Mustang
Gold Member
The NRA has a solution; arm EVERYONE, EVERYWHERE, ALL THE TIME!.
Obama: Inability to get tougher gun laws shameful
- Thread starter rightwinger
- Start date
The NRA has a solution; arm EVERYONE, EVERYWHERE, ALL THE TIME!.
Missourian
Diamond Member
Where I live everyone owns a gun, everyone goes to the store or school, no one gets shot...and hasn't for the last 22 years...the last reported firearm homicide in the county was 1992.
It's not the number of guns, our the type of guns, the number one factor for increased chance of firearm homicide is...population density.
In other words, guns don't kill people, CITIES kill people.
RetiredGySgt
Diamond Member
Once again for the slow and stupid. Even if you lump in ALL suicides and justified homicides the chance one will get shot is .0001 percent. People are perfectly safe EXCEPT in the inner cities where the dems don't care because they are just blacks and Hispanics.
jillian
Princess
well, gun laws that prohibited private gun sales to someone who would not be eligible to buy a gun from a lawful dealer would help and would probably have helped the cops who got shot by the felon and his wife.
funny how the knee-jerk reaction is to oppose reasonable regulation.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
You are full of shit. Almost a shooting a week in schools in this nation since Sandy Hook. That is way down? 32,000 gun deaths a year in the USA. That is something to be proud of? The per capita rate of shootings in the US is 7 times that of Canada. There is something deeply sick in our society. But the only answer you idiots have is more guns.
Old Rocks
Diamond Member
Idiot. Make it a felony offense to for anyone to sell a gun to such a person. That would be a good start. A month waiting period to buy any gun. And a full background check. Proper training, and a license to certify such training was recieved, same as to drive a vehicle. If you own a gun, and it is not properly stored, if it is taken and used in a crime, you own the crime. In other words, a child finds a gun in your home loose, and accidently fires it, killing someone, you do major time for negligent homocide. If someone steals a gun you had sitting in the closet, shoots a policeman dead, you stand trial for murder one.
Yes, there are many reasonable laws that could bring down the kill rate in this nation, but you and the NRA will oppose them. They get in the way of profit. You people have become merchants of death in this nation.
RetiredGySgt
Diamond Member
Idiot. Make it a felony offense to for anyone to sell a gun to such a person. That would be a good start. A month waiting period to buy any gun. And a full background check. Proper training, and a license to certify such training was recieved, same as to drive a vehicle. If you own a gun, and it is not properly stored, if it is taken and used in a crime, you own the crime. In other words, a child finds a gun in your home loose, and accidently fires it, killing someone, you do major time for negligent homocide. If someone steals a gun you had sitting in the closet, shoots a policeman dead, you stand trial for murder one.
Yes, there are many reasonable laws that could bring down the kill rate in this nation, but you and the NRA will oppose them. They get in the way of profit. You people have become merchants of death in this nation.
Retard alert.
Mustang
Gold Member
What I wrote wasn't intended to be interpreted literally. It's a mindset that essentially conveys the idea that arming more people, by definition, makes everyone safer. I think the evidence points in the other direction. The sheer number of gun deaths in the USA compared to other industrialized countries is more than just anecdotal evidence more guns in wide circulation means more gun deaths. The fact of the matter is that you can't deny that the gun lobby has a financial interest in selling more guns in much the same way that any lobby wants to increase the sales of their product. What it basically comes down to is that more fear of personal safety combined with less restrictive gun laws serves to achieve that goal.
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- Moderator
- #52
The more you folks ***** the more guns are sold, thank you, Smith & Wesson appreciates your assistance.
Last edited:
- Moderator
- #53
Obviously gun control will work. When we outlawed drugs everyone stopped using those....
RetiredGySgt
Diamond Member
Except firearm deaths have gone down since the early 90's by about half. While firearm ownership went up. You guys re so full of shit thanks to the lying misinforming Lame stream media and biased groups it isn't funny.
Missourian
Diamond Member
Idiot. Make it a felony offense to for anyone to sell a gun to such a person. That would be a good start. A month waiting period to buy any gun. And a full background check. Proper training, and a license to certify such training was recieved, same as to drive a vehicle. If you own a gun, and it is not properly stored, if it is taken and used in a crime, you own the crime. In other words, a child finds a gun in your home loose, and accidently fires it, killing someone, you do major time for negligent homocide. If someone steals a gun you had sitting in the closet, shoots a policeman dead, you stand trial for murder one.
Yes, there are many reasonable laws that could bring down the kill rate in this nation, but you and the NRA will oppose them. They get in the way of profit. You people have become merchants of death in this nation.
Felony for selling a gun...nope...the government refuses to grant private citizens access to the check system...privacy concerns.
California Virgin bought his guns months in advance, went thru a full background check and had to prove he was proficient and understood gun safety, had to wait 10 days...and he did it THREE TIMES!
The rest of this I'll go for...as long as it applies to everything.
A kid pulls a boiling pot off the stove, you go to prison.
A child drowns in the bathtub, prison.
