The painful truth about Ahmaud Arberry

[CHAZBUKOWSKI]

I'm eager to see what happens in this case.

Everyone watches the video and comes to their own conclusion. In my opinion, as a staunch supporter of the 2nd Amendment and concealed carry permit holder, I believe the only way Travis McMichael avoids the death penalty is if he makes a deal. I believe Gregory McMichael goes to prison for a minimum of 20 years. I may be a bit off on both of those, but they're both going to spend a long time in prison.

They armed themselves, chased down someone down and killed him. And they have it on video. Those are facts. Was Arbury a thief? I dunno', sure. Let's say he was. Did Gregory and Travis McMichael actually witness him stealing anything? No, by their own admission they did not. His previous actions did not justify the actions taken by the McMichael's boys.

Oh, and to a point made by the OP, I haven't seen a single thing which says the younger McMichael was a former law enforcement professional. Frankly, the guy looks like he'd have a difficult time dressing himself...

Travis McMichael was trained by the US military in law enforcement and it's perfectly legal to arm yourself and Chase someone you suspect of committing a crime in the state of Georgia and if that person decides to violently attack you you're allowed to defend yourself as well

The rub here is that they did not chase him because they witnessed him committing a crime. They chased him because they thought he resembled a suspect in previous break ins.

they are going to prison, whether or not they were sincere in their intentions. And that will be the end of it.

They chased him because they recognized him from the photos they'd seen as a wanted individual

that's the same reason they chased Richard The Night Stalker Ramirez

If you want to make it illegal for people to chase someone unless they've actually seen them commit a proper felony you do realize it's going to change the world as we know it

if I see a man running out of my neighbor's house covered in blood in a panic I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

if I saw a man running down the street holding a ladies purse while a woman screamed on the ground and pointed in his Direction I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

Citizen's arrest goes back to English common law

if you have reasonable suspicion that someone has committed a crime it should be perfectly reasonable for you to ask that person to wait for the police to arrive and if they violently attacked you in an attempt to escape it should be perfectly reasonable for you to defend yourself

if you think the arrest is illegal you should sue them in a court of law but don't try to grab their gun and punch them in the throat

Can you post a link to the police wanted posters with his picture? I cannot locate it anywhere.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Did TM shoot AA because he tried to get past to their truck or because he grabbed his gun and started punching him in the face?

You don’t know do you? But we know TM told police that he shot AA when it looked like he was going to attack. TM did not tell police that he fired a shot only after being punched in the face. you’d think TM would remember getting punched in the head before firing the first shot.

But the video shows AA throwing punches about 3/4 second after the first shot was fired while out of view of the camera.

So you don’t know what happened when both men were hidden by the truck.

So we will have to take TM at his word that he shot AA when he thought AA was sqaring up to attack.

You are an idiot if you think it does not matter what TM told police.

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

I'm eager to see what happens in this case.

Everyone watches the video and comes to their own conclusion. In my opinion, as a staunch supporter of the 2nd Amendment and concealed carry permit holder, I believe the only way Travis McMichael avoids the death penalty is if he makes a deal. I believe Gregory McMichael goes to prison for a minimum of 20 years. I may be a bit off on both of those, but they're both going to spend a long time in prison.

They armed themselves, chased down someone down and killed him. And they have it on video. Those are facts. Was Arbury a thief? I dunno', sure. Let's say he was. Did Gregory and Travis McMichael actually witness him stealing anything? No, by their own admission they did not. His previous actions did not justify the actions taken by the McMichael's boys.

Oh, and to a point made by the OP, I haven't seen a single thing which says the younger McMichael was a former law enforcement professional. Frankly, the guy looks like he'd have a difficult time dressing himself...

Travis McMichael was trained by the US military in law enforcement and it's perfectly legal to arm yourself and Chase someone you suspect of committing a crime in the state of Georgia and if that person decides to violently attack you you're allowed to defend yourself as well

The rub here is that they did not chase him because they witnessed him committing a crime. They chased him because they thought he resembled a suspect in previous break ins.

they are going to prison, whether or not they were sincere in their intentions. And that will be the end of it.

They chased him because they recognized him from the photos they'd seen as a wanted individual

that's the same reason they chased Richard The Night Stalker Ramirez

If you want to make it illegal for people to chase someone unless they've actually seen them commit a proper felony you do realize it's going to change the world as we know it

if I see a man running out of my neighbor's house covered in blood in a panic I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

if I saw a man running down the street holding a ladies purse while a woman screamed on the ground and pointed in his Direction I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

Citizen's arrest goes back to English common law

if you have reasonable suspicion that someone has committed a crime it should be perfectly reasonable for you to ask that person to wait for the police to arrive and if they violently attacked you in an attempt to escape it should be perfectly reasonable for you to defend yourself

if you think the arrest is illegal you should sue them in a court of law but don't try to grab their gun and punch them in the throat

Can you post a link to the police wanted posters with his picture? I cannot locate it anywhere.

nope, larry english deleted them all as soon as he started getting death threats but the multiple police reports remain

 

[SavannahMann]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

Did TM shoot AA because he tried to get past to their truck or because he grabbed his gun and started punching him in the face?

