The Math wall.....

[justoffal]

My grandson is doing those exact same types of problems in his technical mathematics class online, sitting beside me right now.

God bless you ....you're a good grandad!

 

[justoffal]

Speaking as someone who never invested the necessary resources into acquiring basic math skills, I wonder if you're underestimating the complexity of your job?

How many engineers work for your firm?

Couple dozen.... Don't know the exact number.

 

[kyzr]

Couple dozen.... Don't know the exact number.

The 1972 SAT math score was the highest. "score high or die"....get drafted and sent to VN. Motivation.

Average SAT Scores Over Time: 1972–2024 · PrepScholar

What were the average SAT scores for 2023, 2022, 2021, and earlier? Find out in our historical guide to SAT averages back to 1972.

blog.prepscholar.com

In 2016 they redesigned it to make it easier.

 

[toobfreak]

Couple dozen.... Don't know the exact number.

OK, now for the dumb question: why not simply issue each employee their own basic solar calculator?

I mean, you can buy wristwatches and little wallet calculators now to do all the math you've described. The highest arithmetic you've mentioned so far are mere radicals.

I say: UP the math test.

• Ask applicants to convert from base10 to base2 or from base 2 to base16 in their heads.
• Throw in a Base2 addition and multiplication problem.
• Require the applicant to convert all decimal numbers to fractions.

Nothing beats the diameter of a valve being 4 and 78/315ths inches.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

God bless you ....you're a good grandad!

I have to be. He is a leukemia survivor and slightly autistic with everyone but me. His therapists say they have never seen a kid like him as he only reacts differently with me. That's why I drove 150 miles this morning to get him back on track.

 

[justoffal]

I have to be. He is a leukemia survivor and slightly autistic with everyone but me. His therapists say they have never seen a kid like him as he only reacts differently with me. That's why I drove 150 miles this morning to get him back on track.

WOW man! If I had a way to hand you a medal over the internet I would do it! That is a truly awesome thing to hear and it's just a wonderful life event to retell.

Thank you for sharing it

Jo

 

[Silent Warrior]

Here we go again..... "I got the wrong change at 7/11, so nobody in the whole country can do math!"

Were it merely one instance I would agree with you. However I see it happen several times a week and hear many others mention the same thing. Denying there is a problem is no way to solve it.

 

[Concerned American]

My job is very math intense. Nothing fancy mostly just your four basic operations.... A lot of number rooting and exponents...

You simply cannot do my job unless you have these skills. My company is currently grossly understaffed and begging for employees.... There are stacks of applications on the desk of the human resources manager who has the unenviable job of sorting them out and sending them off to the testing institute in town to see if they can pass the basic skill tests.

In the past 6 months it's been a 100% failure rate due to the math section of the test.

I hear they're thinking about lowering the standards which I hope they do not. There are some decisions that I have to make based on calculations that could actually be dangerous if they're done wrong.

I suspect this particular problem is widespread in the hiring process right now.

Jo

It's not a new problem either. I built production machinery for the food industry in the 70's. Much of it was pretty straight forward and entry level stuff but I was amazed how many new hires COULD NOT read a tape measure. I mean this is about as basic as it comes. We designed a simple test with graphical reps of tape measures asking for the candidate to pick the correct reading from four multiple choice answers. It was surprising how many unqualified were weeded out.

 

[toobfreak]

It's not a new problem either. I built production machinery for the food industry in the 70's. Much of it was pretty straight forward and entry level stuff but I was amazed how many new hires COULD NOT read a tape measure. I mean this is about as basic as it comes. We designed a simple test with graphical reps of tape measures asking for the candidate to pick the correct reading from four multiple choice answers. It was surprising how many unqualified were weeded out.

Wow, can't read a tape measure? Can't tell quarters from eighths, and sixteenths?

How the **** did they ever make it to the 4th grade?

They should try reading a vernier micrometer.

 

[Concerned American]

I graduated from college in 1976, and my math was mostly done by hand, with paper and pencil. Many people can "do" math because of calculators without really understanding what they are doing.

