CDZ There are TWO Genders: Change My Mind

[Confederate Soldier]

This ain't hard. I don't know why we gotta make it hard.

 

[Wyld Kard]

There are two genders. Male & female. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it's always going to be, despite what all the mentally ill nutjobs who claim differently.

 

[Pellinore]

Seriously, the hysteria of the left right now is absolutely insane.

Okay, we know of the two biological sexes, male and female. While there are genetic disorders that give people traits of both, those genetic disorders are extremely rare, and even when they do happen the person exhibits the traits of one sex much more predominantly than the other. The idea of a “hermaphrodite” is almost a myth, there really is no genetic disorder that allows for fully functional sex organs of both sexes. Besides, according to these “trans” advocates, gender is different than biological sex.

So we aren’t talking about people with some rare genetic disorder, as some have now started to move the goalposts and have been bringing them up. This is about “gender”.

These trans activists are claiming that a male can “be a woman” just by self identifying as one. Sure, they have the right to self identify all they want, but that doesn’t make their fantasy a reality, nor does or should society have to accept it.

For example, a male that pretends to be a female is still a man. He’s a cross dressing man.

A male that undergoes some “sex change” surgery is still a man and a male. His chromosomes do not change, they are still XY.

Same of course goes with females pretending to be men. Their biological sex does not change, so neither does their gender.


For those screaming in horror about the simple statement “there are TWO genders, men and women”, what are the other genders? Please provide specific examples.

This is Clean Debate Zone. Please keep the childish insults to yourself, and provide a clear and concise response.

I'll give this a shot.

You've already got the basic recognition: sex and gender are two different things. Sex is biological, almost everyone you meet is XX or XY, male or female, and is same to every person in every culture in every time. Gender is the social expectations of someone of that sex, masculine or feminine. In our culture, men have names like Steve, can become priests, and wear suits, while women have names like Stephanie, can become nuns, and wear dresses, because names, religion, and clothing are all aspects of our culture.

Social pressure goes a long way to encourage males to do masculine things, and females to do feminine things, but what do you do with someone who simply prefers to do the other? There are plenty of women who prefer pants to dresses, or men who have long hair, and we typically don't care. A transgender person is someone who simply prefers to live most of their life in ways that society usually reserves for the opposite sex. On top of that, there are people who don't identify themselves with either set of expectations (non-gender), who change how to live each day (gender-fluid), or who reject the idea that there are two genders entirely. It is this last group that are most likely to assert that there are a gazillion different genders.

Now, mind you, this is all just about self-identity, what someone calls themselves or how they express themselves. Separate from that is sexual preference—heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, demisexual, sapiosexual, the list goes on and on.

And all of THAT is also separate from the surgery. I don't know *too* much about this, because I really don't care what's in someone else's pants, but you are correct that is not really a "sex change," because there's no such thing as chromosome transplants. That's why they now call it "gender reassignment surgery." I do know that it's not necessary or inevitable for a trans person to get it, and there are several different stages and types. I get the feeling that most trans people don't get it, but I can't say for sure. That's about all I know about that.

The LGBT umbrella includes all of everyone, pretty much except the straight and cisgendered (cis=same, so anyone who isn't trans). Its "long-form" abbreviation is LGBTQIA+, including the Questioning (those who haven't figured themselves out yet), the Intersex (the rare few whose biological sex contains elements of both), the Asexual (or agender, or even aromantic, who are attracted/identify with/feel romance toward no one), and the + for eeeeeeeverybody else. As best I can tell, they use the term "Queer" to refer to anyone under the umbrella, but like any casual terms, their precise meanings vary.

Mind you, I am on the outside looking in, but this is what I've learned after years of trying to get it straight (no pun intended). I hope it helps.

 

[JoeMoma]

I'll give this a shot.

You've already got the basic recognition: sex and gender are two different things. Sex is biological, almost everyone you meet is XX or XY, male or female, and is same to every person in every culture in every time. Gender is the social expectations of someone of that sex, masculine or feminine.

