The Forgotten Mexican - Americans

[DGS49]

Up until 1848, large parts of Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, and California were Mexican territory. As part of the final resolution of the war, the U.S. paid a sum of money to Mexico and took these territories, which later became states.

These areas were sparsely populated, but the fact is that much of the population in 1848 were indeed Mexican - what we might call "Hispanic" in today's language. Presumably most of them remained living in the same place and thus became "Americans" by virtue of the treaty. They had Spanish names, Spanish culture, and undoubtedly spoke Spanish as their first language. No doubt their descendants are fully assimilated by this time.

So my question is this: Are the descendants of these Mexican - Americans still a distinct ethnicity in those states? Are there people who proudly state that they are in some way unique among America's contemporary "Hispanics"?

Just wondering.

 

[Persuader]

Hispanics compose 16.7%
of the national population, or around 52 million people.



Yet we see the msm and especially those who make commericials ignore them whilst being so obsessed with promoting African so called Americans.

Very few blacks are patriotic yet hispanics for the most part are very patriotic and many,many of them join the military and they have a long tradition of that.

Anyone who watches T.V. knows that now half of the actors in t.v. commericals are black. However they are not the only minority. Why do we not see more mexican and asian actors in commercials?

 

[elektra]

No, prior to 1848 the natives of what became a brand new country called mexico lived is Spain's territory. Spain ruled the Texan, New Mexican, Arizona, and California territory. The brand spanking new country. called Mexico in no way ruled north of our current border. They tried but they just did not have an army strong enough to claim territory not theirs.

 

[whitehall]

Hence the hispanic names for towns and cities in Arizona, N.M. and Ca. and Texas. American Indians run gambling casinos today. Is there anyone who thinks Hispanic people in the former territories are too ignorant to assimilate into Anglo culture in a hundred and fifty years?

 

[elektra]

Technically, they are Spanish names from spanish places in Spain.

Covenant San Clemente in Toledo is a good example.

 

[Hawk1981]

There is a robust Hispanic culture in the Southwestern United States, most prominently in New Mexico and to a lesser extent in western Texas, Arizona, southern Colorado, and southern California.

Focusing on the state of New Mexico, there are about 995,000 people in the state who identify as Hispanic, which is about 48% of the state's population. It is estimated that 30% of the population of New Mexico speaks Spanish at home. Culturally, there is a distinct division that separates Hispanics in northern New Mexico and southern Colorado, from the Hispanic culture in southern New Mexico and western Texas, particularly in the El Paso region that extends south of the international border into Chihuahua and beyond.

Historically, the Spanish colonies in the northern borderlands of Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and California always had some measure of self reliance due to the long distances from the government centers far to the south and east. The inhabitants of these norther borderlands or Nortenos, have been described in terms similar to those used for American frontiersman: nationalistic, hardworking, courageous, adaptable, ingenious, aggressive, and enterprising. The need for self reliance became more pronounced after Mexico achieved independence from Spain and the new regime consolidated its power leaving the northern borderlands undersupported.

Though Mexico's northern frontier never captured the popular imagination in the ways that the American west has, the qualities of the Nortenos endures to the present day and rather than being fully assimilated into Anglo-American culture, features a blended Hispanic-Anglo-Indigenous American culture.

 

[Unkotare]

... the U.S. paid a sum of money to Mexico and took these territories...

That means we "bought" them. No need to talk around it. We didn't start that war, and we purchased that land from Mexico fair and square.

 

[Hawk1981]

... the U.S. paid a sum of money to Mexico and took these territories...

That means we "bought" them. No need to talk around it. We didn't start that war, and we purchased that land from Mexico fair and square.

The United States provoked the war with Mexico by annexing the Republic of Texas, which Mexico did not recognize as an independent country and had specifically warned that the annexation would be an act of war.

Additionally the first battle of the war where Mexican forces defeated a detachment of the US Army was made on disputed territory that was widely known to be claimed by both Mexico and Texas.

