Patriot Act wire taps vs. TSA search guidlines

[Quantum Windbag]

Wha do I suggest? Profiling. It works. I don't worry about getting stung by butterflys. I do shy away from hornets. If you are looking for tomatos, you don't look on a rose bush.

You might want to remove your head out of you ass if you don't want to look stoopid. I didn't just start caring last week.

So you say...I have never seen you, Kevin Kennedy, or any of the other so-called libertarians make a peep over the invasion of privacy in shoe removal.

Well I advocate abolishing the TSA completely, so I think my position on shoe removal is pretty clear.

We should try to avoid confusing Ravi with consistency.

 

[Ravi]

Wha do I suggest? Profiling. It works. I don't worry about getting stung by butterflys. I do shy away from hornets. If you are looking for tomatos, you don't look on a rose bush.

You might want to remove your head out of you ass if you don't want to look stoopid. I didn't just start caring last week.

So you say...I have never seen you, Kevin Kennedy, or any of the other so-called libertarians make a peep over the invasion of privacy in shoe removal.

I wasn't on this board when that started.

Just saying.

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

So you say...I have never seen you, Kevin Kennedy, or any of the other so-called libertarians make a peep over the invasion of privacy in shoe removal.

I wasn't on this board when that started.

Just saying.

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

I know you're speaking to Quantum here, but since you specifically mentioned me in your previous post I assume you think the same of me. If you think I'm okay with some civil rights abuses then you are incorrect.

 

[Ravi]

I wasn't on this board when that started.

Just saying.

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

I know you're speaking to Quantum here, but since you specifically mentioned me in your previous post I assume you think the same of me. If you think I'm okay with some civil rights abuses then you are incorrect.

No...your original answer made me realize that was true.

 

[rdean]

And if you support the TSA but not the Patriot Act then you're just as hypocritical.

Why should I want to let the government crawl around in my medical records, looking into my credit or listening to my phone calls? It's not like I have anything to hide, but why is it necessary?

On the other hand, I've been to countless nude beaches. I was stationed in Germany where steam rooms and saunas are "co-ed". I have zero problem with someone seeing me through a scanner. I don't see what the big deal is?

And that's why you're a hypocrite.

Oh yea, that makes sense.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Why should I want to let the government crawl around in my medical records, looking into my credit or listening to my phone calls? It's not like I have anything to hide, but why is it necessary?

On the other hand, I've been to countless nude beaches. I was stationed in Germany where steam rooms and saunas are "co-ed". I have zero problem with someone seeing me through a scanner. I don't see what the big deal is?

And that's why you're a hypocrite.

Oh yea, that makes sense.

It makes perfect sense. You see the invasiveness and violation of liberty involved in going through your personal information, but because you don't have a problem with a stranger seeing you naked you don't see why anybody else should see that as being invasive. Your body is your temple, and most people don't want to be prodded and groped or x-rayed naked by complete strangers. It's absolutely ridiculous. If you can't see how it's invasive to grope or take naked x-rays of a person then yes you are a hypocrite.

 

[Paulie]

Wiretapping should only be done if there is no other way to catch a criminal in the act.

Searching people boarding commercial flights is the only real way to catch people smuggling bombs on their person.

It's not rocket science.

End the war on terror...save a lot of aggravation and a boatload of money.

I don't think there has ever been a person in the US who was caught boarding a plane with a bomb on their person. They come from other places. Profile Profile Profile.

Right, because as soon as we start profiling middle eastern looking people, they won't adapt and pick white or black people for martyr missions.

They'll probably retreat, wave the white flag, and go cry in their caves over it.

Why the fuck are we waiting?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

So you say...I have never seen you, Kevin Kennedy, or any of the other so-called libertarians make a peep over the invasion of privacy in shoe removal.

I wasn't on this board when that started.

Just saying.

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

Sure, which is why I never speak up about police abuse, government abuse, or anything else but this.

