Rate of change in the Ordovician extinction

[elektra]

Use whatever you like to answer these questions.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm?
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole?
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2?
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years?
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet?
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature?
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken?

a better question is why would anybody think so little information could change theory into facts

 

[ding]

a better question is why would anybody think so little information could change theory into facts

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

 

[elektra]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
8. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
9. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES
10. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
11. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
12. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
13. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
14. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
15. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
16. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES
17. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
18. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
19. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
20. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
21. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

Here you go off again, this is where you make your errors. Where did I say the information collected is controversial? Why would you explain it is not when I never said it was. You are making false assumptions.

The tiny amount of information attained about climate does not change any theory into facts.

 

[ding]

Here you go off again, this is where you make your errors. Where did I say the information collected is controversial? Why would you explain it is not when I never said it was. You are making false assumptions.

The tiny amount of information attained about climate does not change any theory into facts.

It's not a tiny amount. Feel free to post any data you wish. I've been presenting this data here for years.

 

[ding]

Here you go off again, this is where you make your errors. Where did I say the information collected is controversial? Why would you explain it is not when I never said it was. You are making false assumptions.

The tiny amount of information attained about climate does not change any theory into facts.

Do you believe the planet is warming?

Do you believe seas are rising?

I bet you don't. I bet you are one of those guys. You might even be one of those guys who believes the earth is flat and 6,000 years old.

 

[Old Rocks]

a better question is why would anybody think so little information could change theory into facts

A better question is why don't you understand the terminology of the scientific terms of theory and fact?

 

[elektra]

Do you believe the planet is warming?

Do you believe seas are rising?

I bet you don't. I bet you are one of those guys. You might even be one of those guys who believes the earth is flat and 6,000 years old.

Is the planet warming? Did it start hot or cold? From the day when earth was created was it hotter then? Will there be a day when the earth is a cold rock? Will the sun one day quit burning.

Sorry ding-a-ling, you want answers to questions that are theories.

 

[elektra]

A better question is why don't you understand the terminology of the scientific terms of theory and fact?

It is a fact that you present theory and opinion.

We know very little about events that happened millions of years ago.

 

[Old Rocks]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

Answer for #1;

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CO2 levels during the late Ordovician​

Posted on 12 March 2010 by John Cook​

One argument used against the warming effect of carbon dioxide is that millions of years ago, CO2 levels were higher during periods where large glaciers formed over the Earth's poles. This argument fails to take into account that solar output was also lower during these periods. The combined effect of sun and CO2 show good correlation with climate (Royer 2006). The one period that until recently puzzled paleoclimatologists was the late Ordovician, around 444 million years ago. At this time, CO2 levels were very high, around 5600 parts per million (in contrast, current CO2 levels are 389 parts per million). However, glaciers were so far-reaching during the late Ordovician, it coincided with one of the largest marine mass extinction events in Earth history. How did glaciation occur with such high CO2 levels? Recent data has revealed CO2 levels at the time of the late Ordovician ice age were not that high after all.
Past studies on the Ordovician period calculated CO2 levels at 10 million year intervals. The problem with such coarse data sampling is the Ordovician ice age lasted only half a million years. To fill in the gaps, a 2009 study examined strontium isotopes in the sediment record (Young 2009). Strontium is produced by rock weathering, the process that removes CO2 from the air. Consequently, the ratio of strontium isotopes can be used to determine how quickly rock weathering removed CO2 from the atmosphere in the past. Using strontium levels, Young determined that during the late Ordovician, rock weathering was at high levels while volcanic activity, which adds CO2 to the atmosphere, dropped. This led to CO2 levels falling below 3000 parts per million which was low enough to initiate glaciation - the growing of ice sheets.
Last week, another study headed by Seth Young further examined this period by extracting sediment cores from Estonia and Anticosti Island, Canada (Young 2010). The cores were used to construct a sequence of carbon-13 levels from rocks formed during the Ordovician. This was used as a proxy for atmospheric CO2 levels, at a much higher resolution than previous data. What they found was consistent with the strontium results in Young 2009 - CO2 levels dropped at the same time that sea surface temperatures dropped and ice sheets expanded. As the ice sheets grew to cover the continent, rock weathering decreased. This led to an increase in atmospheric CO2 which caused global warming and a retreat of the glaciers.

CO2 levels during the late Ordovician

One argument used against the warming effect of carbon dioxide is that millions of years ago, CO2 levels were higher during periods where large glaciers formed over the Earth's poles. This argument fails to take into account that solar output was also lower during these periods. The combined...

skepticalscience.com

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[Old Rocks]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

For #2;

There are many factors that influence the temperature of the planet. Orbit, inclination, distribution of land masses, ocean currents, and GHGs in the atmosphere. Then there are impacts and LIP volcanic eruptions. The interactions of these and more factors is simply not simple. However, you change any one of them rapidly, and the result will be a change in the planets temperature.