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo which established peace between the United States and Mexico called for a payment of $15 million plus settlement of claims of Americans with Mexico up to an additional $5 million.

With the Mexican army defeated and its capital occupied, it can certainly be argued that Mexico agreed to the treaty under considerable duress. Prior to the war, the US had sent an envoy to Mexico with authorization to pay up to $45 million for the same territory, but Mexico had refused to receive the envoy.

 

[Unkotare]

Texas had been an independent nation for almost ten years. Their petition for statehood was none of Mexico’s business by then.

 

[Hawk1981]

Texas had been an independent nation for almost ten years. Their petition for statehood was none of Mexico’s business by then.

Mexico never recognized the independence of Texas. At the time of annexation by the US, Texas was still considered by Mexico to be a territory in rebellion.

 

[Unkotare]

Mexico fired the first shots and started the war. They’ve got nothing to bitch about there.

 

[Unkotare]

Texas had been an independent nation for almost ten years. Their petition for statehood was none of Mexico’s business by then.

Mexico never recognized the independence of Texas. At the time of annexation by the US, Texas was still considered by Mexico to be a territory in rebellion.

Too bad. The fact is that Texas was an independent nation capable of deciding their own destiny.

 

[Picaro]

Most Mexicans wouldn't have been caught dead north of Tampico; the entire population of Mexicans north of what became the southern U.S. border was never over a few thousand even by 1848, counting the gold rush Mexicans. Before 1821, the vast majority of Spanish were garrison soldiers and and few Catholic missions with their indian slaves, not 'Mexicans'. They revolted against Spain, and then decided they were entitled to all former Spanish lands, which of course is ridiculous pomposity; they had to appeal to people like Sam Houston and Stephen F. Austin to attract colonists to Texas. Then Santa Anna welched on that deal re taxes and so Texas revolted. Mexicans wouldn't go near Texas or Colorado or anywhere else because of Apaches and other tribes, which were still raiding deep into Mexico after our land purchases; they promptly sued the U.S. after the sale for not stopping the raids ... lol

 

[Picaro]

... the U.S. paid a sum of money to Mexico and took these territories...

That means we "bought" them. No need to talk around it. We didn't start that war, and we purchased that land from Mexico fair and square.

The United States provoked the war with Mexico by annexing the Republic of Texas, which Mexico did not recognize as an independent country and had specifically warned that the annexation would be an act of war.

Additionally the first battle of the war where Mexican forces defeated a detachment of the US Army was made on disputed territory that was widely known to be claimed by both Mexico and Texas.

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo which established peace between the United States and Mexico called for a payment of $15 million plus settlement of claims of Americans with Mexico up to an additional $5 million.

With the Mexican army defeated and its capital occupied, it can certainly be argued that Mexico agreed to the treaty under considerable duress. Prior to the war, the US had sent an envoy to Mexico with authorization to pay up to $45 million for the same territory, but Mexico had refused to receive the envoy.

lol mostly rubbish even Mexican history doesn't sell any more. Mexico had something like 35 changes in govt. from 1821 to 1850, half of them loony Santa Anna resigning and then changing his mind and taking them back over. He thought he was Napoleon of the Americas.

 

[Moonglow]

Hispanics compose 16.7%
of the national population, or around 52 million people.



Yet we see the msm and especially those who make commericials ignore them whilst being so obsessed with promoting African so called Americans.

Very few blacks are patriotic yet hispanics for the most part are very patriotic and many,many of them join the military and they have a long tradition of that.

Anyone who watches T.V. knows that now half of the actors in t.v. commericals are black. However they are not the only minority. Why do we not see more mexican and asian actors in commercials?

There are many blacks in the military I can tell you have never served

 

[harmonica]

... the U.S. paid a sum of money to Mexico and took these territories...

That means we "bought" them. No need to talk around it. We didn't start that war, and we purchased that land from Mexico fair and square.

