TEACHERS: This Important Question Is For You

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

if they want or need advice on the law, they should speak to an attorney. I don't know what kids you've been around, but my son made it to college without ever having to day "I didn't know it was against the law to drive a car without a license".

But does your son (OR YOU) know what to do if/whenever you get in an accident ? You and him better. If you don't, you or he could be heading to jail. And these are simple, elementary things that we all should know, need to know, and shouldn't have to talk to an attorney for, and are things that could be taught in the classroom in less than ONE MINUTE

Is is very simple. You don't leave!

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Children should be taught basic ethical behavior at home, including teaching them to obey the law. The curriculum is full with math, science, language, social studies, and specific electives focused on getting into college or university or directed toward a vocation. Criminal law is not something most people need on order to pursue a college education and/or a career. It is taught in college and university programs where students are looking to work in law enforcement, law or the criminal justice system.

It is simply unrealistic to teach such a complex subject to high school students who
already have a full curriculum.

As a culture, we know what the basic laws are. What you have seen in the protests when young black men were killed by whites is that the black community has seen a lot of this kind of thing and they get fed up with it.

Your rendition of what happened in both circumstances is biased: what we really need to include in the curriculum is a strong focus on critical thinking skills, teaching students to look at all perspectives of a situation and make an assessment of it based on considered circumspection--not judge it from a obviously biased point of view.

Preposterous post. I can;t believe I'm getting an ounce of resistance here. A complex subject ? Here, does this sound complex to you ? >> Just touching another person against their will, is technically a crime. You can get one year in the county jail for it. If you do it to someone over 65, you can get 3 years in a state prison. Obviously, hitting someone, punching, slapping, grabbing, shoving, are all included in this.

I timed myself reading that (part in red print). It took me 18 seconds to say it. Obviously, it is not complex. And I'm sure that teachers can some up with that 18 seconds to say that. And no, not all people know what the basic laws are. Many, if not most, are oblivious to even basic laws that they NEED to know which could land them in jail if they don't, and which could cause them (et al) to get hurt or even killed. I suspect that neither Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown knew they were breaking a law with George Zimmerman or the clerk in the convenience store.

I'll ask you also about a very basic law, just like I asked 2 other people in this thread who flunked the question with flying colors. 2 cars crash. Neither driver is hurt, but damage has been done to the cars. What, under Florida law or the laws of the state you reside in, are these drivers required to do ? What would you do ?

My "rendition" ? Rendition of what ? And no, we are NOT looking at "perspectives of a situation" That is totally wrong. I'm not talking about something SUBjective. I'm talking about something 100% OBjective (ie, xcriminal law, which documented and you other know what it says, or you don't)

And no, "Criminal law is not something most people need on order to pursue a college education and/or a career." It is something people need to know in order to go about everyday life without getting themselves in trouble and/or in jail.

That is a driver's ed question. Why can't you see that?

 

[Esmeralda]

Children should be taught basic ethical behavior at home, including teaching them to obey the law. The curriculum is full with math, science, language, social studies, and specific electives focused on getting into college or university or directed toward a vocation. Criminal law is not something most people need on order to pursue a college education and/or a career. It is taught in college and university programs where students are looking to work in law enforcement, law or the criminal justice system.

It is simply unrealistic to teach such a complex subject to high school students who
already have a full curriculum.

As a culture, we know what the basic laws are. What you have seen in the protests when young black men were killed by whites is that the black community has seen a lot of this kind of thing and they get fed up with it.

Your rendition of what happened in both circumstances is biased: what we really need to include in the curriculum is a strong focus on critical thinking skills, teaching students to look at all perspectives of a situation and make an assessment of it based on considered circumspection--not judge it from a obviously biased point of view.

Preposterous post. I can;t believe I'm getting an ounce of resistance here. A complex subject ? Here, does this sound complex to you ? >> Just touching another person against their will, is technically a crime. You can get one year in the county jail for it. If you do it to someone over 65, you can get 3 years in a state prison. Obviously, hitting someone, punching, slapping, grabbing, shoving, are all included in this.

