Zone1 Serious Question About Abortion

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

Except I pay taxes and hold down a job and all of that. Most of the globs who get aborted are from people who really aren't making much of a contribution.

You contribute ugly hatred that we could do without, globby.

They at least have the potential to be neutral or a net positive to civilization.

So you care about babies, unless they are actual babies in third world countries that we've exploited into poverty.... got it.

Yeah, no, you don't get that or get much of anything else.

You literally just argued that because someone else somewhere might die, it's fine to shoot you in the head right now. You couldn't mean it, as that "logic" is absurd and insane, but that IS still your argument, your logic.

I mean whine about unrelated things all you like, it won't get you away from your own logical fallacies or nonsense.

Um, okay, get back to me the first time you put a woman in prison for getting an abortion. That will make BLM look like a picnic.

I mean, BLM riots already warranted looters being gunned down, and this would be more worthy of putting down with force than that, so hey. FA, FO.

Me, personally, I'm not going to have an abortion. I don't have the right equipment. Also, I'm really old.

Yeah, no. You could still kill someone else for your own personal benefit. And you don't need any particular equipment to kill the innocent, particularly those who are helpless. All you need is utter disregard for the rights and lives of others, as you already display.

Slavery is present in our modern world... what's your point? We have a whole Prison-industrial complex in this country turning people into slaves because they put a loophole in the 13th Amendment.

Prison labor is not only acceptable, it is desirable. Why shouldn't they have to help pay for their expenses, since they are burdens to everyone due to their own ? It isn't slavery. You're being ridiculous.

You can squeal like a pig, boy

Oh good, movie references and memes, demeaning at that.

... but women are going to keep having abortions whether you like it or not.

Laws don't magically stop crime. No one claimed otherwise. Attack straw men on your own time, stop wasting mine.

More money for sex education, more money to help girls build confidence, paid family leave, universal health care and distribution of other forms of contraception.

Let me counter-offer, no money for any education services, no money to help anyone whatever the hell stupid thing you're saying which obviously isn't the business of the state or taxpayers, none of the government's business what leave policies companies want to offer, no taxpayer money for any healthcare services, and if you want to buy fuck accessories, buy your own.

Just ban abortion as the murder it is though, thanks.

 

[See50]

I do believe that JohnDB also brought up this point once before. Why don't fathers ever have their right to refuse an abortion and take care of their own kid?

Because a women has the right to control her body and her reproductive system. The women's body is not a man's or anybody else's property. Procreation is a mutual consenting practice that should not use force.

 

[Road Runner]

Because a women has the right to control her body and her reproductive system. The women's body is not a man's or anybody else's property. Procreation is a mutual consenting practice that should not use force.

So the father doesn't have any rights at all? Or what about the unborn child's right to life?

 

[JoeB131]

LOL, you can throw a temper tantrum all you want, it doesn't do anything to address me proving your claim incorrect.

You mean your unsourced claim?

Shocking to see how radical American leftists have sprinted towards. Clinton was "Safe, legal, and rare"... now we have you and Anne Hathaway trying to say that it's a good, virtuous thing to abort children. Wow, you're going to look quite barbaric as we continue to find out more and more how alive a growing baby is.

Fetuses aren't children, and yes, contraception IS virtuous. The difference between a first world country and a third world country is the availability of contraception, including abortion. People aren't having kids they can't provide for, and frankly this is a good thing!

Why the double standards everywhere? Shouldn't she have thought of the consequences before acting? Why the continued soft bigotry against women?

She did think of the consequences. She decided she wasn't ready to be a parent, and got that taken care of. I applaud her maturity.

Now, yeah, do I wish more women would be smarter about contraception and relationships? You betcha.

Dude, you must be one miserable person.

Naw, I've never been happier. But, man, it's pretty awful to watch some white trash in the store, letting their kids run amok because they have no idea how to parent. Knowing in 20 years, that kid is going to be occupying a jail cell on my dime.

The baby inside of her doesn't share her DNA, so... it's actually NOT her body, she's just assisting it in its maturity.

Fine. When that unique DNA finds a uterus willing to "assist", we don't have an issue, then.

Why more double standards?

Not a double standard at all. Let's be blunt, we've come a long way since women were considered second class citizens, where marital rape wasn't even considered a crime until 1978. I rejoice in men finally being held accountable.

Not that they really are. As stated, only 3% of rapists ever see the inside of a jail cell... and once you clowns make abortion illegal, you are going to have a lot more rape claims to deal with.

 

[JoeB131]

eah, no, you don't get that or get much of anything else.

You literally just argued that because someone else somewhere might die, it's fine to shoot you in the head right now. You couldn't mean it, as that "logic" is absurd and insane, but that IS still your argument, your logic.

