The Blind Skier Analogy

[shimon]

How Humorous Hobe so what you are saying....For any following along....Wink Wink.... Is that the Romans roaming around Israel were compared to a pack of unclean Swine,,,,Interesting since you have made my point for me as taking this a step further it was the Romans under Constantine that gave us the new testament and the Jesus or Iesous we have today making as I said before Jesus the king of the Swine and his followers a herd of swine roaming the four corners of the earth as they are all descended in one form or another from The Roman herd ....It is interesting how Hoof in Mouth Disease comes about or as they say you just shot yourself in the proverbial foot....

 

[hobelim]

How Humorous Hobe so what you are saying....For any following along....Wink Wink.... Is that the Romans roaming around Israel were compared to a pack of unclean Swine,,,,Interesting since you have made my point for me as taking this a step further it was the Romans under Constantine that gave us the new testament and the Jesus or Iesous we have today making as I said before Jesus the king of the Swine and his followers a herd of swine roaming the four corners of the earth as they are all descended in one form or another from The Roman herd ....It is interesting how Hoof in Mouth Disease comes about or as they say you just shot yourself in the proverbial foot....

Yes, it is very humorous and I have made it no secret that I agree with both you and Hashev that the Jesus conjured by Rome in 325 c.e. was a combination of pagan and historical Jewish characters, a god made man made matzo made by human hands, a false counterfeit edible Jesus that never existed. However they used stories written by Jews hundreds of years earlier to base their fake mangod on without any understanding of Jewish thought, belief, and expression much less the figurative language of the prophets used by the many authors.

So don't go running for a touchdown just yet. No foot in the mouth for you to gloat over. Sorry. You seem to have neglected to notice the deeper implications of your very cute first wobbly steps in realizing the Jewish tradition of comparing human beings to their animal counterparts according to their shared attributes as it must apply to kashrut, ritual slaughter, and the rest of the law in general..

The law is either about one thing or another. Its either about what food is acceptable serve and eat or not or what teaching is acceptable to teach and learn or not. What flesh of any described animal is clean or unclean or what teaching from the figuratively described people is clean or unclean. It is impossible for both the literal and the figurative interpretation to be true because to comply with the strict literal interpretation of any given law in many cases violates the deeper implications of the very same laws.

So even if you have never eaten bacon in your entire life you could still be guilty of eating the flesh of swine by swallowing the bullshit that God gives a crap about what you eat for dinner as if that was the subject of clean or unclean and what makes a person holy as God is holy or not and not what goes into your mind that either sanctifies or defiles.

 

[HaShev]

Actually the supposed texts they used to compile the NT called Q was deemed written by a woman who they rejected as demon spirited, and since it was burned and not much exists on details there is no way of knowing if the text were Jewish, or the writer was basing it on Judaism. It surely doesn't seem to be and it was rejected by Judaism and the surviving HaNotzrim followers of John.
See Hobelim if your Moshiach is Y'Shu in your mind you have to produce a historical acct like era live in and reasoning-backing & sources. This can't be done without fumbling on the same distorted history you admit Rome forged the image character Jesus.
You can only be referring to 2 historical figures-
Yohoshua ben Channiah of the OT who taught the resurrection teachings but was not a messianic figure.
Or Yeshu ben Stada (ben Panderas) son of Mary of 100bc. who taught Egyptian underworld and did forbidden maggis scams liken to Benny Hinn.
The unlikely
Third option is you are referring to future vision of one to come named Y'Shu(y=H transliteration) like the church admited the image was a figment of collective vision and expectations.
So which era, which history, then you can be shown why that is not fulfilled, worthy of any value, or accurate.
When you are affraid of your own choices and logic it's because you know you are wrong and can be exposed.
Truth needs not hide, only a lie or even lying to yourself needs coddling and hiding in shame.

 

[HaShev]

The question on the Roman swine slur is, where they mocking the revolters against Rome (christs Yehuda and Theudas)they swallowed up and recreated in one new image or were they creatively calling them forbbiden for Jews to partake of conciously or even in irony?

 

[shimon]

Hobe .... Michael and I have discussed many of these things before so it is not like we are new to what you are saying for example just a taste and it has nothing to do with food... The Israelites wandered through the wilderness of sinia before they got the law... Or one could say the Israelites wandered through the wilderness of SIN (ia) before they got the LAW...So they might not have figuratively wandered the Sinia at all.. There are many such examples and we are well aware of the use of animals and insects such as beetles, crows, dogs etc etc.. At least you know where we are coming from.....

 

[hobelim]

Actually the supposed texts they used to compile the NT called Q was deemed written by a woman who they rejected as demon spirited, and since it was burned and not much exists on details there is no way of knowing if the text were Jewish, or the writer was basing it on Judaism. It surely doesn't seem to be and it was rejected by Judaism and the surviving HaNotzrim followers of John.

