There is an active shooter at a Florida Highschool

[Dr Grump]

Thank you, exactly the point I was making. Cut the emotional commentary you like to lace your posts with and just address the point

Where's the emotion? You asked for viable alternatives. I gave them. How is me stating those points emotive? Hint: they're not.

 

[BlackSand]

Ie: Blacksand: "I have nothing."
Me: "I know."

I am not asking for anything ... You on the other hand have requested a lot.
You still have nothing to negotiate with.

.

.

 

[Faun]

He could have also known their day off...

It didn’t deter Cruz.

The school was a gun free zone, numb nuts...they had one armed guard on a campus of 2,000 students........one gun.......on an entire campus....doofus....

Gun free? There was an armed officer on the campus. Or at least, there was supposed to be one. Someone did say they heard there was no officer present that day, but Cruz couldn’t know if there were none, one, or more.

Didn’t deter him.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

Who said there was a day of the week without an officer present?

 

[Faun]

It didn’t deter Cruz.

The school was a gun free zone, numb nuts...they had one armed guard on a campus of 2,000 students........one gun.......on an entire campus....doofus....

Gun free? There was an armed officer on the campus. Or at least, there was supposed to be one. Someone did say they heard there was no officer present that day, but Cruz couldn’t know if there were none, one, or more.

Didn’t deter him.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

You are trolling now. Moron.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers.

Shooting down your idiocy is “trolling?” There was an armed police officer assigned to be there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

Your argument is DOA.

 

[2aguy]

The school was a gun free zone, numb nuts...they had one armed guard on a campus of 2,000 students........one gun.......on an entire campus....doofus....

Gun free? There was an armed officer on the campus. Or at least, there was supposed to be one. Someone did say they heard there was no officer present that day, but Cruz couldn’t know if there were none, one, or more.

Didn’t deter him.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

You are trolling now. Moron.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers.

Shooting down your idiocy is “trolling?” There was an armed police officer assigned to be there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

Your argument is DOA.

One armed officer on a campus of 2,000 students....you really are ******* stupid..aren't you?

 

[Faun]

We can’t assume that.

An officer is supposed to be roaming the school, not sit at an entrance point, if they are there. And if the city was paying for one to be there, they should not have a day off during the school week, or pulled off by the sheriffs office, as it appears happened here, from what I am hearing.

Seems the officer was not on campus. See my earlier post. Oh, I’ll repeat it for you-


Actually, an officer is paid for by the city, to be assigned to the school, and everything down here is pointing the fact he/she was not there, from our local paper-

The only person trained and armed to fight back against an assailant is Stoneman Douglas’s one school resource officer, a Broward Sheriff’s deputy funded by the city of Parkland. But Maxwell said she doesn’t think he was on campus when the shooting happened.

“I have been told by a couple of sources that the SRO was either called off campus responding to something happening or it could have been his day off,” she said. “They are stretched very thin.”

Neither BSO (Broward Sheriffs Office) nor school district officials responded to requests for comment about the whereabouts of the officer.
Florida school shooting: How was killer able to get around school security?
I have seen this from a number of sources. Notice how the subject has been broached, -yes, there was an officer assigned to the school-
not that the officer was actually there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

You cut yourself with that double edge sword as the same can be said about conservatives.

In the Washington Navy Yard, the shooter just shot the security guy first

I don't see how that changes anything. Obviously the kid would have known there was a security guard at his school and looked for him

Why not? He went to that school up until last year. He would have known there is an armed police officer on campus.

 

[conserveguy877]

A JROTC Freshman Sacrificed Himself To Help Classmates Escape During Florida Shooting


This is an American hero. Such a sad story. Make American schools safe again.

 

[Faun]

Gun free? There was an armed officer on the campus. Or at least, there was supposed to be one. Someone did say they heard there was no officer present that day, but Cruz couldn’t know if there were none, one, or more.

Didn’t deter him.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

You are trolling now. Moron.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers.

Shooting down your idiocy is “trolling?” There was an armed police officer assigned to be there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

Your argument is DOA.

One armed officer on a campus of 2,000 students....you really are ******* stupid..aren't you?

I asked you for what you thought an adequate ratio is but you can’t say. Still, as far as Cruz knew, there would be an armed police officer on campus.

Didn’t deter him.

Your point remains DOA.

 

[2aguy]

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

You are trolling now. Moron.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers.

Shooting down your idiocy is “trolling?” There was an armed police officer assigned to be there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

Your argument is DOA.

One armed officer on a campus of 2,000 students....you really are ******* stupid..aren't you?

