Shoot or not shoot?

[RodISHI]

The thief verses the one with a murderous heart....

Katko V. Briney, Iowa, 1971

Briney's claim was his defense of his property when he set the spring loaded gun to go off and kill the intruder when the intruder entered into his property to steal from them. Katko lost a leg from shotgun blast and sued Briney's even though he was fully intending on invading the Briney's property and making off with some of their goods.

Katko sued Briney. The jury returned a verdict for Katko and against the defendant for $20000 actual and $10000 punitive damages. The Briney's had to sell 80 acres of their farm land to pay for the lawsuit. The Briney's neighbors chipped in to purchase the land at auction and help the Briney's retain the property long term.

katko vs briney "iowa" - Google Search

 

[Zona]

Here's the scenero. It's 11:30 pm. You are sleeping in your bed and hear somebody break into your house by forcing the front door. You have a pistol in your nightstand and you take it out of the drawer and make sure it is loaded. You get out of your bed, turn on your bedroom light and step out into the hallway. As you do, you notice a person climbing your stairway and the person has a knife in their hand. Would you shoot this person or not shoot this person?

I would shoot this person.

This is too easy. This is what handguns are designed for in my opinion. Just be careful to not shoot him in the back. Each state has different rules.

 

[Zona]

I don't do handguns either. I can't hit shit with them, except possibly my own foot.

But I'm dead on with a rifle.

I went shooting a couple of weeks ago....the target was a paper Bin Ladin....I got him right in the heart with a sig 229...and here's the cool part....that's where I was aiming.

I'm thinking about getting a hand gun, I shot real well with that sig 229.

I took my wife to a gun shop this weekend. I wanted to see if the smith and Wesson .38 642 pistol would fit her hand nicely. It does. It is the next one for us. I like the thought of her having on in the house.

 

[L.K.Eder]

shoot the bastard, then find his family and annihilate them. then nuke his hometown.

 

[007]

The thief verses the one with a murderous heart....

Katko V. Briney, Iowa, 1971

Briney's claim was his defense of his property when he set the spring loaded gun to go off and kill the intruder when the intruder entered into his property to steal from them. Katko lost a leg from shotgun blast and sued Briney's even though he was fully intending on invading the Briney's property and making off with some of their goods.

Katko sued Briney. The jury returned a verdict for Katko and against the defendant for $20000 actual and $10000 punitive damages. The Briney's had to sell 80 acres of their farm land to pay for the lawsuit. The Briney's neighbors chipped in to purchase the land at auction and help the Briney's retain the property long term.

katko vs briney "iowa" - Google Search

The law suit you've sighted has little bearing on MM's scenario. The person in your case here was simply trying to steal. The person in MM's case has broken into a home and is proceeding up the homes stair case with a weapon in his hand in a malicious manner. I'd venture to say that had the case you posted above included the latter facts, the outcome would have been different. Not only that, but it goes back to one simple rule... "a dead man can't sue you."

 

[Diuretic]

Firearms training makes all the difference. So that when the situation warrants, your training kicks in and you do what you need to do.

Killing someone isn't easy to live with after the fact, but if you're trained it's automatic, conditioned response.

And you're 100% certain of it. Why.

Actually, you know what? I want to hear about this from someone who has a first hand experience with this. Not just some gun toting bag of testosterone. I want to hear about this from a cop or a soldier that was in a position where they had to shoot a person. Everyone else's 'theoretical' opinion means jack shit to me.

Having been in a situation a couple of times where it was shoot/don't shoot, at least from my own experience I can say MM is right. You will shoot if you have to. If you don't and this bloke with the knife is within the 21 feet rule, he will probably kill you. There's no point in retreating, no point in calling the police, in this situation you're on your own and you have to deal with an armed man in your house. I've never had to shoot someone and I'm thankful for that. However even without having to discharge the firearm I can tell you that the shakes set in a bit later when you realise what could have happened.

 

[RodISHI]

The thief verses the one with a murderous heart....

Katko V. Briney, Iowa, 1971

Briney's claim was his defense of his property when he set the spring loaded gun to go off and kill the intruder when the intruder entered into his property to steal from them. Katko lost a leg from shotgun blast and sued Briney's even though he was fully intending on invading the Briney's property and making off with some of their goods.

Katko sued Briney. The jury returned a verdict for Katko and against the defendant for $20000 actual and $10000 punitive damages. The Briney's had to sell 80 acres of their farm land to pay for the lawsuit. The Briney's neighbors chipped in to purchase the land at auction and help the Briney's retain the property long term.

katko vs briney "iowa" - Google Search

The law suit you've sighted has little bearing on MM's scenario. The person in your case here was simply trying to steal. The person in MM's case has broken into a home and is proceeding up the homes stair case with a weapon in his hand in a malicious manner. I'd venture to say that had the case you posted above included the latter facts, the outcome would have been different. Not only that, but it goes back to one simple rule... "a dead man can't sue you."

The case was put in just for the thought process, Pale.

