Second Amendment advocates would this change your mind?

2aguy said:
Hmmmm......then how do you explain the South Koreans, with extreme gun control, and the highest level of suicide....? Or the Japanes, and Chinese...or any of those European countries I listed ?

You really have no argument...
Click to expand...

Well, I may not, but science does.

med.stanford.edu

Handgun ownership associated with much higher suicide risk

Men who own handguns are eight times more likely to die of gun suicides than men who don't own handguns, and women who own handguns are 35 times more likely than women who don't.
med.stanford.edu med.stanford.edu


ajph.aphapublications.org

The American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA) publications

American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA)
ajph.aphapublications.org

www.rand.org

The Relationship Between Firearm Availability and Suicide

Empirical research on the causal effects of firearm availability on the risk of suicide is consistent with the claim that firearms increase suicide risk, but this research cannot yet rule out some other explanations for observed associations between guns and suicide. There are, however...
www.rand.org www.rand.org
 
Canon Shooter said:
I promise you, if you walk into the St. Johns Country Sheriff's Office (where I live), put a handgun on the watch sergeant's desk and say you're suicidal, they'll accept it...
Click to expand...
But will they return it to you when you are better??
 
PV System said:
Well, I may not, but science does.

med.stanford.edu

Handgun ownership associated with much higher suicide risk

Men who own handguns are eight times more likely to die of gun suicides than men who don't own handguns, and women who own handguns are 35 times more likely than women who don't.
med.stanford.edu med.stanford.edu


ajph.aphapublications.org

The American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA) publications

American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA)
ajph.aphapublications.org

www.rand.org

The Relationship Between Firearm Availability and Suicide

Empirical research on the causal effects of firearm availability on the risk of suicide is consistent with the claim that firearms increase suicide risk, but this research cannot yet rule out some other explanations for observed associations between guns and suicide. There are, however...
www.rand.org www.rand.org
Click to expand...


And that is just crap...again......explain to us how it is that without guns, South Koreans kill themselves more......please....explain that.

Explain how Japan, china, and countries in Europe kill themselves more...you have to do that to show us you actually have a point.......

Your link is stupid because you can't explain South Korea, Japan, China, ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/suiciderate.html



South Korea 24.7

Hungary 21

Japan 19.4

Belgium 18.4

Finland 16.5

France 14.6

Austria 13.8

Poland 13.8

Czec Republic 12.7

New Zealand 11.9

Denmark 11.3

Sweden 11.1

Norway 10.9

Slovac Republic 10.9

Iceland 10.3

Germany 10.3

Canada 10.2

United States 10.1



You are an idiot to keep pushing this in the face of actual truth, facts and reality.....
 
PV System said:
Well, I may not, but science does.

med.stanford.edu

Handgun ownership associated with much higher suicide risk

Men who own handguns are eight times more likely to die of gun suicides than men who don't own handguns, and women who own handguns are 35 times more likely than women who don't.
med.stanford.edu med.stanford.edu


ajph.aphapublications.org

The American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA) publications

American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA)
ajph.aphapublications.org

www.rand.org

The Relationship Between Firearm Availability and Suicide

Empirical research on the causal effects of firearm availability on the risk of suicide is consistent with the claim that firearms increase suicide risk, but this research cannot yet rule out some other explanations for observed associations between guns and suicide. There are, however...
www.rand.org www.rand.org
Click to expand...


I know, I know, you are a leftist and you think you can just lie and get away with it.......but no, not here....

Fact Check, Gun Control and Suicide

There is no relation between suicide rate and gun ownership rates around the world.

According to the 2016 World Health Statistics report, (2) suicide rates in the four countries cited as having restrictive gun control laws have suicide rates that are comparable to that in the U. S.: Australia, 11.6, Canada, 11.4, France, 15.8, UK, 7.0, and USA 13.7 suicides/100,000. By comparison, Japan has among the highest suicide rates in the world, 23.1/100,000, but gun ownership is extremely rare, 0.6 guns/100 people.

Suicide is a mental health issue. If guns are not available other means are used. Poisoning, in fact, is the most common method of suicide for U. S. females according to the Washington Post (34 % of suicides), and suffocation the second most common method for males (27%).

Secondly, gun ownership rates in France and Canada are not low, as is implied in the Post article. The rate of gun ownership in the U. S. is indeed high at 88.8 guns/100 residents, but gun ownership rates are also among the world’s highest in the other countries cited. Gun ownership rates in these countries are are as follows: Australia, 15, Canada, 30.8, France, 31.2, and UK 6.2 per 100 residents. (3,4) Gun ownership rates in Saudia Arabia are comparable to that in Canada and France, with 37.8 guns per 100 Saudi residents, yet the lowest suicide rate in the world is in Saudia Arabia (0.3 suicides per 100,000).

