The Slaughter Rule

[The Rabbi]

I think it's a con that people pay into a system where breach of contract occurs on a daily basis in the name of profit over people. Again, I'm not anti-profit...I'm anti-corruption.

I think it's a con that in years with record profits that companies use their leverage to drop people from coverage when it's very clear that's the risk that the insurance company undertook.

I could go on and on but that's a good start.

OK.
You realize those things do NOT happen on a daily basis. If they did, companies would get sued constantly and go out of business.
So other than you are operating on a misapprehension what else?

 

[Vanquish]

Yes. They do happen on a daily basis. It's one of the things that keeps me in business.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yes. They do happen on a daily basis. It's one of the things that keeps me in business.

Uh, no. They dont.
This is why the vast majority of Americans are satisfied with their health insurance coverage.

 

[saveliberty]

Yes. They do happen on a daily basis. It's one of the things that keeps me in business.

So if they "fix" these problems you have less business. Very ultruistic of you.

 

[California Girl]

Yeah, because you know what Obama's interaction with his constituency has been. You're his bodyman.

Yeah. Here he is with his constituency. That's Andy Stern, head of SEIU on the right.

Andy Stern.... now there's a real nice guy..... "We use the power of persuasion. And if that doesn't work we use the persuasion of power." Yep, a real charmer. Damned Union Thug.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yeah, because you know what Obama's interaction with his constituency has been. You're his bodyman.

Yeah. Here he is with his constituency. That's Andy Stern, head of SEIU on the right.

Andy Stern.... now there's a real nice guy..... "We use the power of persuasion. And if that doesn't work we use the persuasion of power." Yep, a real charmer. Damned Union Thug.

And Obama's go-to guy on healthcare. His own words.

 

[BasicGreatGuy]

There is nothing constitutional about the Slaughter rule.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Mark levin on the rule
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIt2qCiml3g]YouTube - slaughter rule[/ame]

 

[saveliberty]

Yeah. Here he is with his constituency. That's Andy Stern, head of SEIU on the right.

Andy Stern.... now there's a real nice guy..... "We use the power of persuasion. And if that doesn't work we use the persuasion of power." Yep, a real charmer. Damned Union Thug.

And Obama's go-to guy on healthcare. His own words.

A bunch of rope pushers. Come on guys, push harder.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

There is no question this is tyranny .

 

[PatekPhilippe]

There is no question this is tyranny .

True...and it will be dealt with accordingly.

 

[gautama]

There is no question this is tyranny .

True...and it will be dealt with accordingly.

Not accordingly.

The TYRANT Marxist Muslim PC Protector Obami Salami will not be shot, or imprisoned.....or even deported to his RAPIST and MURDERING COMMIE cousin ODINGA, leader of the ruling COMMIE "Orange Democratic Party" of Kenya where ODINGA is known as the "AFRICAN STALIN".

However, this MONUMENTAL FRAUD will be tossed out on his ear in 2012.

 

[gautama]

Vanquish,

I suppose that you are unaware that you're a POMPOUS ASS with your "holier than thou" pedagogical instruction that:

"We're all in this together so if you're insulting people in your posts, you're getting ignored."

Read this quote:

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself."
Tullius Cicero (106-43 BC)

And, let me ask you this philosophical question: which has been more dangerous to America considering the Vietnam War, the two wars with removing the Baghdad Monster, or even now.....our new kind of war....the "war" with Al Queda whom we KNOW we can reduce to impotence eventually.......these.....or the "ENEMY WITHIN" ???

WHO IS LIKELY TO DAMAGE AMERICA MORE ......

ESPECIALLY NOW......when the ENEMY WITHIN....THE MARXIST Muslim PC Protector Obami Salami and his OBAMARRHOIDS are on the verge of PERMANENTLY SUBVERTING the FOUNDATION of our Country.....the VERY FOUNDATION that has made our BELOVED COUNTRY BY FAR the GREATEST COUNTRY in MANKIND'S HISTORY by subverting the (1) CONSTITUTION of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA....and (2) The ENLIGHTENED CAPITALISM that basically flows out of our SACRED DOCUMENT and accounted for our ECONOMIC SUPERIORITY for over 200 YEARS ??????

