Remove Israel from the map

[flacaltenn]

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Actually it was Hamas in Gaza and the West Bank.

Hamas was the majority party in the PA.

You continuously miss the absurdity of representing an Islamic terrorist syndicate as being able to manage the civil affairs of government.

Your fawning over Hamas is comically tragic as they have been the worst enemy of the Pal'istanians.

65% of Palestinians want Abbas to resign.
79% say that the PA is corrupt.

What are the stats on Hamas?
Hamas is a constitutionally protected political party in Palestine. It is also Israel's boogyman.

I was expecting you to post a YouTube video for stats on Hamas.

And yes, Hamas are the islamo-fascist theocrats elected to political power by the Pal'istanians. How telling that the Palis' elected islamo-retrogrades whose charter is in accord with the musings of a 7th century Arab warlord.

Are you a complete Idiot......It was the USA and ISRAEL who helped and established Hamas,Armed them,gave them a load of CASH as they thought HAMAS would distabalize Arafat......Moron..theliq

REALLY??? I'd like to understand that. I know our MidEast is brainless --- but I'm doubting this a lot.
It's probably some theory that Reagan's arm deal to Iran ended UP in Hamas hands. But we never "established" Hamas or armed them intentionally...

 

[P F Tinmore]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

 

[Phoenall]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

Stop posting islamonazi talking points that are based on lies, typical islamonazi propaganda

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

Besides being from 2010 --- I doubt you actually read much of that -- Or -- if you did, whether you cut thru the happy talk to the real problems.. From the article..

“Gaza could specialize in mushroom cultivation, for example. What we need is a kind of semi-government that would help bridge the gap between the Hamas government and European governments, and to provide the financial and political backing behind such a project” economist Omar Shaban explained, adding that many in the Hamas government are “resistant and suspicious of such an idea”.

The plan and the projects are seen locally as markers of the ability of the Hamas government to defy the siege and its impacts, even if the results have yet to be seen very far in the future.

Many in the Hamas "government" are resistant and suspicious to a bridge to markets in the rest of the world.
They need a "semi-government bridge" to open trade with anyone who would buy their products. Because Hamas government in Gaza is not recognized as a stable or trustworthy trading partner. Issues of currency and credit are not well defined. What IS the currency of Gaza? Where is the Treasury of Gaza and what currency do they issue?

The West Bank remnants of the PA are MUCH more likely to be interested in and receptive to building the govt infrastructure and FOREIGN RELATIONS that ALLOWS commerce. Hamas is not interested in those things.They just want insurrection and the demise of Israel..

Read that last line in the quote above.. It's been FIVE YEARS. How many mushrooms are being exported??? Improvements on the quality of life in Gaza should NOT be --- "yet to be seen very far in the future". You are tossing away an entire generation of people to their vicious rule.

 

[montelatici]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

Besides being from 2010 --- I doubt you actually read much of that -- Or -- if you did, whether you cut thru the happy talk to the real problems.. From the article..

“Gaza could specialize in mushroom cultivation, for example. What we need is a kind of semi-government that would help bridge the gap between the Hamas government and European governments, and to provide the financial and political backing behind such a project” economist Omar Shaban explained, adding that many in the Hamas government are “resistant and suspicious of such an idea”.

The plan and the projects are seen locally as markers of the ability of the Hamas government to defy the siege and its impacts, even if the results have yet to be seen very far in the future.

Many in the Hamas "government" are resistant and suspicious to a bridge to markets in the rest of the world.
They need a "semi-government bridge" to open trade with anyone who would buy their products. Because Hamas government in Gaza is not recognized as a stable or trustworthy trading partner. Issues of currency and credit are not well defined. What IS the currency of Gaza? Where is the Treasury of Gaza and what currency do they issue?

The West Bank remnants of the PA are MUCH more likely to be interested in and receptive to building the govt infrastructure and FOREIGN RELATIONS that ALLOWS commerce. Hamas is not interested in those things.They just want insurrection and the demise of Israel..

