Rape is rape

[AmyNation]

He has to say no, or in another fashion, make his unwillingness known. Did she blackmail him? Or strap him to the bed? Overpower him? Intimidated him?

No, not all rape is back alley masked man style, a large precent is coercion/intimidation.

I'm just not seeing how this guy was intimidated by this hooker.

 

[Noomi]

I will remember that the next time a woman is raped, if she doesn't fight it is not a real rape.

If you are physically unable to fight, then fine. But was this bloke pinned down to the bed? No, he had some chick sucking his cock and he wasn't going to leave the joint until he blew his load - excuse my crudeness.

Its bullshit and you know it.

Legally, it doesn't matter if force is used, or threats, or anything else.

Did he say no?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

He has to say no, or in another fashion, make his unwillingness known. Did she blackmail him? Or strap him to the bed? Overpower him? Intimidated him?

No, not all rape is back alley masked man style, a large precent is coercion/intimidation.

I'm just not seeing how this guy was intimidated by this hooker.

What makes you think he didn't? The obviously unfavorable news story I posted?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

If you are physically unable to fight, then fine. But was this bloke pinned down to the bed? No, he had some chick sucking his cock and he wasn't going to leave the joint until he blew his load - excuse my crudeness.

Its bullshit and you know it.

Legally, it doesn't matter if force is used, or threats, or anything else.

Did he say no?

Do you know that, in order to prove rape, all a prosecutor has to prove is that the victim did not consent?

 

[Noomi]

Legally, it doesn't matter if force is used, or threats, or anything else.

Did he say no?

Do you know that, in order to prove rape, all a prosecutor has to prove is that the victim did not consent?

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Did he say no?

Do you know that, in order to prove rape, all a prosecutor has to prove is that the victim did not consent?

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

 

[Noomi]

Do you know that, in order to prove rape, all a prosecutor has to prove is that the victim did not consent?

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

Great, then every vindictive woman out there can make a false accusation against a man she has never even met and have him charged with rape.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

Great, then every vindictive woman out there can make a false accusation against a man she has never even met and have him charged with rape.

Yes, she can.

 

[AmyNation]

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

Great, then every vindictive woman out there can make a false accusation against a man she has never even met and have him charged with rape.

Yes, she can.

Anyone can falsely report a crime. Although if you want to frame someone for a crime I don't know why you'd choose rape, as only 25% of all reported rapes ever go to trial.

 

[pinqy]

Rape victims often delay reporting, it is one of the things defense attorneys used to use to question the motive of the victim.

Yes, I am aware of delay, but 4 months is a bit beyond the norm. It' questionable.

Rape victims have come out years later, this is not beyond any norm.

Yes, it is. About half of rape victims don't report at all. A good number report immediately or wait a day or a few days (and any delay makes prosecution difficult). There are very few cases of waiting months or years and all the cases I'm aware of are in conjunction with subsequent rapes/abuse where previous victims come forward. I don't believe I've ever heard of a case where the victim waited months or years and then came forward without any particular reason.

And regardless, it is still a question to be asked: Why exactly did he delay? What prompted him to come forward 4 months later? Note that I am NOT saying the delay means he was not raped or is proof that he is lying, but it IS something that needs to be addressed.

In a court of law all it takes is a lack of consent. Force and/or coersion are not required to prove rape.

In most states, lack of consent is defined as giving in under force, threat of force, coercion or incapacity. We can discount incapacity, so without force, threat of force, or coercion, how is there lack of consent?

In particluar we can look at Massachusetts Law Chapter 265 Sec 22:

Whoever has sexual intercourse or unnatural sexual intercourse with a person and compels such person to submit by force and against his will, or compels such person to submit by threat of bodily injury, shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for not more than twenty years; and whoever commits a second or subsequent such offense shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for life or for any term or years.

Harsher punishment if there is a weapon or if the rape occurs during the commission of an assault, a robbery, or a burglary.

 

[pinqy]

Do you know that, in order to prove rape, all a prosecutor has to prove is that the victim did not consent?

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

The victim doesn't have to prove lack of consent, but the prosecution does since that's one of the elements of the crime. The victim's statement of lack of consent is evidence, not proof and can certainly be questioned. Presumption of innocence still holds and the prosecution has to support its case. Simply stating "I have a girlfriend" is not refusal to consent. And under Massachusetts law, the prosecution has to show force or coercion.

 

[Katzndogz]

Rape is rape, unless it's something like the Duke LaCrosse case.

 

[whitehall]

Clinton proved that rape isn't rape if the statute of limitations expired.

 

[amrchaos]

OK--thisd is a bit of a reach here but

Is it possible that this is the result of a failed blackmail attempt?