Clearly, if you're not one of the DEMENTED OBAMARRHOIDS or a POMPOUS "CENTRIST".....IT IS THE "ENEMY WITHIN" !!!!

THESE OBAMANATIONS WITHIN are OBVIOUSLY more dangerous than our ENEMIES WITHAL.

IOW, THESE are WORSE than our other enemies.

Hence, INSULTING THIS SCUM is "fair game".

As a matter of fact, it is a highly salubrious activity in REALISTICALLY describing them for who they are: ARSEHOLES !!!

So, Vanquish, you can take your precious "IGNORE" and shove it up your arse.

 

[FA_Q2]

vanquish
What's so hard to believe about a bunch of smaller reform bills working is that Republicans want to kill everything that BO wants to do at all. Why is it so hard to understand that if Republicans are going to force kill the issue of healthcare...that BO's got to get it done as quickly as possible.

YOU PEOPLE are the reason why it's being rammed through faster. You're the catalyst. If you'd just have played ball and compromised even some...this would have been a much different process.

Quite possible but it would still be the bloated crap that it is. The crap that IS in this bill is to get more dems to pass it AND pleas the special interest groups. Small bills would pass because the R’s would have no ground to fight it. Using that strategy, BO could force the R’s to vote it or commit political suicide in a time that they are already dying out. The problem is that I do not believe BO wants true healthcare reform and smaller bills would not allow him to insert the ideology and kickbacks that are in this bill.

I actually don’t know about the public option as I was very surprised to see the dems drop it. Honestly, no R support was gained from dropping it so I am not so sure that it was a concession for them. If that was the case, why not reinsert it after no political gains were made. As has been pointed out, the dems could have passed this with 0 republican support but they were unable to do so.

vanquish
Because it takes those taxes to enact the reform. What's so hard to understand. Just because there's a delay in the implementation doesnt mean the money is being wasted. That's like saying...yeah it'll take us 5 years before we can finish this rocket...I guess we shouldn't go to the moon. Holy crap?!! You mean it's not instant!!??

And we were doing so good…. Don’t be dishonest. The 4 year delay and current tax is to keep a promise that it stay deficit neutral. The fact is that it is not neutral but a HUGE drain on taxes. So much so that it takes 10 years of taxes to pay for 6 years of benefits. This is one of my MAJOR problems with this bill – in the beginning the problem was that healthcare costs were skyrocketing out of control and needed to be curbed. Then we introduce a bill that not only fails to address this problem but actually is likely causes healthcare to INCREASE.

vanquish
Why is it that if it doesn't take effect for 4 years is it such an emergency? See the answer above. Please tell me you're not denying that healthcare reform is needed? That insurance companies aren't screwing people over and using their humongous leverage to pervert the system?

Cant speak for him but… conceded.
Everyone should understand this by now. I belive that BO sensationalized it and is making it a bigger problem then it is but that is how things get done. There is never support of anything in this country unless it is going to end the world tomarrow

Rabbi
The insurance industry is not a con. Government regulation of it is the con.

+1 – most of those regs engineered by the insurance company much like the mandate. That is one facet that needs to be reformed. Can I smell one small bill in the works?

vanquish
Government regulation isn't the con. I bet you think that insurance companies really want to help people. I bet you think that no one ever gets dropped for a bad reason. Ohhhh to live in that fantasy world. Regulation of insurance is necessary, dare I say it, for the government to protect people. I'm sure in your world all government protections overstep the boundaries of the constitution...but that's not the case.

Yes it is as most of that regulation protects the company and not the customer. Another serious issue in the healthcare industry. Regulations need to be eliminated and new ones placed that protect people with previous conditions and help prevent people from being dropped because of cost.

vanquish
It's a shame you don’t understand that sometimes things have a lead time. Don't know how to explain that one further.

We understand lead time quite well. What we do not understand is the dishonest way HCR funding is using that lead time. All those taxes that are collected are NOT building systems. An excruciatingly small percentage will be the start up money. Most is saved for the entitlement, if it actually gets saved!