A child falls down the stairs...prison.
Someone steals your unlocked car and a policeman is killed in the high speed pursuit...prison for you.
Someone steals a crowbar from your shed and beats someone to death...prison for you.
Someone drinks too much at your party and kills someone driving home....sorry...prison time.
Someone steals your unsecured liquor gets drunk and crashes into a bus full of nuns...life in prison for you.
I mean fair is fair.
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Avorysuds
Gold Member
This topic just gets dumber and dumber. Did someone who legally had a gun kill 20 children and not break a law that I missed?
The speed limit is set yet people break that law like all damn day...
The speed limit is set yet people break that law like all damn day...
HenryBHough
Diamond Member
Without prohibition American could never have had the Kennedy dynasty. I wonder what kind of dynasty absolute gun prohibition would promote. Probably with a Mexican surname? Or maybe Italian?
Remember, libbiekinder, Mexico is a country, not a race. Ditto Italy.
Remember, libbiekinder, Mexico is a country, not a race. Ditto Italy.
It actually IS a felony offense to sell a gun to such a person.
Idiot. Make it a felony offense to for anyone to sell a gun to such a person. That would be a good start. A month waiting period to buy any gun. And a full background check. Proper training, and a license to certify such training was recieved, same as to drive a vehicle. If you own a gun, and it is not properly stored, if it is taken and used in a crime, you own the crime. In other words, a child finds a gun in your home loose, and accidently fires it, killing someone, you do major time for negligent homocide. If someone steals a gun you had sitting in the closet, shoots a policeman dead, you stand trial for murder one.
Yes, there are many reasonable laws that could bring down the kill rate in this nation, but you and the NRA will oppose them. They get in the way of profit. You people have become merchants of death in this nation.
What was your point again, other than proving your ignorance?
i.e you made shit up. Yeah, we got that part.
The evidence is that more guns equals less crime. There are many more guns in circulation today than 30 years. And much less crime. Whether you want to make a causal connection or not is something else. But certainly gun laws do not prevent gun crime.
If I were King of the World, and abiding by the US Constitution, and protecting the Right to Bear Arms, and trying to find a compromise with the Gun-Control crowd, I would wave a magic legislative wand and cause a scenario to materialize, upon the following lines...
* Federal legislation empowering Congress to set mandatory standards for firearms control which must be followed by all the States
* Federal firearms-control database:
- Owner identification
- Licensing
- Training
- Itemizing each and every civilian Gun that exists within the national jurisdiction
- Mapping of Owners to specific Guns
- Registered Home Base (address) for each Gun - where it is most frequently found
- Status of specific Guns (active, destroyed, retired, reported lost or stolen, etc.)
- Disciplinary or violations or banning data, on Owners.
* Federal minimum standards for licensing.
- Provide for both blanket licensing and Gun-by-Gun; max flexibility for States.
- Duration of license (lifetime, 1 or 2 or 5 or 10 or whatever years til renewal, etc.)
- Training (blanket or Gun-Type-by-Gun-Type) - dates - continuing Ed, if approp, etc.
- Criminal background criteria
- Mental health background criteria
- Other screening criteria (dishonorable military discharge, etc., as approp)
* State legislation and databases and infrastructure to interface with the Federal ones
* States make and administer their own laws in conformity with broad Federal standards; thereby leaving functional control over the matter to the States, where it belongs
* State databases feed the Federal database in Real-Time, so that ALL States have access to the centralized information about each Owner and each Gun and other related details.
- No more Owner-is-denied in one State, but circumvents it by going to another State.
* New Federal and State -level rules for transferring Gun possession:
- Recipient (customer, inheritor, borrower, etc.) must be licensed
- Transfer requires a Gun Transfer Permission Certificate from your State
- Certificates available within a matter of minutes online from State systems
- No exceptions, anywhere in the country
- Accommodate oddball scenarios; after-the-fact Certificates for specific situations
- Stiff fines and mandatory jail-time for violators
...and on and on and on; touching-up the hundred-and-one details that escaped me while cobbling-together this short list.
There are ways to effect a nationwide control, tweaked and administered on the State level, without breaking the bank, or breaking the Constitution, or breaking the hearts and minds and goodwill of most of The People; if only we have the brains, and the heart, and the determination, to find that Middle Ground that (a) honors our heritage, (b) preserves all of our macro-level rights connected with the ownership of firearms, and (c) injects some sanity and uniformity into the jumbled, crazy-quilt patchwork of so-called controls that already exist.
And, if such a scheme strikes some as a gross intrusion into the existing rights or ease-of-transfer or usage that they enjoy in a particular jurisdiction, one can take some comfort in the idea that broad Federal guidelines for ownership can ALSO be used to overturn the far more restrictive Gun-Laws that exist in OTHER jurisdictions, where the Gun-Control crowd has made more (and most unfortunate) progress towards a complete disarming of the citizenry. Some give-and-take. Such national standards have advantages, as well as disadvantages, when taking the entire national gun-owning audience into account.