You don’t know do you? But we know TM told police that he shot AA when it looked like he was going to attack. TM did not tell police that he fired a shot only after being punched in the face. you’d think TM would remember getting punched in the head before firing the first shot.

But the video shows AA throwing punches about 3/4 second after the first shot was fired while out of view of the camera.

So you don’t know what happened when both men were hidden by the truck.

So we will have to take TM at his word that he shot AA when he thought AA was sqaring up to attack.

You are an idiot if you think it does not matter what TM told police.

so that proves that he was FORCED to shoot arberry durring the attack completely debunking the REDICLIOUS narritive of a RACIALLY MOTIVATED MURDER of an innocent unarmed black jogger gunned down in the street as he fled from armed men CHASING him

Travis shot AFTER Arberry cut around the front of the truck as arberry was engaged in a felony assault

The fact that he took three point-blank shotgun blast to the chest also proves that Travis McMichael was using a much less deadly type of ammunition then you could buy in your neighborhood Walmart debunking the myth that he was out for murder

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

 

[SavannahMann]

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

One of these days you need to start writing your lies down. It is easier to remember them. First you had experience in the law because you were a public safety expert with twenty years experience. Then you had to make decisions every day on if you could arrest someone. Now. You have years of experience around the world and really appreciate the Old English Common Law.

It is getting hard to keep up with your perpetually changing stories.

While in the Army, I went to Central America. Saudi Arabia. Iraq. I was also briefly in Europe.

I have also lived in eight states. As a Trucker. I drove through many of the others. Actually all of them except three.

Now. Back to the Army. There are a dozen sayings. But in general they boil down to how to live. Old pilots and bold pilots. But very few old bold pilots as one example.

Now there may come a point where you have to charge down the guns in a suicidal attack. But you are desperately seeking that situation. Let me tell you what happens when you get brave.

Yes. You get dead. They may give a shiny piece of tin to your survivors. Your name will go into a history that nobody will ever read. And you will probably get several people killed along with you.

Since you have no first hand experience. Let me give you a cinematic example. We Were Soldiers. The Platoon Leader charged off after an enemy taking the platoon with him. He wanted a prisoner. What he got was dead and half his platoon with him. The lessons from that in my Leadership Training Course was that the Sergeant was the good leader. He kept as many of those soldiers alive as possible. He never stopped.

Sergeant Savage was the real Soldier. He never lost sight of the mission and his duty. He did not go seeking glory. He did not want to prove he was Billy Badass. He just wanted to keep his men alive.

And let me tell you something about Heroes. We are not looking to be one in the Army. Because the Heroics are only needed when everything has gone to shit. Heroes show up after Mr. Murphy has arrived. They are last desperate measures when every alternative is bad.

Watch a movie called The Outpost. Nobody wanted to be there. They fought heroically because the alternative was certain death.

Soldiers prefer things go according to plan. We prefer it because then we live to fight another day. To quote Patton. You don’t win wars by dying for your country.

I reference the movies because you obviously have no experience outside of Mass Media.

You say little balls. I crawled into enemy bunkers sweeping for booby traps. I shot it out with the enemy in a short but vicious firefight. A lot of fellow Engineers died being brave and stupid. They were dealing with unexplored cluster bombs.

America’s Dark History of Killing Its Own Troops With Cluster Munitions (Published 2019)

The weapons are notorious for their effects on civilians. But five years of reporting and hundreds of interviews have revealed they’ve also killed and wounded scores of Americans.

www.nytimes.com

First. You need to realize that the rules for explosives are written in blood. The way we know it is a bad idea is that someone died trying it that way. The book says to explode the munitions in place. They have been exposed to an explosion and are sensitized. Anything can set them off. Do not pick them up. Do not move them. Blow them in place.

Friends of mine died moving them to a more efficient location for mass destruction. Brave. And stupid.

I stayed alive. Because my leaders were not dumb enough to give that order. And I survived the booby traps because I took my time and did it right. To quote Sergeant Stansfjeld one of my instructors. I had the rest of my life to get it right.

I survived. Everyone in my platoon survived. Everyone in my Company lived. And the Battalion returned home with zero KIA.

One of the first steps to solving a problem. Figure out what is going on. You want everyone to be courageous and charge in ignorant as they can be.

While our notional paramedic is standing and debating with you your neighbor is bleeding out. Seconds count. And you are wasting far too many imagining yourself as a hero.

You would be the villain. And one day you are liable to be that villain as you go headlong into a situation you have no understanding of. Or you will be dead.

