This should be a bipartisan issue. It should be illegal for airlines to overbook
- Thread starter ColonelAngus
- Start date
I agree with your post except for the guy leaving peacefully and the "United is Asiaphobic" line.
I'm glad he refused to leave because it brought to light a very serious issue. Of course I hated to see him get hurt. I always knew airlines overbooked, but they are usually resolved with extra tickets, etc.
Also, I really wish some people would not make this a race thing. It really isn't . Making it about race takes the spotlight away from the real issue of airlines overbooking and then treating it's paying customers badly. The race angle makes it to easy for airlines to explain the bad overbooking practice.
In any event, this is a bipartisan issue and has nothing at all to do with race, politics, etc. There needs to be a resolution to this bump policy. I've never had it happen to me but I've stood next to plenty of people at the terminal who did get bumped - some by choice and some almost in a panic.
PredFan
Diamond Member
How long before people who buy something they don't have start going elsewhere? Not very long at all. The free market is the way to go. Take this United story for instance, you think this won't have an impact on their market share?
JoeMoma
Platinum Member
- Nov 22, 2014
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Good point. If overbooking goes away, then refunds would most likely go away. If you want a seat held for you, then pay for it. If you don't show up, that's the buyer's fault.
jc456
Diamond Member
- Dec 18, 2013
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well the facts are that when you purchase a ticket you agree with the airlines rules. It's a legal document. that passenger refusing to leave is in violation of the ticket he purchased. The airline is wrong with how they did what the did and the cop was in a no win situation. But I still would press charges against the man for failure to comply with the purchased ticket.
Anathema
Crotchety Olde Man
Example try. They overbook to ensure a full plane as often as possible, to maximize profits.
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
While it's convenient to think of what airlines sell as a product, the fact is that they don't sell a product; they sell a service -- transportation. "Seats" serve as a surrogate for what they sell, and in the vast majority of instances its perfectly fine to consider what airlines sell as a product. As goes overbooking, its challenges and the possible ways to overcome them present one instance in which the distinction between products and services becomes manifest.
Failing to discover and resolve the service availability conflict before boarding started is the mistake that United made.
I'm not following that story closely, but I seem to recall that the other individual needing to fly on the plane was a United employee. I would not be surprised to find that the employee was essential for the operation of another flight somewhere, for that would explain why United was willing to give up the revenue associated with the man who was removed from the plane. I'm just speculating in that regard; it could be something else that motivated the airline to forgo the man's fare.
??? What? Are you aware that airlines, economically speaking, among businesses that routinely sell a fundamentally -- and economically speaking -- commoditized "product" at well advertised prices, the closest thing to a perfect monopolist?
Put another way for those who aren't economics savvy [1], airlines are among the most effective/efficient profit maximizers in the realm of perfect and monopolistic competitors because they can and do sell their service -- transportation from point A to B -- at such a wide range of prices. What that means is that they are able to collect revenue from (sell tickets at prices acceptable to) the guy who is only willing to pay $100 for it and from the guy who'll pay thousands for the very same service. That is how a perfect monopolist maximizes revenue. [2]
(Yes, though there are not a lot of folks who can buy the $100 -- or less -- ticket, and though there are only a few folks who willfully pay full fare for their tickets, there are people in both groups on every flight.)
Refundable fares are not going anywhere. Within a given class of service, refundable fares (Y-class, A-class, B-Class, etc.) are the highest sums one can pay for a plane ticket. What on Earth makes you think airlines will dispense with them?
Note:
- Click here to see the "math" that makes that so. Careful analysis of that math will make it clear why, in practice, profit maximizing perfect monopolists will sell their "goods" at a wide range of prices. Common sense, even if one doesn't care to "get" the "math" of economics, tells one that among the several market exchage structures, the unfettered monopolist is able to earn the greatest profitability. Awareness of that fact is why so many businesses operate, to as great a degree as they can, as monopolistic competitors rather than as perfect competitors. What makes that possible? Branding.
