CDZ Should prison guard unions be banned, to prevent the increase in for profit prisons?

[miketx]

All unions should be prevented in prisons, public or private.

Private prisons should be banned, period.

I think for-profit prison industry is a bad bad idea - to make profit off of human misery is wrong. Worse - it seems that it would encourage the creation of more prisons and more reasons to put people into prison rather than using alternative methods.

If unions encourage this - I would oppose them.

We agree on the banning of private prisons, but how in general are prisons "human misery"?

Prisons are institutions for punishment and for banishment from society either for a fixed period or for a lifetime period, the situation is if they don't want to have to endure that harsh treatment then they should think twice before committing crimes.

I see prisons a bit differently:
Protect society first and formost.
Punishment
Rehabilitation

You need rehabilitation to prevent the constant cycle of ending up back in prison. If punishment can be done without prison, then it might be more effective for certain crimes.

It is not the prisons job, or the employees job to punish the offender. The incarcerated offenders punishment is being locked up and being forced to live under the rules of engagement of the unit he is in. The prisons job is to make sure they are safe during that time.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

 

[Disir]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

 

[miketx]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival. Officers are trained to watch for behavior that could be mental. In my time, we identified some that had to be sent to mental health units. Now here is the part you may find hard to swallow. On many of these reassignments due to mental health issues, the majority of these offenders were sent back because they were faking. Their "abhorrent" behavior, was, to put it mildly, because they were assholes. We had one that was sent off three times for cutting himself. Each time he was sent back because his self inflicted cuts were little more than abrasions. He made a lot of blood and smeared it everywhere. I myself pepper sprayed him twice for attempting to assault me while in restraints as did two LT's. He was just an asshole that wanted to be off this particular unit.

You do have to take mental complaints seriously and they are. There were some legitimate complaints, but by far, they were all mostly acting out.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

 

[Coyote]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival. Officers are trained to watch for behavior that could be mental. In my time, we identified some that had to be sent to mental health units. Now here is the part you may find hard to swallow. On many of these reassignments due to mental health issues, the majority of these offenders were sent back because they were faking. Their "abhorrent" behavior, was, to put it mildly, because they were assholes. We had one that was sent off three times for cutting himself. Each time he was sent back because his self inflicted cuts were little more than abrasions. He made a lot of blood and smeared it everywhere. I myself pepper sprayed him twice for attempting to assault me while in restraints as did two LT's. He was just an asshole that wanted to be off this particular unit.

You do have to take mental complaints seriously and they are. There were some legitimate complaints, but by far, they were all mostly acting out.

No, I don't find it "hard to swallow" - I fully recognize people can fake it or just be assholes. But It's also true that jails, particularly county jails end up having to house a lot of mentally ill people that shouldn't be there.

 

[Disir]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival. Officers are trained to watch for behavior that could be mental. In my time, we identified some that had to be sent to mental health units. Now here is the part you may find hard to swallow. On many of these reassignments due to mental health issues, the majority of these offenders were sent back because they were faking. Their "abhorrent" behavior, was, to put it mildly, because they were assholes. We had one that was sent off three times for cutting himself. Each time he was sent back because his self inflicted cuts were little more than abrasions. He made a lot of blood and smeared it everywhere. I myself pepper sprayed him twice for attempting to assault me while in restraints as did two LT's. He was just an asshole that wanted to be off this particular unit.

You do have to take mental complaints seriously and they are. There were some legitimate complaints, but by far, they were all mostly acting out.

"Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival."

I think the main problem is at the arrest stage, that's where people with mental health issues are slipping through the safety net.

Those with severe mental health issues should not even be arriving at a prison in the first place, they should be immediately sent to a psychiatric hospital.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

Well being against privatising prisons doesn't automatically mean pro-Socialism.

A Socialist version of running the prison system would be a complete disaster.

 

[miketx]

I used to tease our MH lady all the time. She was extremely professional. And built like a brick house. 44 DD. It was very hard to get her goat, as she took her job Very seriously. In fact, I even used her to get to a few turds in seg that wouldn't come out of their cells for showers so I could search the cell.

One day she came in and asked me what was going on. I said that I had some really cool stuff that I was going to do after work. She asked what, and i said I couldn't tell her what I was gonna do. She got a puzzled look on her face and asked my why I couldn't tell her? I said the voices in my head said they would kill a kitten if I told. LOL! She ignored me for a week!

