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I would readily grant you that point, and I'm hoping that Rumpole will too.This means that access to guns does not create gun crime........
Your strawman aside,
Every basket has a few rotten apples. Every group has a few nattering naysayers of negativity, and lo, here we are as the pithy aphorisms manifest in this very forum.
The notion that gun regulation does not work is as preposterous as it is unfounded. Observe, if you will, our peers (the first world USA western aligned countries) across the pond in the United Kingdom, Australia, and Japan, whose stringent firearm regulations have engendered a drastic reduction in gun-related deaths and crimes. To contend that regulation is futile is to dismiss, with casual disregard, the resounding evidence before us. Permit me to assert, with no small measure of conviction, that the myth of regulation's inefficacy is naught but a desperate attempt to cling to a dated and dangerous narrative.
Of course, it would be simplistic to point to numbers alone, as, in my view, the proliferation is due to the NRA's vast propaganda machine which perpetuates and foments the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that exists in America. That, is the problem.
Your strawman aside,
Every basket has a few rotten apples. Every group has a few nattering naysayers of negativity, and lo, here we are as the pithy aphorisms manifest in this very forum.
The notion that gun regulation does not work is as preposterous as it is unfounded. Observe, if you will, our peers (the first world USA western aligned countries) across the pond in the United Kingdom, Australia, and Japan, whose stringent firearm regulations have engendered a drastic reduction in gun-related deaths and crimes. To contend that regulation is futile is to dismiss, with casual disregard, the resounding evidence before us. Permit me to assert, with no small measure of conviction, that the myth of regulation's inefficacy is naught but a desperate attempt to cling to a dated and dangerous narrative.
Of course, it would be simplistic to point to numbers alone, as, in my view, the proliferation is due to the NRA's vast propaganda machine which perpetuates and foments the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that exists in America. That, is the problem.
Your strawman aside,
Every basket has a few rotten apples. Every group has a few nattering naysayers of negativity, and lo, here we are as the pithy aphorisms manifest in this very forum.
The notion that gun regulation does not work is as preposterous as it is unfounded. Observe, if you will, our peers (the first world USA western aligned countries) across the pond in the United Kingdom, Australia, and Japan, whose stringent firearm regulations have engendered a drastic reduction in gun-related deaths and crimes. To contend that regulation is futile is to dismiss, with casual disregard, the resounding evidence before us. Permit me to assert, with no small measure of conviction, that the myth of regulation's inefficacy is naught but a desperate attempt to cling to a dated and dangerous narrative.
Of course, it would be simplistic to point to numbers alone, as, in my view, the proliferation is due to the NRA's vast propaganda machine which perpetuates and foments the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that exists in America. That, is the problem.
Well stated! You're slowly bringing the whole thing together in a way that can make sense.Of course, it would be simplistic to point to numbers alone, as, in my view, the proliferation is due to the NRA's vast propaganda machine which perpetuates and foments the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that exists in America. That, is the problem.
Naysayers and gun worshippers say 'do nothing'.
Democrats, moderates and sensible republicans say 'do something'.
I see no compelling reason for the former, but solid reasoning for the latter, given that......
America has more gun related deaths and injury per capita than other nations,
and America has more guns per capita than other other nations, and despite anemic
hollers that 'correlation is not causation', for which the correct reply is, there is causation
when the volume of statistics is so great that it overwhelmingly points to one, irrefutable inescapable conclusion,
not to mention that gun related deaths are the number one killer of children as of 2020 and that correlates to the proliferation
of guns via the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that is spreading like a malignant cancer by the likes of the NRA and
MAGA movements. This idea that MAGA republicans are 'pro life' is a delusion. Ban abortion, deaths of the female poor go up, proliferate guns, and more children die. As for MAGA republicans and gun worshippers, one can only conclude, they are pro death.