My entire history of posting here shows I am strongly oriented in favor of all civil rights. I even think that police should not be able to arrest someone who is suicidal, yet you somehow think that I am fine with government searching my shoes without a warrant.

One of us is clearly delusional, and it is not me.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Wiretapping should only be done if there is no other way to catch a criminal in the act.

Searching people boarding commercial flights is the only real way to catch people smuggling bombs on their person.

It's not rocket science.

End the war on terror...save a lot of aggravation and a boatload of money.

I don't think there has ever been a person in the US who was caught boarding a plane with a bomb on their person. They come from other places. Profile Profile Profile.

Right, because as soon as we start profiling middle eastern looking people, they won't adapt and pick white or black people for martyr missions.

They'll probably retreat, wave the white flag, and go cry in their caves over it.

Why the fuck are we waiting?

Which is why you profile base on associations and travel itinerary, not appearance. that is the method that will actually make a difference, and might actually stop someone before they get on a plane, or mail a bomb to Chicago.

 

[Ravi]

I wasn't on this board when that started.

Just saying.

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

Sure, which is why I never speak up about police abuse, government abuse, or anything else but this.

My entire history of posting here shows I am strongly oriented in favor of all civil rights. I even think that police should not be able to arrest someone who is suicidal, yet you somehow think that I am fine with government searching my shoes without a warrant.

One of us is clearly delusional, and it is not me.

Sorry, dude...you are simply not consistent.

 

[Paulie]

I don't think there has ever been a person in the US who was caught boarding a plane with a bomb on their person. They come from other places. Profile Profile Profile.

Right, because as soon as we start profiling middle eastern looking people, they won't adapt and pick white or black people for martyr missions.

They'll probably retreat, wave the white flag, and go cry in their caves over it.

Why the fuck are we waiting?

Which is why you profile base on associations and travel itinerary, not appearance. that is the method that will actually make a difference, and might actually stop someone before they get on a plane, or mail a bomb to Chicago.

And what of the potential sleepers who have never even traveled outside the US?

Maybe to be safe, we should create a national registry system for all churches that would require anyone attending to log themselves in, so that way we can narrow down our profiling to those who attend mosques. That way if we don't have a good travel profile on them, at least we have their religious leanings to go on.

And the whites and blacks wouldn't be able to slip through the cracks.

If that doesn't work, I suggest we require all airline passengers to report to the airport 24 hours in advance of their flight for a mandatory waterboarding. Anyone who was planning on something nefarious will most likely cop to it and can then be dealt with accordingly with more 'enhanced' techniques.

Anyone who doesn't have anything to hide shouldn't have a problem with that, it's for their safety.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You've been here since May...and didn't say anything about any of it...which leads me to believe you are okay with some "civil rights abuses" but not others.

Sure, which is why I never speak up about police abuse, government abuse, or anything else but this.

My entire history of posting here shows I am strongly oriented in favor of all civil rights. I even think that police should not be able to arrest someone who is suicidal, yet you somehow think that I am fine with government searching my shoes without a warrant.

One of us is clearly delusional, and it is not me.

Sorry, dude...you are simply not consistent.

Really?

Can you point to any place where I support some civil rights and ignore others?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Right, because as soon as we start profiling middle eastern looking people, they won't adapt and pick white or black people for martyr missions.

They'll probably retreat, wave the white flag, and go cry in their caves over it.

Why the fuck are we waiting?

Which is why you profile base on associations and travel itinerary, not appearance. that is the method that will actually make a difference, and might actually stop someone before they get on a plane, or mail a bomb to Chicago.

And what of the potential sleepers who have never even traveled outside the US?

Maybe to be safe, we should create a national registry system for all churches that would require anyone attending to log themselves in, so that way we can narrow down our profiling to those who attend mosques. That way if we don't have a good travel profile on them, at least we have their religious leanings to go on.

And the whites and blacks wouldn't be able to slip through the cracks.