If that's the case, we shouldn't have issues with biological males that insist on playing female sports or insisting on using female restrooms and locker rooms.

Bottom line, transgender females (bio-males) expected to be recognized as fully female by society, no different than real women and girls. Ditto for transgender males wanting to be recognized as fully male.

 

[woodwork201]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

 

[rightwinger]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

 

[Orangecat]

Homosexuals and Transgenders have demonstrated through the ages that psychology dominates

Incorrect. Your mind cannot change your DNA no matter how much you want to act, dress, or have sexual relations as the opposite sex. Biology dominates.

 

[rightwinger]

This ain't hard. I don't know why we gotta make it hard.

Who is being hard?

Just let people live their lives according to their sexuality instead of biology

 

[rightwinger]

Homosexuals and Transgenders have demonstrated through the ages that psychology dominates

Incorrect. Your mind cannot change your DNA no matter how much you want to act, dress, or have sexual relations as the opposite gender. Biology dominates.

DNA has no bearing on your sexuality

 

[Orangecat]

Incorrect. Your mind cannot change your DNA no matter how much you want to act, dress, or have sexual relations as the opposite gender. Biology dominates.

DNA has no bearing on your sexuality

I didn't say it did. DNA determines whether you are male or female. You can fuck whoever you want, for all I care.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Seriously, the hysteria of the left right now is absolutely insane.

Okay, we know of the two biological sexes, male and female. While there are genetic disorders that give people traits of both, those genetic disorders are extremely rare, and even when they do happen the person exhibits the traits of one sex much more predominantly than the other. The idea of a “hermaphrodite” is almost a myth, there really is no genetic disorder that allows for fully functional sex organs of both sexes. Besides, according to these “trans” advocates, gender is different than biological sex.

So we aren’t talking about people with some rare genetic disorder, as some have now started to move the goalposts and have been bringing them up. This is about “gender”.

These trans activists are claiming that a male can “be a woman” just by self identifying as one. Sure, they have the right to self identify all they want, but that doesn’t make their fantasy a reality, nor does or should society have to accept it.

For example, a male that pretends to be a female is still a man. He’s a cross dressing man.

A male that undergoes some “sex change” surgery is still a man and a male. His chromosomes do not change, they are still XY.

Same of course goes with females pretending to be men. Their biological sex does not change, so neither does their gender.


For those screaming in horror about the simple statement “there are TWO genders, men and women”, what are the other genders? Please provide specific examples.

This is Clean Debate Zone. Please keep the childish insults to yourself, and provide a clear and concise response.

I'll give this a shot.

You've already got the basic recognition: sex and gender are two different things. Sex is biological, almost everyone you meet is XX or XY, male or female, and is same to every person in every culture in every time. Gender is the social expectations of someone of that sex, masculine or feminine. In our culture, men have names like Steve, can become priests, and wear suits, while women have names like Stephanie, can become nuns, and wear dresses, because names, religion, and clothing are all aspects of our culture.

Social pressure goes a long way to encourage males to do masculine things, and females to do feminine things, but what do you do with someone who simply prefers to do the other? There are plenty of women who prefer pants to dresses, or men who have long hair, and we typically don't care. A transgender person is someone who simply prefers to live most of their life in ways that society usually reserves for the opposite sex. On top of that, there are people who don't identify themselves with either set of expectations (non-gender), who change how to live each day (gender-fluid), or who reject the idea that there are two genders entirely. It is this last group that are most likely to assert that there are a gazillion different genders.

Now, mind you, this is all just about self-identity, what someone calls themselves or how they express themselves. Separate from that is sexual preference—heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, asexual, demisexual, sapiosexual, the list goes on and on.

And all of THAT is also separate from the surgery. I don't know *too* much about this, because I really don't care what's in someone else's pants, but you are correct that is not really a "sex change," because there's no such thing as chromosome transplants. That's why they now call it "gender reassignment surgery." I do know that it's not necessary or inevitable for a trans person to get it, and there are several different stages and types. I get the feeling that most trans people don't get it, but I can't say for sure. That's about all I know about that.

