CDZ Overcoming Personality & Emotional Issues

[Bonzi]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

 

[Bonzi]

Does this question involve so-called Freudian-type therapy, etc?

Do you think it needs to be?

 

[Pogo]

What if you have an inability to love?
How would you differentiate between a psychological issue and a chemical one, or, even perhaps, an illness such as psychosis or schizophrenia ?

Schizophrenia is pretty much identifiable clinically AFAIK, being an interruption of the cooperative network between the two hemispheres of the brain. Each of those hemispheres tempers the other; if left untempered, very odd-looking things are manifest from paranoia to mood swings to impaired motor function to psychosis and seeming hallucinations, but all make sense within the knowledge of how the hemispheres function.

That of course is entirely unrelated to behaviour patters derived from experience.

 

[Pogo]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

"Black Bile" and all that? Yes, we are born with innate natures, but they're still subject to free will as far as how we manifest that nature. As astrologers would say in their piece of that real estate, "the stars impel; they do not compel".

So we work within the framework Nature gives us. If an extroverted nature is our innate tendency, then it makes sense to work within it. If it is not, it doesn't make sense to try to fake it.

 

[Bonzi]

What if you have an inability to love?
How would you differentiate between a psychological issue and a chemical one, or, even perhaps, an illness such as psychosis or schizophrenia ?

Schizophrenia is pretty much identifiable clinically AFAIK, being an interruption of the cooperative network between the two hemispheres of the brain. Each of those hemispheres tempers the other; if left untempered, very odd-looking things are manifest from paranoia to mood swings to impaired motor function to psychosis and seeming hallucinations, but all make sense within the knowledge of how the hemispheres function.

That of course is entirely unrelated to behaviour patters derived from experience.

Doesn't sound like the inability to love or have compassion (sympathize) would be either of those....

 

[Auld Phart]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

 

[Bonzi]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

"Black Bile" and all that? Yes, we are born with innate natures, but they're still subject to free will as far as how we manifest that nature. As astrologers would say in their piece of that real estate, "the stars impel; they do not compel".

But are we all born with the same innate nature - to be selfish, cry when we need something, react positively to positive attention (smiles, being held etc.) - then, experiences mold us... ?

 

[Pogo]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

Trust me, no astrologer has ever made "billions".

 

[Bonzi]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

What do YOU think? Sounds like you are sold on the astrology....

 

[there4eyeM]

Therapy working on finding root incidents leading to a behavior, predisposition, etc., may have value. Mostly, the 'why' doesn't serve for much. 'How to change' or 'what to do differently' usually gets to improvement more quickly and less painfully.
Inherent conditions such as schizophrenia are totally different and may well involve chemical adjustment at first, then counseling to integrate the conditions, their consequences and control.

 

[Auld Phart]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

Trust me, no astrologer has ever made "billions".

Let me guess, you missed the word "centuries".

 

[Bonzi]

Therapy working on finding root incidents leading to a behavior, predisposition, etc., may have value. Mostly, the 'why' doesn't serve for much. 'How to change' or 'what to do differently' usually gets to improvement more quickly and less painfully.
Inherent conditions such as schizophrenia are totally different and may well involve chemical adjustment at first, then counseling to integrate the conditions, their consequences and control.

Just seem to me that, say if you are angry or unable to love, you just start working on exercises to correct the issue.

If you do things over and over enough, it becomes habit and a part of who you are... no?

 

[Pogo]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

"Black Bile" and all that? Yes, we are born with innate natures, but they're still subject to free will as far as how we manifest that nature. As astrologers would say in their piece of that real estate, "the stars impel; they do not compel".

But are we all born with the same innate nature - to be selfish, cry when we need something, react positively to positive attention (smiles, being held etc.) - then, experiences mold us... ?

But these ^^ are very basic, primal, survival reactions. I thought we were speaking of personality traits, which are far more on an individual level with a helping hand from one's culture. Everyone needs food, shelter, love etc. But obviously not everyone needs to react to a circumstance in the same way.

 

[Auld Phart]

Could you give an example to flesh out the question?

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

What do YOU think? Sounds like you are sold on the astrology....

Sold on it?

No, just another factor that might possibly have an effect.

 

[Pogo]

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

Trust me, no astrologer has ever made "billions".

Let me guess, you missed the word "centuries".

No, actually I didn't, nor did I miss the plural. And I also meant "billions" metaphorically.

I used to do people's charts. A lot of 'em. How much did I "make"? Zero. It's not a profit kind of "business". And any one I ever met that was charging for it certainly wasn't anywhere close to living off it.

 

[Bonzi]

Okay... say you have anger issues.....
does it make more sense to believe.....

1. I was born that way or
2. My dad was angry so I'm angry

Or say, you don't have an angry family - but maybe something happened in your past to make you an angry person... so you necessarily immediately go to the "let's delve into your past" thing?