Read that last line in the quote above.. It's been FIVE YEARS. How many mushrooms are being exported??? Improvements on the quality of life in Gaza should NOT be --- "yet to be seen very far in the future". You are tossing away an entire generation of people to their vicious rule.

Well, if your land is leveled by Israeli bombs every 2 years or so, nothing will be produced or exported from the leveled land.

 

[Indeependent]

Muslims export murder.

 

[flacaltenn]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

Besides being from 2010 --- I doubt you actually read much of that -- Or -- if you did, whether you cut thru the happy talk to the real problems.. From the article..

“Gaza could specialize in mushroom cultivation, for example. What we need is a kind of semi-government that would help bridge the gap between the Hamas government and European governments, and to provide the financial and political backing behind such a project” economist Omar Shaban explained, adding that many in the Hamas government are “resistant and suspicious of such an idea”.

The plan and the projects are seen locally as markers of the ability of the Hamas government to defy the siege and its impacts, even if the results have yet to be seen very far in the future.

Many in the Hamas "government" are resistant and suspicious to a bridge to markets in the rest of the world.
They need a "semi-government bridge" to open trade with anyone who would buy their products. Because Hamas government in Gaza is not recognized as a stable or trustworthy trading partner. Issues of currency and credit are not well defined. What IS the currency of Gaza? Where is the Treasury of Gaza and what currency do they issue?

The West Bank remnants of the PA are MUCH more likely to be interested in and receptive to building the govt infrastructure and FOREIGN RELATIONS that ALLOWS commerce. Hamas is not interested in those things.They just want insurrection and the demise of Israel..

Read that last line in the quote above.. It's been FIVE YEARS. How many mushrooms are being exported??? Improvements on the quality of life in Gaza should NOT be --- "yet to be seen very far in the future". You are tossing away an entire generation of people to their vicious rule.

Well, if your land is leveled by Israeli bombs every 2 years or so, nothing will be produced or exported from the leveled land.

Establishing a government, a legal system, currency and credit and diplomacy should be the HIGHEST priority. Not building clandestine tunnels and launching missiles into your neighbors. If you don't think and value those priorities -- I don't believe you or Hamas really cares how much suffering and death and destruction results.

The suffering, death, and destruction can all be repaired by becoming a clean political entity with RESPONSIBLE leadership, media relations, and diplomacy. Things that Hamas don't give a crap about..

 

[flacaltenn]

Muslims export murder.

Mushrooms would be good. You know those yummy things that grow in decaying matter... Kinda fitting. Lots of decay and moving backwards. Instead of presenting a govt to the world that speaks responsibly to the world..

 

[montelatici]

Removing the blockade, by whatever means, is the highest priority. Without that, there can be no government, no legal system, credit, currency, no economy, no exports and at the end of the day without sovereignty nothing can progress.

 

[Phoenall]

Hamas has no limit on their tolerance for the number of Palis killed for the cause. They also have NO PLAN to make life better for their "constituents".. Only sadistic morons and bastards would confuse them with leadership and government.

Typical BS Israeli talking point.

Leaving aside the obvious question of how a territory and its people whose every marker of sovereignty is effectively controlled by an occupying power that nevertheless refuses to recognize its responsibility as an occupier can “build a state” and “make a life”, the Gaza government has actually been doing some pretty impressive things.

It was a follow-up to an interview colleague Maggie Schmitt and I did with the Minister of Agriculture, Mohammad Al-Agha. In consultation with dozens of international and local NGOs, the Gaza Ministry has drawn up an impressive “ten-year plan” aimed at reducing Gaza’s dependence on imported Israeli produce, incorporating organic farming on a wider scale, and generally “helping Gaza help itself” through a return to more sustainable agricultural practices (such as relying more on rain-fed crops rather than cash cropping for export which involves wasteful amounts of water and an abundance of pesticides, and is subject to the whim of Israeli authorities and their punitive border closure).

Gaza Mom » Gaza; settlements; Israel; Hamas; agriculture​

Besides being from 2010 --- I doubt you actually read much of that -- Or -- if you did, whether you cut thru the happy talk to the real problems.. From the article..