Georgia Law is set up to empower those who know what is going on. And dissuade those who like you are clueless fools looking to emulate Dirty Harry.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Travis shot AFTER Arberry cut around the front of the truck as arberry was engaged in a felony assault

m

What Georgia statute are you citing that says (running past a truck on the passenger side to try to get past a deranged shotgun brandishing whacko who was standing on the driver’s side) is a felony under Georgia law.

TM told police he shot AA in the chest when he assumed AA was going to attack. So since AA did not attack TM until after he was shot on the wrist the defense you are presenting has been shot down by your defendants own testimony.

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

Travis shot AFTER Arberry cut around the front of the truck as arberry was engaged in a felony assault

m

What Georgia statute are you citing that says (running past a truck on the passenger side to try to get past a deranged shotgun brandishing whacko who was standing on the driver’s side) is a felony under Georgia law.

TM told police he shot AA in the chest when he assumed AA was going to attack. So since AA did not attack TM until after he was shot on the wrist the defense you are presenting has been shot down by your defendants own testimony.

It was the grabbing of the gun and the punching that was the felony NOT the CHARGING around the truck part

the charging around the truck just proves that he was about to commit a felony assault by charging and of course he did

The simple fact that Arberry ran directly at the McMichaels for such a long distance and then attacked them is an absolute deadlock that he wasn't afraid of them and in fact planned to attack the entire time...he was just looking for his opportunity and decided to Ambush Travis by pulling that quick sneak attack around the front of the truck

The McMichaels had been standing their ground for some time when arberry ran the better part of a football field and charged around the truck with a quick 90-degree juke move and tried to beat a weapon out of the hands of Travis McMichael

A stupid move to be sure but he was a mentally retarded Criminal afterall

I was looking at the road he ran down buy a satellite photography this afternoon and I was surprised to notice how many wooded areas were around... this isn't a heavily urbanized area there were ample opportunities for him to break into the woods and lose them in a jiffy

A young athletic man with a background in football has no reason to let himself get trapped on the roadway when he could simply jump a few fences or bolt through some trees and completely lose three chubby middle-aged rednecks

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

One of these days you need to start writing your lies down. It is easier to remember them. First you had experience in the law because you were a public safety expert with twenty years experience. Then you had to make decisions every day on if you could arrest someone. Now. You have years of experience around the world and really appreciate the Old English Common Law.

It is getting hard to keep up with your perpetually changing stories.

While in the Army, I went to Central America. Saudi Arabia. Iraq. I was also briefly in Europe.

I have also lived in eight states. As a Trucker. I drove through many of the others. Actually all of them except three.

Now. Back to the Army. There are a dozen sayings. But in general they boil down to how to live. Old pilots and bold pilots. But very few old bold pilots as one example.

Now there may come a point where you have to charge down the guns in a suicidal attack. But you are desperately seeking that situation. Let me tell you what happens when you get brave.

Yes. You get dead. They may give a shiny piece of tin to your survivors. Your name will go into a history that nobody will ever read. And you will probably get several people killed along with you.

Since you have no first hand experience. Let me give you a cinematic example. We Were Soldiers. The Platoon Leader charged off after an enemy taking the platoon with him. He wanted a prisoner. What he got was dead and half his platoon with him. The lessons from that in my Leadership Training Course was that the Sergeant was the good leader. He kept as many of those soldiers alive as possible. He never stopped.

Sergeant Savage was the real Soldier. He never lost sight of the mission and his duty. He did not go seeking glory. He did not want to prove he was Billy Badass. He just wanted to keep his men alive.

And let me tell you something about Heroes. We are not looking to be one in the Army. Because the Heroics are only needed when everything has gone to shit. Heroes show up after Mr. Murphy has arrived. They are last desperate measures when every alternative is bad.

Watch a movie called The Outpost. Nobody wanted to be there. They fought heroically because the alternative was certain death.

Soldiers prefer things go according to plan. We prefer it because then we live to fight another day. To quote Patton. You don’t win wars by dying for your country.

I reference the movies because you obviously have no experience outside of Mass Media.

You say little balls. I crawled into enemy bunkers sweeping for booby traps. I shot it out with the enemy in a short but vicious firefight. A lot of fellow Engineers died being brave and stupid. They were dealing with unexplored cluster bombs.

America’s Dark History of Killing Its Own Troops With Cluster Munitions (Published 2019)

The weapons are notorious for their effects on civilians. But five years of reporting and hundreds of interviews have revealed they’ve also killed and wounded scores of Americans.

www.nytimes.com

First. You need to realize that the rules for explosives are written in blood. The way we know it is a bad idea is that someone died trying it that way. The book says to explode the munitions in place. They have been exposed to an explosion and are sensitized. Anything can set them off. Do not pick them up. Do not move them. Blow them in place.

Friends of mine died moving them to a more efficient location for mass destruction. Brave. And stupid.