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

"Black Bile" and all that? Yes, we are born with innate natures, but they're still subject to free will as far as how we manifest that nature. As astrologers would say in their piece of that real estate, "the stars impel; they do not compel".

But are we all born with the same innate nature - to be selfish, cry when we need something, react positively to positive attention (smiles, being held etc.) - then, experiences mold us... ?

But these ^^ are very basic, primal, survival reactions. I thought we were speaking of personality traits, which are far more on an individual level with a helping hand from one's culture. Everyone needs food, shelter, love etc. But obviously not everyone needs to react to a circumstance in the same way.

Right - I am but I'm trying to discuss when personality traits like "introvert" or "extrovert" or "moody" come to be......

 

[there4eyeM]

Therapy working on finding root incidents leading to a behavior, predisposition, etc., may have value. Mostly, the 'why' doesn't serve for much. 'How to change' or 'what to do differently' usually gets to improvement more quickly and less painfully.
Inherent conditions such as schizophrenia are totally different and may well involve chemical adjustment at first, then counseling to integrate the conditions, their consequences and control.

Just seem to me that, say if you are angry or unable to love, you just start working on exercises to correct the issue.

If you do things over and over enough, it becomes habit and a part of who you are... no?

Remember the extreme power of words.

If it's a habit, etc., one wishes to change, better to say "part of whom I was" or "part of whom I have been". Eschew the present simple, which implies 'permanent'. Think "I can change".

 

[Auld Phart]

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

Trust me, no astrologer has ever made "billions".

Let me guess, you missed the word "centuries".

No, actually I didn't, nor did I miss the plural. And I also meant "billions" metaphorically.

I used to do people's charts. A lot of 'em. How much did I "make"? Zero. It's not a profit kind of "business". And any one I ever met that was charging for it certainly wasn't anywhere close to living off it.

People 'centuries' ago made their living doing charts for Kings, emperors, pharaohs, etc, and, over centuries, I have little doubt billions have been made.

Some in this day and age still confer with astrologers (remember the fuss about Reagan?)

 

[Pogo]

Between those two I'd go with #2. Imprint at the very youngest ages is crucial.

Either one can be overcome and retrained, but #1 is pretty vague, in that it doesn't give a source cause.

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

"Black Bile" and all that? Yes, we are born with innate natures, but they're still subject to free will as far as how we manifest that nature. As astrologers would say in their piece of that real estate, "the stars impel; they do not compel".

But are we all born with the same innate nature - to be selfish, cry when we need something, react positively to positive attention (smiles, being held etc.) - then, experiences mold us... ?

But these ^^ are very basic, primal, survival reactions. I thought we were speaking of personality traits, which are far more on an individual level with a helping hand from one's culture. Everyone needs food, shelter, love etc. But obviously not everyone needs to react to a circumstance in the same way.

Right - I am but I'm trying to discuss when personality traits like "introvert" or "extrovert" or "moody" come to be......

That's where one's innate (inborn) nature comes in. I think those need to be separated from primal reactions such as positive reactions to food, love, etc, which are universal and basic. When we speak of personality traits we're in a more subtle and individual area of how the head works with those basic needs -- but the needs themselves are a given.

That covers introversion and extroversion; "moody" and its exaggerated state manic depression, have to do I think with the right hemisphere of the brain falling somewhat out of balance -- with a bit of help from other factors like recent events and what phase the moon is in. But ultimately those events don't dictate one's reaction; let's say a sudden an unexpected death; it may trigger (or fail to trigger) an emotional reaction that was already going to happen (or fail to happen) without the event.

IMHO.

 

[Pogo]

Do you think people are " born " with any predispositions or personality traits...

Positive person, negative person, etc.? Outgoing, introverted? Or are we like a blank slate when we are born?

Astrologers have made billons over the centuries, because of similarities seen in people born the same time of the year,
Brother born a Taurus, and he, and almost every other Taurus I've ever met, were the most hardheaded individuals I've known.

Are we determined by parents, environment, stars?

If someone were raised by a robot, (as I claimed to be), would they have any personality, be able to show emotion?

Trust me, no astrologer has ever made "billions".

Let me guess, you missed the word "centuries".

No, actually I didn't, nor did I miss the plural. And I also meant "billions" metaphorically.

I used to do people's charts. A lot of 'em. How much did I "make"? Zero. It's not a profit kind of "business". And any one I ever met that was charging for it certainly wasn't anywhere close to living off it.

People 'centuries' ago made their living doing charts for Kings, emperors, pharaohs, etc, and, over centuries, I have little doubt billions have been made.

Some in this day and age still confer with astrologers (remember the fuss about Reagan?)

Yeah, and nobody ever got rich off it. It's not that kind of marketability. People consulted with astrologers for the same reasons they consulted with priests and rabbis. They don't get rich either.