As Adam Winkler wrote in his book, 'Gunfight, the battle over the right to bear arms in America', wrote:
View attachment 774841
His work has frequently been cited in judicial opinions, including in Supreme Court cases pertaining to the First and Second Amendments
I realize this proposal is stirring up a proverbial hornet's nest, and the idea has about as much of a chance as catching a cloud with a fishnet. Nevertheless, I believe it is time to at least start the conversation. Think of this conversation as planting a seed. There is an old saying: "There is no idea like one whose time has come." I think this idea is just that – an idea whose time has come. And that idea is to amend the Second Amendment.
It is indeed a pressing concern to address the issue of gun violence in the United States, particularly when it comes to school shootings. While the Second Amendment guarantees the right to bear arms, the changing landscape of American society has led to calls for re-evaluating and amending this constitutional provision. The proposed "2A v.2" offers a nuanced approach to addressing this issue, allowing states to regulate guns as they see fit while still preserving the right to own firearms for specific purposes.
First, it is crucial to acknowledge that the context in which the Second Amendment was written has evolved significantly. The original intent of the framers was to ensure the ability of citizens to form a well-regulated militia, as a check against potential tyranny. However, as former Supreme Court justice John Paul Stevens pointed out, the National Guard now serves the purpose of a militia, making the original rationale for the Second Amendment less applicable to modern society.
Second, the proposed "2A v.2" amendment balances the need for individual rights with public safety. It respects the right to own single-shot bolt action rifles for hunting, self-defense, and sustenance purposes, as well as the right to own handguns at the state level. These provisions acknowledge the cultural and historical significance of gun ownership in America, while providing a framework for states to enact regulations that reflect the values and needs of their citizens.
Third, by allowing cities the right to ban handguns, the proposed amendment recognizes the unique challenges urban areas face when it comes to gun violence. The density and diversity of city populations can contribute to higher rates of crime, and localized handgun bans may be an effective way to address this issue. This proposal also respects the principle of local control, empowering cities to implement solutions tailored to their specific circumstances. Note that in the old west, many small towns required residents, when entering the town's borders, to turn in their guns to the local sheriff's office, yet no one complained about the second amendment. Since the NRA has become such a central force in opposing any regulation of arms, which, in my view, their efforts make it difficult for states and municipalities to regulate arms as the see fit, as they see are needed for their state's circumstances, circumstances with vary, not only from state to state, but from region to region, I feel this is an idea whose time has come.
Finally, the proposed "2A v.2" amendment maintains the spirit of the Second Amendment while adapting it to address the modern reality of gun violence. It offers a flexible framework for states and cities to develop regulations that protect public safety without infringing on individual rights. By updating the Second Amendment in this way, the United States can work towards reducing the devastating impact of gun violence while still respecting the constitutional rights of its citizens.
Also note that since I am not an expert on rifles, my view on single-shot bolt action versus semi automatic rifles is not solidified in my proposal, and I remain open to arguments presented by experts on their reasoning for continuing to allow for semi-automatic rifles. Also note that the amendment allows states to allow for semi-automatics--remember, a constitutional amendment is not a ban whatsoever, it is just being amended to allow states more freedom to regulate without interference from, what I personally view as, second amendment radical groups such as the NRA. Obviously, the NRA and it's hard core believers will oppose this idea, and I expect that.
What argument I reject is the one that goes; "if you ban guns only criminals will have guns". I reject it given that since the stern regulation, the hurdles placed on the path to owning a fully automatic machine gun have vastly reduced crimes for that particular weapon, there are very view crimes committed with them. Remember, 'I am not an expert" and if my reasoning is faulty, I invite your arguments to the contrary, and, of course, that goes for this entire proposal. The details, I'm asserting, are subject to negotiation, but I do feel the time has come for an amendment to the second amendment, one that will allow states and cities more freedom to regulate arms as they see fit, for the needs or their states and municipalities.
In conclusion, although the idea of amending the Second Amendment may seem like a difficult conversation to initiate, it is essential to plant the seed of change in order to address the pressing issue of gun violence in the United States. The "2A v.2" proposal offers a balanced and nuanced approach that respects individual rights, public safety, and local control. By engaging in this conversation, we can explore potential solutions and work towards creating a safer society for all.