I timed myself reading that (part in red print). It took me 18 seconds to say it. Obviously, it is not complex. And I'm sure that teachers can some up with that 18 seconds to say that. And no, not all people know what the basic laws are. Many, if not most, are oblivious to even basic laws that they NEED to know which could land them in jail if they don't, and which could cause them (et al) to get hurt or even killed. I suspect that neither Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown knew they were breaking a law with George Zimmerman or the clerk in the convenience store.

I'll ask you also about a very basic law, just like I asked 2 other people in this thread who flunked the question with flying colors. 2 cars crash. Neither driver is hurt, but damage has been done to the cars. What, under Florida law or the laws of the state you reside in, are these drivers required to do ? What would you do ?

My "rendition" ? Rendition of what ? And no, we are NOT looking at "perspectives of a situation" That is totally wrong. I'm not talking about something SUBjective. I'm talking about something 100% OBjective (ie, xcriminal law, which documented and you other know what it says, or you don't)

And no, "Criminal law is not something most people need on order to pursue a college education and/or a career." It is something people need to know in order to go about everyday life without getting themselves in trouble and/or in jail.

You are talking out of your ass. You don't understand education and you can't see your own biased perspective about social issues. Your are an old crank who knows almost nothing. Go take a nap.

 

[rightwinger]

Not clear what you want taught

That murder is a crime? Do you want to teach the drug laws and how much you are allowed to carry? How about the traffic laws or business laws? Rape laws?

How about their Constitutional right to free speech or protection from unreasonable search and seizure?

Yes it's clear. It couldn't be more clear. Teach kids that any unrequested touching of another person is a crime, and you could go to jail for a year for it (obviously includes punching, slapping, shoving, etc) That's not clear ? don't talk stupid. And yes, the traffic laws - the basic ones (do YOU know them - what you NEED to know, to stay out of jail ?) Basic drug law - yes. Rape - yes. All these are far more important than who sailed around the world in the 1500s. Get it ?

As for their Constitutional right to free speech or protection from unreasonable search and seizure, sure they should be taught that. But that's ALREADY being taught. The basic criminal law usually isn't. Get it ?

Kids don't need to know that unwanted touching is a crime...doesn't matter to them if he goes to jail for a year
They need to know that they have a right to say NO and to report it to an adult

 

[regent]

Some schools seem to have a difficult job of effectively teaching students just the rules of their school, much less criminal law.

 

[protectionist]

Please point out where I said I did not know. I said it is not what I teach. When you get appointed to my state school board, then you can set the curriculum.

In my state, you never leave the scene of an accident that has resulted in injury, death or any property damage Have a nice day, troll!.

Point out > You got a question. Time went by. You didn't answer it, and you're still trying to hide from that by ludicrously calling me a troll (which merely magnifies your ignorance)

And in your state you NEVER leave the scene of an accident. HA HA HA. So you stay there for the rest of your life, right ? You are making a fool of yourself.

Post # 39 told you what you do at an accident. You don't need to say anything more.

 

[protectionist]

Is is very simple. You don't leave!

FALSE! (and absolutely idiotic) Of course you leave, at some point in time. The question is, when and under what conditions, and the answer is in Post # 39.

You can stop pretending now. You had no clue. The world knows it now. You not going to erase that. No biggee. Almost no one else knows it either. Better to just make a copy of Post # 39 and keep it in your glove compartment whenever you're driving in Florida.

 

[protectionist]

That is a driver's ed question. Why can't you see that?

Trying to dodge all this isn't serving you well. Driver's ed. Who cares what you call it ? Sick any label you want on it. Put it in whatever class you like. All I'm saying is, just like the law on battery, the schools aren't teaching it, and they need to, and not in an elective. They need to teach it to EVERY STUDENT.

And generally they're not teaching it in drivers ed either. My kids and their friends all took driver's ed. They never heard of 316.061, 316.062, or 316.065.

 

[protectionist]

You are talking out of your ass. You don't understand education and you can't see your own biased perspective about social issues. Your are an old crank who knows almost nothing. Go take a nap.