I asked you for what you thought an adequate ratio is but you can’t say. Still, as far as Cruz knew, there would be an armed police officer on campus.

Didn’t deter him.

Your point remains DOA.

Moron.

I gave you the best response...get rid of the gun free school zone, and you cover the entire property with doubt for the shooter, there is no way to know who will be armed, and they will go somewhere else....

 

[Faun]

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

You are trolling now. Moron.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers.

Shooting down your idiocy is “trolling?” There was an armed police officer assigned to be there.

It didn’t deter Cruz.

Your argument is DOA.

One armed officer on a campus of 2,000 students....you really are ******* stupid..aren't you?

I asked you for what you thought an adequate ratio is but you can’t say. Still, as far as Cruz knew, there would be an armed police officer on campus.

Didn’t deter him.

Your point remains DOA.

Moron.

I gave you the best response...get rid of the gun free school zone, and you cover the entire property with doubt for the shooter, there is no way to know who will be armed, and they will go somewhere else....

No, what you gave was the dumb-******* conservative idea. Which is typically the dumbest idea on the table. Putting guns in schools does not make them safer, it makes them far more dangerous than they are now. Now any kid who maybe wants to shoot someone at school but can’t obtain a weapon to do so has a bunch to choose from. All they need to do is get their hands on one at school and start shooting. What is needed is sensible gun control to make it more difficult for assholes like Cruz to get their hands on a weapon like that. Which can kill the maximum number of people in the shortest amount of time.

 

[Dr Grump]

I am not asking for anything ... You on the other hand have requested a lot.
You still have nothing to negotiate with.
.

Really? What have I asked for?

 

[jon_berzerk]

why so dramatic

have him evaluated could have barred him from ownership

Have him evaluated for what? Being an asshole? What law did he break to warrant a mental health evaluation? There aren't enough prisons in the US to hold all of the Democrats we would need to lock up!

mental illness you dont have to break a law for a mental health evaluation

If you are on Medicaid, it's a challenge to find good mental health professionals that will take you, primarily because the reimbursement is likely to be 40% to 50%. In my area getting an appointment with a psychiatrist that accepts Medicaid can take months and that's with a referral. If you try to kill yourself, you get pretty fast action, 3 to 5 days of evaluation, discharge, a hand full of pills, and a better luck next time.

Unfortunately those that need help the most are likely to be on Medicaid and likely to get the worst care. Nowhere is income inequality so obvious as mental health care for the poor.

indeed that is all true and maybe worse in some cases

medicaid just does not cover the cost

out here at our full service facility we only accept x amount of medicaid and medicare enrollments

however in the case of a court ordered mental evaluation the state picks up the tab

This ridiculous situation got started with some studies of effectiveness of inpatient mental health care back in the 70's and 80's. The conclusion was that most patients could be treated more effectively with outpatient services at significant savings. With big cost savings in mind, we started dumping institutional patients and tightening the criteria for inpatient care. The only thing missing from the plan was sufficient out patient mental healthcare for the poor. Medicaid has never provided anywhere near what is needed. Today Medicaid is paying for over 25% of the mental healthcare bill of the country which commonly is evaluations, 3 to 5 day stays, a handful of pills, and very limited long term treatment for the people in the country who need it the most.

Every time some mentally unbalance teen, father, or mother kills their family, friends, co-workers, or class mates, someone will point how badly intervention was needed and nothing was done. Well, there is good reason why nothing is done, lack of money and coordination of service.

perhaps however in both cases inpatient and outpatient medicaid reimbursements are less then other carriers

again once it is ordered by the state the state pays the bill

they may do that through a state hospital or contact it out

there is no financial obligation to the client other then he/she may have to pay down while committed

 

[depotoo]

If you had read my other posts to you, you would have seen they stated in may have been the officers day off, or was pulled away from the school for something else.

He could have also known their day off...

The school was a gun free zone, numb nuts...they had one armed guard on a campus of 2,000 students........one gun.......on an entire campus....doofus....

Gun free? There was an armed officer on the campus. Or at least, there was supposed to be one. Someone did say they heard there was no officer present that day, but Cruz couldn’t know if there were none, one, or more.

Didn’t deter him.

The shooters research 6 months to 2 years out......read the information on these shooters...they changed their targets based on the likelihood of facing armed resistance......this is a fact....you can find it....the Colorado theater shooter, the Santa Barbara Sorority shooter, the South Carolina church shooter, Sandy Hook.......

Sandy Hook? The only school that didn't have an armed guard was the one that was attacked...the other schools had police resource officers....