I stayed alive. Because my leaders were not dumb enough to give that order. And I survived the booby traps because I took my time and did it right. To quote Sergeant Stansfjeld one of my instructors. I had the rest of my life to get it right.

I survived. Everyone in my platoon survived. Everyone in my Company lived. And the Battalion returned home with zero KIA.

One of the first steps to solving a problem. Figure out what is going on. You want everyone to be courageous and charge in ignorant as they can be.

While our notional paramedic is standing and debating with you your neighbor is bleeding out. Seconds count. And you are wasting far too many imagining yourself as a hero.

You would be the villain. And one day you are liable to be that villain as you go headlong into a situation you have no understanding of. Or you will be dead.

Georgia Law is set up to empower those who know what is going on. And dissuade those who like you are clueless fools looking to emulate Dirty Harry.

just cuz you went to the desert to help a couple greedy Corporation steal a bunch of oil doesn't mean you're courageous

the fact that you'd sit there and crap yourself while a guy covered in blood runs out of your neighbor's front door is probably a good example why we keep losing these wars

must have got your balls blown off by an IED

 

[SavannahMann]

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

One of these days you need to start writing your lies down. It is easier to remember them. First you had experience in the law because you were a public safety expert with twenty years experience. Then you had to make decisions every day on if you could arrest someone. Now. You have years of experience around the world and really appreciate the Old English Common Law.

It is getting hard to keep up with your perpetually changing stories.

While in the Army, I went to Central America. Saudi Arabia. Iraq. I was also briefly in Europe.

I have also lived in eight states. As a Trucker. I drove through many of the others. Actually all of them except three.

Now. Back to the Army. There are a dozen sayings. But in general they boil down to how to live. Old pilots and bold pilots. But very few old bold pilots as one example.

Now there may come a point where you have to charge down the guns in a suicidal attack. But you are desperately seeking that situation. Let me tell you what happens when you get brave.

Yes. You get dead. They may give a shiny piece of tin to your survivors. Your name will go into a history that nobody will ever read. And you will probably get several people killed along with you.

Since you have no first hand experience. Let me give you a cinematic example. We Were Soldiers. The Platoon Leader charged off after an enemy taking the platoon with him. He wanted a prisoner. What he got was dead and half his platoon with him. The lessons from that in my Leadership Training Course was that the Sergeant was the good leader. He kept as many of those soldiers alive as possible. He never stopped.

Sergeant Savage was the real Soldier. He never lost sight of the mission and his duty. He did not go seeking glory. He did not want to prove he was Billy Badass. He just wanted to keep his men alive.

And let me tell you something about Heroes. We are not looking to be one in the Army. Because the Heroics are only needed when everything has gone to shit. Heroes show up after Mr. Murphy has arrived. They are last desperate measures when every alternative is bad.

Watch a movie called The Outpost. Nobody wanted to be there. They fought heroically because the alternative was certain death.

Soldiers prefer things go according to plan. We prefer it because then we live to fight another day. To quote Patton. You don’t win wars by dying for your country.

I reference the movies because you obviously have no experience outside of Mass Media.

You say little balls. I crawled into enemy bunkers sweeping for booby traps. I shot it out with the enemy in a short but vicious firefight. A lot of fellow Engineers died being brave and stupid. They were dealing with unexplored cluster bombs.

America’s Dark History of Killing Its Own Troops With Cluster Munitions (Published 2019)

The weapons are notorious for their effects on civilians. But five years of reporting and hundreds of interviews have revealed they’ve also killed and wounded scores of Americans.

www.nytimes.com

First. You need to realize that the rules for explosives are written in blood. The way we know it is a bad idea is that someone died trying it that way. The book says to explode the munitions in place. They have been exposed to an explosion and are sensitized. Anything can set them off. Do not pick them up. Do not move them. Blow them in place.

Friends of mine died moving them to a more efficient location for mass destruction. Brave. And stupid.

I stayed alive. Because my leaders were not dumb enough to give that order. And I survived the booby traps because I took my time and did it right. To quote Sergeant Stansfjeld one of my instructors. I had the rest of my life to get it right.

I survived. Everyone in my platoon survived. Everyone in my Company lived. And the Battalion returned home with zero KIA.

One of the first steps to solving a problem. Figure out what is going on. You want everyone to be courageous and charge in ignorant as they can be.

While our notional paramedic is standing and debating with you your neighbor is bleeding out. Seconds count. And you are wasting far too many imagining yourself as a hero.

You would be the villain. And one day you are liable to be that villain as you go headlong into a situation you have no understanding of. Or you will be dead.

Georgia Law is set up to empower those who know what is going on. And dissuade those who like you are clueless fools looking to emulate Dirty Harry.

just cuz you went to the desert to help a couple greedy Corporation steal a bunch of oil doesn't mean you're courageous

the fact that you'd sit there and crap yourself while a guy covered in blood runs out of your neighbor's front door is probably a good example why we keep losing these wars

must have got your balls blown off by an IED

Like I said earlier. You are free to do whatever you want. Just don’t scream it isn’t fair when the consequences arrive.