If that doesn't work, I suggest we require all airline passengers to report to the airport 24 hours in advance of their flight for a mandatory waterboarding. Anyone who was planning on something nefarious will most likely cop to it and can then be dealt with accordingly with more 'enhanced' techniques.

Anyone who doesn't have anything to hide shouldn't have a problem with that, it's for their safety.

Potential sleepers who never traveled outside the US, never talked to any terrorists, and never did anything to arouse suspicion only exist in the movies.

 

[Paulie]

Which is why you profile base on associations and travel itinerary, not appearance. that is the method that will actually make a difference, and might actually stop someone before they get on a plane, or mail a bomb to Chicago.

And what of the potential sleepers who have never even traveled outside the US?

Maybe to be safe, we should create a national registry system for all churches that would require anyone attending to log themselves in, so that way we can narrow down our profiling to those who attend mosques. That way if we don't have a good travel profile on them, at least we have their religious leanings to go on.

And the whites and blacks wouldn't be able to slip through the cracks.

If that doesn't work, I suggest we require all airline passengers to report to the airport 24 hours in advance of their flight for a mandatory waterboarding. Anyone who was planning on something nefarious will most likely cop to it and can then be dealt with accordingly with more 'enhanced' techniques.

Anyone who doesn't have anything to hide shouldn't have a problem with that, it's for their safety.

Potential sleepers who never traveled outside the US, never talked to any terrorists, and never did anything to arouse suspicion only exist in the movies.

Whether or not someone aroused suspicion apparently isn't much of an issue, considering we only seem to hear about their suspicious activities in hindsight.

Since 9/11, as well as including it, we've heard about more stories where someone pulled it off or at least got caught in the act, than we did law enforcement preemptively nabbing someone before they made an attempt.

And you're naive to say the least, if you don't think sleepers are an integral asset to international terrorists.

While you're afraid terrorists might actually be able to acquire materials for, build, and detonate an extremely complex weapon like a nuclear bomb, you simultaneously believe that they could never adequately utilize a friggin sleeper agent. That really doesn't compute.

 

[The Infidel]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9a8jGVXOMsw&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

 

[Quantum Windbag]

And what of the potential sleepers who have never even traveled outside the US?

Maybe to be safe, we should create a national registry system for all churches that would require anyone attending to log themselves in, so that way we can narrow down our profiling to those who attend mosques. That way if we don't have a good travel profile on them, at least we have their religious leanings to go on.

And the whites and blacks wouldn't be able to slip through the cracks.

If that doesn't work, I suggest we require all airline passengers to report to the airport 24 hours in advance of their flight for a mandatory waterboarding. Anyone who was planning on something nefarious will most likely cop to it and can then be dealt with accordingly with more 'enhanced' techniques.

Anyone who doesn't have anything to hide shouldn't have a problem with that, it's for their safety.

Potential sleepers who never traveled outside the US, never talked to any terrorists, and never did anything to arouse suspicion only exist in the movies.

Whether or not someone aroused suspicion apparently isn't much of an issue, considering we only seem to hear about their suspicious activities in hindsight.

Since 9/11, as well as including it, we've heard about more stories where someone pulled it off or at least got caught in the act, than we did law enforcement preemptively nabbing someone before they made an attempt.

And you're naive to say the least, if you don't think sleepers are an integral asset to international terrorists.

While you're afraid terrorists might actually be able to acquire materials for, build, and detonate an extremely complex weapon like a nuclear bomb, you simultaneously believe that they could never adequately utilize a friggin sleeper agent. That really doesn't compute.

Which is why we need to concentrate more resources on humint instead of actully trying to find people with bombs when they are boarding planes. Instead of spending millions of dollars on technology we should sink that money into putting people on the ground who speak the language, and let them infiltrate these groups. We used to do that before the government started spending money supporting corporations. How do you think we won WWII?

 

[Samson]

I agree with both.

I guess I'm pretty goddamn boring: If anyone wants to tap my phone or search my crotch, they can go right ahead.