*So, ladies and gentlemen, "fire away" (with your affirmations, discussions, and debate/counter arguments. Sorry, I couldn't resist the pun).
Humbly tendered,
Rumpole
***************************************************************Caveat: rude comments, "TLDL" comments, snarky and lazy retorts, disingenuous comments, ad nauseum, will be ignored.
Sorry Bob but I'm only interested in preventing a woman's need for an abortion in Canada.Theleftwrong, of course, is all in on abortion, whereby more innocent human beings are savagely murdered, by several orders of magnitude, than die in any way having anything at all to do with firearms. By supporting this savage practice, theleftwrong prove that they are flat-out lying when they express any concern at all for any value of human life. They are an ideology of evil, madness, and death.
Clearly, you didn't read the OP. No mention of a federal or a state ban on guns.Bub...when the guns go...all is lost.
Without guns, clan 13 will drive from house to house to rape and pillage.
Without guns, mentally ill dems will go from house to house and exterminate the fascist, nazi reps.
No Bub...I'll keep my guns.
Not if white children are taught how to respect firearms and shoot well, like they used to be.Will we see groups of dead white children huddled in a group and full of bullet holes and in pools of blood?
MSP will be the next Chicago.....Mark it down.In a very disturbing way, this image reminds me of a cousin of mine. About ten years younger than myself, one of very few female cousins on that side of the family, daughter of my father's younger brother. She always was very beautiful, as of when I last saw her, but I haven't seen her for very, very many years, and by now, she's old enough that she might not be as attractive as she once was.
This looks like a druggie version of my cousin; if my cousin had been into heavy drug abuse, to the point that it ended up adversely affecting her visual appearance, this is about how she'd likely end up looking.
Australia.......
Ms Mallet said she believed the types of offences associated with gang-related crime in Australia had shifted in recent years.
'We're seeing people being shot in the street, total disregard for the public, for families,' she said.
'I think the police are concerned about the different types of violence because the rule book seems to have been thrown out with some of these organised gangs.'
Ms Mallet said the alleged kidnapping of Mr Vuong was 'very frightening'.
'I'm sure that everybody in Sydney and especially that neighbourhood is going to be thrown by this,' she said.
A number of high-profile gang-related crimes have dominated the news in the past 12 months, including the brutal execution-style shooting of celebrity chauffer Taha Sabbagh less than two weeks ago.
Crime expert compares bloodshed on Australia's streets to Brazil
9/3/22
It's a portrait of the average Australian who operates in the country's illegal firearms market, built from the findings of a 2022 Deakin University study.
In the study, criminology professor David Bright and his colleagues conducted 75 interviews with prisoners across 16 correctional facilities comprising drug traffickers, members of organised crime gangs and armed robbers.
The researchers were attempting to build a picture of the illegal gun trade in the Australian underworld.
They found buying an illegal gun in Australia could be as easy as a trip to the supermarket for those in the know.
Figures show a deep reservoir of illegal firearms exists for criminals to tap into, with police measures only able to recover tiny fractions each year.
----
Professor Bright said most of the interviewees came from backgrounds where criminal behaviour and access to guns were the norm.
----
"Some of the stories were shocking, I suppose, in the sense of the violence that some of these men had either experienced or had engaged in using guns," Professor Bright said.
"The other surprising thing was just how easily some of these men were able to access firearms."
---
The source of illegal firearms
The Deakin University study identified the main ways illegal firearms were procured in Australia.
Very few criminals interviewed spoke of obtaining weapons through the internet or "dark web", with them instead preferring to rely on personal connections.
Guns are commonly obtained from friends and family, as well as from deals where a trusted party has vouched for the potential buyer.
One prisoner was given guns on the condition that he attacked certain people to earn them.
"I had to do two things to get the guns, but that was simple so I didn't really have to do much," they said.
"I just had to shoot at people … I didn't care … I was getting free guns out of it."
---
Police use firearms prohibition orders (FPOs) to ban people they believe are linked to organised crime from coming into contact with guns.
---
In 2019 — the year after FPOs were introduced — Victoria recorded a nine-year high in firearm assault deaths.