Whether there was an undisclosed older common source for the gospels of Matthew and Luke is irrelevant and could add credence to the surviving manuscripts as being closer to its Jewish roots.. That aside there is no such Q responsible for the gospels of Mark and John and in the gospel of Mark there is no mention of Jesus as God or any story of virgin birth which would make it more likely to have been originally written by a Jew during the reign of Nero, whatever his sources and not a superstitious Roman fabrication from 325 c.e.. And even the gospels containing fantastical stories of a virgin birth, miracles and what seem like superstitious stories of supernatural demonstrations of divine power could have been written intentionally to divert the superstitious Romans while preserving the teachings of Jesus or whatever you want to call him and compelling those teachings into the future, hidden in a curse, right in the middle of the belly of the beast who had just destroyed the Temple and the nation and slaughtered and sent into captivity and exile hundreds of thousands of Jews.

 

[hobelim]

The question on the Roman swine slur is, where they mocking the revolters against Rome (christs Yehuda and Theudas)they swallowed up and recreated in one new image or were they creatively calling them forbbiden for Jews to partake of conciously or even in irony?

It seems likely to me that Paul was an undercover agent of the enemy who deliberately put words into the mouth of Jesus which would have perverted Christianity and made Jesus and all Christians seem insane to any educated Jew effectively burying his teachings under a mountain of blasphemy.

Whichever historical figure was the real Jesus, he must have really pissed off and embarrassed a lot of powerful people to have inspired such hatred that they went through so much trouble to eliminate his revelation by killing everyone who understood it and then making it the official religion of the entire empire to desecrate his teachings and profane the name of his God as the focus of religious devotion..

 

[hobelim]

Hobe .... Michael and I have discussed many of these things before so it is not like we are new to what you are saying for example just a taste and it has nothing to do with food... The Israelites wandered through the wilderness of sinia before they got the law... Or one could say the Israelites wandered through the wilderness of SIN (ia) before they got the LAW...So they might not have figuratively wandered the Sinia at all.. There are many such examples and we are well aware of the use of animals and insects such as beetles, crows, dogs etc etc.. At least you know where we are coming from.....

No, you have never heard of such a thing before, that kosher law has nothing whatever to do with food or animals but the teaching of people metaphorically defined as lower beasts whether clean or unclean..

If you did, why do some of you refrain from eating mice but gobble down the flesh of teeming people who go down on all fours and swallow the lie that "we" all worship the same God? Talk about straining at a gnat but swallowing a camel!

And I find it astonishing that you are already aware of the use of lower beast human analogies in scripture and have not applied that knowledge to discerning the will of God to master the way to life as instructed through the law.

Astonishing that even one Jew worries about what to eat or what to wear.

Astonishing.

 

[HaShev]

Since Paul is also a converged character (hence Saul given a new name) then perhaps studying the historical figures used for the character will reveal your answer on Paul. Does Acts 13 help you?

In Acts 13 Saul supposedly met Sergius Paulus (a convert) called Paul who's friend was a "maggis" (alymas) called Bar(son)Jesus who Saul called the son of the devil.
Obviously Paul is not Saul, but to defeat Saul and convert Jews Rome perhaps simply makes Saul, Paul the convert, as a tactic to swallow their enemies.

Now to find your Christ you say is in John and Mark then you should research and investigate the Historical Christs matching the described stories and historical figures events etc.
Let me see If I can correlate those texts to the Fitting figure then that Historical christ can be discussed.

 

[HaShev]

Ok if the following seems like a giant mess it's because the NT is a giant contradiction and mess to correlate to actual history.
Contradictions:
Where did Jesus first meet Simon Peter and Andrew?

(a) By the sea of Galilee (Matthew 4:18-22).

(b) On the banks of river Jordan (John 1:42).

This most likely means Matt's Christ is Yehuda the Galilean tax revolter who lived in the Herod Lysanias era and died in 6bc. While John's might be The AD era Theudas by the Jordan.
Although the verse after still can be the Galilean he refers to
As this character Jesus
decided to go to Galilee (John 1:43) after.
How do we determine which one? Well John elsewhere Says Jesus is closer to 50 and since Theudas lasted to 45 ad the AD era christ is the one John is talking about which is Theudas.

History contradicts the tales:
Jesus was supposed to have been baptized by the baptist John soon after John the Baptist had started baptizing and preaching in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberias, i.e. 28-29 C.E., when Pontius Pilate was governor of Judaea i.e. 26-36 C.E. According to the New Testament, this also happened when Lysanias was tetrarch of Abilene and Annas and Caiaphas were high priests. But Lysanias ruled Abilene from c. 40 B.C.E until he was executed in 36 B.C.E by Mark Antony, about 60 years before the date for Tiberias and about 30 years before the supposed birth of Jesus!
This is why it says Satan (Rome the adversary) changes dates and time and holidays.
This throws people off the historical reality to expose the forging of the figure and his image.
Even older copies of John contradict newer ones and chapters in John contradict each other in itself so John as a whole is proven tainted and contradicting enough to not assume anything.