NO, FOOL! I'm talking out of the Florida Statutes, which you are also ignorant and oblivious to. If you got in an accident, you'd be pathetically incompetent to deal with the situation. You'd FAIL to present the other driver with the needed information, and you'd wind up in jail. And I just gave you the information (Post # 39) to help you avoid that. YOU'RE WELCOME! ....... IDIOT!

And what YOU "don't understand" is COMMON SENSE.

 

[protectionist]

Kids don't need to know that unwanted touching is a crime...doesn't matter to them if he goes to jail for a year
They need to know that they have a right to say NO and to report it to an adult

So if a kid grabs another kid, or keeps tapping him on the shoulder, or punches him, and the other kid tells his parents, and they call the cops, and the kid gets arrested, because he didn't know he was committing a crime,.............you get the idea (hopefully) Sheeesh!!

 

[protectionist]

Some schools seem to have a difficult job of effectively teaching students just the rules of their school, much less criminal law.

I wouldn't doubt it. Sounds about right. And then it's up to the parents and citizens of the community to fix it.

 

[jasonnfree]

Some schools seem to have a difficult job of effectively teaching students just the rules of their school, much less criminal law.

I wouldn't doubt it. Sounds about right. And then it's up to the parents and citizens of the community to fix it.

I'm surprised you think that the schools should teach what kids already know, like you can't go around punching senior citizens, or any citizens for that matter. Other than a business law class in high school, I was never taught the law in school. You just knew certain thing were wrong and couldn't do them. By the time a kid's in 8th or 9th grade, he's had enough life experience to know right from wrong. Many kids, especially boys, don't belong in school after about age of 13 and 14 anyway. They make trouble because school bores them. IMO, anyway.

 

[protectionist]

I'm surprised you think that the schools should teach what kids already know, like you can't go around punching senior citizens, or any citizens for that matter. Other than a business law class in high school, I was never taught the law in school. You just knew certain thing were wrong and couldn't do them. By the time a kid's in 8th or 9th grade, he's had enough life experience to know right from wrong. Many kids, especially boys, don't belong in school after about age of 13 and 14 anyway. They make trouble because school bores them. IMO, anyway.

That isn't what I said schools should teach. Of course kids know it's wrong. That isn't the topic. The topic is having schools teach THE LAW regarding these things. What the law says, and what the PENALTIES are for breaking that law.

 

[Esmeralda]

You are talking out of your ass. You don't understand education and you can't see your own biased perspective about social issues. Your are an old crank who knows almost nothing. Go take a nap.

NO, FOOL! I'm talking out of the Florida Statutes, which you are also ignorant and oblivious to. If you got in an accident, you'd be pathetically incompetent to deal with the situation. You'd FAIL to present the other driver with the needed information, and you'd wind up in jail. And I just gave you the information (Post # 39) to help you avoid that. YOU'RE WELCOME! ....... IDIOT!

And what YOU "don't understand" is COMMON SENSE.

LMAO

Common sense is a subjective concept: your common sense is not necessarily someone else's common sense. You understand absolutely nothing about education, except, perhaps, as it existed 60 years ago. And it's pretty obvious, you have a primitive understanding of criminal and civil law. You're up the creek. You got no paddle. Go back to bed.

 

[mgh80]

Some schools seem to have a difficult job of effectively teaching students just the rules of their school, much less criminal law.

I wouldn't doubt it. Sounds about right. And then it's up to the parents and citizens of the community to fix it.

Parents (really the lack of parenting) is what causes the problem in the first place. Parents nowadays want to be their kid's best friends and not actual parent them.

 

[Esmeralda]

Some schools seem to have a difficult job of effectively teaching students just the rules of their school, much less criminal law.

I wouldn't doubt it. Sounds about right. And then it's up to the parents and citizens of the community to fix it.

Parents (really the lack of parenting) is what causes the problem in the first place. Parents nowadays want to be their kid's best friends and not actual parent them.

I agree to the extent that parents are not effectivly teaching ethics and morals, and, especially, self control. It really is not the schools' job to teach those things.

 

[CremeBrulee]

That is a driver's ed question. Why can't you see that?

Trying to dodge all this isn't serving you well. Driver's ed. Who cares what you call it ? Sick any label you want on it. Put it in whatever class you like. All I'm saying is, just like the law on battery, the schools aren't teaching it, and they need to, and not in an elective. They need to teach it to EVERY STUDENT.

