The World FDR Inherited Thread

[MikeK]

FDR took a downturn in the economy and turned it into a soup line, bodies in ditches full scale depression in eight years.

You are talking about Herbert Hoover, not FDR. And the "downturn" you mention was in fact a full-scale economic collapse. FDR commenced the mechanism of recovery by imposing a 91% tax on the rich and implementing the WPA and CCC programs -- which put money in circulation.

It took the carnage of a World War to turn the economy around.

That commonly held but nonsensical belief would be true if World War Two was conducted free of cost. But it wasn't. It was a financial disaster which was managed well by the FDR Administration. The advantage it did provide was a graceful introduction into the era of advanced industrial production that took place in the early 1950s.

 

[Picaro]

FDR took a downturn in the economy and turned it into a soup line, bodies in ditches full scale depression in eight years.

You are talking about Herbert Hoover, not FDR. And the "downturn" you mention was in fact a full-scale economic collapse. FDR commenced the mechanism of recovery by imposing a 91% tax on the rich and implementing the WPA and CCC programs -- which put money in circulation.

It took the carnage of a World War to turn the economy around.

That commonly held but nonsensical belief would be true if World War Two was conducted free of cost. But it wasn't. It was a financial disaster which was managed well by the FDR Administration. The advantage it did provide was a graceful introduction into the era of advanced industrial production that took place in the early 1950s.

Yes. That argument actually proves that FDR didn't spend enough during the '30's considering the depth of the Depression, going by their contradictory, cognitively dissonant 'criticism'. I guess military spending isn't 'government spending' or something in their minds. Who knows why; my guess is they just repeat nonsense they read at Free Republic or Town Hall, and don't bother to examine what it is they're repeating. From a macro-economic view, it doesn't matter whether or not it was military spending or construction spending or any other productive expenditure, as long as it produced jobs, generated contracts for private firms and commodities, etc., and generally infused money into the economy to be spent and circulated.

 

[MikeK]

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

It is amazing to me how effective the brazenly overt misinformation put forth by Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin, and other multi-millionaire, right wing, corporatist propagandists has been, even in this time of readily available, factual information.

Josef Goebbels was right. "Ordinary people will swallow the most brazen lies if they are fed to them often enough!" It worked for the Nazis and it continues to work for the American right wing.

So, thank you, Picaro, for your effort.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

[

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933;.

exactly and his Great Depression did not end till he finally died in 1945!! His legacy is 100% Depression and 100% World War!!

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

it continues to work for the American right wing.

Dear the right wing follows the principles of our genius Founders. If you're a communist why don't you go to Cuba?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

it doesn't matter whether or not it was military spending or construction spending or any other productive expenditure, as long as it produced jobs, generated contracts for private firms and commodities, etc., and generally infused money into the economy to be spent and circulated.

a liberal will be 100% stupid! the money was taken from the economy and then infused back ito the economy so no net benefit is possible. If someone told you they could fill a swimming pool with water from the other side of the pool would you beleive them??

See why we have to be 100% positive that liberalism is based in pure ignorance? What other conclusion is possible?

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

One of the lies PC depends on is that she uses a source that compares FDR's later UE numbers to 1931,

claiming it shows things didn't get better after he took office...'31 being of course 2 years BEFORE he became president.

too stupid even FDR agreed unemployment never got better!!
****Here's what Henry Morgenthau, FDR's Secretary of the Treasury (the man who desperately needed the New Deal to succeed as much as Roosevelt) said about the New Deal stimulus: "We have tried spending money.We are spending more than we ever have spent before and it does not work... We have never made good on our promises...I say after eight years of this administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started... And an enormous debt to boot!"

"The New Republic"( at the time a FDR greatest supporter") noted. In June 1939, the federal public works programs still supported almost 19 million people, nearly 15% of the population" [page 313]

In fact in 1939, unemployment was at 17%, and there were 11 million additional in stimulus make work welfare jobs. Today when the population is 2.5 times greater we have only 8 million unemployed. Conclusion: legislation to make Democrats illegal
is urgently needed

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

too 100% stupid and liberal, the Great Depression lasted till 1945 when FDR , a libcommie, finally died!!