I mean whine about unrelated things all you like, it won't get you away from your own logical fallacies or nonsense.

Just remember, they are totally against abortion because they are "pro-life", not because they just hate women .

I mean, BLM riots already warranted looters being gunned down, and this would be more worthy of putting down with force than that, so hey. FA, FO.

Just remember, they are totally against abortion because they are "pro-life", not because they just hate women .

Yeah, no. You could still kill someone else for your own personal benefit. And you don't need any particular equipment to kill the innocent, particularly those who are helpless. All you need is utter disregard for the rights and lives of others, as you already display.

Except if I kill a real person, there will be consequence. What you don't seem to get is that even when abortion was "illegal", women were never prosecuted for having them, and the only time the providers were prosecuted was when they goofed up and maimed the woman. This is why SCOTUS struck down the abortion laws, because the legislatures weren't getting rid of laws everyone was ignoring.

Little did they know the Evangelicals needed a fake issue to get asses back into pews after segregation wasn't selling anymore.

Prison labor is not only acceptable, it is desirable. Why shouldn't they have to help pay for their expenses, since they are burdens to everyone due to their own ? It isn't slavery. You're being ridiculous.

Because= wait for it- you ARE paying for their expenses. And when most people are in jail for victimless or property crimes, but someone else is profiting off of their prison labor, you are being kind of a sucker.

Laws don't magically stop crime. No one claimed otherwise. Attack straw men on your own time, stop wasting mine.

Quite right. Let's discuss the Philippines, which has the kinds of laws you want.

The Philippines have the exact kind of laws you want. Contraception isn't readily available. They are very religious. Abortion is illegal, even in cases of rape and incest.

And Filipinas have 500,000 to 800,000 illegal abortions a year, almost on par with the US, even though they only have a quarter of our population.

Let me counter-offer, no money for any education services, no money to help anyone whatever the hell stupid thing you're saying which obviously isn't the business of the state or taxpayers, none of the government's business what leave policies companies want to offer, no taxpayer money for any healthcare services, and if you want to buy fuck accessories, buy your own.

Just ban abortion as the murder it is though, thanks.

Okay, let's do that.

And how do you enforce the law? I mean, it's kind of hard to prove a "murder" when your victim is the size of a kidney bean and can be flushed down a toilet. The police have a hard enough time investigating the 25,000 ACTUAL murders in this country, you think they are going to have time to investigate 600,000 abortions and 800,000 miscarriages (and yes, you will have to investigate the miscarriages) as potential homicides? Do you think that the prosecutors are going bring these cases? I mean, I guess the rural ones in Jesusland will, but the actual places where people live, not so much.

But let's say you bring a legal case against someone for having or performing an abortion. Can you say, Jury Nullification? Sure, I thought you could! If I ever found myself on such a jury, I wouldn't care if you had pictures of the doctor throwing Globby across the room into the medical waste container and yelling "THREE POINTS!!!" I'm still voting to acquit. So will about half the country.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

Just remember, they are totally against abortion because they are "pro-life", not because they just hate women .

That is correct. We are against abortion because we want innocent human beings to have their human right to life protected, and not because of some asinine, unsupported, and unsupportable claim about "hating women."

Excellent lack of rebuttal for the second time, by the way, confirming that you don't remotely believe the nonsense you are saying and can't support it, and won't even try.

So we know you don't actually believe that the possibility of someone else dying somewhere from unrelated events justifies killing you. Shock. Quelle surprise.

So you're just all bluster and noise, no arguments. You're posting in pure bad faith things you don't even believe, wasting everyone's time with trolling.

Thank you for confirming this beyond any doubt.

Except if I kill a real person, there will be consequence.

Despicable - the status quo that is a product of your bigotry denies personhood and thus legal consequence for homicide, so you cite this lack of legal consequence to justify denying personhood.

It is circular logic to justify hatred and mass slaughter. That is all you have, logical fallacies and nonsense that you don't even really support.

Because= wait for it- you ARE paying for their expenses. And when most people are in jail for victimless or property crimes, but someone else is profiting off of their prison labor, you are being kind of a sucker.

Prison labor is justified, prison labor isn't slavery, and that isn't the topic.

Can you say, Jury Nullification? Sure, I thought you could! If I ever found myself on such a jury, I wouldn't care if you had pictures of the doctor throwing Globby across the room into the medical waste container and yelling "THREE POINTS!!!" I'm still voting to acquit. So will about half the country.

Then we need judges who will nail your ass to the wall, Globby. Lying to get on a jury is a crime. And stop attributing your name to innocent human beings. They don't need the harmful associations.