Oh no Gautama is here to hijack the thread. Stay focused here vanquish, I know he can be tempting but it will kill the thread in the end and I have waited months to find one person here that is actally willing to have a true debate about healthcare

 

[Vanquish]

Vanquish,

I suppose that you are unaware that you're a POMPOUS ASS with your "holier than thou" pedagogical instruction that:

"We're all in this together so if you're insulting people in your posts, you're getting ignored."

Read this quote:

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself."
Tullius Cicero (106-43 BC)

And, let me ask you this philosophical question: which has been more dangerous to America considering the Vietnam War, the two wars with removing the Baghdad Monster, or even now.....our new kind of war....the "war" with Al Queda whom we KNOW we can reduce to impotence eventually.......these.....or the "ENEMY WITHIN" ???

WHO IS LIKELY TO DAMAGE AMERICA MORE ......

ESPECIALLY NOW......when the ENEMY WITHIN....THE MARXIST Muslim PC Protector Obami Salami and his OBAMARRHOIDS are on the verge of PERMANENTLY SUBVERTING the FOUNDATION of our Country.....the VERY FOUNDATION that has made our BELOVED COUNTRY BY FAR the GREATEST COUNTRY in MANKIND'S HISTORY by subverting the (1) CONSTITUTION of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA....and (2) The ENLIGHTENED CAPITALISM that basically flows out of our SACRED DOCUMENT and accounted for our ECONOMIC SUPERIORITY for over 200 YEARS ??????

Clearly, if you're not one of the DEMENTED OBAMARRHOIDS or a POMPOUS "CENTRIST".....IT IS THE "ENEMY WITHIN" !!!!

THESE OBAMANATIONS WITHIN are OBVIOUSLY more dangerous than our ENEMIES WITHAL.

IOW, THESE are WORSE than our other enemies.

Hence, INSULTING THIS SCUM is "fair game".

As a matter of fact, it is a highly salubrious activity in REALISTICALLY describing them for who they are: ARSEHOLES !!!

So, Vanquish, you can take your precious "IGNORE" and shove it up your arse.

Call me trollish, but reading this warmed my heart.

Being a centrist doesnt make you elitist. It doesnt make you pompous or condescending or any of the other things you've said.

When I came to this forum and lurked, before I ever posted I made myself a promise...not to be a partisan hack ...and not to insult people. I dont think that telling people that "if you're insulting people in your posts, you're getting ignored" is out of bounds at all.

How does insulting someone advance your argument? It doesn't. How does it make the people on "your side" look better by calling someone an arsehole? It doesnt.

You may think that the level of damage being done to this country is SOOO high that defending it takes extreme measures. I believe you have the right to express your views and work to achieve them....but when you insult people, you're not converting minds, you're solidifying them. When you insult people you make yourself seem irrational and unworthy of listening to.

And I'm not casting the first stone...I haven't 100% held true to my promise to myself not to insult. I've really tried hard though. It's hard to "debate" someone like CMike who accuses me of wanting to harm Americans/being a terrorist sympathizer....and not want to type something with the wrath of God behind it.

I'm just as much a protector of our constitution as anyone. So don't expect to be listened to if you're going to insult me. Those are my ground rules whether you like it or not.

 

[Vanquish]

vanquish
What's so hard to believe about a bunch of smaller reform bills working is that Republicans want to kill everything that BO wants to do at all. Why is it so hard to understand that if Republicans are going to force kill the issue of healthcare...that BO's got to get it done as quickly as possible.

YOU PEOPLE are the reason why it's being rammed through faster. You're the catalyst. If you'd just have played ball and compromised even some...this would have been a much different process.

Quite possible but it would still be the bloated crap that it is. The crap that IS in this bill is to get more dems to pass it AND pleas the special interest groups. Small bills would pass because the R’s would have no ground to fight it. Using that strategy, BO could force the R’s to vote it or commit political suicide in a time that they are already dying out. The problem is that I do not believe BO wants true healthcare reform and smaller bills would not allow him to insert the ideology and kickbacks that are in this bill.

