The Constitution was designed to make liberalism illegal.

[Bern80]

So why is Liberalism so tolerated today? What is wrong with us?

The United States Constitution is one of the most liberal documents in history.

Depends on which definition of liberal you're using. Liberal as in going to great lenght to insure freedom, yes. Liberal as in the centralized, ever expanding entitlement providing government that 'liberals' seem to want today.......no.

 

[Dragon]

The enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8, would be a good start.

I see nothing there that outlaws liberalism.

 

[Bern80]

The enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8, would be a good start.

I see nothing there that outlaws liberalism.

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

 

[Moonglow]

Considering that when the Constitution was written their was no form or ideaology of socialsm, marxism, communism, leninism, and the form of liberalism is what they wanted and is not the same as today, they could not have written it to exclude those forms of systems.

 

[rdean]

So why is Liberalism so tolerated today? What is wrong with us?

Liberals WROTE the constitution fool. If we left it up to your kind, we would still be a colony.

 

[Dragon]

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

None of those programs outlaw liberalism.

Or, if you mean that the enumerated powers don't allow those programs, you're mistaken, with the exception of the income tax which required a constitutional amendment.

"Congress shall have the power to lay and collect taxes . . . to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States."

This power alone covers everything you listed, again with the exception of the income tax which required the 16th amendment.

 

[Bern80]

So why is Liberalism so tolerated today? What is wrong with us?

Liberals WROTE the constitution fool. If we left it up to your kind, we would still be a colony.

You are showing an incredible lack of intellectual integrity if you are going to pretend the liberal you are is anything like the liberals then.

 

[Sallow]

So why is Liberalism so tolerated today? What is wrong with us?

The United States Constitution is one of the most liberal documents in history.

Depends on which definition of liberal you're using. Liberal as in going to great lenght to insure freedom, yes. Liberal as in the centralized, ever expanding entitlement providing government that 'liberals' seem to want today.......no.

I generally use this one:

lib·er·al   /ˈlɪbərəl, ˈlɪbrəl/ Show Spelled[lib-er-uhl, lib-ruhl] Show IPA
adjective
1. favorable to progress or reform, as in political or religious affairs.
2. ( often initial capital letter ) noting or pertaining to a political party advocating measures of progressive political reform.
3. of, pertaining to, based on, or advocating liberalism.
4. favorable to or in accord with concepts of maximum individual freedom possible, especially as guaranteed by law and secured by governmental protection of civil liberties.
5. favoring or permitting freedom of action, especially with respect to matters of personal belief or expression: a liberal policy toward dissident artists and writers.

Very little of the constitution is "conservative".

If it were..we'd still have a king.

That's the system you guys love.

 

[Bern80]

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

None of those programs outlaw liberalism.

Or, if you mean that the enumerated powers don't allow those programs, you're mistaken, with the exception of the income tax which required a constitutional amendment.

"Congress shall have the power to lay and collect taxes . . . to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States."

This power alone covers everything you listed, again with the exception of the income tax which required the 16th amendment.

Having the power to collect taxes does not give the government the power to use said tax revenue to do whatever they feel like. So no, simply collecting taxes does not allow government to do any of those things. I didn't say collecting taxes was unconstitutional. I said collecting a dispraportionate amount from one group (i.e. the liberal mantra of taxing the rich) over another is.

 

[Bern80]

The United States Constitution is one of the most liberal documents in history.

Depends on which definition of liberal you're using. Liberal as in going to great lenght to insure freedom, yes. Liberal as in the centralized, ever expanding entitlement providing government that 'liberals' seem to want today.......no.

I generally use this one:

lib·er·al   /ˈlɪbərəl, ˈlɪbrəl/ Show Spelled[lib-er-uhl, lib-ruhl] Show IPA
adjective
1. favorable to progress or reform, as in political or religious affairs.
2. ( often initial capital letter ) noting or pertaining to a political party advocating measures of progressive political reform.
3. of, pertaining to, based on, or advocating liberalism.
4. favorable to or in accord with concepts of maximum individual freedom possible, especially as guaranteed by law and secured by governmental protection of civil liberties.
5. favoring or permitting freedom of action, especially with respect to matters of personal belief or expression: a liberal policy toward dissident artists and writers.

Very little of the constitution is "conservative".

If it were..we'd still have a king.

That's the system you guys love.

I would agree. But that definition isn't even close to what liberalism is today.

 

[Sallow]

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

None of those programs outlaw liberalism.

Or, if you mean that the enumerated powers don't allow those programs, you're mistaken, with the exception of the income tax which required a constitutional amendment.

"Congress shall have the power to lay and collect taxes . . . to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States."

This power alone covers everything you listed, again with the exception of the income tax which required the 16th amendment.

Having the power to collect taxes does not give the government the power to use said tax revenue to do whatever they feel like. So no, simply collecting taxes does not allow government to do any of those things. I didn't say collecting taxes was unconstitutional. I said collecting a dispraportionate amount from one group (i.e. the liberal mantra of taxing the rich) over another is.

Sure it does. The people send representatives from their state to decide how much tax will be collected. That's part of the job..and the power.

 

[Bern80]

None of those programs outlaw liberalism.

Or, if you mean that the enumerated powers don't allow those programs, you're mistaken, with the exception of the income tax which required a constitutional amendment.

"Congress shall have the power to lay and collect taxes . . . to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States."