“Gaza could specialize in mushroom cultivation, for example. What we need is a kind of semi-government that would help bridge the gap between the Hamas government and European governments, and to provide the financial and political backing behind such a project” economist Omar Shaban explained, adding that many in the Hamas government are “resistant and suspicious of such an idea”.

The plan and the projects are seen locally as markers of the ability of the Hamas government to defy the siege and its impacts, even if the results have yet to be seen very far in the future.

Many in the Hamas "government" are resistant and suspicious to a bridge to markets in the rest of the world.
They need a "semi-government bridge" to open trade with anyone who would buy their products. Because Hamas government in Gaza is not recognized as a stable or trustworthy trading partner. Issues of currency and credit are not well defined. What IS the currency of Gaza? Where is the Treasury of Gaza and what currency do they issue?

The West Bank remnants of the PA are MUCH more likely to be interested in and receptive to building the govt infrastructure and FOREIGN RELATIONS that ALLOWS commerce. Hamas is not interested in those things.They just want insurrection and the demise of Israel..

Read that last line in the quote above.. It's been FIVE YEARS. How many mushrooms are being exported??? Improvements on the quality of life in Gaza should NOT be --- "yet to be seen very far in the future". You are tossing away an entire generation of people to their vicious rule.

Well, if your land is leveled by Israeli bombs every 2 years or so, nothing will be produced or exported from the leveled land.

If the scum did not use the buildings to fire illegal weapons at Israel then they would not get flattened. After all over 50% of gaza is urban land with no buildings.

 

[Phoenall]

Removing the blockade, by whatever means, is the highest priority. Without that, there can be no government, no legal system, credit, currency, no economy, no exports and at the end of the day without sovereignty nothing can progress.

The blockade can be removed at any time by asking for peace talks and negotiating mutual borders. Until that is done the blockade stays

 

[P F Tinmore]

Removing the blockade, by whatever means, is the highest priority. Without that, there can be no government, no legal system, credit, currency, no economy, no exports and at the end of the day without sovereignty nothing can progress.

The blockade can be removed at any time by asking for peace talks and negotiating mutual borders. Until that is done the blockade stays

Israel and Hamas have been negotiating since a year ago last August.

I haven't seen any progress reports though.

 

[Hollie]

Removing the blockade, by whatever means, is the highest priority. Without that, there can be no government, no legal system, credit, currency, no economy, no exports and at the end of the day without sovereignty nothing can progress.

The blockade can be removed at any time by asking for peace talks and negotiating mutual borders. Until that is done the blockade stays

Israel and Hamas have been negotiating since a year ago last August.

I haven't seen any progress reports though.

With regard to the Hamas Charter, there's nothing to negotiate. Islamo-fascists only understand force of will and arms. The Hamas terrorists need to have their turbans ventilated as a negotiating tactic on the part of the Israelis.

 

[theliq]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

 

[theliq]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrirtories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Soon Forward to Peace

 

[flacaltenn]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism. The type that has it's priorities on forming a REAL united govt and effective leadership and improvements in the quality of life.. It's just that I'm not responsible for all their bad choices. Neither is my country. Nor are you. I don't make excuses for their dysfunction like the characters on this forum. That's where the "co-dependency" comment came from. The illness is a transference of guilt and self-worth from a party acting illogically and irresponsibly to your own person.. Like feeling it's your responsibility to go out and look for a drunken friend at 3AM every Friday. Because YOUR self-worth is dependent on the actions of others with deviant behaviour problems.

I'm on the "tough love" train when it comes to my sympathies for the Palestinians..

They made it clear to you that they would rather waste their lives and fortunes in a perpetual state of isolation and revolt and death. That's self-destructive behavior.. And THEY have to live with the consequences. Ain't my fault -- not Israels fault -- not the fault of the USA.

And like that friend with the problem, the Palis are not gonna get with the program until they end up like the Aborigines, the Maories, and the Cherokees. As indigenous people 300 years behind, with an inability to comprehend why it was THEIR behavior and values contributed to their derailment.

Abbas and PA was the best thing ever to happen to the Palis.. Largely the reason Gaza was made autonomous in the first place. Israel made the mistake that the Palis would spend their energy on commerce and quality of life and peaceful coexistence with other nations. Israel's not stupid enough to try that again.