 

[Canon Shooter]

I'm eager to see what happens in this case.

Everyone watches the video and comes to their own conclusion. In my opinion, as a staunch supporter of the 2nd Amendment and concealed carry permit holder, I believe the only way Travis McMichael avoids the death penalty is if he makes a deal. I believe Gregory McMichael goes to prison for a minimum of 20 years. I may be a bit off on both of those, but they're both going to spend a long time in prison.

They armed themselves, chased down someone down and killed him. And they have it on video. Those are facts. Was Arbury a thief? I dunno', sure. Let's say he was. Did Gregory and Travis McMichael actually witness him stealing anything? No, by their own admission they did not. His previous actions did not justify the actions taken by the McMichael's boys.

Oh, and to a point made by the OP, I haven't seen a single thing which says the younger McMichael was a former law enforcement professional. Frankly, the guy looks like he'd have a difficult time dressing himself...

Travis McMichael was trained by the US military in law enforcement and it's perfectly legal to arm yourself and Chase someone you suspect of committing a crime in the state of Georgia and if that person decides to violently attack you you're allowed to defend yourself as well

The rub here is that they did not chase him because they witnessed him committing a crime. They chased him because they thought he resembled a suspect in previous break ins.

they are going to prison, whether or not they were sincere in their intentions. And that will be the end of it.

They chased him because they recognized him from the photos they'd seen as a wanted individual

that's the same reason they chased Richard The Night Stalker Ramirez

If you want to make it illegal for people to chase someone unless they've actually seen them commit a proper felony you do realize it's going to change the world as we know it

if I see a man running out of my neighbor's house covered in blood in a panic I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

if I saw a man running down the street holding a ladies purse while a woman screamed on the ground and pointed in his Direction I wouldn't be allowed to chase him

Citizen's arrest goes back to English common law

if you have reasonable suspicion that someone has committed a crime it should be perfectly reasonable for you to ask that person to wait for the police to arrive and if they violently attacked you in an attempt to escape it should be perfectly reasonable for you to defend yourself

if you think the arrest is illegal you should sue them in a court of law but don't try to grab their gun and punch them in the throat

Can you post a link to the police wanted posters with his picture? I cannot locate it anywhere.

nope, larry english deleted them all as soon as he started getting death threats but the multiple police reports remain
View attachment 434115

So Larry English is able to delete police documents (which a wanted poster is, by the way)?

The fact is that there never were any "WANTED" posters with Arbury's name and face on them.

You're lying again. Nothing more, nothing less...

 

[Canon Shooter]

I was looking at the road he ran down buy a satellite photography this afternoon and I was surprised to notice how many wooded areas were around... this isn't a heavily urbanized area there were ample opportunities for him to break into the woods and lose them in a jiffy

Yeah, it kinda' is.

I was there two weeks ago.

Please post a screen shot of where you think this happened...

 

[Canon Shooter]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

But none of that happened.

They just saw a black guy running. That's it. No blood, nothing.

And the very suggestion that you're a "real man" is laughable. You'd have to explain away that vagina of yours...

 

[whutTHEYsay]

The simple fact that Arberry ran directly at the McMichaels for such a long distance and then attacked them is an absolute deadlock that he wasn't afraid of them and in fact planned to attack the entire time...he was just looking for his opportunity and decided to Ambush Travis by pulling that quick sneak attack around the front of the truck

The reason we know you are a dumbass is because when AA changed direction to go around on the passenger side, TM was standing on the driver side between the open door and and the rear tire. TM was fully exposed because TM was standing with the open door to his back. If AA was planning to attack TM on the driver side by going around the truck on the passenger side he would have to run twenty feet to get to the front of the truck plus circle back another twenty feet to get around the open driver side door to have a open shot at punching a man with a shotgun in the head.

You are and idiot for suggesting such a stupid scenario. It’s obvious AA changed direction to get past TM with the full length and width of the truck as a shield.

AA’s escape plan was good except TM ran around to the front of the truck to interfere with AA’s escape. When TM shot AA on the hand AA quit the ‘flight’ plan and instinctively switched to ‘fight’.

Because TM ran around from the side of the truck with the loaded shotgun he initiated an attack and fired weapon. AA was wounded and fought back.

AA was murdered by three white men who chased and cornered him and they will be found guilty and hopefully spend the rest of their miserable lives in prison paying for what they did. Hopefully it stops other stupid men with guns from killing innocent jogging black men going forward.

 

[SavannahMann]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

But none of that happened.

They just saw a black guy running. That's it. No blood, nothing.

And the very suggestion that you're a "real man" is laughable. You'd have to explain away that vagina of yours...