---
The latest figures from the Australian Criminal Intelligence Commission (ACIC) estimate there are at least 260,000 illegal firearms circulating in Australia.
In its report, it states the number of illegal firearms could be as high as 600,000 if estimation methods from the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime were used.
---
It means the seizures represent just a fraction of a percentage of Australia's illegal firearms market. And for those convicted of serious gun-related crimes in SA and NSW, not much has changed.
The insular nature of the illegal firearms market has led to increased caution among criminals when trafficking and carrying firearms, but the ease of access remains the same.
"Honestly, the access is pretty easy. I could get access to a gun within an hour of walking out of jail … no problem at all," one prisoner said in the Deakin report.
Paper linked to in above article....
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/01639625.2022.2086838
As Melbourne and Sydney reel from inner-city shootings, researchers look to trace where the guns are coming from
==============
More on the 9/3/22 topic.....from above...
He said some of the interviewees spoke of illegal firearm suppliers having "huge caches" of guns, including pistols, shotguns and semi-automatic rifles.
Buying illegal guns 'surprisingly easy' for underworld figures, research finds
=======
1/6/22
The modus operandi of the hitmen contracted to take out Hamzy associates is to sneak up on the target - often in a public place - and pepper them with bullets.
---
OCTOBER 18, 2020 - Rafat Alameddine's former home is shot up in a drive-by shooting
OCTOBER 19, 2020 - Mejid Hamzy is shot dead in Condell Park
JANUARY 30, 2021 - Mustafa Naaman is shot dead in Hurstville in a suspected mistaken identity attack on Ibrahem Hamze
JANUARY 30, 2021 - Mejed Derbas is shot dead in Smithfield
FEBRUARY 15, 2021 - Bilal Hamze's mother Maha Hamze comes under gunfire again in another drive-by shooting at her home in Auburn
MARCH 12, 2021 - A home linked to the Alameddine family in Guildford is shot up
AUGUST 6, 2021 - Alameddine low-level associate Shady Kanj is shot in Chester Hill and found dead by police in Guildford
AUGUST 14, 2021 - Police foil alleged gangland hit on Ibrahim Hamze when they spot stolen Mercedes in North Sydney
OCTOBER 20, 2021 - Salim and Toufik Hamze are gunned down outside their home in Guildford
NOVEMBER 10, 2021 - Drive-by shooting at Guildford home of Alameddine associate. No-one is hurt
JANUARY 6, 2022 - Brother of Bassam Hamzy, Ghassan Amoun, is shot dead at 35 years of age in a brazen daylight execution as he sat in a BMW outside an apartment building in Western Sydney.
How cops made a chilling prediction before crime boss brother killed
New article 9/1/20
Gun violence grips Victoria as deadly shootings double
More than 14 hardened criminals are being found in possession of firearms each week as the state grapples with a rising gun culture that has led to twice as many Victorians shot dead in 2019.
------
Anti-gangs division Detective Superintendent Peter Brigham said illegal firearms were routinely unearthed at the homes of drug traffickers and in the possession of “gangster types” chasing image and status.
----
In September, a 35-year-old Docklands man was sentenced to at least eight years' jail for heroin trafficking. As part of his plea deal, the former Iraqi national led police to a cache of weapons wrapped in plastic and hidden in a Melbourne drain. They included an SKS assault rifle and grenades.
---
And while handguns were proving to be the gun of choice among young men, high powered military-grade firearms were in demand from the city’s outlaw motorcycle gangs
======
Gun city: Young, dumb and armed
The notion that a military-grade weapon could be in the hands of local criminals is shocking, but police have already seized at least five machine guns and assault rifles in the past 18 months. The AK-47 was not among them.
Only a fortnight ago, law enforcement authorities announced they were hunting another seven assault rifles recently smuggled into the country. Weapons from the shipment have been used in armed robberies and drive-by shootings.
These are just a handful of the thousands of illicit guns fuelling a wave of violent crime in the world’s most liveable city.