Mark 6:16 is the later AD Herod and Baptist AD era christ Theudas so Mark also is a Theudite.

But wait a second: both
John 18-19 and Mark 14-15 even though contradicting each other are talking about the events of Yeshu son of Mary in around 88-85 bc where he was
sentenced at passover (rarity of high holidays being used for sentencing makes this acct of Yeshu a match hard to argue.
And yet both mention Pilate a supposed AD era figure, and a crucifixion in John 19 which was not the stoned and hanged christ on passover.
The crucified christs were Yehuda and Theudas, but Yeshu son of Mary was slew and hanged even acct in Nt in
Acts 5:30, 10:39, 13:29,
1 Peter 2:24.
So the writers of John and Mark are blending Christs through passing confused stories down the line or on purpose, just as you acknowledge Roman forged texts have done.

What we do know is that John and Mark seem to be addressing mainly Theudas and not your claim it's Yeshu.
Yet still mix the Christs in the accts proving it's not Historical and is also a compuled mess as other texts.
Like John talking about Mother Mary being there during the AD era Crucifixion. Impossible unless Yehuda or Theudas Mom was named Mary, but then Joseph story in Matt shows Mary is the 100bc harlot character and why John 9f Patmos would call it the Harlot church.

 

[hobelim]

Now to find your Christ you say is in John and Mark then you should research and investigate the Historical Christs matching the described stories and historical figures events etc.
Let me see If I can correlate those texts to the Fitting figure then that Historical christ can be discussed.

All four gospels were written between the years 50 -100 c.e., during a time of brutal Roman occupation, the destruction of Israel, and the slaughter exile and enslavement of hundreds of thousands of Jews. Hundreds of years of Jewish and Christian persecution followed. The frankenstein Jesus based on many pagan sources and historical Jewish characters created by Rome in 325 c.e. had not yet been conjured.

The only form of Judaism and Christianity that were allowed to persist was the Christianity created by Rome that is a desecration of the teachings of Jesus and a demonstration of pure hatred for God and the only branch of Judaism that was allowed to persist by Rome also hated Jesus, that bastard, because of his teaching that exposed their ignorance that the law was figurative and the subjects hidden..

If you have no definitive proof that any such Jesus existed as described by the esoteric writings in the Gospels, whose image was further distorted and perverted by the dogma and doctrines perpetuated by the Roman church, it is because he was denigrated, his teachings disregarded as the ramblings of a suicidal lunatic who was a drunk that ran around with sinners and prostitutes, and his memory was extirpated leaving no record of him other than in the gospels themselves and a few dismissive and derogatory accounts recorded by the people he publicly humiliated and condemned as actors and money grubbing lying frauds, according to the gospels.

Any discussion about Jesus to discover what he taught and why he pissed of so many people and was so deeply hated can only be discovered by deciphering the figurative language used in the gospels that was the same language used by the authors of the OT, the language of the prophets as was taught to be understood by Maimonides..

As with the book of Isaiah that is a compilation of many authors over a long period of time the historical accuracy of the character written about is irrelevant, only the hidden teaching matters..

If you look and look and keep on looking, you will find it. If you do not look, you will never find it.

 

[HaShev]

Oh you are so wrong, the historical is everything and the teachings mean nothing, because they are also compiled of all cultures and any resemblence to Judaism or teaching love thy neighbor would be through the partial use of Torah and plagiarism as well as Abrahamic accounts. Any Rabbi teaching Torah is attributed to the Torah not the Rabbi who is not served or venerated.
The Christ you speak of was not teaching Judaism the Notzrim were teaching Luciferianism , as their god was said to be the mystical light between the sun and earth.
Their concept of light was physical, while Jews was spiritual meaning knowledge and truth. Believing the suns rays is your god and death is your paradise is not knowledgable nor truthful therefore it's ignorant and a lie=spiritual darkness.
For you to make excuses for having the wrong name and christ and wrong era is a form of spiritual darkness.
You are still helping the scarab(dung beetle) roll his dung ball larger and larger with your twist to the farce that has no historical reference or accuracies.

That being said: these are the possible reasons for compiled teachings in the images name:
Appollonius of Tyana called Pol was from Tarsus and his acct of sneaking out the window to Syria is used for the Paul character. He had an extensive library of all cultures including Krishna called Christos.
Constantine in forming the new world religion also had an exyensive library and enjoyed many cultures beliefs, it's possible POL could have helped influence the later Constantine or been part of his collection library or been accessible to the writers like Eusebius the great liar and forger who tampered with many books most likely including Josephus' writings..

 

[hobelim]

Oh you are so wrong, the historical is everything and the teachings mean nothing,

Then you might as well throw the entire law and prophets in the trash as well.

Eat what you want, wear what you want, and do whatever you want to do on Saturday,

make up your mind already.