Pro-Choice or Pro-Forced Pregnancy?

[JBeukema]

Pro-Choice. But I do not chastize those who are pro-life. I personally believe the govt. should let the choice be left between a woman and her doctor. Her body, her choice.

Another human being is not your body

women already making a terribly difficult decision..

1/3 of them are repeat business

Evidently, they don't find it to be a difficult decision at all- much harder, it seems, that the decision to use birth control or not be sluts

 

[whitehall]

Leave it to the left to invent a stupid argument like "forced pregnancy". They can't even be honest about their agenda. Using a benign term like "pro-choice" to mean hiring someone to kill your unborn child is completely dishonest.

 

[Phoenix]

I'm sorry, but I just don't see enough lash-back coming from the Right when these things happen. You're an exception to the rule if anything.

Perhaps the majority of us exceptions tend not to be in the news. We're just average people, living average lives. We ponder and pontificate in the small puddles of society, helping where we can.

 

[MarcATL]

I'm sorry, but I just don't see enough lash-back coming from the Right when these things happen. You're an exception to the rule if anything.

Perhaps the majority of us exceptions tend not to be in the news. We're just average people, living average lives. We ponder and pontificate in the small puddles of society, helping where we can.

Hahaha...I know, not even you, believes that.

LOL!!

 

[Phoenix]

Hahaha...I know, not even you, believes that.

LOL!!

I swear it's true!

Well, my part is. I cannot and don't want to speak for others. They have to do their own speaking.

 

[AllieBaba]

Rape victims who are impregnated by the crime.

In your world if you had your way, those rape victims would be forced to carry to term.

Less than one percent of one percent of all abortions performed are to hide rape.

But it's good to know that you want to protect rapists from prosecution. Dead baby AND pro-rapist! You're an okay guy! Love to be next to you in the subway...

Are you pro-Islam, too? Because that would be a trifecta!

Please provide the stats.

I think I smell more far RW claptrap.

Ah, sorry..it's a whopping 1 percent.

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/3711005.pdf

 

[JBeukema]

I assumed 'one percent of' appearing twice was just a typo

 

[Cal]

Pro-Choice. But I do not chastize those who are pro-life. I personally believe the govt. should let the choice be left between a woman and her doctor. Her body, her choice. However, I understand the passion of the other side of the debate, and I refuse to chastize those that carry the point of view that by outlawing Abortion, they'd be saving lives.

I do, however, chastize the morons that go stand outside of Abortion clinics with those signs, yelling at women already making a terribly difficult decision.. Telling the they're murderers. Those people should die and go to hell.

Here's the thing about that though. Those SOBs represent the rest of the Far RW couchpotatoes who either are too lazy or don't have the balls to get the signs and do that themselves. However, they silently and not-so-silently cheer them on heartily from their coaches.

Not true. I know many pro-life Democrats, as well as Republicans, who think we simply need to work together to reduce abortions, not eliminate. That would change nothing. I'm not totally opposed to that, either.

Do I think women should have every option? Yes. I know a woman who was pregnant and the baby would have had very serious issues, and would've very likely died upon delivery, had she carried to term. That, paired with many, many things, are reasons that abortion is a valid option for women. I don't think for any reason that the government should be able to tell a woman what to do with her uterus. However, I fully support a woman being able to use any option available. And I think adoption, etc.. should also be promoted as an option. In the end, it's the woman and her doctor's decision. Not mine, yours, or the governments.

However, defunding PP isn't going to lead to fewer abortions, it will lead to more. Simply put, when you give people birth control and condoms, it prevents babies, which prevents abortions. But some people can't think about complicated things like that.. .

(Just throwing the last bit in there )

 

[AllieBaba]

I assumed 'one percent of' appearing twice was just a typo

I figure by saying it twice it will have twice as much impact, lol.

 

[JBeukema]

you forgot the dashes

 

[AllieBaba]

Pro-Choice. But I do not chastize those who are pro-life. I personally believe the govt. should let the choice be left between a woman and her doctor. Her body, her choice. However, I understand the passion of the other side of the debate, and I refuse to chastize those that carry the point of view that by outlawing Abortion, they'd be saving lives.

I do, however, chastize the morons that go stand outside of Abortion clinics with those signs, yelling at women already making a terribly difficult decision.. Telling the they're murderers. Those people should die and go to hell.

I've actually crossed one of those lines. Nobody called anyone anything, the people were quiet and peaceable, and smiled at us with a lot of sympathy when we went in.

People have a right to protest.

 

[Anachronism]

Pro-Forced Pregnancy, and that phrase does actually represent most of my mentality on the topic. The ONLY two situations where I am for any amount of choice are in the instance of VERIFIABLE RAPE, and in the instance where the mother's life is in IMMEDIATE DANGER if the pregnancy were to be allowed to continue.

In my mind, at the moment that a woman consents to spreading her legs, and a man consents to placing himself between those legs, they have BOTH consented to the potential of supporting a child for a minimum of 18 years and 9 months. In fact, given my druthers, I would force them not only to carry the child to term, but to get married, and deny them the ability to get a divorce until that child turns 18 years of age.

 

[MarcATL]

Ah, sorry..it's a whopping 1 percent.

