Slate exposes the "Medicare for All" lie being pushed by Democrats

Mac1958

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Dec 8, 2011
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Opposing Authoritarian Ideological Fundamentalism.
Medicare for All Doesn’t Mean What Americans Think It Means

“Medicare for all” is a popular and politically effective slogan. Polls have shown that 70 percent of adults, and maybe more, say they’d support opening the federal health care program for the elderly to every American. This is all much to the delight Sen. Bernie Sanders, who managed to mainstream the idea during his 2016 presidential run, and has trumpeted those survey results in recent appearances.


One problem for Sanders is that when most Americans hear the words “Medicare for all,” they aren’t necessarily imagining the sort of single-payer system the Vermont senator has proposed. Worse yet, support for national health insurance seems to vacillate a great deal based on how pollsters couch the question. On Wednesday, for instance, the Kaiser Family Foundation published its latest tracking poll on public attitudes towards health care policy. Similar to its previous results, it found that 56 percent of Americans would support “a national health plan, sometimes called Medicare for all, in which American would get their insurance from a single government plan.” That’s not a bad outcome on its face. But many survey takers seemed to be confused about what Medicare for all, as it’s been formally proposed, would actually do. Among those under the age of 65 who had employer-sponsored coverage, 55 percent said they thought they would be able to keep their current health plan if Medicare for all were put in place.


That is not how Sanders’ single-payer bill would work. The legislation that Sanders has written, and that many of his colleagues and potential Democratic primary opponents endorsed, would expressly ban private insurance plans that compete with the government.


That turns out to be a fairly unpopular idea. According to Kaiser, support for Medicare for all drops to 37 percent if survey takers are told that the bill would eliminate private insurance companies, with 58 percent opposed.


In other words, Americans want access to government insurance, but they don’t want to be forced to use it—people prefer optionality. Kaiser finds that 73 percent of adults support “creating a national government administered health plan similar to Medicare open to anyone, but would allow people to keep the coverage they have.” This is an idea that, in health policy world, generally gets referred to as “Medicare for anyone.” The closest thing to it is probably a proposal produced by the Center for American Progress that would ban private insurers from competing on the individual market and would create strong incentives for employers to move their employees onto the federal plan.

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Expand the current Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with graduated coverage as we age. Maintain the current and popular free market component, and take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers.

You are being lied to, if you care.
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I clicked on the "has written" link above in hopes of reading portion of the the legislation which "would expressly ban private insurance plans that compete with the government.". It wasn't there. Do you have a link to that?
 
Medicare for all” is a popular and politically effective slogan. Polls have shown that 70 percent of adults, and maybe more, say they’d support opening the federal health care program for the elderly to every American. This is all much to the delight Sen. Bernie Sanders, who managed to mainstream the idea during his 2016 presidential run, and has trumpeted those survey results in recent appearances.

Vichy Mac living in mortal fear that Insurance companies can't make obscene profits on pain and suffering.
 
I clicked on the "has written" link above in hopes of reading portion of the the legislation which "would expressly ban private insurance plans that compete with the government.". It wasn't there. Do you have a link to that?
What to expect when you’re expecting to eliminate private insurance

That's nice. It didn't answer my question, though.
From the article-

There are lots of reasons Democrats are increasingly supporting legislation that would eliminate employer-sponsored coverage entirely. Both Harris and Booker, for example, are co-sponsors on Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) single-payer bill, which would move all Americans to government-run coverage.
 
From the article-

There are lots of reasons Democrats are increasingly supporting legislation that would eliminate employer-sponsored coverage entirely. Both Harris and Booker, for example, are co-sponsors on Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) single-payer bill, which would move all Americans to government-run coverage.

Why is that a bad thing? Frankly, that we let our employers hold our family's health coverage over our heads is obscene.
 
Bernie knows this is true Single Payer and not "Medicare for All".

He also knows that the term "Medicare for All" POLLS higher than "Single Payer".

So do the Regressive Left.

I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
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"Expand the current Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with graduated coverage as we age. Maintain the current and popular free market component, and take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers."


If you take the massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers, who picks up the tab? I'm guessing the American taxpayers, true? And how is the current free market component going to compete with an expanded Medicare system that is mostly paid for by the gov't?
 
"Expand the current Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with graduated coverage as we age. Maintain the current and popular free market component, and take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers."
If you take the massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers, who picks up the tab? I'm guessing the American taxpayers, true? And how is the current free market component going to compete with an expanded Medicare system that is mostly paid for by the gov't?
49% of our lifetime health costs are incurred after age 65, and we're already covering that under the overall Medicare system. Because the cost of supplemental free market health plans would be so cheap for younger people, we'd have a sliding scale so that their actual Medicare coverage is far lower, say 30% and rising to 80% over time. That way we know that preventive/diagnostic treatments would be covered, instead of letting conditions fester and worsen for those who have no coverage.

The free market would expand its current Medicare Supplement and Medicare Advantage offerings to all. Competition. Innovation.

Would it increase our income taxes? Decent chance. But it would also keep costs down because we'd be catching serious conditions earlier. And it would be a SHITLOAD better than true Single Payer, the monopoly of all monopolies. I'd take a small tax increase over the large one that Single Payer would cause.
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Bernie knows this is true Single Payer and not "Medicare for All".

He also knows that the term "Medicare for All" POLLS higher than "Single Payer".

So do the Regressive Left.