 

[miketx]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival. Officers are trained to watch for behavior that could be mental. In my time, we identified some that had to be sent to mental health units. Now here is the part you may find hard to swallow. On many of these reassignments due to mental health issues, the majority of these offenders were sent back because they were faking. Their "abhorrent" behavior, was, to put it mildly, because they were assholes. We had one that was sent off three times for cutting himself. Each time he was sent back because his self inflicted cuts were little more than abrasions. He made a lot of blood and smeared it everywhere. I myself pepper sprayed him twice for attempting to assault me while in restraints as did two LT's. He was just an asshole that wanted to be off this particular unit.

You do have to take mental complaints seriously and they are. There were some legitimate complaints, but by far, they were all mostly acting out.

"Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival."

I think the main problem is at the arrest stage, that's where people with mental health issues are slipping through the safety net.

Those with severe mental health issues should not even be arriving at a prison in the first place, they should be immediately sent to a psychiatric hospital.

Judging by the very few we had, I would say it works.

 

[Disir]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

Well being against privatising prisons doesn't automatically mean pro-Socialism.

A Socialist version of running the prison system would be a complete disaster.

Mental Hospitals.

 

[JakeStarkey]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Canada, Denmark, France, United Kingdom, Germany, and on and on.

 

[miketx]

The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons.

MikeTx, and all security prison personnel, have an awful job. The environment is terrible, the pay is not worth it (and I have no idea about benefitis), but the fact is our society has permitted our LEO to be the first line of interaction far too often with the mentally ill. With the profession and infrastructure set up as it is, where else are they going to go?

"The mentally ill belong in mental hospitals not prisons."

Yes too many people with mental health issues including Schizophrenia are in prison, prison is the worst possible environment for them to be in.

Prisons have mental health professionals on staff and each offender is evaluated many times upon arrival. Officers are trained to watch for behavior that could be mental. In my time, we identified some that had to be sent to mental health units. Now here is the part you may find hard to swallow. On many of these reassignments due to mental health issues, the majority of these offenders were sent back because they were faking. Their "abhorrent" behavior, was, to put it mildly, because they were assholes. We had one that was sent off three times for cutting himself. Each time he was sent back because his self inflicted cuts were little more than abrasions. He made a lot of blood and smeared it everywhere. I myself pepper sprayed him twice for attempting to assault me while in restraints as did two LT's. He was just an asshole that wanted to be off this particular unit.

You do have to take mental complaints seriously and they are. There were some legitimate complaints, but by far, they were all mostly acting out.

No, I don't find it "hard to swallow" - I fully recognize people can fake it or just be assholes. But It's also true that jails, particularly county jails end up having to house a lot of mentally ill people that shouldn't be there.

Those are evaluated as well. All offenders in prison come from county jails. Judging by the small amount we ever got, they must be doing a good job. One possibility is that people on the verge of "going crazy" go over after being locked up a while.

 

[JakeStarkey]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

Well being against privatising prisons doesn't automatically mean pro-Socialism.

A Socialist version of running the prison system would be a complete disaster.

You have no idea of what you are saying. A Socialist prison system would be run by the government, as most prison systems are in fact run by the Governments. The problem is that a Socialist or a private prison is not the place for a seriously mentally ill person.

 

[Lucy Hamilton]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

Well being against privatising prisons doesn't automatically mean pro-Socialism.

A Socialist version of running the prison system would be a complete disaster.

Mental Hospitals.

 

[Disir]

All of that is long gone. It's going to take some socialism to bring it back.

Why would it need Socialism? The only things that Socialism bring are complete misery and abject inequality.

The latest example in a long list of examples of the disaster of Socialism is Venezuela.

Because there is nothing to profit from so the private industry does not want it.

Well being against privatising prisons doesn't automatically mean pro-Socialism.

A Socialist version of running the prison system would be a complete disaster.

Mental Hospitals.

Most of the prisons are "socialist" as in it's run by the government and we the people pay money in the form of taxes. Private prisons we call faux privatization because we the people still pay money in the form of taxes. When they get sued? We the people still cover the cost.

Once upon a time in the US there were state run mental hospitals. There are a few left in some states. The private industry does not make any money off of the seriously mentally ill. They won't take them. Cops take people to the psych ward of hospitals and the hospital dopes them up and releases them. Cops...........another bit of socialism.

So, in order to get done what needs to be done it will require a bit of socialism. You know where the rich people in the US send their mentally ill relatives?

Socialist Europe.

 

[miketx]

Suicide watch.