 

[whitehall]

The left's hypocrisy is stunning. They snickered about a democrat former president accused of rape by a credible victim and they defended Teddy Kennedy when he admitted leaving a woman in his car to drown. They defend groups like NAMBLA who are in the business of raping young boys or trying to get statutes enacted that would make it easier to rape young boys and they tried to boycott the Boy Scouts of America because they were able to prevent homosexual men from supervising young boys. They snickered about a democrat congressman (Gary Studds) who was convicted of the statutory rape of a male page and they laughed about Barney Frank's D.C. apartment being used as a call-boy operation. Now the party of no family values pretends to be outraged about statements made by a republican?

 

[Not2BSubjugated]

Rape is a harsh word. I prefer "struggle snuggle".

Also, incapacity is potentially a valid argument in this case. Personally, when I'm getting my weasel tongue-waxed, it's nearly impossible for me to will my legs into motion and walk away. I fall into a shallow breathing, shit-eating-grin malaise that doesn't release its grip until after I release them kids.

Seriously, though, not that I necessarily feel bad for this dude. . . but you gotta admit that saying that it's not rape since he wasn't clear enough about his denial and because he finished is a double standard for most of you. If I whipped it out and just started going to town on a girl who didn't really fight, but told me in a reprimanding manner that she had a boyfriend, most of you would favor a conviction in my case if she came forward later and said she didn't consent. If I responded with, "But she came!" that seriously wouldn't help my defense.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Great, then every vindictive woman out there can make a false accusation against a man she has never even met and have him charged with rape.

Yes, she can.

Anyone can falsely report a crime. Although if you want to frame someone for a crime I don't know why you'd choose rape, as only 25% of all reported rapes ever go to trial.

That statistic is meaningless. We have something called a plea bargain in the US criminal justice system, and it means that only a fraction of all criminal procedures end up at trial. what usually happens is the prosecutor comes in and threatens to charge someone with a crime that could result in years in prison, and they plead guilty to a lesser charge to avoid the complications.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Yes, I am aware of delay, but 4 months is a bit beyond the norm. It' questionable.

Rape victims have come out years later, this is not beyond any norm.

Yes, it is. About half of rape victims don't report at all. A good number report immediately or wait a day or a few days (and any delay makes prosecution difficult). There are very few cases of waiting months or years and all the cases I'm aware of are in conjunction with subsequent rapes/abuse where previous victims come forward. I don't believe I've ever heard of a case where the victim waited months or years and then came forward without any particular reason.

And regardless, it is still a question to be asked: Why exactly did he delay? What prompted him to come forward 4 months later? Note that I am NOT saying the delay means he was not raped or is proof that he is lying, but it IS something that needs to be addressed.

In a court of law all it takes is a lack of consent. Force and/or coersion are not required to prove rape.

In most states, lack of consent is defined as giving in under force, threat of force, coercion or incapacity. We can discount incapacity, so without force, threat of force, or coercion, how is there lack of consent?

In particluar we can look at Massachusetts Law Chapter 265 Sec 22:

Whoever has sexual intercourse or unnatural sexual intercourse with a person and compels such person to submit by force and against his will, or compels such person to submit by threat of bodily injury, shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for not more than twenty years; and whoever commits a second or subsequent such offense shall be punished by imprisonment in the state prison for life or for any term or years.

Harsher punishment if there is a weapon or if the rape occurs during the commission of an assault, a robbery, or a burglary.

In Massachusetts you can be charged with, and convicted of, rape if the person you are having sex with is drunk because they are legally incapable of giving consent. That kind of bursts your argument that force is needed.

BLACHE, COMMONWEALTH vs., 450 Mass. 583

You really should look at all the laws before you try to pretend you know what you are talking about.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

There is no evidence the 'victim' didn't consent. He consented by remaining in that room and allowing the woman to suck him off.

Still missing the point.

The victim doesn't have to prove he, or she, did not consent, all they have to do is say they didn't, and that makes it rape.

The victim doesn't have to prove lack of consent, but the prosecution does since that's one of the elements of the crime. The victim's statement of lack of consent is evidence, not proof and can certainly be questioned. Presumption of innocence still holds and the prosecution has to support its case. Simply stating "I have a girlfriend" is not refusal to consent. And under Massachusetts law, the prosecution has to show force or coercion.

The presumption in the court is that the victim in a rape case is telling the truth. Just because the story said that is what he said, and tried to imply that was all he said, does not mean that it is all he said. The police are investigating the incident, my guess is they think the facts they have warrant an investigation. Your assumption that there is no need for an investigation is rather stupid under those circumstances, don't you think?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Rape is rape, unless it's something like the Duke LaCrosse case.

That was not rape, it was a druggie prostitute trying to avoid more charges.