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

too stupid and liberal, the Great Depression lasted till 1945 when FDR , a libcommie, finally died!!

Barry can never rise to FDR's level because his recession only lasted 5 years longer than it should have!!

 

[gipper]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

W

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

That alleviates FDR of any responsibility... In your mind...right?

 

[Moonglow]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

W

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

That alleviates FDR of any responsibility... In your mind...right?

Not at all, but it is important to the situation that was at hand when FDR came into office...

 

[Picaro]

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

It is amazing to me how effective the brazenly overt misinformation put forth by Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Mark Levin, and other multi-millionaire, right wing, corporatist propagandists has been, even in this time of readily available, factual information.

Josef Goebbels was right. "Ordinary people will swallow the most brazen lies if they are fed to them often enough!" It worked for the Nazis and it continues to work for the American right wing.

So, thank you, Picaro, for your effort.

Another topic worth discussing is what was happening in the two years before the 1929 crash; the slowdown and layoffs for people in the real economy began in 1927, roughly the same time short term interest on loaning cash to brokerages and stock market operators for margin buying went up to 4% and higher; floods of cash began being sucked into that instead of financing capital investments in factories and businesses in the real economy. Which came first, the chicken or the egg? ... But that's another thread in itself.

 

[Moonglow]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee. Promising to bring continued peace and prosperity to the nation, he carried 40 states and defeated Democratic candidate Alfred E. Smith (1873-1944), the governor of New York, by a record margin of 444-87 electoral votes. “I have no fears for the future of our country,” Hoover declared in his inaugural address. “It is bright with hope.”

On October 24, 1929–only seven months after Hoover took office–a precipitous drop in the value of the U.S. stock market sent the economy spiraling downward and signaled the start of the Great Depression. Banks and businesses failed across the country. Nationwide unemployment rates rose from 3 percent in 1929 to 23 percent in 1932. Millions of Americans lost their jobs, homes and savings. Many people were forced to wait in bread lines for food and to live in squalid shantytowns known derisively as Hoovervilles.
Herbert Hoover - U.S. Presidents - HISTORY.com

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee.

Hoover was a flaming liberal. Ever heard of the Hoover Dam stimulus project or the Smoot Hawley tarriff that collapsed world trade?.

 

[Moonglow]

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee.

Hoover was a flaming liberal. Ever heard of the Hoover Dam stimulus project or the Smoot Hawley tarriff that collapsed world trade?.

 

[Picaro]

Everything got better under FDR.

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee. Promising to bring continued peace and prosperity to the nation, he carried 40 states and defeated Democratic candidate Alfred E. Smith (1873-1944), the governor of New York, by a record margin of 444-87 electoral votes. “I have no fears for the future of our country,” Hoover declared in his inaugural address. “It is bright with hope.”

On October 24, 1929–only seven months after Hoover took office–a precipitous drop in the value of the U.S. stock market sent the economy spiraling downward and signaled the start of the Great Depression. Banks and businesses failed across the country. Nationwide unemployment rates rose from 3 percent in 1929 to 23 percent in 1932. Millions of Americans lost their jobs, homes and savings. Many people were forced to wait in bread lines for food and to live in squalid shantytowns known derisively as Hoovervilles.
Herbert Hoover - U.S. Presidents - HISTORY.com

It's important to remember many parts of the country weren't booming in the '20's to begin with; farmers weren't doing well that decade, when a significant number of Americans lived in rural and small town areas, one reason being a huge portion of the manufacturing jobs went to immigrants, massive immigration levels after the Civil War and especially from the early 1880's on kept wages low, below even subsisitence level for many immigrants, so a 'boom' didn't mean much improvement for most people, native or immigrant, and a severe recession lasted into 1922, post -WW I. The ;middle class' was pretty small; few people had much of a buffer against hard times. As cheap as a Model T was, most people still had to borrow on credit to buy one.

 

[Moonglow]

yes dear they called it the Great Depression by mistake!!