Making up a scenario is just that a scenario. A person can only assume what they may do in any given situation. You can prepare, train and have experience but when it comes down to the actual situation in any given situation that is the moment you make the choice and the decision on how you will react. Even then it is not always what you may have thought it would be. I was train as a certified EMT. I don't care for blood or seeing people hurt but we were around a lot of situations where I needed to have the know how on what to do so I went through the courses. Could have not told you how I would react once I received that training even until a situation was there and I was faced with helping an accident victim. Fortunately I reacted with the training I had been given. I did decide afterward taking care of hurt people bleeding was not my gig.

 

[brewerboy]

I'd make them aware of the situation.

Lay down your belly! Dont move!

Have the significant other call the cops.

If said robber made so much as a twitch in my general direction, its lights out.

So the court can appoint a greedy little unemployable, beady eyed mommas boy, wanna be lawyer, and get him back on the streets in 90 days so he can knife your grandmother.
Go back to England.

And you go back to your local gun safety/hunters safety course.

Anyone who would blindly shoot not knowing EXCATLY who the person was, or EXCATLY what is in their hand, is well....a fool and IMO probably shouldnt have a gun.

I can see you're that idiot though.

And I've never even been to England, D-bag.

 

[WillowTree]

Tell them to drop the knife and then shoot them in the leg, if they come toward me after that, I would have no choice but to shoot to kill

I would never aim at a leg, I might miss, if I'm going to shoot at someone, I will shoot to kill.

now there is the exact right answer!

 

[sitarro]

After pumping the slide on my 12 gauge to load a round into the chamber, if that distinctive sound doesn't send the intruder running, he or she needs to be killed........ they are crazy with seriously bad intensions..
In Texas, if someone comes onto your property after dark, they are fair game.

 

[Big Black Dog]

Actually, you know what? I want to hear about this from someone who has a first hand experience with this. Not just some gun toting bag of testosterone. I want to hear about this from a cop or a soldier that was in a position where they had to shoot a person. Everyone else's 'theoretical' opinion means jack shit to me.

Never had the guy with a knife in my home but a would be rapist entered into my bedroom one early morning. It was a guy my cousin who lived in the apartment next to me had brought home with her the night before from a bar (she was a few years younger than I). I awoke to this stranger standing a few feet away from the foot of my bed. I asked him what are you doing in my house? How did you get in here? Leave now. He said, I just thought I'd ask coffee, tea or me? I told him again leave and added I do not want anything but you out of my house. He repeated it again. Again told I him out. He said I know you want me and jumped on top of me and pinned me into my bed. It had all happened very quickly. I reached my left hand down beside the bed frame and the mattress and slipped my fingers around the gun handle my dad had given me for protection. At that point i was still calm and trying not to panic. I asked the guy again to please leave and get off of me. He said, I know you want me. I told him I want you off of me and out of here. He then told me he was going to rape me. At the point in my mind the thoughts were "thou shalt not kill" but I was not going to be raped or abused by anyone ever again. If it came down to me or him I was prepared to shoot him. I asked once more get off of me, leave now. I did not give him another chance to get out of his mouth what he was going to do to me. I put the gun to his head and told him get off or I am going to blow your ass away. He flew off of me. Not jumped flew. He landed six feet away from the end of my bed standing upright. He was shaking as he said I was just kidding. I told him that is not something that you kid about.

A few years later I was in a neighboring town walking down the sidewalk. This same guy approached me and said, do you remember me? I thought to myself yes I remember you you little prick but I just said yes. He said I have something I want to show you. I'm thinking I really do not want to see anything he has. He said please just a few moments of your time? I relented, okay. He walked down a few store buildings, went into a restaurant and came back out with a beautiful baby girl in his arms. He told me, this is my daughter isn't she beautiful. I agreed with him she was beautiful. He said I want you to know you saved me. I told him no God saved you I was going to shoot your ass. The guy still nice and polite told me he vowed to take very good care of that baby girl God had given him and took her to Church every Sunday.

If I had of shot that young man God would not have been able to work a miracle of life in his life. That beautiful little girl he cared so very much for.

Would I shoot someone if I had too, yes but only in absolute dire circumstances where no other choice was given but to shoot.

You were very foolish. This guy should have been worm food.

 

[Zona]

After pumping the slide on my 12 gauge to load a round into the chamber, if that distinctive sound doesn't send the intruder running, he or she needs to be killed........ they are crazy with seriously bad intensions..
In Texas, if someone comes onto your property after dark, they are fair game.

From what I understand...in Texas, if the guy gets your order wrong in a restaurant, you are allowed to kill him...

 

[sitarro]

After pumping the slide on my 12 gauge to load a round into the chamber, if that distinctive sound doesn't send the intruder running, he or she needs to be killed........ they are crazy with seriously bad intensions..
In Texas, if someone comes onto your property after dark, they are fair game.

From what I understand...in Texas, if the guy gets your order wrong in a restaurant, you are allowed to kill him...

Only on your property.......... You can pistol whip the guy in a restaurant though.

