November 5 not about electing a president.

[Harry Dresden]

So what. You WANT to be defeated. That means they have won in your case.

Watch what they DO, not what they say.

Like you I have been disgusted with the party's, and wanted desperately for a third party to come along.

The libertarians started off good, but then they were infiltrated, and taken over by the political class.

Trump is doing to them, what they have been doing to us, for decades.

no they have not won in my case.....2 parties telling everyone whats what, means there will still be a duopoly......and it doesnt matter who is in charge of the party....

 

[westwall]

no they have not won in my case.....2 parties telling everyone whats what, means there will still be a duopoly......and it doesnt matter who is in charge of the party....

So quit. That's their goal.

 

[Harry Dresden]

So quit. That's their goal.

their goal failed....

 

[westwall]

their goal failed....

Nope. They succeeded, you have abandoned voting for a meaningful candidate.

The duopoly as you love to call the political class, is attacking their one enemy, the one guy who has the gumption to stand up to them, but you refuse to recognize that thanks to THEIR propaganda campaign.

So you will "vote" for a non entity.

Just like they want you to.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Nope. They succeeded, you have abandoned voting for a meaningful candidate.

The duopoly as you love to call the political class, is attacking their one enemy, the one guy who has the gumption to stand up to them, but you refuse to recognize that thanks to THEIR propaganda campaign.

So you will "vote" for a non entity.

Just like they want you to.

a meaningful candidate is a matter of opinion...and once again, i wont let a party tell me who is a meaningful candidate...i dont vote for people who maybe have a few years left to live....you had better hope trumps VP pick fits your idea of "meaningful".....

 

[DonaldFG]

Contrary to some statements here, democracy means people have the ultimate power. Since the 9th and 10th Amendments to the Constitution give us that, America is a Democracy

Amendment 9
- Other Rights Kept by the People

The enumeration in the Constitution of certain rights shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment 10
- Undelegated Powers Kept by the States and the People

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

So, when an undefined or new issue comes up, the people have the power to decide and make policy. If we, the people, don't use our power that's on us. It appears historically that we Americans have been politically lazy in enforcing Constitutional rules and electing good people who will respect those rules.

One way to make our new policy decisions easier (whether local, state, or national) is to put them on the ballot. We, the people, can clean up government abuse quickly if we listen to our brightest minds and enable them to create the ballot initiatives needed. When responsible and ethical initiative proposals are made that will benefit us all, most of us will agree quickly.

 

[M14 Shooter]

The upcoming election is no longer about electing a president. It's about saving our democracy.

This is, of course, a lie.

 

[scruffy]

why do think?....what have we been discussing here?..

You're an idealist.

I'm more practical.

I think in terms of resources and the ability to get the job done.

Which Libertarians for example (with a capital L) don't have.

 

[scruffy]

Trump is turning the repub party into an independent party. If Trump wins the GOP will no longer be a wholly owned subsidiary of the democrat party.

That's never been the case.

There's 2 parts of the GOP, businessmen and political idealists.

The latter these days, are very close to populists.

But the former, don't care about idealism. They care about the ability to make a profit. Hence their support of minorities and special interests, because they represent markets.

Gays for example are a little less than 10% of the population. That's a big market. Blacks, around 20%, an even bigger market. They'll support DEI if it means opening the market.

 

[scruffy]

Contrary to some statements here, democracy means people have the ultimate power. Since the 9th and 10th Amendments to the Constitution give us that, America is a Democracy

Amendment 9
- Other Rights Kept by the People

The enumeration in the Constitution of certain rights shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment 10
- Undelegated Powers Kept by the States and the People

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

So, when an undefined or new issue comes up, the people have the power to decide and make policy. If we, the people, don't use our power that's on us. It appears historically that we Americans have been politically lazy in enforcing Constitutional rules and electing good people who will respect those rules.