Im not worried about what he says. I read a philosophy book that influenced me deeply. The Buddha said that there were three people in all of us. The person others saw us as. The person we saw ourselves as. And that which we truly were. The Buddha said the goal was to combine the three into one. People saw us as we saw ourselves. And we saw ourselves as we truly are.

I realized that The Buddha was enlightened. But he was wrong. My place in the universe could not be determined by someone else’s opinion. I could not imagine giving them that kind of power over me.

What is telling is his reaction. He detests soldiers. Claiming they have no courage. Yet he has never done it so it is the voice of at most an ASVAB reject. Someone who tried and flunked.

He detests anyone with knowledge. Like Pol Pot he would execute anyone who has read a book.

He is going to tell us what a “Real Man” would do. But he won’t actually do it himself. He won’t walk into the recruiters office and sign his life away. He won’t study and try to get in. He won’t put it on the line day in and out. He does not actually risk anything but a sprained finger pounding a keyboard.

He lies about his experience. He lies about what he said. He lies constantly.

Maybe he is too dumb. Maybe he is too fat. Maybe he is just too scared. Maybe his fear is what drives his self loathing to make him lash out at anyone who knows more than he does. Obviously he has issues.

Honestly. I am glad he never joined the Military. The troops have enough problems without a nut like him making everything harder.

He is like those little mutant dogs. You know the ones. They are vicious and snarling all the time. I honestly think that those little dogs are a great analogy for him. All snarling and barking and threats and completely unable to back it up.

He does not know what bad really is. He doesn’t know what dangerous really is. And I honestly hope he never finds out. Because not only will he die. But probably others will die from his wanton stupidity.

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

The simple fact that Arberry ran directly at the McMichaels for such a long distance and then attacked them is an absolute deadlock that he wasn't afraid of them and in fact planned to attack the entire time...he was just looking for his opportunity and decided to Ambush Travis by pulling that quick sneak attack around the front of the truck

The reason we know you are a dumbass is because when AA changed direction to go around on the passenger side, TM was standing on the driver side between the open door and and the rear tire. TM was fully exposed because TM was standing with the open door to his back. If AA was planning to attack TM on the driver side by going around the truck on the passenger side he would have to run twenty feet to get to the front of the truck plus circle back another twenty feet to get around the open driver side door to have a open shot at punching a man with a shotgun in the head.

You are and idiot for suggesting such a stupid scenario. It’s obvious AA changed direction to get past TM with the full length and width of the truck as a shield.

AA’s escape plan was good except TM ran around to the front of the truck to interfere with AA’s escape. When TM shot AA on the hand AA quit the ‘flight’ plan and instinctively switched to ‘fight’.

Because TM ran around from the side of the truck with the loaded shotgun he initiated an attack and fired weapon. AA was wounded and fought back.

AA was murdered by three white men who chased and cornered him and they will be found guilty and hopefully spend the rest of their miserable lives in prison paying for what they did. Hopefully it stops other stupid men with guns from killing innocent jogging black men going forward.

Travis McMichael didn't run anywhere... he took about three steps towards the front of the vehicle and was the attacked by a man who ran directly at him grabbed his gun and started punching him in the face from a distance greater than a football field

I thought he was an innocent young jogger gunned down in the street how come he did the Braveheart charge from a football field away?

the innocent young black jogger would have ran up to somebody's door and asked for help

A strong fit athletic kid would have just taken off through the woods or jumped a few fences losing them in his dust

A mentally retarded career criminal that came from a family of criminals would try to attack them in the middle of the street can get his dumbass blasted in the process

 

[KingGUERRILLA]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

But none of that happened.

They just saw a black guy running. That's it. No blood, nothing.

And the very suggestion that you're a "real man" is laughable. You'd have to explain away that vagina of yours...

Im not worried about what he says. I read a philosophy book that influenced me deeply. The Buddha said that there were three people in all of us. The person others saw us as. The person we saw ourselves as. And that which we truly were. The Buddha said the goal was to combine the three into one. People saw us as we saw ourselves. And we saw ourselves as we truly are.

I realized that The Buddha was enlightened. But he was wrong. My place in the universe could not be determined by someone else’s opinion. I could not imagine giving them that kind of power over me.

What is telling is his reaction. He detests soldiers. Claiming they have no courage. Yet he has never done it so it is the voice of at most an ASVAB reject. Someone who tried and flunked.

He detests anyone with knowledge. Like Pol Pot he would execute anyone who has read a book.

He is going to tell us what a “Real Man” would do. But he won’t actually do it himself. He won’t walk into the recruiters office and sign his life away. He won’t study and try to get in. He won’t put it on the line day in and out. He does not actually risk anything but a sprained finger pounding a keyboard.

He lies about his experience. He lies about what he said. He lies constantly.

Maybe he is too dumb. Maybe he is too fat. Maybe he is just too scared. Maybe his fear is what drives his self loathing to make him lash out at anyone who knows more than he does. Obviously he has issues.