Barring that, we need a good civil war to take out the problem globs who are that committed to inequality and monstrous inhumanity.

 

[M14 Shooter]

I do believe that JohnDB also brought up this point once before. Why don't fathers ever have their right to refuse an abortion and take care of their own kid?

And then, why aren't mothers forced to pay support?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Because a women has the right to control her body and her reproductive system.

No right is absolute.
No right is unlimited.
So... the question remains.

 

[JoeB131]

That is correct. We are against abortion because we want innocent human beings to have their human right to life protected, and not because of some asinine, unsupported, and unsupportable claim about "hating women."

Yup, you are all for those fetuses until they are born, and then fuck them. Rich people need their tax cuts!

So we know you don't actually believe that the possibility of someone else dying somewhere from unrelated events justifies killing you.

No, that was just you sputtering, so I just let you be.

Despicable - the status quo that is a product of your bigotry denies personhood and thus legal consequence for homicide, so you cite this lack of legal consequence to justify denying personhood.

It is circular logic to justify hatred and mass slaughter. That is all you have, logical fallacies and nonsense that you don't even really support.

It's quite the contrary, dummy. Giving Globby the Fetus more rights than the woman he is inside will have ALL SORTS of legal consequences beyond abortion.

For instance, do you arrest women for smoking or drinking or not eating the right foods during pregnancy? Globby has more rights than the woman he is inside now. Do you investigate every miscarriage as a potential homicide? You'd kind of have to, otherwise the abortionists will just write down 'miscarriage' on every chart.

Prison labor is justified, prison labor isn't slavery, and that isn't the topic.

Well, it kind of is... since you said we didn't have slavery when we clearly do.

Then we need judges who will nail your ass to the wall, Globby. Lying to get on a jury is a crime. And stop attributing your name to innocent human beings. They don't need the harmful associations.

Who said I lied to get on the hypothetical jury that will never happen? I said I would fairly consider the evidence... And medical waste aren't people, so I'd be completely justified in acquitting.

Barring that, we need a good civil war to take out the problem globs who are that committed to inequality and monstrous inhumanity.

Uh, sorry, guy, your side is in the minority, and the minute you turn to violence, you'll get the McVeigh Treatment.

 

[JoeB131]

No right is absolute.
No right is unlimited.
So... the question remains.

Actually, there's no question. You can't regulate what you do to one's body. This is why prohibition was an abject failure. This is why the war on drugs has been a failure. This is why prostitution laws are largely ignored.

 

[Road Runner]

And then, why aren't mothers forced to pay support?

Good question and I honestly don't know the answer to that.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

Yup, you are all for those fetuses until they are born, and then fuck them. Rich people need their tax cuts!

Flagrantly off-topic bullshit. It’s already illegal to attack the born, and we want it to be illegal to attack the unborn. That’s the same standard for everyone.

Taxes in the US being too high, too complex, and unfair are all obvious facts to anyone with a brain, sure, but this isn’t the topic and it isn’t even marginally related to the subject of criminal law enforcement when you would divert all of those tax dollars to things other than law and order anyway.

You changed topics again to yet more fallacious fake-logic, rather than offer any defense for anything you’re saying.

And Zone 1 namecalling to boot now…

You’re a low-effort and uninteresting troll, and you’re not worth another moment of anyone else’s time.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Flagrantly off-topic bullshit. It’s already illegal to attack the born, and we want it to be illegal to attack the unborn. That’s the same standard for everyone.

Taxes in the US being too high, too complex, and unfair are all obvious facts to anyone with a brain, sure, but this isn’t the topic and it isn’t even marginally related to the subject of criminal law enforcement when you would divert all of those tax dollars to things other than law and order anyway.

You changed topics again to yet more fallacious fake-logic, rather than offer any defense for anything you’re saying.

And Zone 1 namecalling to boot now…

You’re a low-effort and uninteresting troll, and you’re not worth another moment of anyone else’s time.

indeed, i would stop feeding the miserable sap

 

[JoeB131]

So after calling for murdering people he doesn't like, this guys whines like this.

Flagrantly off-topic bullshit. It’s already illegal to attack the born, and we want it to be illegal to attack the unborn. That’s the same standard for everyone.

No, it's totally on topic, guy. If you want to create 600,000 more unwanted children every year, you'd better be willing to pay the taxes to feed, house, clothe, educate and eventually jail them, because that's what it's going to mean.

Taxes in the US being too high, too complex, and unfair are all obvious facts to anyone with a brain, sure, but this isn’t the topic and it isn’t even marginally related to the subject of criminal law enforcement when you would divert all of those tax dollars to things other than law and order anyway.