.if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing......

Difference is -- Israel is a nation state with an economy and trade relations and a set of reasonable laws. It has a FUNCTIONAL govt and STATESMEN and public relations and Allies and open dialogue and tourists and diversity -- and again the Palis haven't been able to get even a bit organized in over 300 years and chose to toss rocks and vote for brutal lawless regimes. Ask the Jordanians or the Egyptians. Pretty sure they'd agree with what I've said here..

 

[theliq]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism. The type that has it's priorities on forming a REAL united govt and effective leadership and improvements in the quality of life.. It's just that I'm not responsible for all their bad choices. Neither is my country. Nor are you. I don't make excuses for their dysfunction like the characters on this forum. That's where the "co-dependency" comment came from. The illness is a transference of guilt and self-worth from a party acting illogically and irresponsibly to your own person.. Like feeling it's your responsibility to go out and look for a drunken friend at 3AM every Friday. Because YOUR self-worth is dependent on the actions of others with deviant behaviour problems.

I'm on the "tough love" train when it comes to my sympathies for the Palestinians..

They made it clear to you that they would rather waste their lives and fortunes in a perpetual state of isolation and revolt and death. That's self-destructive behavior.. And THEY have to live with the consequences. Ain't my fault -- not Israels fault -- not the fault of the USA.

And like that friend with the problem, the Palis are not gonna get with the program until they end up like the Aborigines, the Maories, and the Cherokees. As indigenous people 300 years behind, with an inability to comprehend why it was THEIR behavior and values contributed to their derailment.

Abbas and PA was the best thing ever to happen to the Palis.. Largely the reason Gaza was made autonomous in the first place. Israel made the mistake that the Palis would spend their energy on commerce and quality of life and peaceful coexistence with other nations. Israel's not stupid enough to try that again.

.if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing......

Difference is -- Israel is a nation state with an economy and trade relations and a set of reasonable laws. It has a FUNCTIONAL govt and STATESMEN and public relations and Allies and open dialogue and tourists and diversity -- and again the Palis haven't been able to get even a bit organized in over 300 years and chose to toss rocks and vote for brutal lawless regimes. Ask the Jordanians or the Egyptians. Pretty sure they'd agree with what I've said here..

300 years.........I beg to differ but pointless here at the moment....Palestinians have one of the highest matriculation rates to University world wide.....As the Israelis know and use these Graduates...where would Kuwait,Saudi,Jordan and Egypt plus others be,without Palestinian Engineers Civil and Structural,Doctors,IT Experts etc.,etc,.time.com/4018306/rawbi-bashar-masri/

You are talking .................How can Palestine be functional,without infrastructure,an Airport,Sea Ports ect.............World wide businesses are happy to invest in Palestine and their educated work force.....What prevents this....Israel...New report: "Palestinian Universities Under Occupation".....enough said.But Flac thanks for your interesting post(that's better)..regards steve

 

[flacaltenn]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism. The type that has it's priorities on forming a REAL united govt and effective leadership and improvements in the quality of life.. It's just that I'm not responsible for all their bad choices. Neither is my country. Nor are you. I don't make excuses for their dysfunction like the characters on this forum. That's where the "co-dependency" comment came from. The illness is a transference of guilt and self-worth from a party acting illogically and irresponsibly to your own person.. Like feeling it's your responsibility to go out and look for a drunken friend at 3AM every Friday. Because YOUR self-worth is dependent on the actions of others with deviant behaviour problems.

I'm on the "tough love" train when it comes to my sympathies for the Palestinians..

They made it clear to you that they would rather waste their lives and fortunes in a perpetual state of isolation and revolt and death. That's self-destructive behavior.. And THEY have to live with the consequences. Ain't my fault -- not Israels fault -- not the fault of the USA.

And like that friend with the problem, the Palis are not gonna get with the program until they end up like the Aborigines, the Maories, and the Cherokees. As indigenous people 300 years behind, with an inability to comprehend why it was THEIR behavior and values contributed to their derailment.