Honestly. I am glad he never joined the Military. The troops have enough problems without a nut like him making everything harder.

He is like those little mutant dogs. You know the ones. They are vicious and snarling all the time. I honestly think that those little dogs are a great analogy for him. All snarling and barking and threats and completely unable to back it up.

He does not know what bad really is. He doesn’t know what dangerous really is. And I honestly hope he never finds out. Because not only will he die. But probably others will die from his wanton stupidity.

take a deep breath and try to focus on the mentally retarded career criminal who attacked a couple guys trying to take him into custody for the police

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Travis McMichael didn't run anywhere... he took about three steps towards the front of

why did TM leave from his position beside the truck between the opened driver side door and the rear tire and run toward the passenger side front end of the truck and have both feet completely across the double yellow line and shoot AA on the wrist before AA attacked as he told police.

It was not a three step attack by TM - it had to be at least ten to run around to be in front of the truck out of camera view when the first shot was fired.

 

[SavannahMann]

Ok. Grounds for Self Defense. A man tries to kidnap a woman. She kicks at him. He shoots her dead. Self Defense? Would the mans actions be considered self defense? Do not think about anything but the action of the shooting is what you are saying.

This is a great example of the kind of mentality I'm dealing with...

Trying to equate a well-known local criminal who runs the better part of a football field directly at two men with guns and then violently attacks them with a act of violence to a rape victim is the epitome of hilarious

Anyone trying to kidnap a woman while threatening her with a gun is clearly motivated very differently as compared to an adult male trying to stop another adult male they suspect of having committed a crime

the woman is unarmed and has a realistic and understandable fear that she's going to be Harmed

arberry had no reason to believe he was going to be shot because the people trying to protect their neighborhood had several chances to shoot him prior to his attack and clearly did not... if he has pulled out at legal firearm and shot them in their initial encounter I would support it but after running from them for a considerable amount of time and then turning to attack shows that he clearly was not afraid and decided to ignore a chance to escape in order to attack

the woman in your rape equation was completely unarmed and being threatened with a gun while no one pointed a gun at your criminal hero and as soon as he grabbed the barrel of Travis's firearm he became armed himself and us a deadly threat to the man who was standing his ground holding a shotgun in the low ready position

Chasing someone while in the possession of a firearm and standing your ground in the middle of the street while in the possession of a firearm it's not felony assault

a man with a gun grabbing an unarmed woman most definitely is

It is felony Aggravated Assault by law in Georgia. It is attempted False Imprisonment by Georgia law. A felony.

From the moment that the McMichaels set off in pursuit they were breaking the law. From the moment the armed up they were breaking the law. Both actions are Felonies.

The fact that they were committing Felonies just like my examples above means that it is NOT self defense. For it to be self defense you have to start out minding your own damned business.

What if the woman in my scenario above was a drug dealing prostitute? Does that mean the man is now able to claim self defense? What if the security guard was living under a false identity as an illegal alien? Does the bank robber get to claim self defense?

Georgia Courts have said the criminal history does not matter. What matters is the situation that occurred. As I said before. Arbury could have been al Capone. It would not matter by Georgia law. The McMichaels had no legal authority to set off in pursuit and try to stop Arbury. None. So from that point. They were the ones committing crimes.

his prior criminal history really has you unhinged as is expected...must have been a shock to learn he wasent a simple jogger afterall

whoever commited a violent act or threatened someones life 1st is the criminal aggressor in any situation so being a prostitute or an illegal alien is a fiat argument

Travis and Gramps never threatened Arberrys life by trying to interview him

just because they had guns is NOT PROOF they threatened him in any way

View attachment 434047this man is NOT CORNERED or being ASSAULTED

he is CHARGING 2 men who HAD BEEN following him and VIOLENTLY attacked them as they stood their ground

*just like travon

Um. No.

As I and the lawyers I quoted have said. For the purposes of Citizens Arrest previous criminal history does not matter. Under Georgia Law the only thing that matters is if you saw the suspect commit a crime that you have the authority to act upon. They did not. They did not see him commit a crime. And they were not empowered or authorized to enforce.

See the BAR of Georgia page again.

So if I see a stranger running out of the front of my neighbor's house covered in blood and then he flees in a panic when I confront him I'm not allowed to chase him by Georgia law?

You can do whatever you want. However if you find yourself wearing handcuffs, you can console yourself with the idea that you were trying to do the right thing. That is what is great about being an American. You are free to do what you want. However because we are not an anarchy we face consequences for our actions.

What if this man covered in blood is a paramedic visiting your neighbor on his off time. A horrible accident has happened and he is sprinting towards his car to get a First Responder Kit to save her life. You set out and arrest him thinking it is a murder. Well it is. And you are the murderer by preventing him from acting to save her life.

