgeon didn't rescue him from a ship that was infested with typhoid. He recovered and wrote some provocative pamphlets that the revolutionary colonists liked. Fair enough but fast forward to the late 20th century when an entrepreneur named Trump risked capital and created jobs and rebuilt the declining city of NY. Why do lefties hate him so much?

Enough with the Junior High School civics lessons.

I complimented you on a good synopsis on Paine.

entrepreneur named Trump is a trust fund baby, who failed in many endeavors,, was bailed out by daddy time and time again, became The King of Debt (his own words) and lucked out with a tv show. Born on third base, he believes he's struggled LOL

 

[DudleySmith]

I am no fan on Paine, but to state his is not considered a founder?



What the heck?

Well, some idiots will claim anything, like you, for instance. He was a not a Founder, he was a pamphleteer, and there is nothing you can do about it except whine.

 

[ESay]

Yiur question presupposes that you have any clue what your words mean. They don’t. In a democracy, the people rule via the majority. So if a majority decide that you libturds should all be shipped to the South Pole, off you go. That cannot be done in a Constitutional republic where our sovereignty is explicitly and purposefully limited to avoid such tyranny

If the Congress passes such bill, then why not?

 

[DudleySmith]

Founders are the people who signed the Declaration of Independence and members elected to the first Continental Congress. Others with a more liberal outlook include the delegates to the Convention of 1787 that framed the Constitution as well. No one else counts as a Founder, no matter how popular they are with modern spin doctors.

Others are even more restrictive, citing only 7 Founders: Washington Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, Hamilton, Jay, and Madison.

Being a liberal, I go with the !st Continental Congress and the 1787 Convention both being included, at least re our modern state, until it was overturned and destroyed by Lincoln and the northeastern bankers and industrialists and became a welfare state for robber barons.

 

[BackAgain]

If the Congress passes such bill, then why not?

Wow. Why not? The word is “unconstitutional.” Now, there are two ways the constitution can be amended. But a simple majority vote by Congress isn’t one of them.

 

[ESay]

Wow. Why not? The word is “unconstitutional.” Now, there are two ways the constitution can be amended. But a simple majority vote by Congress isn’t one of them.

Of course isn't. Usually, constitutional changes is a legally difficult and lengthy process. The US is not unique in this.

 

[whitehall]

Enough with the Junior High School civics lessons.

I complimented you on a good synopsis on Paine.

entrepreneur named Trump is a trust fund baby, who failed in many endeavors,, was bailed out by daddy time and time again, became The King of Debt (his own words) and lucked out with a tv show. Born on third base, he believes he's struggled LOL

I didn't bring up Trump, you did. You have to be afflicted with TDS to reach back in time and try to compare Payne to Trump. It just doesn't work. There was a time when Jr. High history lessons included U.S. history but that's all gone now