It seems certain that we are headed for a tighter control over firearms in the country; if not now, then certainly at some point in the not-too-distant future. Thinking about this in rational terms, it may prove wisest, when viewing the struggle over multiple decades and generations, and thinking strategically rather than simply tactically, to 'get out in front of the issue', and work towards some sane combination of Federal and State standards and legislation and supporting systems and processes, that will result in a reasonable and satisfactory Middle Ground, rather than dumbly and blindly repeating this Gun-Control Round Robin every so often.
Then again, I have grave doubts, over three factors, that probably put the ka-bosh on the whole idea...
1. government tends to phukk-up everything it touches, and I'm not overly-confident that the gubmint can pull off such a Middle Ground, even if we gave it the power to try
2. give government an inch and they'll take a mile - agree to reasonable controls now, and government will use those precedents to claim the power to make more and less reasonable controls, later.
3. some percentage of gun-owners will be so myopic and intransigent and so unable or unwilling to find a strategic Middle Ground (to defuse future attempts at the usurpation of Rights) that their sheer numbers may very well prove enough to squelch any such attempts
"It's... a puzzlement"
* Federal legislation empowering Congress to set mandatory standards for firearms control which must be followed by all the States
* Federal firearms-control database:
- Owner identification
- Licensing
- Training
- Itemizing each and every civilian Gun that exists within the national jurisdiction
- Mapping of Owners to specific Guns
- Registered Home Base (address) for each Gun - where it is most frequently found
- Status of specific Guns (active, destroyed, retired, reported lost or stolen, etc.)
- Disciplinary or violations or banning data, on Owners.
* Federal minimum standards for licensing.
- Provide for both blanket licensing and Gun-by-Gun; max flexibility for States.
- Duration of license (lifetime, 1 or 2 or 5 or 10 or whatever years til renewal, etc.)
- Training (blanket or Gun-Type-by-Gun-Type) - dates - continuing Ed, if approp, etc.
- Criminal background criteria
- Mental health background criteria
- Other screening criteria (dishonorable military discharge, etc., as approp)
* State legislation and databases and infrastructure to interface with the Federal ones
* States make and administer their own laws in conformity with broad Federal standards; thereby leaving functional control over the matter to the States, where it belongs
* State databases feed the Federal database in Real-Time, so that ALL States have access to the centralized information about each Owner and each Gun and other related details.
- No more Owner-is-denied in one State, but circumvents it by going to another State.
* New Federal and State -level rules for transferring Gun possession:
- Recipient (customer, inheritor, borrower, etc.) must be licensed
- Transfer requires a Gun Transfer Permission Certificate from your State
- Certificates available within a matter of minutes online from State systems
- No exceptions, anywhere in the country
- Accommodate oddball scenarios; after-the-fact Certificates for specific situations
- Stiff fines and mandatory jail-time for violators
...and on and on and on; touching-up the hundred-and-one details that escaped me while cobbling-together this short list.
There are ways to effect a nationwide control, tweaked and administered on the State level, without breaking the bank, or breaking the Constitution, or breaking the hearts and minds and goodwill of most of The People; if only we have the brains, and the heart, and the determination, to find that Middle Ground that (a) honors our heritage, (b) preserves all of our macro-level rights connected with the ownership of firearms, and (c) injects some sanity and uniformity into the jumbled, crazy-quilt patchwork of so-called controls that already exist.
And, if such a scheme strikes some as a gross intrusion into the existing rights or ease-of-transfer or usage that they enjoy in a particular jurisdiction, one can take some comfort in the idea that broad Federal guidelines for ownership can ALSO be used to overturn the far more restrictive Gun-Laws that exist in OTHER jurisdictions, where the Gun-Control crowd has made more (and most unfortunate) progress towards a complete disarming of the citizenry. Some give-and-take. Such national standards have advantages, as well as disadvantages, when taking the entire national gun-owning audience into account.
It seems certain that we are headed for a tighter control over firearms in the country; if not now, then certainly at some point in the not-too-distant future. Thinking about this in rational terms, it may prove wisest, when viewing the struggle over multiple decades and generations, and thinking strategically rather than simply tactically, to 'get out in front of the issue', and work towards some sane combination of Federal and State standards and legislation and supporting systems and processes, that will result in a reasonable and satisfactory Middle Ground, rather than dumbly and blindly repeating this Gun-Control Round Robin every so often.
Then again, I have grave doubts, over three factors, that probably put the ka-bosh on the whole idea...
1. government tends to phukk-up everything it touches, and I'm not overly-confident that the gubmint can pull off such a Middle Ground, even if we gave it the power to try
2. give government an inch and they'll take a mile - agree to reasonable controls now, and government will use those precedents to claim the power to make more and less reasonable controls, later.
3. some percentage of gun-owners will be so myopic and intransigent and so unable or unwilling to find a strategic Middle Ground (to defuse future attempts at the usurpation of Rights) that their sheer numbers may very well prove enough to squelch any such attempts
"It's... a puzzlement"
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