And Cruz would have known there could be an armed police officer there.

It didn’t deter him.

Who said there was a day of the week without an officer present?

 

[depotoo]

Trump must be heading to Parkland. They closed off the turnpike.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

The US has a higher incarceration rate than you do

The US has more crime than you do.

Oh my fing God, that's brilliant. You're a genius. Our countries are not the same. Damn, I wish I'd realized that. Oh wait, I did. You didn't know that ...

It wasn't an insight. I was asked a question and answered it. Nothing more. Nothing less.

The US has shit drug and prostitution laws for a start. Get those sorted and your incarceration rate would halve. And the tax bill associated with that. THen again, you have private prisons, so there is a driver right there for people to be incarcerated. Especially if you are a shareholder in that prison company and you give judges back handers.

Well, I agree on the drugs and prostitution.

The thing is that you keep arguing we should just pass laws. You really don't address that we are very different country. We have a million illegal aliens entering our country. And we have no southern border. The drug dealers who already exist can import guns. Think about it.

We also have 300 million guns. All our gun laws are doing is making it easier for mass shooters. And each one tries to outdo the last one and no one has guns to stop them. Gun owners are overwhelmingly good people who learn to use them safely. And the ones who aren't can get them anyway. I know, I came from there even though I've lived my adult life in urban areas.

Australia is like NZ both in demographics and in that you have no borders or millions of illegal aliens, drugs and guns flowing freely in. To just say gun laws is so shallow. And it's clearly not working, and you don't address that either.

The Washington Navy yard was the epitome example of the stupidity of our laws where people who owned and knew how to use them were prohibited from having them and died because of it

. SECURE THE SCHOOL BORDERS !!

Secure the points or entry and exit to all U.S. schools, and do it with metal detectors, barriers, and armed gaurds. No one in or out without being processed through these check points.

It can be done, and it can be done without it looking or feeling like a prison system.

Maybe. Not sure it's a one size fits all solution. I think the parents of these shooter kids should be shamed, honestly.

 

[depotoo]

This ones are dead. And the mother called the police numerous times and nothing changed. She died in Nov, the father years ago.

The US has a higher incarceration rate than you do

The US has more crime than you do.

Oh my fing God, that's brilliant. You're a genius. Our countries are not the same. Damn, I wish I'd realized that. Oh wait, I did. You didn't know that ...

It wasn't an insight. I was asked a question and answered it. Nothing more. Nothing less.

The US has shit drug and prostitution laws for a start. Get those sorted and your incarceration rate would halve. And the tax bill associated with that. THen again, you have private prisons, so there is a driver right there for people to be incarcerated. Especially if you are a shareholder in that prison company and you give judges back handers.

Well, I agree on the drugs and prostitution.

The thing is that you keep arguing we should just pass laws. You really don't address that we are very different country. We have a million illegal aliens entering our country. And we have no southern border. The drug dealers who already exist can import guns. Think about it.

We also have 300 million guns. All our gun laws are doing is making it easier for mass shooters. And each one tries to outdo the last one and no one has guns to stop them. Gun owners are overwhelmingly good people who learn to use them safely. And the ones who aren't can get them anyway. I know, I came from there even though I've lived my adult life in urban areas.

Australia is like NZ both in demographics and in that you have no borders or millions of illegal aliens, drugs and guns flowing freely in. To just say gun laws is so shallow. And it's clearly not working, and you don't address that either.

The Washington Navy yard was the epitome example of the stupidity of our laws where people who owned and knew how to use them were prohibited from having them and died because of it

. SECURE THE SCHOOL BORDERS !!

Secure the points or entry and exit to all U.S. schools, and do it with metal detectors, barriers, and armed gaurds. No one in or out without being processed through these check points.

It can be done, and it can be done without it looking or feeling like a prison system.

Maybe. Not sure it's a one size fits all solution. I think the parents of these shooter kids should be shamed, honestly.

 

[kaz]

The US has a higher incarceration rate than you do

The US has more crime than you do.

Oh my fing God, that's brilliant. You're a genius. Our countries are not the same. Damn, I wish I'd realized that. Oh wait, I did. You didn't know that ...

It wasn't an insight. I was asked a question and answered it. Nothing more. Nothing less.

The US has shit drug and prostitution laws for a start. Get those sorted and your incarceration rate would halve. And the tax bill associated with that. THen again, you have private prisons, so there is a driver right there for people to be incarcerated. Especially if you are a shareholder in that prison company and you give judges back handers.

Well, I agree on the drugs and prostitution.