Abbas and PA was the best thing ever to happen to the Palis.. Largely the reason Gaza was made autonomous in the first place. Israel made the mistake that the Palis would spend their energy on commerce and quality of life and peaceful coexistence with other nations. Israel's not stupid enough to try that again.

.if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing......

Difference is -- Israel is a nation state with an economy and trade relations and a set of reasonable laws. It has a FUNCTIONAL govt and STATESMEN and public relations and Allies and open dialogue and tourists and diversity -- and again the Palis haven't been able to get even a bit organized in over 300 years and chose to toss rocks and vote for brutal lawless regimes. Ask the Jordanians or the Egyptians. Pretty sure they'd agree with what I've said here..

300 years.........I beg to differ but pointless here at the moment....Palestinians have one of the highest matriculation rates to University world wide.....As the Israelis know and use these Graduates...where would Kuwait,Saudi,Jordan and Egypt plus others be,without Palestinian Engineers Civil and Structural,Doctors,IT Experts etc.,etc,.time.com/4018306/rawbi-bashar-masri/

You are talking .................How can Palestine be functional,without infrastructure,an Airport,Sea Ports ect.............World wide businesses are happy to invest in Palestine and their educated work force.....What prevents this....Israel...New report: "Palestinian Universities Under Occupation".....enough said.But Flac thanks for your interesting post(that's better)..regards steve

Most of that University infrastructure that's left is in West Bank under the remains of the PA. Fatah and Hamas FOUGHT each other thru the hallways and classrooms of those institutions. And since Hamas evolved as the bigger proponent of senseless violence -- they've squandered ALL their infrastructure gains in Gaza to repeated punishing assaults by Israel..

That INCLUDES (and you know this quite well) the well documented plans for an airport and seaport in Gaza with assurances from Israel that they would ease into allowing open commerce and trade in Gaza after it was made autonomous.. ALL SQUANDERED by the decision to take the Hamas all or nothing fighting stance against Israel..

You also know that Israel largely ignored Hamas when the PLO was the bigger problem to their security. Which is the reason why Hamas GOT a foothold in Gaza in the 1st place. They PRETENDED to be the "high road" --- the "better partner" --- the enlightened, charitable side of Pali representation. But they were turned into a proxy for Iran and a suicidal militarized group that doesn't give a full crap about the value of trade or infrastructure or statesmanship..

 

[P F Tinmore]

OF COURSE the US backed the overthrow of Hamas in Gaza. So what? Who SUPPORTED the Hamas takeover besides leftists mouthpieces like "Democracy Now" who did that reporting just to take a jab at Bush.

Kinda of silly for an Org called "Democracy Now" to be sympathetic to Hamas --- don't ya think?

These factions were kill each other the split ANYWAYS. The US did not instigate the violence between Fatah and Hamas. They justly took a side. And they STILL hate each other today. Refuse to form a govt together.

If the US instigated "a coup" ----- it was a really shitty ineffective one.. That's the facts on the ground.

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism. The type that has it's priorities on forming a REAL united govt and effective leadership and improvements in the quality of life.. It's just that I'm not responsible for all their bad choices. Neither is my country. Nor are you. I don't make excuses for their dysfunction like the characters on this forum. That's where the "co-dependency" comment came from. The illness is a transference of guilt and self-worth from a party acting illogically and irresponsibly to your own person.. Like feeling it's your responsibility to go out and look for a drunken friend at 3AM every Friday. Because YOUR self-worth is dependent on the actions of others with deviant behaviour problems.

I'm on the "tough love" train when it comes to my sympathies for the Palestinians..

They made it clear to you that they would rather waste their lives and fortunes in a perpetual state of isolation and revolt and death. That's self-destructive behavior.. And THEY have to live with the consequences. Ain't my fault -- not Israels fault -- not the fault of the USA.

And like that friend with the problem, the Palis are not gonna get with the program until they end up like the Aborigines, the Maories, and the Cherokees. As indigenous people 300 years behind, with an inability to comprehend why it was THEIR behavior and values contributed to their derailment.