One way to make our new policy decisions easier (whether local, state, or national) is to put them on the ballot. We, the people, can clean up government abuse quickly if we listen to our brightest minds and enable them to create the ballot initiatives needed. When responsible and ethical initiative proposals are made that will benefit us all, most of us will agree quickly.

No, a democracy has a specific meaning, in terms of government structure.

The US is a republic, not a democracy.

The people have a voice, but it's not 100% of the voice.

 

[scruffy]

so why does trump need the republicans?....he can start a 3 rd party right now.....he has more people behind him than any 3rd party has ever had.....

The GOP is a financial institution. It controls votes in the House and Senate through the purse strings.

 

[M14 Shooter]

One way to make our new policy decisions easier (whether local, state, or national) is to put them on the ballot.

Federally, there's no way to do this w/o amending the constitution.

 

[scruffy]

Federally, there's no way to do this w/o amending the constitution.

Yes. There is no referendum at the federal level.

 

[Harry Dresden]

You're an idealist.

I'm more practical.

I think in terms of resources and the ability to get the job done.

Which Libertarians for example (with a capital L) don't have.

no im an angry citizen....big difference...i dont buy the "lessor of 2 evils" bullshit....both parties only give a shit about the parties....all they do is tit for tat...

 

[Harry Dresden]

The GOP is a financial institution. It controls votes in the House and Senate through the purse strings.

so what i was saying earlier in this thread was right....trump is part of that duopoly...

 

[BULLDOG]

This is, of course, a lie.

You haven't seen Project 2025, have you?

 

[M14 Shooter]

You haven't seen Project 2025, have you?

I have
That;s how I know you;re lying.

 

[Concerned American]

Federally, there's no way to do this w/o amending the constitution.

It is being done on the state level in many states and I believe the reps and senators are neglecting their duties. If everything is to be decided at the ballot box, WTF are we paying those reps and senators? It is their job to determine the merits and constitutionality of any proposed bill.

 

[LuckyDuck01!]

The upcoming election is no longer about electing a president. It's about saving our democracy. I have some concerns about Biden too, but those concerns are far outweighed by the damage that trump has already promised to visit on our democracy. He already said he would "terminate the Constitution if he determined that fraud occurred during an election." "fire 40,000 career civil servants on day one and replace them with ‘patriots’ loyal to him." "He will bring back the architect of the child separation policy at the border" and "Tom Homan (will) run ICE." Have the Justice Department "investigate Comcast, NBC and MSNBC for treason and remove them from the public airwaves." offered to sell out safety and environmental protections for donations, and the partisan Supreme Court has cleared the way for him to reign terror on the poor and middle class. We have to elect Joe, or somebody else who won't use the newly provided presidential powers at least until congress has time to pass new laws to bring us back to normal. If enough people want to call a special election after that, we can do that, but for now, we have to protect our country. You don't have to vote for Joe, but for the country's sake, vote against trump, the wannabe king.

I am in complete support of removing anyone from any civil servant/political position, that must raise their hand and swear an oath to support and defend the U.S. Constitution which of course, includes our Bill of Rights, then go about trying to undermine it.....which the leftist politicians and their associates are trying to do. If that means getting rid of thousands of civil servants, GOOD. If you are not in favor of our first ten amendments to the Constitution, then you shouldn't hold a position that requires you to swear an oath to defend it.

 

[BULLDOG]

I am in complete support of removing anyone from any civil servant/political position, that must raise their hand and swear an oath to support and defend the U.S. Constitution which of course, includes our Bill of Rights, then go about trying to undermine it.....which the leftist politicians and their associates are trying to do. If that means getting rid of thousands of civil servants, GOOD. If you are not in favor of our first ten amendments to the Constitution, then you shouldn't hold a position that requires you to swear an oath to defend it.

I'm sure you actually believe Democrats are trying to undermine the Constitution. That is proof positive you have fallen for all those batshit crazy conspiracy theories, and your brainwashing is complete. I'm sure you were once a normal sane person. Too bad you aren't now.