I agree, our taxes are too complicated and unfair. The rich aren't paying enough and there are too many loopholes. But if you are going to bring 600,000 more kids into the world every year, you'd better be ready to pay for them.

Of course, it's a moot point. Women are going to get abortions no matter what the law is.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

So after calling for murdering people he doesn't like

You’re the one promoting mass slaughter of innocent human beings. You are demonstrably a liar, a misanthrope, and a hatemonger.

No, it's totally on topic, guy. If you want to create 600,000 more unwanted children every year

I am not creating anything by advocating for cessation of violence against kids who others have already created. Learn what causal reality is. Or stop trolling. If you can.

My advocacy for no violence against innocent human beings does not create any financial responsibility for their well-being. That insinuation is idiotic. Duh.

Of course, it's a moot point. Women are going to get abortions no matter what the law is.

Yes, murderers will always kill, the point is to make it as unsafe, illegal, and as rare as possible. Ideally they will die or at least be sterilized in their efforts to kill others.

 

[JoeB131]

You’re the one promoting mass slaughter of innocent human beings. You are demonstrably a liar, a misanthrope, and a hatemonger.

Fetuses aren't people. The minute you make them people, you give them more rights than the woman they are inside. Have to keep stressing this, because it's a point you ignore.

I am not creating anything by advocating for cessation of violence against kids who others have already created. Learn what causal reality is. Or stop trolling. If you can.

My advocacy for no violence against innocent human beings does not create any financial responsibility for their well-being. That insinuation is idiotic. Duh.

Sure, you are very good at spending other people's money and making problems someone else is going to have to deal with. It's the conservative way.

Yes, murderers will always kill, the point is to make it as unsafe, illegal, and as rare as possible. Ideally they will die or at least be sterilized in their efforts to kill others.

So, once again, it's not about "the babies", it's about punishing women for being women. Got it.

 

[CarsomyrPlusSix]

Fetuses aren't people. The minute you make them people, you give them more rights than the woman they are inside. Have to keep stressing this, because it's a point you ignore.

It's easy to ignore because it's stupid and wrong.

You can just stop being a bigot and not discriminate against these innocent human beings, extend them personhood, which gives them the same rights as everyone else. Your claim of "more rights" is absurd and unsupportable nonsense.

Sure, you are very good at spending other people's money and making problems someone else is going to have to deal with. It's the conservative way.

Trolling off-topic bullshit. Other humans NOT BEING KILLED like they SHOULDN'T BE, because it's illegal to kill them, doesn't make their well-being the financial responsibility of everyone else who doesn't want them killed.

That's a lunatic take.

Unsurprisingly, it's supposedly your claim. Supposedly, because you don't seem to actually have any takes, just whatever you can spew to be inflammatory and nothing you actually believe.

So, once again, it's not about "the babies", it's about punishing women for being women. Got it.

Murderers should be punished for murdering. Sorry about that illiteracy thing you have going on there, that would explain a lot of what you say.

 

[JoeB131]

It's easy to ignore because it's stupid and wrong.

You can just stop being a bigot and not discriminate against these innocent human beings, extend them personhood, which gives them the same rights as everyone else. Your claim of "more rights" is absurd and unsupportable nonsense.

But giving globby the fetus the same rights as everyone else gives the woman they are in LESS rights. You've said yourself you don't want to pay the taxes for the inevitable welfare that will result from banning abortion, but you think the woman should have to deal with all the health effects of having her rapist's baby?

Trolling off-topic bullshit. Other humans NOT BEING KILLED like they SHOULDN'T BE, because it's illegal to kill them, doesn't make their well-being the financial responsibility of everyone else who doesn't want them killed.

That's a lunatic take.

Unsurprisingly, it's supposedly your claim. Supposedly, because you don't seem to actually have any takes, just whatever you can spew to be inflammatory and nothing you actually believe.

Quite the contrary, if you are going to pursue a policy that creates 600,000 more births than we normally have, then you had better have the resources available to house, clothe, feed and educate them. Don't expect their parents to, because if they could afford a kid, they wouldn't be having an abortion to start with.

Put your money where your mouth is.

Murderers should be punished for murdering. Sorry about that illiteracy thing you have going on there, that would explain a lot of what you say.

Fetuses aren't people. Even when abortion was illegal, no one was charged with murder for having one, or even performing one.

 

[flan327]

You're a hostage taker.

Exactly

 

[flan327]

Decent men are absolutely involved with child rearing and caregivers. I don't know many who aren't. Sure there's a few dumb kids who want to play at being sexist as the kids think being macho gives them gravitas. But it doesn't last as they grow up.

In your OPINION