- In the U.S. one doesn't get to actually observe the price maximizing behavior of perfect monopolists because (1) for industries/"products" that aren't most efficiently delivered under the model of natural monopoly, monopolies are not permitted to exist, and (2) where a natural monopoly is allowed to exist, it's regulated so as to prevent the supplier from acting as a profit maximizing perfect monopolist.
usmbguest5318
Gold Member
It's neither partisan nor bipartisan. It's not a political issue. It's an economic and business issue. One, perhaps many, may want to make it a political issue, for doing so allows one, to whatever degree it suits one to do so, to ignore the empirical imperatives of the matter and instead cast and discuss it as an ethical one.
JimBowie1958
Old Fogey
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And how many innocent people have to die from bad drugs, bad business practices, doctors unable to get to their patients, highway wrecks, etc because we have stupidly decided that 'free market' = 'corrupt chaotic market'?
The two are not the same. a truly free market is a market that is well regulated and validated to not be rigged, criminal, or lethal to its customers.
Yeah, but too late if he had a critical medical treatment for his patient, or any number of other things.
How many innocent deaths are an acceptable loss each year for your version of a free market?
ColonelAngus
Diamond Member
- Feb 25, 2015
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- Thread starter
- #50
If you see where this is going, you must have read my post about DOT and Airlines bumping passengers. That's the real crux of the issue.
PredFan
Diamond Member
Who has the free market killed?
Answer: no one.
And I never said no regulations, I said we don't need more regulations.
JoeMoma
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"Too Many Regulations" can become almost impossible to follow and almost impossible to enforce. They can be used as a weapon to prevent a new business from entering an established market.
ColonelAngus
Diamond Member
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- #53
Not selling the same product to 2 people at the same time shouldn't have to be a regulation.
Does 7-11 sell the same piece of gum to 2 people and then rip it out of one person's mouth after they started chewing it?
Does 7-11 sell the same piece of gum to 2 people and then rip it out of one person's mouth after they started chewing it?
NYcarbineer
Diamond Member
The airlines are shit, run by shits, but,
if they stop overbooking then it is fair for them to sell you only non-refundable tickets.
They should sell tickets first come, first served, and when they get into overbook status, they should inform the ticket buyer that they are in line to be bumped if every person who bought tickets ahead of them shows up.
if they stop overbooking then it is fair for them to sell you only non-refundable tickets.
They should sell tickets first come, first served, and when they get into overbook status, they should inform the ticket buyer that they are in line to be bumped if every person who bought tickets ahead of them shows up.
danielpalos
Diamond Member
- Banned
- #55
I make a motion to end the limits on compensation under our form of Capitalism. Airlines over book for the bottom line; any inconvenience to passengers is the fault of the Airlines.
ColonelAngus
Diamond Member
- Feb 25, 2015
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- #56
Assaulting and dragging an Asian medical doctor off a flight he paid for is BAD FORM for United.
If the guy was any sort of brown, the snowflakes would be apoplectic...but he's yellow...so it's ok.
If the guy was any sort of brown, the snowflakes would be apoplectic...but he's yellow...so it's ok.
danielpalos
Diamond Member
- Banned
- #57
There should be no recourse, to Force Majeure for the private sector, but for actual emergencies.
Capital should work fine in the public sector in public accommodation.
There should be no limits on compensation due to airlines routinely overbooking, simply for the bottom line.
Capital should work fine in the public sector in public accommodation.
There should be no limits on compensation due to airlines routinely overbooking, simply for the bottom line.
Seawytch
Information isnt Advocacy
You're kidding, right?
Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire - Facts & Summary - HISTORY.com
And to say we don't need more is to deny an ever changing landscape as well as scientific discoveries.
percysunshine
Diamond Member
If you pay for the service, you should get the service.
One should not have to get off an airplane because the AIRLINE sold your seat twice.
UTTER NONSENSE!
THE GUY SHOULD HAVE LEFT PEACEFULLY, but overbooking is bullshit.
United is Asiaphobic.
United Struggles to Extinguish Social Media Firestorm
Video shows man getting dragged off overbooked United flight
Sooo..if I book a seat on a flight, but do not show up at the gate, the airline should hire bounty hunters, track me down, and drag me onto the plane....
I do not see this ending well.
Iceweasel
Diamond Member
The same people that ***** about over booking will scream bloody murder if the ticket price goes up.
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