I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
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Hmmm. You’ve gone all in on this one, huh? The Affordable Care Act polled way better than Obamacare too.

You think that people don’t know that Medicare For All signifies the end of private health care insurance being the way people get their health care? Of course they do. Sanders uses nations with single payer as examples when he discusses his plan all the time. France. Germany. Japan. Look them up.

You claim to want to take the burden of providing a health insurance benefit off of the backs of employers. That’s a noble concept. Except employers would rather provide the benefit ( and get the tax break ) than increase the wages of their employees....which they’d have to do.

The key is to remove the obscene profit incentive when it comes to providing health care. There is an entire unnecessary industry which exists to do nothing but add cost to health care services.

Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it.

Thread fail.
 
"Expand the current Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with graduated coverage as we age. Maintain the current and popular free market component, and take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers."


If you take the massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers, who picks up the tab? I'm guessing the American taxpayers, true? And how is the current free market component going to compete with an expanded Medicare system that is mostly paid for by the gov't?

Where “by the government” means “by everyone who earns a paycheck”.

Derp.
 
I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it. Thread fail.
I swear, folks, I don't pay them to do this.
.
 
I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it. Thread fail.
I swear, folks, I don't pay them to do this.
.

And nobody pays you to make dopey threads claiming to expose shit that everyone knows.
 
I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it. Thread fail.
I swear, folks, I don't pay them to do this.
.

And nobody pays you to make dopey threads claiming to expose shit that everyone knows.
So you admit the lie.

Cool, thanks.

Yet you bitch anyway. That's just who you are.
.
 
I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it. Thread fail.
I swear, folks, I don't pay them to do this.
.

And nobody pays you to make dopey threads claiming to expose shit that everyone knows.
So you admit the lie.

Cool, thanks.

Yet you bitch anyway. That's just who you are.
.

It’s not a lie. It’s right there in the plan. You knew it. I knew it. Nobody told you or me that Medicare For All would preserve the wasteful private insurance market that we have today.

So who lied?
 
I'm disappointed to see him lying like this. I'm not at all surprised that the Regressive Left is.
Medicare For All IS Single Payer and those of us who pay attention enough to meaningfully respond to this kind of poll question know it. Thread fail.
I swear, folks, I don't pay them to do this.
.

And nobody pays you to make dopey threads claiming to expose shit that everyone knows.
So you admit the lie.

Cool, thanks.

Yet you bitch anyway. That's just who you are.
.

It’s not a lie. It’s right there in the plan. You knew it. I knew it. Nobody told you or me that Medicare For All would preserve the wasteful private insurance market that we have today.

So who lied?
I refer you to the Slate article in the OP. That's not exactly a right wing publication.

You're ignorant. Or you're a liar. Or you're an ignorant liar.

There. I've shown you your attention for the day. You're welcome.
.
 
"Expand the current Medicare / Medicare Advantage / Medicare Supplement system to all, with graduated coverage as we age. Maintain the current and popular free market component, and take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers."
If you take the massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers, who picks up the tab? I'm guessing the American taxpayers, true? And how is the current free market component going to compete with an expanded Medicare system that is mostly paid for by the gov't?
49% of our lifetime health costs are incurred after age 65, and we're already covering that under the overall Medicare system. Because the cost of supplemental free market health plans would be so cheap for younger people, we'd have a sliding scale so that their actual Medicare coverage is far lower, say 30% and rising to 80% over time. That way we know that preventive/diagnostic treatments would be covered, instead of letting conditions fester and worsen for those who have no coverage.

The free market would expand its current Medicare Supplement and Medicare Advantage offerings to all. Competition. Innovation.

Would it increase our income taxes? Decent chance. But it would also keep costs down because we'd be catching serious conditions earlier. And it would be a SHITLOAD better than true Single Payer, the monopoly of all monopolies. I'd take a small tax increase over the large one that Single Payer would cause.
.

A decent chance? More like an absolute sure thing, and I don't think it'll be a small increase either.

Now tell me how private HC insurance can possibly compete with an expanded gov't paid Medicare program. Answer: they can't. Right now, Medicare pays for about 80% or so of most HC expenses, right? How does private HCI match that? Answer: they can't, so we're going to end up with something very close to single Payer by another name. Private insurance would effectively be reduced to Medicare supplement and advantage plans, but there's a whole lot of people at or below whatever the income level is for qualifying for gov't paid medical care.

So - right now we pay for Medicare for those 65 and up, if we change it to just about everybody then that's not going to be an insignificant increase in cost to the taxpayers. And we haven't talked about the increased demand, if you add almost everybody into the HC system then you're going to have huge access problems. Except for the rich guys, who can afford the cost of private insurance here or will be flying off to another country for treatment.

Nice idea, but until I see some numbers I won't be buying into the concept. Recent estimates are about $30 trillion (give or take) over 10 years for single payer, what have you got for this proposal? I don't see how the idea is fiscally feasible.
 
From the article-

There are lots of reasons Democrats are increasingly supporting legislation that would eliminate employer-sponsored coverage entirely. Both Harris and Booker, for example, are co-sponsors on Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) single-payer bill, which would move all Americans to government-run coverage.

Why is that a bad thing? Frankly, that we let our employers hold our family's health coverage over our heads is obscene.
Correct.

And employers would love nothing more than to free themselves from the burden of dealing with providing their employees with healthcare insurance.
 

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