The United States provoked the war with Mexico by annexing the Republic of Texas, which Mexico did not recognize as an independent country and had specifically warned that the annexation would be an act of war.

Additionally the first battle of the war where Mexican forces defeated a detachment of the US Army was made on disputed territory that was widely known to be claimed by both Mexico and Texas.

The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo which established peace between the United States and Mexico called for a payment of $15 million plus settlement of claims of Americans with Mexico up to an additional $5 million.

With the Mexican army defeated and its capital occupied, it can certainly be argued that Mexico agreed to the treaty under considerable duress. Prior to the war, the US had sent an envoy to Mexico with authorization to pay up to $45 million for the same territory, but Mexico had refused to receive the envoy.

and America provoked Japan in WW2.....

 

[Picaro]

Hispanics compose 16.7%
of the national population, or around 52 million people.



Yet we see the msm and especially those who make commericials ignore them whilst being so obsessed with promoting African so called Americans.

Very few blacks are patriotic yet hispanics for the most part are very patriotic and many,many of them join the military and they have a long tradition of that.

Anyone who watches T.V. knows that now half of the actors in t.v. commericals are black. However they are not the only minority. Why do we not see more mexican and asian actors in commercials?

There are many blacks in the military I can tell you have never served

They join for the bennies, and they're grossly under-represented in the combat units. I can tell you never served anywhere near combat units.

 

[DGS49]

I have read that Texas wanted to become a state, but the U.S. Congress was unwilling to accept another "slave" state at the time.

Certainly, there was a Spanish element in the "Republic of Texas" that was not on board with any of it.

I wonder if Mexico would be willing to give us back the fifteen mil, in exchange for California. We could throw in Manhattan for good measure.

 

[Hawk1981]

I have read that Texas wanted to become a state, but the U.S. Congress was unwilling to accept another "slave" state at the time.

Certainly, there was a Spanish element in the "Republic of Texas" that was not on board with any of it.

I wonder if Mexico would be willing to give us back the fifteen mil, in exchange for California. We could throw in Manhattan for good measure.

Texas applied for annexation to the US in 1836, the same year that it declared independence from Mexico. Congress refused the offer. Leaders of both political parties (Democrat and Whig) opposed annexation at that time because of the complex sectional difficulties involving the slavery issue. When Texas did become a state, it was paired for admission to the Union with Iowa, a free state.

There has always been an element in Mexico that has desired a restoration of the American Southwest. During the First World War, Germany attempted to entice Mexico into joining the war on the side of the Central Powers and against the US by offering to support Mexican claims to its former northern provinces.

 

[Picaro]

Mexico also claimed everything up to Oregon, so why should anybody take their silliness seriously? They never found any Mexicans who wanted to move here in any great numbers; Los Angeles had a population of 300, mostly the missions and a few ranchers, Texas had maybe 300 in the Rio Grande Valley, Santa Fe had long since declined as they killed off their indian slaves working the silver mines it was little more than a cow town and so far isolated from Mexico, with only a caravan or two a year coming in, it never really played a part in the whole history.

There was no 'big Mexican cultural entity' here, just a former Spanish system of garrisons and Catholic missions that Mexico couldn't maintain or even cared to. Why would they bring in all those European and American colonists if they had any Mexican presence worth mentioning? Of course they would like to have stolen it back, after the U.S. got rid of the Apache threats and developed the economy and found lots of minerals worth mining, same as Arab bandits and vermin all of a sudden wanted 'Palestine' after the Jews and British made it productive and created industries there between 1870 and 1910.

Texas merely adopted the Spanish place names and a lot of the legal systems pertaining to riperian laws and such because many of those were already in place, so no need to change them, not because there were a bunch of ethnic Mexicans living here; the European immigrants were 'Mexicans' as well, after all; Sam Houston was a Mexican Ambassador to the U.S.