LOL, I remember a battle with my daughter as she was entering HS math in 2000. The class required her to get a graphing calculator and we went round and round. I am a firm believer in learning the operations and being able to do it by hand on paper. Long story short, she got her calculator, but I insisted on seeing her work. She has turned out to be a very competent, well rounded, successful adult. But I may be slightly conflicted.

 

[ReinyDays]

On the construction site ... we just beat it with a bigger hammer ... math was for losers ...

18 jiggers in a fifth ... what more do you need ...

 

[Concerned American]

Wow, can't read a tape measure? Can't tell quarters from eighths, and sixteenths?

How the **** did they ever make it to the 4th grade?

They should try reading a vernier micrometer.

Yeah, we don't even want to discuss those precision tools. LOL, I tried to explain a vernier caliper to a youngster recently and about two minutes in, the glazed, deer in the headlights look appeared and I decided it wasn't going anywhere.

 

[80zephyr]

It's not a new problem either. I built production machinery for the food industry in the 70's. Much of it was pretty straight forward and entry level stuff but I was amazed how many new hires COULD NOT read a tape measure. I mean this is about as basic as it comes. We designed a simple test with graphical reps of tape measures asking for the candidate to pick the correct reading from four multiple choice answers. It was surprising how many unqualified were weeded out.

You think thats bad? I was a carpenter and I cannot tell you how many could not read a tape measure.

 

[Concerned American]

You think thats bad? I was a carpenter and I cannot tell you how many could not read a tape measure.

A simple test is very effective. Saves a bunch of money during onboarding and retention too.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

WOW man! If I had a way to hand you a medal over the internet I would do it! That is a truly awesome thing to hear and it's just a wonderful life event to retell.

Thank you for sharing it

Jo

I saw this kid suffer so much with his treatment for cancer that it really inspired me when dealing with my own health issues both before and after I had my transplant. If he could do it, I had to do it too!

 

[justoffal]

I saw this kid suffer so much with his treatment for cancer that it really inspired me when dealing with my own health issues both before and after I had my transplant. If he could do it, I had to do it too!

Awesome..... Just awesome! Bravo!!!!

 

[toobfreak]

Yeah, we don't even want to discuss those precision tools. LOL, I tried to explain a vernier caliper to a youngster recently and about two minutes in, the glazed, deer in the headlights look appeared and I decided it wasn't going anywhere.

That is sort of scary. A vernier is not hard to read. It is basically simplicity itself, you just have to understand it. The girl with the slide rule I had told me "Thank God for calculators!" When I was in school, a calculator would have gotten you flunked. It was paper and pencil or slide rule.

What if these kids HAD to use a vernier? What if there was no "digital readout?"

When I took calc, the instructor said they had dumbed it down a little because too few were passing, so, are people getting stupider, or is technology just making people lazy?

I shudder to think what AI will do to people's learning over the next 25 years--- when you depend on AI to think for you, you don't bother to learn.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Math is a problem all over the country. Even simple math is causing problems. Many young retail cashiers can't even make change unless the register tells them the amount so I can imagine what problems you hare having. Our education system is failing the country.

Many retail places don't accept cash anymore. The burger franchises have pictures instead of money charges.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

For instance what is the diameter of the safety valve that has 85 square inches of surface?

Wouldn’t that be double the square route of 85/pi?

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

That is sort of scary. A vernier is not hard to read. It is basically simplicity itself, you just have to understand it. The girl with the slide rule I had told me "Thank God for calculators!" When I was in school, a calculator would have gotten you flunked. It was paper and pencil or slide rule.

What if these kids HAD to use a vernier? What if there was no "digital readout?"

When I took calc, the instructor said they had dumbed it down a little because too few were passing, so, are people getting stupider, or is technology just making people lazy?

I shudder to think what AI will do to people's learning over the next 25 years--- when you depend on AI to think for you, you don't bother to learn.

Good Lord, how old are you?