 

[Old Rocks]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

#3. No. The CO2 level was about 285 ppm, slightly higher than at the beginning of the industrial revolution;

The Last Interglacial Part Two - Why was it so warm?​

Posted on 6 July 2011 by Steve Brown​

NOTE: This is the second article of a five-part series on what we can learn from the Last Interglacial time period. Understanding this period may provide clues on how the environment may respond to similar conditions in the future. In the first post, we described the conditions that exisited during the Last Interglacial. In this post, we we examine two of the key factors that caused the conditions described in the first post.

In the previous installment of this series on the Last Interglacial; also known as the Eemian in Europe, we learnt that it was a period that was warmer and wetter, with smaller ice sheets and higher global sea level. Three of the the key factors in determining the conditions that existed during the Last Interglacial are:

1. Changes in solar insolation, which is a measure of solar radiation energy received on a given surface area in a given time commonly expressed as average irradiance in watts per square meter (W/m2).
2. Changes in the concentrations of greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere.
3. Changes in the albedo of the Earth, which is a measure of how much energy from the Sun is absorbed due to changes in reflectivity of the Earth's surface, such as from changes in snow and ice cover.

The IPCC Assessment Report 4 describes palaeoclimatic proxy evidence from the Last Interglacial, which estimates that the largest warming then was in northern Greenland and Eurasia of ~3 to 5oC, though some individual sites may have been even warmer. Models have determined that much, if not all this warming can be explained by increased insolation from orbital forcing as the Earth travels around the Sun, shifts its axial tilt and changes the amount of eccentricity in its orbit in regular cycles; effectively acting like a long-term climate pacemaker. In itself, this additional warming from the Sun is too small and too regional to fully explain all the observed warming during the period. It's likely that lowered albedo, increasing CO2 and other carbon feedbacks have amplified this warming from the orbital pacemaker.

The Last Interglacial Part Two - Why was it so warm?

NOTE: This is the second article of a five-part series on what we can learn from the Last Interglacial time period. Understanding this period may provide clues on how the environment may respond to similar conditions in the future. In the first post, we described the conditions that exisited...

skepticalscience.com

 

[Old Rocks]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

#4. Yes;

Abstract​

Global warming involves changes not only in the mean atmospheric temperature, but also in its variability and extremes. Here, we use a feature-tracking technique to investigate the dynamical contribution to temperature anomalies in the Northern Hemisphere in climate-change simulations from the Coupled Model Intercomparison Project – Phase 5 (CMIP5). We develop a simple theory to explain how temperature variance and skewness changes are generated dynamically from mean temperature gradient changes, and demonstrate the crucial role of regional warming patterns in shaping the distinct response of cold and warm anomalies. We also show that skewness changes must be taken into account, in addition to variance changes, to correctly capture the projected temperature variability response. Our findings suggest that the world may experience not only a warmer mean climate in the coming decades, but also changes in the likelihood of temperature anomalies within that climate.

Changes in Northern Hemisphere temperature variability shaped by regional warming patterns - Nature Geoscience

Regional warming patterns control temperature variance and skewness changes in the Northern Hemisphere, suggests analysis of tracked temperature anomalies.

www.nature.com

 

[elektra]

We develop a simple theory to explain how

And this is because facts dont explain how

 

[Old Rocks]

There's tons of evidence, and none of it is controversial. It's all widely accepted and based upon science. You are making uninformed statements.

The answer to each of these questions is "yes" because that's what the empirical climate evidence of the geologic record shows.

1. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the planet cooled for millions of years with atmospheric CO2 greater than 600 ppm? YES
2. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show different thresholds for glaciation at each pole? YES
3. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the present temperature is 2C cooler than the last interglacial period with 26 ft shallower seas and 120 ppm of more CO2? YES
4. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that the northern hemisphere has driven the climate of the planet for the last 3 million years? YES
5. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show climate fluctuations increased after the planet became a bipolar glaciated icehouse planet? YES
6. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that prior to the industrial revolution CO2 lagged temperature by 1000 years because CO2 was a function of temperature due to the solubility of CO2 in water versus temperature? YES
7. Does the empirical climate evidence from the geologic record show that after the industrial revolution the correlation between temperature and CO2 was broken? YES

#6, 7; Prior to the very rapid increase in manmade GHG's in the atmosphere, the CO2 levels were determined by the response to the Milankovitch Cycles. But as the GHG levels climbed rapidly, they became the driving force for retaining heat in the atmosphere and oceans. The so called hockey stick graph, and all the studies that verified that graph, confirmed this.

 

[Old Rocks]

And this is because facts dont explain how

Facts never explain anything, silly ass. A scientific theory is an overall explanation of the facts, observations, and experiments. It can never be proven, only falsified. Thus far, no one has falsified the connection between atmospheric GHGs and planetary temperature.

 

[elektra]

Facts never explain anything, silly ass.

That explains you and a few others.