Third, recent statistics in the state of Florida show that nearly one third of the guns used in suicides are obtained illegally, putting these firearm deaths beyond control through gun laws.(5)

Fourth, the primary factors affecting suicide rates are personal stresses, cultural, economic, religious factors and demographics.

According to the WHO statistics, the highest rates of suicide in the world are in the Republic of Korea, with 36.8 suicides per 100,000, but India, Japan, Russia, and Hungary all have rates above 20 per 100,000; roughly twice as high as the U.S. and the four countries that are the basis for the Post’s calculation that gun control would reduce U.S. suicide rates by 20 to 38 percent.


Lebanon, Oman, and Iraq all have suicide rates below 1.1 per 100,000 people--less than 1/10 the suicide rate in the U. S., and Afghanistan, Algeria, Jamaica, Haiti, and Egypt have low suicide rates that are below 4 per 100,000 in contrast to 13.7 suicides/100,000 in the U. S.
========

Suicide rates: An overview

Methods of suicide vary by sex and age​

Over the past ten years, the most common method of suicide in Canada has been hanging (44%), which includes strangulation and suffocation; followed by poisoning (25%) and firearm use (16%).
Males were most likely to commit suicide by hanging (46%) while females most often died by poisoning (42%) (Chart 2). Males (20%) were far more likely to use firearms than females (3%).
 
PV System said:
Oh gosh! Such a NOVEL argument! Wow. That's amazing.


the point about suicides is a bit more subtle. I'll outline it again since reading doesn't appear to be your forte:

Many suicides start off trying or "attempting" suicide unsuccessfully. If they are lucky they get the help they need and subsequent attempts are not made.

But with a gun the odds of any given attempt being SUCCESSFUL go WAAAAY up. (I'll let you figure out why).

So the presence of guns increases the likelihood that a "rash decision" attempt becomes a permanent situation.



What about the guns in the house that don't belong to the suicidal person?


I'm all for better social safety nets! That's probably the quickest way to eliminate a lot of urban crime by improving opportunities for the desperately poor.



LOL. Not really. I assume you know that it is MUCH easier to kill with a gun than a knife. That's why you don't go deer hunting with a knife. Guns are extremely efficient killing machines.

The shooter at Las Vegas wouldn't have been able to do what he did from his hotel room dozens of floors up and a long way away from the concert if he was armed even with a BUNCH of knives.
Click to expand...
If a person doesn't give a shit about their life don't try and force me to give a fuck it ain't going to happen.
 
2aguy said:
And that is just crap...again......explain to us how it is that without guns, South Koreans kill themselves more......please....explain that.

Explain how Japan, china, and countries in Europe kill themselves more...you have to do that to show us you actually have a point.......

Your link is stupid because you can't explain South Korea, Japan, China, ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/world/suiciderate.html



South Korea 24.7

Hungary 21

Japan 19.4

Belgium 18.4

Finland 16.5

France 14.6

Austria 13.8

Poland 13.8

Czec Republic 12.7

New Zealand 11.9

Denmark 11.3

Sweden 11.1

Norway 10.9

Slovac Republic 10.9

Iceland 10.3

Germany 10.3

Canada 10.2

United States 10.1



You are an idiot to keep pushing this in the face of actual truth, facts and reality.....
Click to expand...

Feel free to ignore the science as you like.
 
Cowboy Guns ( Especially real ones ) are not my cup of tea . I'm into Military Firearms of the second half of the 20th Century .
 
Canon Shooter said:
Well, then, I guess if you ever feel suicidal you should just hold onto your firearm...
Click to expand...
That's one option.

Another option would be to set up some sort of system where suicidal people can voluntarily and temporarily hand in their guns until they are better.
 
Open Bolt said:
That's one option.

Another option would be to set up some sort of system where suicidal people can voluntarily and temporarily hand in their guns until they are better.
Click to expand...
My police department held my firearms for a while after they got called to my house cause I took pills to kill myself they gave them back well my wife had to collect them they wouldnt give them to me.
 
RetiredGySgt said:
My police department held my firearms for a while after they got called to my house cause I took pills to kill myself they gave them back well my wife had to collect them they wouldnt give them to me.
Click to expand...
Not all police departments will do that. Some police departments will only return someone's guns if a court order forces them to do so. And not everyone has the resources to go to court and have a judge issue such an order.
 
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