And generally they're not teaching it in drivers ed either. My kids and their friends all took driver's ed. They never heard of 316.061, 316.062, or 316.065.

Maybe they weren't paying attention.

"Driver's Education in Florida"
"If you have never held a regular driver's license in any state, country, or jurisdiction, you must complete a Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (TLSAE) course prior to applying for a learner's permit in Florida."
Florida Driver's Ed Online Guide | DMV.org
"Drivers Ed courses are designed to give you both classroom and on-road instruction. In addition to the rules of the road and traffic laws for your state, some of the things you'll learn include how to"
"Handle emergency situations, such as flat tires, traffic accidents, and running out of gas."
Teen Drivers: a Beginner's Guide | DMV.org

It's also right there in the Florida Driver Handbook. Also covered in Drivers Ed.
"From the handbook, you'll learn about things like:"
"Insurance and accident reporting laws."

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I'm surprised you think that the schools should teach what kids already know, like you can't go around punching senior citizens, or any citizens for that matter. Other than a business law class in high school, I was never taught the law in school. You just knew certain thing were wrong and couldn't do them. By the time a kid's in 8th or 9th grade, he's had enough life experience to know right from wrong. Many kids, especially boys, don't belong in school after about age of 13 and 14 anyway. They make trouble because school bores them. IMO, anyway.

That isn't what I said schools should teach. Of course kids know it's wrong. That isn't the topic. The topic is having schools teach THE LAW regarding these things. What the law says, and what the PENALTIES are for breaking that law.

That is why they make books and search engines. You should try them sometime.

 

[protectionist]

Common sense is a subjective concept: your common sense is not necessarily someone else's common sense. You understand absolutely nothing about education, except, perhaps, as it existed 60 years ago. And it's pretty obvious, you have a primitive understanding of criminal and civil law. You're up the creek. You got no paddle. Go back to bed.

I would say "Nice try", but you didn't even achieve that much. "primitive understanding of criminal and civil law ?"
Everyone in this forum knows that is FALSE, as proven by Post # 39, in which I poster clearly the laws of Florida 316.061, 316.062, and 316.065. And you childish use of derogatory words like "primitive", and everything you posted after that, shows you can't debate in a public forum with facts and information, but instead, you succumb to silly name calling, displaying your inability to control yourself.

Here's some more understanding of CRIMINAL LAW for you (which is all we're talking about here, not civil) No charge for the tutoring. You're getting an education. You're welcome.

316.061 Crashes involving damage to vehicle or property.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

316.062 Duty to give information and render aid.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

316.065 Crashes; reports; penalties.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

784.011 Assault.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

784.03 Battery; felony battery.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

784.08 Assault or battery on persons 65 years of age or older; reclassification of offenses; minimum sentence.
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Common sense is a subjective concept: your common sense is not necessarily someone else's common sense. You understand absolutely nothing about education, except, perhaps, as it existed 60 years ago. And it's pretty obvious, you have a primitive understanding of criminal and civil law. You're up the creek. You got no paddle. Go back to bed.

I would say "Nice try", but you didn't even achieve that much. "primitive understanding of criminal and civil law ?"
Everyone in this forum knows that is FALSE, as proven by Post # 39, in which I poster clearly the laws of Florida 316.061, 316.062, and 316.065. And you childish use of derogatory words like "primitive", and everything you posted after that, shows you can't debate in a public forum with facts and information, but instead, you succumb to silly name calling, displaying your inability to control yourself.

Here's some more understanding of CRIMINAL LAW for you (which is all we're talking about here, not civil) No charge for the tutoring. You're getting an education.

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

Since you want to continue on this quest to show that you have no sense whatsoever, where do you draw the line?

Do the kids need classes on drug penalties? Sexual misconduct? Real estate law? Tax law? Consumer product labeling? Truth in advertising? Employment law? Where is your line where we can stop?

Oh, what the heck! Let;s just extend high school by about 7 years and give everyone a J.D. degree with their high school diploma.

You are severely challenged. I suggest counseling.