Abbas and PA was the best thing ever to happen to the Palis.. Largely the reason Gaza was made autonomous in the first place. Israel made the mistake that the Palis would spend their energy on commerce and quality of life and peaceful coexistence with other nations. Israel's not stupid enough to try that again.

.if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing......

Difference is -- Israel is a nation state with an economy and trade relations and a set of reasonable laws. It has a FUNCTIONAL govt and STATESMEN and public relations and Allies and open dialogue and tourists and diversity -- and again the Palis haven't been able to get even a bit organized in over 300 years and chose to toss rocks and vote for brutal lawless regimes. Ask the Jordanians or the Egyptians. Pretty sure they'd agree with what I've said here..

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism.​

As long as the Zionist colonial project is allowed to continue to eat up Palestine until there is nothing left.

 

[theliq]

Goodness me Flac,Your ignorance like all of the Pro-Zionists on here,is frankly bloody dreadful.................of course America and Israel are responsible for this situation.....for it was you Two Cowboys that INSISTED that the Palestinians have open and fair ELECTIONS...THEY DID.....the result was HAMAS in Gaza and PA in the West Bank..............So much for your DENIAL..........1/10 Go Directly to the Naughty Corner and take the rest of the uneducated lemmings with you.

Flac,..If you find that you cannot respond properly or find dialogue difficult in these piquant situations,you'll find you will end up becoming a bit of a BORE.......................Much like the Lemmings you seem to be supporting.

I am the liq, ever living, ever faithful, EVER SURE.............................ALWAYS,EVER SURE

Excuse me. SHAME on the US for prodding the Palis into having open elections. What a tyrannical, imperialistic deal that was. OBVIOUSLY Liq --- we should have encouraged them to kill each other FIRST !!!! And THEN have an election..

What were we thinking??

You ever look up the psych disorder of co-dependency? You know when you're value and you're life become dictated by the dysfunctional behaviour of someone close to you?

That's pretty much why you folks shove your heads up your arses and make excuses and blame everyone else for the CHRONIC and pitiful dysfunction of the Palestinians. They NEED leadership and a CIVILIZED alternative to suffering and victimhood. A Ghandi or a M.L. King. Not folks like you or P.F. Tinmore..

What a ridiculous response,"Every Action Has A Reaction" Israel and the USA implicitely requested free and fair elections in Palestinian Terrortories and GOT THEM,.......you see Flac,you may not like the outcome but you got what you requested,and in your Mind the Result failed You..."Yes What Were You Thinking Indeed" much like how you created Hamas in the first place.........I do admit Palestine has had basic leadership but Israel has thwarted much good will and too Israel has had basic leadership too.The recent intransigence by Israel has created more crimes on both sides,you have left the latest generation of Palestinians,the youth not prepared to put up with the status quo,like their parents,thus more killings/murders on both sides by both sides ..............I do note that the US has declared the 4 killings last Saturday by Jews as a War Crime,moreover note 8 Israelis and 36 Palestinians have been killed/murdered in the past week or so, including a pregnant Palestinian woman.

As for you comment re my mental state ect., I will pass on as you are too emotional at the moment......you asked me twice to answer a question you put to someone else........at first I though this is nothing to do with me,but you persisted and I gave you a truthful and honest answer,including a fair two state solution.......which would dissipate much in this open sore.......but that wasn't good enough for you......so you slagg me off totally without real cause.....As I said "If you cannot deal with these piquant situations" that is your problem NOT mine......you asked for an open dialogue and you got one........That I pissed you off is irrelevant as I was honest with you.......I will also remind you that I think I am the only poster that wishes to see a positive outcome for The Israelis and the Palestinians,hence Viva Israel and Viva Palestine with fairness.

Your attack was out of order,but I only get this from you recently because I stand my ground..........you can say what you like,but one,when reading ALL the information must make a judgement,your happiness like the Lemmings
is only accounted for because you cannot digest all the information fairly.......people like you and the Lemmings cannot be changed because to do so brings admittance that what you espouse...... is flawed.