The thing is that you keep arguing we should just pass laws. You really don't address that we are very different country. We have a million illegal aliens entering our country. And we have no southern border. The drug dealers who already exist can import guns. Think about it.

We also have 300 million guns. All our gun laws are doing is making it easier for mass shooters. And each one tries to outdo the last one and no one has guns to stop them. Gun owners are overwhelmingly good people who learn to use them safely. And the ones who aren't can get them anyway. I know, I came from there even though I've lived my adult life in urban areas.

Australia is like NZ both in demographics and in that you have no borders or millions of illegal aliens, drugs and guns flowing freely in. To just say gun laws is so shallow. And it's clearly not working, and you don't address that either.

The Washington Navy yard was the epitome example of the stupidity of our laws where people who owned and knew how to use them were prohibited from having them and died because of it

. SECURE THE SCHOOL BORDERS !!

Secure the points or entry and exit to all U.S. schools, and do it with metal detectors, barriers, and armed gaurds. No one in or out without being processed through these check points.

It can be done, and it can be done without it looking or feeling like a prison system.

Maybe. Not sure it's a one size fits all solution. I think the parents of these shooter kids should be shamed, honestly.

No worries, they died before the shooting

 

[depotoo]

Trump must be heading to Parkland. They closed off the turnpike.

Yep

Donald Trump visits shooting survivors at hospital

 

[depotoo]

Florida school shooter Nikolas Cruz to offer guilty plea to avoid death penalty


Nikolas Cruz was investigated after cutting himself on Snapchat, state report shows

 

[Flopper]

Have him evaluated for what? Being an asshole? What law did he break to warrant a mental health evaluation? There aren't enough prisons in the US to hold all of the Democrats we would need to lock up!

mental illness you dont have to break a law for a mental health evaluation

If you are on Medicaid, it's a challenge to find good mental health professionals that will take you, primarily because the reimbursement is likely to be 40% to 50%. In my area getting an appointment with a psychiatrist that accepts Medicaid can take months and that's with a referral. If you try to kill yourself, you get pretty fast action, 3 to 5 days of evaluation, discharge, a hand full of pills, and a better luck next time.

Unfortunately those that need help the most are likely to be on Medicaid and likely to get the worst care. Nowhere is income inequality so obvious as mental health care for the poor.

indeed that is all true and maybe worse in some cases

medicaid just does not cover the cost

out here at our full service facility we only accept x amount of medicaid and medicare enrollments

however in the case of a court ordered mental evaluation the state picks up the tab

This ridiculous situation got started with some studies of effectiveness of inpatient mental health care back in the 70's and 80's. The conclusion was that most patients could be treated more effectively with outpatient services at significant savings. With big cost savings in mind, we started dumping institutional patients and tightening the criteria for inpatient care. The only thing missing from the plan was sufficient out patient mental healthcare for the poor. Medicaid has never provided anywhere near what is needed. Today Medicaid is paying for over 25% of the mental healthcare bill of the country which commonly is evaluations, 3 to 5 day stays, a handful of pills, and very limited long term treatment for the people in the country who need it the most.

Every time some mentally unbalance teen, father, or mother kills their family, friends, co-workers, or class mates, someone will point how badly intervention was needed and nothing was done. Well, there is good reason why nothing is done, lack of money and coordination of service.

perhaps however in both cases inpatient and outpatient medicaid reimbursements are less then other carriers

again once it is ordered by the state the state pays the bill

they may do that through a state hospital or contact it out

there is no financial obligation to the client other then he/she may have to pay down while committed

Not quite.
Almost all Medicaid reimbursements are less than other carriers and mental health is one of the worst in most states. However, the actual percent reimbursement is set by the state.

Medicaid is a partnership between the state and the federal government. States must meet certain guidelines for federal payments, however states set many of the rules. There are certain state programs that are 100% state funded. However most of Medicaid is 50% funded by the federal government and the rest comes from the state.

One of my kids was on Medicaid for two years. The only good thing about Medicaid is it's free if you qualify. Low reimbursement rates can make finding treatment difficult. Medicaid will tell you there are many providers in your area that accept Medicaid but when you call for an appointment they tell you they aren't accepting Medicaid patients at this time or they tell you they are booked for 2 months.

Another problem with Medicaid is they have rules and rules and more rules, most of which are unknown to patient. For example, you may need a certain treatment and Medicaid will hold it for certification or 2nd opinion. For various mental health problems, you may have be evaluated before you can even make an appointment. In some instances, you can get only so many appointments. In fact, many services you get with Medicaid are not determined by your need.