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee. Promising to bring continued peace and prosperity to the nation, he carried 40 states and defeated Democratic candidate Alfred E. Smith (1873-1944), the governor of New York, by a record margin of 444-87 electoral votes. “I have no fears for the future of our country,” Hoover declared in his inaugural address. “It is bright with hope.”

On October 24, 1929–only seven months after Hoover took office–a precipitous drop in the value of the U.S. stock market sent the economy spiraling downward and signaled the start of the Great Depression. Banks and businesses failed across the country. Nationwide unemployment rates rose from 3 percent in 1929 to 23 percent in 1932. Millions of Americans lost their jobs, homes and savings. Many people were forced to wait in bread lines for food and to live in squalid shantytowns known derisively as Hoovervilles.
Herbert Hoover - U.S. Presidents - HISTORY.com

It's important to remember many parts of the country weren't booming in the '20's to begin with; farmers weren't doing well that decade, when a significant number of Americans lived in rural and small town areas, one reason being a huge portion of the manufacturing jobs went to immigrants, massive immigration levels after the Civil War and especially from the early 1880's on kept wages low, below even subsisitence level for many immigrants, so a 'boom' didn't mean much improvement for most people, native or immigrant, and a severe recession lasted into 1922, post -WW I. The ;middle class' was pretty small; few people had much of a buffer against hard times. As cheap as a Model T was, most people still had to borrow on credit to buy one.

3% employment is not a boom?

 

[Picaro]

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee.

Hoover was a flaming liberal. Ever heard of the Hoover Dam stimulus project or the Smoot Hawley tarriff that collapsed world trade?.

lol ... I don't know why, but I'm getting a vague sense Baiamonte just might be upset about something; hope it wasn't anythng I said.

 

[EdwardBaiamonte]

It's important to remember many parts of the country weren't booming in the '20's to begin with;

dear, you clean forgot to say why its important to remember that? What's important to remember is that lib govt interference caused the Great Depression and prolonged it for 16 years that included a liberal world war with 60 million dead. It didn't happen again under Obama because he followed Milton Friedmans' advice.

 

[Picaro]

The worst of the Depression was 1933.

I will never understand why these fellows are bereft of any knowledge that a GOP president was at the helm when the Great Depression began and was in charge for 3 years before FDR....

FDR was sworn into office first term in March, 1933; check a graph of the GDP and check out when the economy started climbing again. The confidence level was tremendous. The rich were still hoarding their wealth and hiding out behind private armies on their estates, having done absolutely nothing to build the economy back up under Hoover, unless you count gambling on short selling stocks and sniveling about taxes.

In the U.S. presidential election of 1928, Hoover ran as the Republican Party’s nominee. Promising to bring continued peace and prosperity to the nation, he carried 40 states and defeated Democratic candidate Alfred E. Smith (1873-1944), the governor of New York, by a record margin of 444-87 electoral votes. “I have no fears for the future of our country,” Hoover declared in his inaugural address. “It is bright with hope.”

On October 24, 1929–only seven months after Hoover took office–a precipitous drop in the value of the U.S. stock market sent the economy spiraling downward and signaled the start of the Great Depression. Banks and businesses failed across the country. Nationwide unemployment rates rose from 3 percent in 1929 to 23 percent in 1932. Millions of Americans lost their jobs, homes and savings. Many people were forced to wait in bread lines for food and to live in squalid shantytowns known derisively as Hoovervilles.
Herbert Hoover - U.S. Presidents - HISTORY.com

It's important to remember many parts of the country weren't booming in the '20's to begin with; farmers weren't doing well that decade, when a significant number of Americans lived in rural and small town areas, one reason being a huge portion of the manufacturing jobs went to immigrants, massive immigration levels after the Civil War and especially from the early 1880's on kept wages low, below even subsisitence level for many immigrants, so a 'boom' didn't mean much improvement for most people, native or immigrant, and a severe recession lasted into 1922, post -WW I. The ;middle class' was pretty small; few people had much of a buffer against hard times. As cheap as a Model T was, most people still had to borrow on credit to buy one.

3% employment is not a boom?

I doubt the unemployment rate was that low everywhere; Detroit, maybe.