----
Despite Australia’s strict gun control regime, criminals are now better armed than at any time since then-Prime Minister John Howard introduced a nationwide firearm buyback scheme in response to the 1996 Port Arthur massacre.
Shootings have become almost a weekly occurrence, with more than 125 people, mostly young men, wounded in the past five year
-----------
While the body count was higher during Melbourne’s ‘Underbelly War’ (1999-2005), more people have been seriously maimed in the recent spate of shootings and reprisals.
Crimes associated with firearm possession have also more than doubled, driven by the easy availability of handguns, semi-automatic rifles, shotguns and, increasingly, machine guns, that are smuggled into the country or stolen from licensed owners.
-------------
These weapons have been used in dozens of recent drive-by shootings of homes and businesses, as well as targeted and random attacks in parks, shopping centres and roads.
“They’re young, dumb and armed,” said one former underworld associate, who survived a shooting attempt in the western suburbs several years ago.
“It used to be that if you were involved in something bad you might have to worry about [being shot]. Now people get shot over nothing - unprovoked.”
------------
Gun crime soars
In this series, Fairfax Media looks at Melbourne’s gun problem and the new breed of criminals behind the escalating violence.
The investigation has found:
In response to the violence, it can be revealed the state government is planning to introduce new criminal offences for drive-by shootings, manufacturing of firearms with new technologies such as 3D printers, and more police powers to keep weapons out of the hands of known criminals.
- There have been at least 99 shootings in the past 20 months - more than one incident a week since January 2015
- Known criminals were caught with firearms 755 times last year, compared to 143 times in 2011
- The epicentre of the problem is a triangle between Coolaroo, Campbellfield and Glenroy in the north-west, with Cranbourne, Narre Warren and Dandenong in the south-east close behind
- Criminals are using gunshot wounds to the arms and legs as warnings to pay debts
- Assault rifles and handguns are being smuggled into Australia via shipments of electronics and metal parts
============
The second part of the series....
Gun city: Gunslingers of the North West
========================
'Thousands' of illegal guns tipped to be handed over in firearms amnesty
Asked roughly how many he expected to be handed in, Mr Keenan said: "Look I certainly think the number will be in the thousands."
The Australian Crime Commission estimated in 2012 there were at least 250,000 illegal guns in Australia. But a Senate report noted last year it was impossible to estimate how many illicit weapons are out there.
And despite Australia's strict border controls, the smuggling of high-powered military-style firearms is also a growing problem.
First, to compare a first world country with the vastly more complex issues of a third world country is specious reasoning.
Now then....
Naysayers and gun worshippers say 'do nothing'. they say 'more guns is the answer'.
Democrats, moderates and sensible republicans say 'do something'. They say, 'less guns is the answer, and a comprehensive approach to the problem, given that it's not a simple problem'.
No one is suggesting the solution is a panacea, but when there is crime, though it can't be stopped, it does NOT mean we don't try and stop it, which appears to be the recommendation of the pro gun worshippers, i.e., 'do nothing'. I reject the premise.
I see no compelling reason for the former, but solid reasoning for the latter, given that......
America has more gun related deaths and injury per capita than other developed (first world) nations,
and America has more guns per capita than western developed nations, and despite anemic
hollers that 'correlation is not causation', for which the correct reply is, there is causation
when the volume of statistics is so great that it overwhelmingly points to one, irrefutable inescapable conclusion,
not to mention that gun related deaths are the number one killer of children as of 2020 and that correlates to the proliferation
of guns via the gun worshipping/gun fetishing culture that is spreading like a malignant cancer by the likes of the NRA and
MAGA movements. This idea that MAGA republicans are 'pro life' is a delusion. Ban abortion, deaths of the female poor go up, proliferate guns, and more children die. As for MAGA republicans and gun worshippers, one can only conclude, they are pro death.
As Adam Winkler wrote in his book, 'Gunfight, the battle over the right to bear arms in America', wrote:
View attachment 775049
His work has frequently been cited in judicial opinions, including in Supreme Court cases pertaining to the First and Second Amendments