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/3711005.pdf

Thanks for getting those stats.

Seems there are 12% and 13% having them due to health reasons for the woman and for the fetus respectively.

However, we're getting way off the topic here.

Which is should a woman be able to HAVE THE FREEDOM to choose what to do HERSELF.

That answer remains a yes.

BTW, I don't believe in having abortions for any reason...but I believe in PERSONAL FREEDOM and RESPONSIBILITY.

Those individuals have to answer to God and not to me or you for their actions.

 

[AllieBaba]

Ah, sorry..it's a whopping 1 percent.

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/3711005.pdf

Thanks for getting those stats.

Seems there are 12% and 13% having them due to health reasons for the woman and for the fetus respectively.

However, we're getting way off the topic here.

Which is should a woman be able to HAVE THE FREEDOM to choose what to do HERSELF.

That answer remains a yes.

BTW, I don't believe in having abortions for any reason...but I believe in PERSONAL FREEDOM and RESPONSIBILITY.

Those individuals have to answer to God and not to me or you for their actions.

You're the one who brought up "forced pregnancy" via rape. I've asked for stats on women who are forced to bear out pregnancies because abortion is or was illegal.

Got those? Cuz without them, the rest of your argument is shit as well.

 

[JBeukema]

Which is should a woman be able to HAVE THE FREEDOM to choose what to do HERSELF.


That answer remains a yes.

suicide bombing? Time Square on New Years Eve?

 

[MarcATL]

JBuekama...you've proven yourself to be quite the extremist reactionary.

 

[MarcATL]

You're the one who brought up "forced pregnancy" via rape. I've asked for stats on women who are forced to bear out pregnancies because abortion is or was illegal.

Got those? Cuz without them, the rest of your argument is shit as well.

You clearly don't get...as usual.

*sigh*

I'm not talking about stats, never was.

Someone mentioned the language issue...being how the argument(s) are made.

The right posits "Pro-Life" by default the opposite must be "Pro-Death"

The left posits "Pro-Choice" by default the opposite must be forced choice or "Forced Pregnancy" as there's no longer a choice to be made.

Get it now, or will you continue to be willfully obtuse?

 

[JBeukema]

[
The right posits "Pro-Life" by default the opposite must be "Pro-Death"

The ending of life is death. If you support that, you're advocating death.

If what you advocate is defensible, why do you have to deny what it is you advocate?

I, for instance, advocate the death of enemy soldiers who shoot at our men. I advocate shooting a man who breaks into your home- if that means he dies, then so be it. The act of returning fire or shooting an intruder- and the resulting deaths- can be readily justified.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Pro-Choice. But I do not chastize those who are pro-life. I personally believe the govt. should let the choice be left between a woman and her doctor. Her body, her choice. However, I understand the passion of the other side of the debate, and I refuse to chastize those that carry the point of view that by outlawing Abortion, they'd be saving lives.

I do, however, chastize the morons that go stand outside of Abortion clinics with those signs, yelling at women already making a terribly difficult decision.. Telling the they're murderers. Those people should die and go to hell.

Here's the thing about that though. Those SOBs represent the rest of the Far RW couchpotatoes who either are too lazy or don't have the balls to get the signs and do that themselves. However, they silently and not-so-silently cheer them on heartily from their coaches.

Not true. I know many pro-life Democrats, as well as Republicans, who think we simply need to work together to reduce abortions, not eliminate. That would change nothing. I'm not totally opposed to that, either.

Do I think women should have every option? Yes. I know a woman who was pregnant and the baby would have had very serious issues, and would've very likely died upon delivery, had she carried to term. That, paired with many, many things, are reasons that abortion is a valid option for women. I don't think for any reason that the government should be able to tell a woman what to do with her uterus. However, I fully support a woman being able to use any option available. And I think adoption, etc.. should also be promoted as an option. In the end, it's the woman and her doctor's decision. Not mine, yours, or the governments.

However, defunding PP isn't going to lead to fewer abortions, it will lead to more. Simply put, when you give people birth control and condoms, it prevents babies, which prevents abortions. But some people can't think about complicated things like that.. .

(Just throwing the last bit in there )

The government shouldn't have any say in a woman's uterus.

It's ok for government to fund PP, thus paying for abortions.

Which is it? Either the government is in or the government is out.

 

[AllieBaba]

You're the one who brought up "forced pregnancy" via rape. I've asked for stats on women who are forced to bear out pregnancies because abortion is or was illegal.

Got those? Cuz without them, the rest of your argument is shit as well.

You clearly don't get...as usual.

*sigh*

I'm not talking about stats, never was.

Someone mentioned the language issue...being how the argument(s) are made.

The right posits "Pro-Life" by default the opposite must be "Pro-Death"

The left posits "Pro-Choice" by default the opposite must be forced choice or "Forced Pregnancy" as there's no longer a choice to be made.

Get it now, or will you continue to be willfully obtuse?

It actually appears to be about nothing at all.

So..you say that women who are raped must have abortion or be forced to carry the monster rape babies. But...then you say it doesn't matter.

Likewise you say that illegal abortion means forced pregnancy...but you have no evidence.

That's pathetic.