I actually don’t know about the public option as I was very surprised to see the dems drop it. Honestly, no R support was gained from dropping it so I am not so sure that it was a concession for them. If that was the case, why not reinsert it after no political gains were made. As has been pointed out, the dems could have passed this with 0 republican support but they were unable to do so.

vanquish
Because it takes those taxes to enact the reform. What's so hard to understand. Just because there's a delay in the implementation doesnt mean the money is being wasted. That's like saying...yeah it'll take us 5 years before we can finish this rocket...I guess we shouldn't go to the moon. Holy crap?!! You mean it's not instant!!??

And we were doing so good…. Don’t be dishonest. The 4 year delay and current tax is to keep a promise that it stay deficit neutral. The fact is that it is not neutral but a HUGE drain on taxes. So much so that it takes 10 years of taxes to pay for 6 years of benefits. This is one of my MAJOR problems with this bill – in the beginning the problem was that healthcare costs were skyrocketing out of control and needed to be curbed. Then we introduce a bill that not only fails to address this problem but actually is likely causes healthcare to INCREASE.

Cant speak for him but… conceded.
Everyone should understand this by now. I belive that BO sensationalized it and is making it a bigger problem then it is but that is how things get done. There is never support of anything in this country unless it is going to end the world tomarrow

+1 – most of those regs engineered by the insurance company much like the mandate. That is one facet that needs to be reformed. Can I smell one small bill in the works?

vanquish
Government regulation isn't the con. I bet you think that insurance companies really want to help people. I bet you think that no one ever gets dropped for a bad reason. Ohhhh to live in that fantasy world. Regulation of insurance is necessary, dare I say it, for the government to protect people. I'm sure in your world all government protections overstep the boundaries of the constitution...but that's not the case.

Yes it is as most of that regulation protects the company and not the customer. Another serious issue in the healthcare industry. Regulations need to be eliminated and new ones placed that protect people with previous conditions and help prevent people from being dropped because of cost.

vanquish
It's a shame you don’t understand that sometimes things have a lead time. Don't know how to explain that one further.

We understand lead time quite well. What we do not understand is the dishonest way HCR funding is using that lead time. All those taxes that are collected are NOT building systems. An excruciatingly small percentage will be the start up money. Most is saved for the entitlement, if it actually gets saved!



Oh no Gautama is here to hijack the thread. Stay focused here vanquish, I know he can be tempting but it will kill the thread in the end and I have waited months to find one person here that is actally willing to have a true debate about healthcare

Sorry...you predicted it! ha ha. I got sidetracked.

Here goes...

I actually agree with most of what you've said. If the amount of money for the lead time is small...and there's no way we can keep filling the Ponzi scheme bucket...then I'm against it. Not simply conceding so I wont have to argue...but I really do feel that way. Where do I find out the real numbers on this. I'd love to really get to learn more.

And I agree with you that most regulations protect the insurance companies. Hell, I'll even admit that the rumors that BO struck deals with Big Pharma could possibly be true.

I really do think that starting over would be the best thing to do...but I'm afraid that if we do...nothing will get done EVER. There's been nothing to make me think otherwise. Yeah, that sounds like me saying "do something mostly bad so we can get some slight good." And I'm coming clean about that. I just dont see an alternative.

 

[gautama]

FA_Q2 stated:

"Oh no Gautama is here to hijack the thread. Stay focused here vanquish, I know he can be tempting but it will kill the thread in the end and I have waited months to find one person here that is actally willing to have a true debate about healthcare."

FA-Q2, I TRY not to return "Friendly Fire" even if it is done by FOOLS like you (ONLY referring to this matter, to my knowledge). FOOLS, who do not see the value of such measures in quaffing the INSULTING CRAP of our political adversaries.

 

[gautama]

Vanquish,

I suppose that you are unaware that you're a POMPOUS ASS with your "holier than thou" pedagogical instruction that:

"We're all in this together so if you're insulting people in your posts, you're getting ignored."

Read this quote:

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself."
Tullius Cicero (106-43 BC)

And, let me ask you this philosophical question: which has been more dangerous to America considering the Vietnam War, the two wars with removing the Baghdad Monster, or even now.....our new kind of war....the "war" with Al Queda whom we KNOW we can reduce to impotence eventually.......these.....or the "ENEMY WITHIN" ???