This power alone covers everything you listed, again with the exception of the income tax which required the 16th amendment.

Having the power to collect taxes does not give the government the power to use said tax revenue to do whatever they feel like. So no, simply collecting taxes does not allow government to do any of those things. I didn't say collecting taxes was unconstitutional. I said collecting a dispraportionate amount from one group (i.e. the liberal mantra of taxing the rich) over another is.

Sure it does. The people send representatives from their state to decide how much tax will be collected. That's part of the job..and the power.

You are not listening. How much or whom they tax is not the issue. It is WHAT they use the tax money on. And WHAT they can do with said tax revenue is most certainly restricted by the constitution. Specifically in article 1 section 8.

 

[Sallow]

Having the power to collect taxes does not give the government the power to use said tax revenue to do whatever they feel like. So no, simply collecting taxes does not allow government to do any of those things. I didn't say collecting taxes was unconstitutional. I said collecting a dispraportionate amount from one group (i.e. the liberal mantra of taxing the rich) over another is.

Sure it does. The people send representatives from their state to decide how much tax will be collected. That's part of the job..and the power.

You are not listening. How much or whom they tax is not the issue. It is WHAT they use the tax money on. And WHAT they can do with said tax revenue is most certainly restricted by the constitutions. specificall in article 1 section 8.

What restrictions?

Congress has very broad powers.

 

[jillian]

The enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8, would be a good start.

I see nothing there that outlaws liberalism.

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

nice rant.

of course, none of what you say is accurate, but there ya go.

still not understanding the concept of judicial review and the role of the supreme court, bern?

 

[Bern80]

I see nothing there that outlaws liberalism.

Well except for things like social security, medicare, most of our entitlement programs, federally funded schools, a dispraportionate tax code.....other than things like that, yeah, nothing at all.

nice rant.

of course, none of what you say is accurate, but there ya go.

still not understanding the concept of judicial review and the role of the supreme court, bern?

I understand it just fine. I guess I just wasn't aware that it is not possible for judges not render unconstitutional decisions.

 

[Moonglow]

again Brutus is proved wrong

 

[Bern80]

Sure it does. The people send representatives from their state to decide how much tax will be collected. That's part of the job..and the power.

You are not listening. How much or whom they tax is not the issue. It is WHAT they use the tax money on. And WHAT they can do with said tax revenue is most certainly restricted by the constitutions. specificall in article 1 section 8.

What restrictions?

Congress has very broad powers.

Like government can really only tax for the purpose of funding it's obligations per the constitution like the specific powers and obligations listed in section 8. In other words, if it isn't there, government can't do it.

 

[Sallow]

You are not listening. How much or whom they tax is not the issue. It is WHAT they use the tax money on. And WHAT they can do with said tax revenue is most certainly restricted by the constitutions. specificall in article 1 section 8.

What restrictions?

Congress has very broad powers.

Like government can really only tax for the purpose of funding it's obligations per the constitution like the specific powers and obligations listed in section 8. In other words, if it isn't there, government can't do it.

Ah..so you support getting rid of the Air Force and various military departments. A strict reading of the Constitution does not provide for a professional standing army under federal control either. Only militias and only when needed to repulse land invasions and quell rebellion..and funding to be determined every 2 years. Only the navy is a permanent fixture. By the way it's defense..not a military capable of attack that the Constitution makes provisions for..

So all those overseas military bases..all the funding that goes to various "allies" would be "bye bye".

Along with various "R&D" projects, the CIA, NSA, and lots of other letters in the alphabet.

 

[Brutus]

As I said on another thread, "Brutus" in Latin means stupid or bestial. This poster chose his name well.

Got any backup to that incredibly silly claim that the Constitution was designed to make liberalism illegal? Like what provisions in the Constitution do this and how? And what the hell you mean by "liberalism"?

The enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8, would be a good start.

The Founders were conservative in the sense that modern conservatives are conservative, i.e. they were for limited governemnt.
They wrote the Constitution to enshrine the Jeffersonian concept of limited government. This, in effect, made liberalism illegal.


"The government of the United States [federal government] is a definite government confined to specified objects [powers]. It is not like state governments, whose powers are more general. CHARITY IS NO PART OF THE LEGISLATIVE DUTY OF THE GOVERNMENT."
-James madison

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated." -Jefferson


Now you can understand why our liberals spied for Stalin, not the USA.

 

[Sallow]

As I said on another thread, "Brutus" in Latin means stupid or bestial. This poster chose his name well.

Got any backup to that incredibly silly claim that the Constitution was designed to make liberalism illegal? Like what provisions in the Constitution do this and how? And what the hell you mean by "liberalism"?

The enumerated powers of Article I, Section 8, would be a good start.

The Founders were conservative in the sense that modern conservatives are conservative, i.e. they were for limited governemnt.
They wrote the Constitution to enshrine the Jeffersonian concept of limited government. This, in effect, made liberalism illegal.


"The government of the United States [federal government] is a definite government confined to specified objects [powers]. It is not like state governments, whose powers are more general. CHARITY IS NO PART OF THE LEGISLATIVE DUTY OF THE GOVERNMENT."
-James madison

"Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated." -Jefferson


Now you can understand why our liberals spied for Stalin, not the USA.

Julia Childs spied for Stalin?

The things you learn here.

Oh..and Conservatives had very little to do with the constitution.