The LGBT umbrella includes all of everyone, pretty much except the straight and cisgendered (cis=same, so anyone who isn't trans). Its "long-form" abbreviation is LGBTQIA+, including the Questioning (those who haven't figured themselves out yet), the Intersex (the rare few whose biological sex contains elements of both), the Asexual (or agender, or even aromantic, who are attracted/identify with/feel romance toward no one), and the + for eeeeeeeverybody else. As best I can tell, they use the term "Queer" to refer to anyone under the umbrella, but like any casual terms, their precise meanings vary.

Mind you, I am on the outside looking in, but this is what I've learned after years of trying to get it straight (no pun intended). I hope it helps.

This also explains why the "trans" agenda comes into conflict with feminism and women in general: because women have fought for decades to get out of the box of shallow cultural stereotypes defining womanhood, and now here we are, right back where we started, with a group of men declaring that those same shallow stereotypes are THE definition of womanhood.

 

[JoeMoma]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

Some people psychologically identify as animals or other non-human beings. If a biological human identifies as a dog, is it okay for him to have sex with a real dog?

Otherkins - the 'trans species' people who don't identify as human

Why identify as human when you could identify as a fairy?

metro.co.uk

 

[theHawk]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

It doesn’t matter how they “feel”. It doesn’t change their gender.

 

[woodwork201]

It doesn’t matter how they “feel”. It doesn’t change their gender.

Or their sex.

 

[rightwinger]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

It doesn’t matter how they “feel”. It doesn’t change their gender.

Your biological gender does not determine who you love or the sex you associate with

Why are you so obsessed with biological gender?
Let people live their lives and stop being such an asshole about it

 

[theHawk]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

It doesn’t matter how they “feel”. It doesn’t change their gender.

Your biological gender does not determine who you love or the sex you associate with

Why are you so obsessed with biological gender?
Let people live their lives and stop being such an asshole about it

When did I ever say it did? No one is disputing that homos exist.

So stop trying to derail the thread. Sexual attraction has nothing to do with how many genders there are.

 

[ESay]

So stop trying to derail the thread. Sexual attraction has nothing to do with how many genders there are

Derail the thread? This thread will soon have a thousand posts and discussions here started over and over again about the same point. What else can be added to that?

 

[ESay]

Some people psychologically identify as animals or other non-human beings. If a biological human identifies as a dog, is it okay for him to have sex with a real dog

No, that is disgusting. Shoot the bastrad along with his dog.

 

[rightwinger]

Once again proving that Conservatives are unable to distinguish Biology from Psychology.

We can clearly recognize batshit crazy when we see it. That you and your kind see this ability as something to be condemned says much more about you than it does about us.

You don’t recognize that a biological male can be psychologically attracted to his own sex?

A male can absolutely be sexually attracted to a male. Homosexuality is psychological, perhaps even emotional, but it's not biological. And just because a biological male is attracted to males does not mean that the biological male is, or can be converted into, or even should be converted to, a female.

Transgenderism and transexualism is an assault on homosexuals.

There are also males who psychologically identify as female, even though biologically they are male.

Same applies to females

It doesn’t matter how they “feel”. It doesn’t change their gender.

Your biological gender does not determine who you love or the sex you associate with

Why are you so obsessed with biological gender?
Let people live their lives and stop being such an asshole about it

When did I ever say it did? No one is disputing that homos exist.

So stop trying to derail the thread. Sexual attraction has nothing to do with how many genders there are.

So, what difference does that make?

There are two biological genders and endless variations within those genders.

 

[theHawk]

So stop trying to derail the thread. Sexual attraction has nothing to do with how many genders there are

Derail the thread? This thread will soon have a thousand posts and discussions here started over and over again about the same point. What else can be added to that?

Quite correct. There two genders, and none of these wackos can prove otherwise. That’s why they keep trying to move the goal posts.