WHO IS LIKELY TO DAMAGE AMERICA MORE ......

ESPECIALLY NOW......when the ENEMY WITHIN....THE MARXIST Muslim PC Protector Obami Salami and his OBAMARRHOIDS are on the verge of PERMANENTLY SUBVERTING the FOUNDATION of our Country.....the VERY FOUNDATION that has made our BELOVED COUNTRY BY FAR the GREATEST COUNTRY in MANKIND'S HISTORY by subverting the (1) CONSTITUTION of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA....and (2) The ENLIGHTENED CAPITALISM that basically flows out of our SACRED DOCUMENT and accounted for our ECONOMIC SUPERIORITY for over 200 YEARS ??????

Clearly, if you're not one of the DEMENTED OBAMARRHOIDS or a POMPOUS "CENTRIST".....IT IS THE "ENEMY WITHIN" !!!!

THESE OBAMANATIONS WITHIN are OBVIOUSLY more dangerous than our ENEMIES WITHAL.

IOW, THESE are WORSE than our other enemies.

Hence, INSULTING THIS SCUM is "fair game".

As a matter of fact, it is a highly salubrious activity in REALISTICALLY describing them for who they are: ARSEHOLES !!!

So, Vanquish, you can take your precious "IGNORE" and shove it up your arse.

Call me trollish, but reading this warmed my heart.

Being a centrist doesnt make you elitist. It doesnt make you pompous or condescending or any of the other things you've said.

When I came to this forum and lurked, before I ever posted I made myself a promise...not to be a partisan hack ...and not to insult people. I dont think that telling people that "if you're insulting people in your posts, you're getting ignored" is out of bounds at all.

How does insulting someone advance your argument? It doesn't. How does it make the people on "your side" look better by calling someone an arsehole? It doesnt.

You may think that the level of damage being done to this country is SOOO high that defending it takes extreme measures. I believe you have the right to express your views and work to achieve them....but when you insult people, you're not converting minds, you're solidifying them. When you insult people you make yourself seem irrational and unworthy of listening to.

And I'm not casting the first stone...I haven't 100% held true to my promise to myself not to insult. I've really tried hard though. It's hard to "debate" someone like CMike who accuses me of wanting to harm Americans/being a terrorist sympathizer....and not want to type something with the wrath of God behind it.

I'm just as much a protector of our constitution as anyone. So don't expect to be listened to if you're going to insult me. Those are my ground rules whether you like it or not.

The POMPOUS Pedagogical ASS:

YES !!! I think that when we have an ENEMY who is more dangerous than ANY ENEMY IN OUR ~200 YEAR HISTORY......PERHAPS....PERHAPS.....EVEN AS DANGEROUS AS HITLER.....WHOM WE KNOW (in retrospect) THAT IS NOT......I REPEAT.....NOT.....as DANGEROUS AS THE MARXIST Muslim PC Protector Obami Salami ...... then YES, and a THOUSAND TIMES YES......we should do everything we can within LEGAL BOUNDS to stop this POLITICAL MONSTER and his POISONOUS STOOGES.

The POLITICAL MONSTER, and his STOOGES who are actively attempting to DESTROY the FOUNDATION of our BELOVED COUNTRY by DESTROYING THE "ESSENCE OF OUR
COUNTRY" WHICH IS (1) OUR SACRED CONSTITUTION of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA. And (2) The Economic System that practically flows out of our SACRED DOCUMENT, The Economic System that made us the GREATEST NATION IN MANKIND'S HISTORY: THE ENLIGHTENED CAPITALISM !!!

And, you shouldn't dismiss CMIKE in your ALL KNOWING, condescending manner, as though it is YOU that has the MORAL HIGH GROUND in the treatment of America's MOST DANGEROUS ENEMY IN OUR 200 YEAR HISTORY. For, YOU ARE harming Americans with your defense of their CRAP. YOU ARE, probably an unwitting, "TERRORIST SYMPATHIZER".

Political Idiots who whine, or decry against the RIGHTEOUSLY outraged citizens' (whom you call "Party Hacks") INSULTS against this HORRENDOUS "ENEMY WITHIN" .....or, IOW......"OBAMANATION WITHIN" should look again into their hearts and ask themselves again: Is it righteous, or efficacious to INSULT, or in other words REALISTICALLY DESCRIBE THE MONSTER AND HIS STOOGES for whom they are.