Flac I want you to know I think you are a fair minded Bloke most of the time and have no ill towards you..............I more than most can see both sides but my support will most of the time be on the Palestinian side because they like most Jews are a fine race of people.......but for various reasons down trodden and dispossessed by Jews........Answer me this......if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing..........The trouble is none of you have solution for a future peace.........steve excuse the fair amount of spelling errors above

Seriously -- don't misinterpret my comments. I'm all for effective Pali Nationalism. The type that has it's priorities on forming a REAL united govt and effective leadership and improvements in the quality of life.. It's just that I'm not responsible for all their bad choices. Neither is my country. Nor are you. I don't make excuses for their dysfunction like the characters on this forum. That's where the "co-dependency" comment came from. The illness is a transference of guilt and self-worth from a party acting illogically and irresponsibly to your own person.. Like feeling it's your responsibility to go out and look for a drunken friend at 3AM every Friday. Because YOUR self-worth is dependent on the actions of others with deviant behaviour problems.

I'm on the "tough love" train when it comes to my sympathies for the Palestinians..

They made it clear to you that they would rather waste their lives and fortunes in a perpetual state of isolation and revolt and death. That's self-destructive behavior.. And THEY have to live with the consequences. Ain't my fault -- not Israels fault -- not the fault of the USA.

And like that friend with the problem, the Palis are not gonna get with the program until they end up like the Aborigines, the Maories, and the Cherokees. As indigenous people 300 years behind, with an inability to comprehend why it was THEIR behavior and values contributed to their derailment.

Abbas and PA was the best thing ever to happen to the Palis.. Largely the reason Gaza was made autonomous in the first place. Israel made the mistake that the Palis would spend their energy on commerce and quality of life and peaceful coexistence with other nations. Israel's not stupid enough to try that again.

.if the Iranians claimed that Israel was theirs,and threw out most of the Israeli Jews..........Slaughter them,Raze the towns...would it not be right that Jews fight for Israel back.....Of course it would......And that is exactly what the Palestinians are doing......

Difference is -- Israel is a nation state with an economy and trade relations and a set of reasonable laws. It has a FUNCTIONAL govt and STATESMEN and public relations and Allies and open dialogue and tourists and diversity -- and again the Palis haven't been able to get even a bit organized in over 300 years and chose to toss rocks and vote for brutal lawless regimes. Ask the Jordanians or the Egyptians. Pretty sure they'd agree with what I've said here..

300 years.........I beg to differ but pointless here at the moment....Palestinians have one of the highest matriculation rates to University world wide.....As the Israelis know and use these Graduates...where would Kuwait,Saudi,Jordan and Egypt plus others be,without Palestinian Engineers Civil and Structural,Doctors,IT Experts etc.,etc,.time.com/4018306/rawbi-bashar-masri/

You are talking .................How can Palestine be functional,without infrastructure,an Airport,Sea Ports ect.............World wide businesses are happy to invest in Palestine and their educated work force.....What prevents this....Israel...New report: "Palestinian Universities Under Occupation".....enough said.But Flac thanks for your interesting post(that's better)..regards steve

Most of that University infrastructure that's left is in West Bank under the remains of the PA. Fatah and Hamas FOUGHT each other thru the hallways and classrooms of those institutions. And since Hamas evolved as the bigger proponent of senseless violence -- they've squandered ALL their infrastructure gains in Gaza to repeated punishing assaults by Israel..

That INCLUDES (and you know this quite well) the well documented plans for an airport and seaport in Gaza with assurances from Israel that they would ease into allowing open commerce and trade in Gaza after it was made autonomous.. ALL SQUANDERED by the decision to take the Hamas all or nothing fighting stance against Israel..

You also know that Israel largely ignored Hamas when the PLO was the bigger problem to their security. Which is the reason why Hamas GOT a foothold in Gaza in the 1st place. They PRETENDED to be the "high road" --- the "better partner" --- the enlightened, charitable side of Pali representation. But they were turned into a proxy for Iran and a suicidal militarized group that doesn't give a full crap about the value of trade or infrastructure or statesmanship..

Flac.....It takes TWO to TANGO..you are assuming it's all the Palestinians fault.........IT ISN'T as you full well know!!!!steve