You don’t know what is happening. You don’t know what the situation is. If in fact it was a murder then you being alive to testify what you saw is vital to justice. But if you chase him and he kills you too what then?

Georgia Law is very restrictive about Citizens Arrest. We don’t want a lot of people beating the snot out of another and covered with I thought I was doing the right thing. That is why it is a bet your life move. If you are wrong. If you do not have justification to make the arrest. You are going to jail and then Prison. Because you detained someone without legal authority.

Keep coming up with asinine scenarios. Keep bemoaning how the law which has been on the books for decades is unfair.

Or. Here is another idea. If you want to arrest people. Become a cop. Probably impossible in your case. But you can try. I say impossible because you won’t learn. And that means you will refuse to listen to those who know what they are talking about.

Through this entire thread you have rejected factual information. You deride the words of actual experts. You hang your hat on this old English nonsense and embrace YouTube vids from people not in Georgia and unfamiliar with Georgia Law. And when you have it pointed out that your basement experts are wrong you get mad about it.

You get mad at me and others for refusing to agree with you. And that is just pathetically childish. Want to change the laws in Georgia? Ok. Here is what you do. Move here. Run for office. Get elected. Convince your fellow elected officials that the law needs to be changed to allow random posse’s of well meaning imbeciles charging around in pick up trucks chasing imaginary villains.

Or you could adapt to the way we handle things in Georgia. Mind your own damned business. Let the cops arrest people. And if someone does break into your house. Get a lawyer before talking to the cops. Because you are stupid enough to talk your way right into the electric chair.

If the man who was running out of my neighbor's front door covered in blood was a paramedic he wouldn't flee in a panic when I confronted him.... he would calmly but urgently explain the scenario without trying to throat punch me and that's all arberry had to do to survive his encounter with the McMichaels

having lived in multiple 3rd world countries I have gained an appreciation for English common law that most Americans will never dream

You people come off as a tiny handful of privileged limp wristed sissies Who hide under your bed and Peck away at the dials of your phone whenever you're afraid but the history of America has made Provisions for those of us who are real men and will stand up and protect our neighborhood running headlong into Danger in a selfless Act to keep our life liberty and property safe from crime

You people are sniveling weakling cowards and interpret the law to that world ethos... you want all men to be weakling cowards and forced by the hand of the law to behave in that way so that your personal weakness and sniveling cowardness doesn't stand out so much in comparison to the real men among you.

If you saw a man beating woman in the middle of the street you would tuck your tiny testicles between your butt cheeks run around the corner and urinate on yourself while you frantically tried to find the 911 button on your panic dial... I would run directly over there, grab him in a headlock and thrown to the ground with a mighty thump... then I would place my knee on the back of his neck while I wrenched his arm behind his back and hold him face down until the police arrived and carted him off to jail where he belongs

one of us is a real man the other one is a sniveling coward who wants the power of the law to neuter the real man so his tiny testicles don't feel so itty bitty anymore

But none of that happened.

They just saw a black guy running. That's it. No blood, nothing.

And the very suggestion that you're a "real man" is laughable. You'd have to explain away that vagina of yours...

Im not worried about what he says. I read a philosophy book that influenced me deeply. The Buddha said that there were three people in all of us. The person others saw us as. The person we saw ourselves as. And that which we truly were. The Buddha said the goal was to combine the three into one. People saw us as we saw ourselves. And we saw ourselves as we truly are.

I realized that The Buddha was enlightened. But he was wrong. My place in the universe could not be determined by someone else’s opinion. I could not imagine giving them that kind of power over me.

What is telling is his reaction. He detests soldiers. Claiming they have no courage. Yet he has never done it so it is the voice of at most an ASVAB reject. Someone who tried and flunked.

He detests anyone with knowledge. Like Pol Pot he would execute anyone who has read a book.

He is going to tell us what a “Real Man” would do. But he won’t actually do it himself. He won’t walk into the recruiters office and sign his life away. He won’t study and try to get in. He won’t put it on the line day in and out. He does not actually risk anything but a sprained finger pounding a keyboard.

He lies about his experience. He lies about what he said. He lies constantly.

Maybe he is too dumb. Maybe he is too fat. Maybe he is just too scared. Maybe his fear is what drives his self loathing to make him lash out at anyone who knows more than he does. Obviously he has issues.

Honestly. I am glad he never joined the Military. The troops have enough problems without a nut like him making everything harder.

He is like those little mutant dogs. You know the ones. They are vicious and snarling all the time. I honestly think that those little dogs are a great analogy for him. All snarling and barking and threats and completely unable to back it up.

He does not know what bad really is. He doesn’t know what dangerous really is. And I honestly hope he never finds out. Because not only will he die. But probably others will die from his wanton stupidity.

take a deep breath and try to focus on the mentally retarded career criminal who attacked a couple guys trying to take him into custody for the police

You mean the felons who were trying to illegally imprison him?