 

[txlonghorn]

Slaughter Rule defines and solidifies the lefts commitment to do the opposite of what Obama promised we would have in Washington if he was elected...transparency and bi partisanship.

The Party of No will prevail in 2010 and 2012 and the Party of **** You will be in shambles.

Nancy Pelosi and her brood of leftist hooligans may not care what the American People think or feel right now, but they soon will.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

vanquish
What's so hard to believe about a bunch of smaller reform bills working is that Republicans want to kill everything that BO wants to do at all. Why is it so hard to understand that if Republicans are going to force kill the issue of healthcare...that BO's got to get it done as quickly as possible.

YOU PEOPLE are the reason why it's being rammed through faster. You're the catalyst. If you'd just have played ball and compromised even some...this would have been a much different process.

Quite possible but it would still be the bloated crap that it is. The crap that IS in this bill is to get more dems to pass it AND pleas the special interest groups. Small bills would pass because the R’s would have no ground to fight it. Using that strategy, BO could force the R’s to vote it or commit political suicide in a time that they are already dying out. The problem is that I do not believe BO wants true healthcare reform and smaller bills would not allow him to insert the ideology and kickbacks that are in this bill.

I actually don’t know about the public option as I was very surprised to see the dems drop it. Honestly, no R support was gained from dropping it so I am not so sure that it was a concession for them. If that was the case, why not reinsert it after no political gains were made. As has been pointed out, the dems could have passed this with 0 republican support but they were unable to do so.


And we were doing so good…. Don’t be dishonest. The 4 year delay and current tax is to keep a promise that it stay deficit neutral. The fact is that it is not neutral but a HUGE drain on taxes. So much so that it takes 10 years of taxes to pay for 6 years of benefits. This is one of my MAJOR problems with this bill – in the beginning the problem was that healthcare costs were skyrocketing out of control and needed to be curbed. Then we introduce a bill that not only fails to address this problem but actually is likely causes healthcare to INCREASE.

Cant speak for him but… conceded.
Everyone should understand this by now. I belive that BO sensationalized it and is making it a bigger problem then it is but that is how things get done. There is never support of anything in this country unless it is going to end the world tomarrow

+1 – most of those regs engineered by the insurance company much like the mandate. That is one facet that needs to be reformed. Can I smell one small bill in the works?


Yes it is as most of that regulation protects the company and not the customer. Another serious issue in the healthcare industry. Regulations need to be eliminated and new ones placed that protect people with previous conditions and help prevent people from being dropped because of cost.

vanquish
It's a shame you don’t understand that sometimes things have a lead time. Don't know how to explain that one further.

We understand lead time quite well. What we do not understand is the dishonest way HCR funding is using that lead time. All those taxes that are collected are NOT building systems. An excruciatingly small percentage will be the start up money. Most is saved for the entitlement, if it actually gets saved!



Oh no Gautama is here to hijack the thread. Stay focused here vanquish, I know he can be tempting but it will kill the thread in the end and I have waited months to find one person here that is actally willing to have a true debate about healthcare

Sorry...you predicted it! ha ha. I got sidetracked.

Here goes...

I actually agree with most of what you've said. If the amount of money for the lead time is small...and there's no way we can keep filling the Ponzi scheme bucket...then I'm against it. Not simply conceding so I wont have to argue...but I really do feel that way. Where do I find out the real numbers on this. I'd love to really get to learn more.

And I agree with you that most regulations protect the insurance companies. Hell, I'll even admit that the rumors that BO struck deals with Big Pharma could possibly be true.

I really do think that starting over would be the best thing to do...but I'm afraid that if we do...nothing will get done EVER. There's been nothing to make me think otherwise. Yeah, that sounds like me saying "do something mostly bad so we can get some slight good." And I'm coming clean about that. I just dont see an alternative.

You are a true statesman of our times

Delay is preferable to error.
Thomas Jefferson

Bill Clinton
"It's not important to be perfect here. It's important to act, to move, to start...