 

[Big Black Dog]

I have had some pretty extensive training in both handguns and an AR-15 rifle. The correct response to the situation is "SHOOT TO KILL". If you came up with any other kind of an answer, especially if you did not take the situation exactly as written but added your own ideas or facts into the story, you are wrong. You would be completely justified in shooting this person as the story is told. In the story, the bedroom light was turned on for several reasons. (1) Unless you are an owl, it's pretty hard to identify and see a person in the dark. (2) By turning on the light you have alerted the intruder to the fact that you know he is there and it's his turn to make a decision and that decision is: (a) immediately leave or (b) face the consequences. If you are in the unfortunate position of having to shoot somebody to defend yourself, by all means, shoot to kill. When the police arrive there will only be one side of the story to be told. You never, ever, point a gun at something you do not intend to destroy - either loaded or unloaded. If you shoot, shoot to kill. Unless you have had some sort of firearm training, you should not have a firearm in your home. If you do not completely understand how to use that firearm, by all means either sell it in a legal way or get the training. If you don't understand it, you have no business with it. A firearm is nothing more than a tool. It is a tool designed to shoot projectiles. A gun alone has never killed anybody. Somebody has to pull the trigger - be it by accident or on purpose. You can leave a loaded gun on your table forever and it will never hurt anybody. However, once you pick it up unless you use it correctly it can cause deadly harm. One last statement about this story. If the intruder had of turned around to leave, and was making a clear effort to leave, he is no longer a threat to you and you are not justified in shooting this individual. Never shoot at someone who is running away from you because if you do, then you are committing a crime.

 

[AllieBaba]

Unless you happen to be a cop.

 

[Zona]

After pumping the slide on my 12 gauge to load a round into the chamber, if that distinctive sound doesn't send the intruder running, he or she needs to be killed........ they are crazy with seriously bad intensions..
In Texas, if someone comes onto your property after dark, they are fair game.

From what I understand...in Texas, if the guy gets your order wrong in a restaurant, you are allowed to kill him...

Only on your property.......... You can pistol whip the guy in a restaurant though.

Ah...but not just on your property, you can kill him if he is coming out of your neighbors window as well. Gotta love Texas.

 

[Againsheila]

The thief verses the one with a murderous heart....

Katko V. Briney, Iowa, 1971

Briney's claim was his defense of his property when he set the spring loaded gun to go off and kill the intruder when the intruder entered into his property to steal from them. Katko lost a leg from shotgun blast and sued Briney's even though he was fully intending on invading the Briney's property and making off with some of their goods.

Katko sued Briney. The jury returned a verdict for Katko and against the defendant for $20000 actual and $10000 punitive damages. The Briney's had to sell 80 acres of their farm land to pay for the lawsuit. The Briney's neighbors chipped in to purchase the land at auction and help the Briney's retain the property long term.

katko vs briney "iowa" - Google Search

We live in a sick world......I'm glad the neighbor's chipped in to buy the land back for the people, and I hope Katko eventually pays for his crime of robbing them of everything tangible.

 

[Againsheila]

I don't do handguns either. I can't hit shit with them, except possibly my own foot.

But I'm dead on with a rifle.

I went shooting a couple of weeks ago....the target was a paper Bin Ladin....I got him right in the heart with a sig 229...and here's the cool part....that's where I was aiming.

I'm thinking about getting a hand gun, I shot real well with that sig 229.

I took my wife to a gun shop this weekend. I wanted to see if the smith and Wesson .38 642 pistol would fit her hand nicely. It does. It is the next one for us. I like the thought of her having on in the house.

Hope she practiced with it before you decide to buy it. I tried a Smith and Wesson and it just didn't have the control of the sig 229. I also tried the glock. Of the three, I like the sig 229 best and the Smith and Wesson the worst.

 

[sitarro]

If you're going to get her a pistol, this might be the killer choice.......... it's the Judge by Taurus, fires .45 and .410.

 

[Zona]

I went shooting a couple of weeks ago....the target was a paper Bin Ladin....I got him right in the heart with a sig 229...and here's the cool part....that's where I was aiming.

I'm thinking about getting a hand gun, I shot real well with that sig 229.

I took my wife to a gun shop this weekend. I wanted to see if the smith and Wesson .38 642 pistol would fit her hand nicely. It does. It is the next one for us. I like the thought of her having on in the house.

Hope she practiced with it before you decide to buy it. I tried a Smith and Wesson and it just didn't have the control of the sig 229. I also tried the glock. Of the three, I like the sig 229 best and the Smith and Wesson the worst.

I looked into the sig 229, read what others have said about it, hmmmm...you have to keep in mind, this is for my wife...I was directed to this particular gun (Smith and Wesson) by my brother...he is a cop in California and said for reliability, size, weight, and accuracy for the home, this is the best gun for my wife. ( but defiantly get a speed loader, its only a five shot gun...) Actually, if she needs more than five shots, there are some serious issues doing on that day...

I really don't know yet, but will have her feel the sig as well. Will let you know what happens.